Transcript

Your chance to ask us your Bible question at 888-589-8840

>> Alex McFarland: Its Fire Away Friday on Exploring the Word. This is your chance to ask us your Bible question at 888-589-8840. That's 888-589-8840.

>> Bert Harper: You can also email your [email protected] or

>> Alex McFarland: visit facebook.com exploring the word. Exploring the Word.

>> Bert Harper: It's Fireaway Friday on American Family Radio. Yes, it is fire M. McFarlane and Bert Harper love to look forward to and it's here today. So, Alex, we're going to take calls and that number, if you've got a call for us, is 8885-8984-0888-8589, 8840. And, we're ready for those calls, Alex. We look forward to them, don't we?

>> Alex McFarland: Well, we really do. And we've been studying parables. Now we're going to start next week studying the book of Malachi, the Old Testament Book of Malachi. But encourage people to, read ahead. But call in today and I see some of those calls are already coming through. If you've got a Bible question of any sort. Doesn't just have to be about the parables that we've been doing, but the number 888-589-8840. Hey Bert, are you going to be on the road preaching this weekend?

>> Bert Harper: So where I wouldn't say it on the road. I'm at Ozark Baptist Church where I'm interim pastor. And, just looking forward to it. I got a special message. I'm looking forward to sharing it. It Joshua and I love the Book of Joshua. And so if you are able, Ozark Baptist Church, Marietta, Mississippi at 11 o', clock, come on out and be with us.

>> Alex McFarland: Amen. Well, if you are in eastern North Carolina, Greenville, North Carolina, now there is a Greenville, South Carolina, not to be confused. I will be in Greenville, North Carolina, Christ Hope Church, Pastor Lenny Furlow. And that's in Greenville, 10:30am Sunday morning. And I know we have listeners in that part of the world. Love to see you when I'm down there in Greenville Sunday morning.

>> Bert Harper: Okay, well, I'm telling you what, Alex, it's been a good week. I want to say this. I've enjoyed the parables and I want to say thanks to Dylan and Jon who helped us out and they added to it so much. And so we appreciate our listeners and so, so Malachi, we're looking forward to it. It's an awesome book. It's got a lot of great stuff in It. So we'll do that starting Monday.

>> Alex McFarland: Amen. Amen.

Elizabeth has a serious prayer request for God regarding her grandson's marriage

Well, we're going to begin our calls today. not gonna say what state, but we have a caller named Elizabeth. Elizabeth. That's a Bible name. And we thank you for calling in. God bless you. Elizabeth, you're on.

>> sue: I have a serious, prayer request. This just came to light yesterday. It's for my grandson's marriage.

>> Caroline: They have two small children, another one due in two months.

>> sue: And it's very serious. And, only with God's intervention will

>> Caroline: this marriage be saved.

>> sue: They are both Christians, so we're praying, you know, for healing. And I did have one prayer last

>> sue: night that I just prayed desperately all night, and it was answered this morning. So God is working. But I would appreciate your, your prayers, please.

>> Alex McFarland: Amen. Elizabeth, thank you for sharing that bird. It does seem like, marriages and families are in a tough place in many cases these days. And so would you pray for this marriage that's really needing God's intervention?

>> Bert Harper: I will. Elizabeth, thank you for calling in. Father, we're praying for this man and this woman. We don't know what the issues are. But you do. They do. But Father, I, with all my heart, I believe those issues can be overcome with a spirit of forgiveness, a spirit of desire to do your will. So I'm praying that they would turn to you. I'm praying that they would grow closer to you. And if they both grow closer to you, that means they're growing closer to one another. And Father, we're praying for victory. I pray that they would understand, they can make justification. But Father, I pray that they would just look unto you and your love, your strength, and that this marriage would be healed for those two children that are born, for the one that is to be born. Father, they need mom and dad and I'm praying a victory. And Elizabeth's already seen a prayer answered last night. So, Father, we've got this one compounded with people all over America, maybe even other parts of the world praying right now asking for this marriage to be resolved, healed, and even become a great marriage. We believe this, we trust this. In Jesus name, Amen.

>> Alex McFarland: Amen. Thank you. And thank you, Elizabeth, for sharing. We're going to go to Texas. Sue in Texas.

Sue says early Christians worshiped on Sunday because that was resurrection day

Welcome to Exploring the Word.

>> sue: Yes, I'm a first time caller and, I've listened for years and I just love your show. It's just the greatest. But, I wanted to add more things about, the fourth commandment. Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. I know that it was pre Mosaic. It happened in the garden, and it said, God bless the seventh day and sanctified it. And then Moses, wrote that they were to keep it throughout their generations for perpetual government, covenant forever. And then I noticed that, it's been mentioned that they kept the first day of the week in the NewSong Testament. And that was in Troas, where Paul was just passing through for one week, and his last day there happened to be the first day of the week. And that's where the young man fell out the window. But then the other reference is First Corinthians 16, 2 and 3, where it says, upon the first day of the week, let every one of you lay by him, and stores God hath prospered him. Bring your liberality unto Jerusalem. They were. They were gathering things that on the first day of the week. And that was, to me, that's work. You know, they maybe gave money, but they could have given, bags of barley or figs or clothing and, loading them up on an animal or something. And when the circumcision was done away with for the Gentiles, they. The. They wrote extensively about it in the Bible. And. But this changing to the first day, just. It just wasn't there. There's two places in the Ten Commandments, that I've noticed where people have changed it. One is the second commandment. Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image. And that's been left out in the Catholic Ten Commandments. And then.

>> Alex McFarland: Sue, what's your question, Sister? I appreciate. What's your question.

>> sue: Well, it says that Matthew 5 says that whosoever teaches, shall break one of the least of these commandments, and. And shall teach men so shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven. If you. But you're still in the kingdom of heaven.

>> Alex McFarland: So I'm going to help you out here. I, guess to worship on Sunday. you're asking is that teaching something contrary to the commandments? And forgive me for jumping in here. We just want to give everybody a chance. Bert, let me just say this. The early Christians worshiped on Sunday, morning, because that was resurrection day and it wasn't. I want to be very clear that the Sunday is not Saturday. The Sabbath was always on Saturday. Now, Hebrews chapter four says that we are in the perpetual Sabbath rest of Jesus. And so let me just say this. What's interesting is, there were a number of, early. As early as 112 A.D. so this is just 16 years after the Book of Revelation was written, Pliny the Younger, he was a Roman governor, and he wrote to Emperor Trajan asking on how to deal with Christians. He said, now plenty. And then also Lucian and also Celsus, who was a Roman philosopher, said that the Christians gather, quote a great while before day on Sunday and sing hymns to Jesus as to God. And then Lucian, mentioned that they worship the crucified one. And Celsus said, they get up on Sunday and they worship Jesus. I guess my point, Bert, is that it wasn't that the church, 400 years later changed the Sabbath, but a. We don't have to keep a Sabbath, although I think it's good to keep a Sabbath. But we are in. We have fulfilled the commandment of, remember the Sabbath to keep it holy. As with all of the Mosaic Law, it's fulfilled in our relationship with Jesus. And Romans 4 says, all of the righteousness that we couldn't earn by attempting to keep the law, all of the righteousness is ours by knowing Jesus. But in Acts 2, 46 and other verses, they would get together and worship, on Sunday because it was resurrection day. And that's in Acts 20. That's 1 Corinthians 16. So, Bert, we've been doing Sunday worship for 20 centuries. I think we probably ought to stick with it.

>> Bert Harper: Well, let me say, two or three things, Sue. you know, creation and the law, the. And honestly, the Sabbath. And you. You referred to creation. It really is a Sabbath rest. Look what God has done. And it was great. It was great. The law, Moses. God gave it that. To set that aside. So honestly. And I've come to this decision. I don't know if this will help you or if you disagree with it, sue, but I agree with Alex that, you know, we've been doing this a while in the early church with every information we have. They did.

>> alex: But.

>> Bert Harper: But creation is honored by the Sabbath. Look what God has done. When Jesus Christ rose from the dead on the first day of the week, we say, look what God has done. And again, that's the redemption. And with all my heart, I really do believe that the first day of the week is the day that the early church did this. And, so you need to worship God. But I do believe it is the first day of the week. The early church. I think it's enough.

All the ten Commandments are repeated at different places in the New Testament

And I'd say this. All the ten Commandments, nine are repeated at different places in the NewSong Testament. The one that is not repeated. And you talked about several things about Circumcision the one that's not repeated is you shall worship on the Sabbath. That one is not. So I think we're good worshiping on the first day of the week. So thank you for calling first. First time caller.

Charles in Texas uses the New Living Translation in preaching

>> Alex McFarland: Let's go to Charles in Texas. Charles, welcome to Exploring the Word.

>> charles: yes, thank you for your program. I, know, Alex, that, you are very oriented toward using the, King James version in your, in your preaching. But, you know, one of our real goals should be to reach the young people today. And I just wanted to give an example of, how, how misleading and hard to understand the King James is. This is from Zephaniah 2 3. I would normally read in that book, but this is from the, Days of praise, Zephaniah 2:3. Seek ye the Lord all you make of the earth which have wrought his judgment. Seek righteousness, seek meekness. It may be it maybe shall be hid in the day of the Lord's anger. Now that same verse reading from the new Living translation is, seek the Lord, all who are humble and follow his commands. Seek to do what is right and to live humbly, perhaps even yet. The Lord will protect you, protect you from his anger on that day of destruction.

>> Alex McFarland: Okay, yeah, yeah. When we're doing our youth camps and our youth events, we use several Bibles. We'll use the NewSong King James. We've used the, the nlt, the NewSong Living Translation. And then I, wrote the notes for the, or most of the notes for one of the youth Study Bibles. That is the, Holman Christian standard. So, yeah, I've got a couple King James that I have them marked up real good. But they're not the only ones I use. Okay, we got a break. Stay tuned. 888-589-8840.

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>> sue: the word of the Lord is right and true.

>> Alex McFarland: He is faithful in all he does. The Lord loves righteousness and justice. The earth is full of his unfailing love. Psalm, chapter 33, 4, 5.

>> matty: The devil thought he had a hold of me.

>> matty: He told so many lies that I believed Got too weak to carry on I thought that I was too far gone but then I heard a voice from Calvary and Now I'm singing no more shackles on my feet. No more shackles. Wow. Set free. You know, Isaiah, 61 tells us that Jesus came to set the captives free. I'm going to give the number. We're going to do all the questions and Bible questions and, prayer requests. Whatever's on your heart, call in at 888-589-8840. Bert, do you rejoice in the knowledge that if the Son sets you free, you should be free indeed.

>> Bert Harper: Hallelujah. And that freedom is to do the purpose of God. We're set free to follow him. We're set free, from our sin. Alex, this freedom is awesome. And, we've been redeemed. We've been bought with a price. And, he redeemed us and set us free. That's a. That's an awesome deal, man.

>> Alex McFarland: Amen. Well, we're going to go to Jon, in Mississippi. Jon, thank you for calling. And you are on Exploring the Word.

>> jon: Well, thank you very much. And I, listen to you guys whenever I get a chance. Surely appreciate your insight into the Word.

How do we have everlasting life through faith in Jesus

Ah, I had a question today relative to a passage in Luke 10 where there was a lawyer that stood up and, wanted to put Jesus to test. And he said, jesus, teacher, what shall I do to inherit eternal life? Well, Jesus asked, lawyer, well, what does the law say? And so the lawyer managed to quote part of her most of out of Deuteronomy 6, where it says, you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your strength, with all your mind, and your neighbor is yourself. And Jesus said to him, you've answered correctly. Do this and you will live. Well, I'm having trouble putting that together with, Eternal life is just a matter of faith. And. And it's not a matter of what we do, but asking Jesus for salvation. So can you shed a little light on that?

>> Alex McFarland: That's a fantastic question. I've got some thoughts on this. Bert, do you want to go first? You want me to,

>> Bert Harper: I will notice the words. You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your strength, with all your mind. Okay, then it goes, and your neighbor is yourself. He quoted that. And Jesus said, you will live if you. What? Do this. If you do what? If you love the Lord, if you do this, put your fai. Faith in him. That's what you do when you love the Lord. You put your confidence if you want to trust in him. it is an action of the will, and of your mind. And, when you qualify that with Ephesians 2, 8, 9, and 10, where we're saved by grace through faith, but we are his workmanship created unto good works. So, Alex, I see. No, again, I'm not trying to say anything, Jon, but I see no contradiction in what he says. And, what Jesus responded.

>> Alex McFarland: let me say this. There was a dear, dear man, that was part of Word of Life. His name was Jack Wurtson. Bert, did you ever hear that?

>> Bert Harper: Yes, yes, yes.

>> Alex McFarland: And when I was at Liberty University, he would come and Jack Wurtson, we should do a show about what a man of God he was. I'll never forget he was doing a chapel service on personal evangelism. And there was, you know, at the time I was at Liberty, probably five or six thousand students. Now it's probably 50 times that. But he said, some people, before you get them saved, you have to get them lost. And I thought, now what does that mean? Now, Jack Wurtson, when he said, before you can get them saved, you have to get them lost. You have to help people understand that they, have transgressed God's law, and they haven't really done everything. Here's the thing, and I'm going to give you two verses fairly quickly. Guess who can go to heaven without being born again through Jesus? The person who has perfectly kept the law of God in its entirety. They would not need to get born again. But who's ever done that? Nobody. Psalm 14. 3. There is none righteous. No, not one. Romans 3:12. There is no one righteous. Not one. So when Jesus said, well, do these things and you will live. Certainly the man would have thought, oh, well, I haven't. So how do we have everlasting life? Through faith in Jesus. The perfect, righteous, sinless Son of God rose from the dead. We have no righteousness of our own. And Christ's illustrations, like to the rich young ruler in Luke 18, or the lawyer in Luke, 19, I think it was. He was asking them m. Questions. Have you kept the law? Oh, you haven't? Well, then you need the righteousness that comes through faith in the Son of God. So, Bert, when you look at all the corpus of the salvation verses, I don't think there's, necessarily a contradiction, do you?

>> Bert Harper: I don't see it. I really don't. And when you. When you look and I go back to this simple scripture, Ephesians 2, 8, 9 and 10 by. It is by grace, through faith, that you're saved. It is not of works. It is not. It cannot. It is a gift of God. But then it goes on. It says, for we are his workmanship. Workmanship created unto good works. if your faith, this trust that we're talking about is not real, it will be shown in your life. It really will, sooner or later. it's. It's faith that works. And so, Jon, I. I, would say you're saved by. By the straight, straight scripture. What, Paul told the Philippian jailer, believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you'll be saved. That word is trust him. And, it is, if you call that doing, it is doing. If you do that, you'd live. It didn't say if you'll do that plus works, you will. So I. Jon, I think Alex has said it right. That's the corpus of scripture.

>> Caroline: Yeah.

Tammy in Texas holds a youth debate on baptism to go to heaven

>> Alex McFarland: Amen. Thank you, Tammy in Texas. Tammy, thanks for holding, and welcome to the program.

>> tammy: Thank you. I am trying to. In the debate that we're having in our junior high, our junior high class, I had a young man that came and asked me if I believed that we had to be baptized to go to heaven. And so this debate has been going on now, for three months with our kids have got involved in it now. A, boy took it to his youth camp and everything. It's exciting because the kids are talking and everything, but he believes that you have to be baptized to go to heaven.

>> Bert Harper: Okay, Alex, go right ahead first.

>> Alex McFarland: Well, Tammy, thank you, and thank you for being involved in the spiritual, life of the youth. That's great.

The New Testament uses the word baptism in a couple of senses

I think it's vitally important to understand that the NewSong Testament uses the word baptism in a couple of senses. now the idea that you put your faith in Jesus, plus you get water baptized, and if you don't get water baptized, you're not saved. Sometimes that's called baptismal regeneration. But it is vitally important that we understand there are two ways the word baptism is used. Galatians, chapter three says that we are baptized into salvation through Jesus Christ or baptized into Christ through faith. So if you have put your trust in Jesus, you have been baptized. baptizo is a word immersed, saturated with. In fact, in the ancient Greek language, they've got, examples where they would write about washing dishes, and they baptizo. They put them under the water. They were immersed. But here's the thing, you know, I think about when, Paul wrote this. Paul said, Christ did not sent me to, Baptize, but to preach the gospel. Isn't that amazing? so if water baptism was necessary for salvation, the Apostle Paul was not a preacher of salvation because he said, you know, and that's, I think First Corinthians 1:14. you know, Christ did not send me to baptize, but to preach. Okay, now there is water baptism. And it's just like I've got a wedding band on. Putting on a wedding band is not what got me married. Now, this wearing of the wedding band shows that I have been married. But standing at an altar, there was a transaction and I was married. the wedding ring displays that. And that's what water baptism is. Bert, I've baptized one day in Peru in 2008. We baptized over 500 people in one day. And, I, promptly got pneumonia. seriously. But water baptism is a fine thing and we believe in it, but that is not what saves you. It's the outward public act of the salvation that's already taken place the minute you put your faith in Jesus. Bert. that's my reading of the scriptures.

>> alex: It is.

>> Bert Harper: And that scripture is First Corinthians 1:17. And before that he said, I thank God that I baptized none of you. That's pretty powerful. Now, one more thing, and this is simple. And most of you that listen to this program all the time, you know, I try to come up with simple answers because who I am. But listen to this passage. It's in Jon, chapter one, verse 12 and 13. Just listen. But as many as received him, hm? Jesus Christ, to them he gave the right to become children of God, those that received him, to those who believe in his name. There it is. Trust in his name. Now listen to verse 13. And this kind of people may not get it. It, does to me who were born not of blood, okay? That blood, not the shedding of the animal blood, nor either by blood of inheritance or nor of the will of the flesh. That means no works. You can't just desire it and listen. Listen. Nor of the will of man, but of God. Alex, if salvation baptism was necessary for salvation, guess what I'd have to do after I trusted Christ? Find somebody that was, and I'm using this word, willing to baptize me.

>> Bert Harper: Willing. Okay. And a man's. It's not my will that you be. You catch my little. I know it's a little nuance there, but you catch what I'm saying?

>> Alex McFarland: That's a great point. That is a great, great point. And you know, I think about the thief on the cross who said to Jesus, you know, lord, remember me when you come into your kingdom. And Jesus said, today you'll be with me in paradise. in the olden days, they'd call it the penitent thief. He wasn't water baptized. Now, water baptism is a fine thing,

>> Bert Harper: and I think it's important for discipleship. It is a command, but not for salvation.

>> Alex McFarland: Yeah, I mean, and I don't mean to belabor the point, but it's like, imagine you say, well, I put my faith in Jesus. Well, I'm halfway there. But you're not all the way there. Do you get water baptized? That just doesn't make sense. the new birth, I believe, as I read scripture, is instantaneous. The minute you have put your faith in Jesus.

>> Bert Harper: Amen.

>> Alex McFarland: Really now, there's many, many, many steps of obedience. As long as we live as a born again believer, there are steps of obedience to take. Isn't it, Bert?

>> Bert Harper: Really is. And again, salvation is that event. Discipleship is the process that follows. And, we need to. We need to become disciples.

>> Alex McFarland: Tammy, thank you for helping the youth understand that.

Carlinda is coming to San Angelo next Saturday for Freedom Festival

Let's go to, Is it Carlinda in Texas? Carlinda.

>> charlinda: Charlinda.

>> Alex McFarland: Charlinda. I'm sorry.

>> charlinda: Welcome. That's okay. you're coming here next Saturday for our Freedom Festival. I live in Texas, in San Angelo.

>> Alex McFarland: I am. And I'm looking forward to it.

>> charlinda: I'm looking forward to it, too. you're an amazing speaker.

Is there any correlation between 400 years of slavery and the New Testament silence

I have a strange question to ask y' all about the Bible. okay, so the Israelites were in slavery, in bondage, for 400 years in Egypt. And they. There's an intertestamental period of, 400 years between the Old and the NewSong Testament where there was silence. Is there any correlation between the 400 years of slavery in Egypt and that intertestamental silence of 400 years?

>> Bert Harper: Alex, let me take a stab at this first. Numbers are really important. And when they line up that perfectly. Okay. I don't think it's just, quote, a coincidence. Let me put it this way, Alex. But I don't think it's magical. I don't think. Okay. That's something, you know, unusual. No. having that 400 years, that four centuries of, you know. No, no, prophet. not a new word from God there in Israel. So I think God's using those 400 years to. Would you say, weed out. Would, you know, to, you know, to make it. Sure. I think there is some significance to it.

>> Alex McFarland: Do you Yeah, I do. And, you know, some amazing things happened about 200 or 250 BC. They translated, Genesis through Malachi from Hebrew to Greek because, you know, the, the Roman Empire was global. And so many people, even two centuries before the birth of Jesus, so many of the people coming up were speaking Greek and some reading Greek and Hebrew. It was almost, you know, we talk about translations now, but it was like, we need to get God's word in the vernacular that the common man can read and understand. Hence the Septuagint. I mean, so the 400 years after Malachi, but before Bethlehem, God was still at work. He really was. You know, Bert, I don't know that there's any necessary correlation. maybe the darkness of the intertestamental period versus the dark and compared with the darkness of 400 years of slavery. But here's, I think, the key why it was 400 years, because Galatians 4:4 says, in the fullness of time, amen, God sent forth his. And so, God's sovereignty, man's trajectory, suddenly it was the right time. And C.S. lewis said, all of history comes down to a Hebrew girl at her prayers. And, an angel appears and says, hail Mary, thou art highly favored. You will bring forth the Son of God. Isn't that amazing, Bert?

>> Bert Harper: It is amazing. And think about the 400 years in Egypt, they were waiting on Jesus the deliverer. In those, you know, the inter biblical period, they were waiting on a deliverer. During that period of time, his name was to be Moses. Now he was. You know, there is some significance to it, isn't.

>> Alex McFarland: Simeon looked for the consolation of Israel.

>> Bert Harper: Hallelujah. We'll be back with more of your questions.

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one day when heaven was filled with his praises. One day when sin was as black as could be, Jesus came forth to be born of a virgin dwelt among men. My example is He. The word became flesh and the light shined among us. His glory revealed Living. He loved me. Welcome back to Exploring the Word. You know those lyrics? The Word became flesh. And you know the Bible speaks of Jesus, quote, on whom the ends of the earth have come. Jesus is everything.

>> Bert Harper: Amen.

>> Alex McFarland: do you know him? He's as close by as a prayer. And there's life and there's eternity and there's loved ones that pass on. And there's the mountains and the valleys. How could you face the day without Jesus? But if you put your trust in Jesus, he is the friend who sticks closer than a brother. He will never leave you or forsake you. Nothing can pluck you out of his hand. And that's why we sing. That's why we rejoice. That's why our, our present, our future, our hope, our everything is in Jesus.

>> Bert Harper: Amen. No other. No other.

>> Alex McFarland: Amen. Hey, we got a lot of calls. 885-89-8840. the caller mentioned next week I'm going to be in San Angelo, Texas. We love San Angelo. Fantastic people down there. I have the great honor. I will be July 4 and 5 at Calvary Baptist Church. Pastor Bobby Roger. That's, on Armstrong street in San Angelo, Texas. And the complete info [email protected]. so, Texans, I'll be down your way for the fourth of July. Let's get together and brag on Jesus. What do you say?

>> Bert Harper: We needed 250 years, man. Hallelujah.

>> Alex McFarland: Hallelujah. David is in Alabama. David, thank you for calling and welcome to Exploring the Word.

>> david: Yes, thank you for taking my voice. My voice, my call. I love hearing your commentary on various questions that come up.

David: I think the great city is Babylon in Revelation 16:19

I'm in the process of studying, the book of Revelation. I have to study, guys. I'm going through. And in chapter 16, verses 18 and 19, it talks about the seventh bowl judgment and was a great earthquake. And the great city, was divided into three parts. And of course, my question is, what would be your thought about what that great city is? one. One. One person or one study guide suggested it's Jerusalem. I was wondering if it could be any other city than Jerusalem. Babylon, of course, is. Is indicated in the. In the comment that. In the new King James that I'm reading.

>> Alex McFarland: Yeah, let me jump in on this, for a minute. And Bert, you can feel free to agree or disagree. You know, in the, Book of Revelation, there are judgments, there are seals, that are broken. And with the breaking of every seal, a document is opened further and further. And there are bowls which are. Imagine like a vial or a bucket full of God's wrath poured out. And then there are trumpets that announce God's judgment. Now, in Revelation 16:19, I think the great city is Babylon. And not just historic Babylon, which is a very real city, by the way. Saddam Hussein wanted to rebuild Babylon and put his picture on the coins. But, I think it's the complete global world system which the Bible compares to the Roman Empire. But it's the great secular, anti Christian world system that has, built itself up against Christ and Christ's followers. Bert, what do you think?

>> Bert Harper: I do believe that. But that has a center. You know, in other words, when you have a, like you just said, this system, it usually has a center from whence it comes. Like an earthquake, it has what is called the epicenter. And, so here I do believe there is a city, whether, you know, Babylon with another name or what. But when you read this, and in the latter part of verse 19, I do believe. I don't believe it's Jerusalem because it says, great Babylon was remembered before God. Okay. To give her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath. what's he doing during this period of time that we call the Tribulation? He is pouring out his wrath. It really is. He's pouring out. We'd say judgment, and I believe you're right on the judgment that comes with this, and especially when you read what takes place before. So whether it's, quote, that city or the system, the only thing I would say and add to that, usually a system has a center, like a college. Oh, that went out from there, you remember? And I want to do something good. It's like the great, I would say revival that started in the eight, 1960s at Asbury. And it spread out as those students and faculty would go to different places all over, and it would. But the center was where? Asbury. You catch?

>> Alex McFarland: Yeah.

>> Bert Harper: Does that make sense, Alex?

>> Alex McFarland: That's a great. That's a great thought. So, that's what we would say, brother. David, I believe it's. It's Babylon. the World system, but with a center. Go to Kirk in Indiana. Kirk, are you there?

>> kirk: You can. Yeah.

>> Bert Harper: Kirk, be sure and turn off your radio. We, we're ready for you if your radio is off, brother. Kirk, are you there? okay, I guess we need to go to. Where to now, Alex?

>> Alex McFarland: How about Tommy in Arkansas?

Bert says baptism of the Spirit is an additional act to salvation

>> tommy: Hey, guys, just to follow up to your, baptism, question about baptism being needed for salvation, what would you say to those folks who say that, baptism of the Spirit is also an additional act to salvation? Just get your response to that.

>> Bert Harper: An additional act. let's clarify that, make sure we get it, because words are important on this. The indwelling of the Holy Spirit, of the baptism of the Holy Spirit happens at that point in time. Alex, as hard, you know, using those words exactly, you put it into word, your words. See how it works out.

>> Alex McFarland: Well, you know, I believe the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, the filling of the Spirit and the sealing of the Spirit, it's all present at the moment of salvation. Now, I think, Bert, that we can grow in the degree to which the Holy Spirit really has control of us. you know, I don't know a perfect analogy of this, but, you know, many computers, let's say you've got a hard drive with, you know, 100 gig hard drive, that's pretty big. But, the first day you boot it up, there's only one sector free that you can use, and you realize you've got to go in there and configure it, and a few points and clicks happen to get the computer to its fullest capacity. You know, I think we get all of the Holy Spirit we're ever going to get at the day of salvation, which is the fullness of the Spirit. Now, I do think as we mature in the Lord, walk with the Lord, grow in the Lord, our faith grows. we, have all of the Holy Spirit on day one. Takes a few years for the Holy Spirit to have all of us.

>> Bert Harper: Am I saying that is exactly and why I remember this. I'm going to quote my College, professor, Dr. James Travis, and he was talking about same thing we were talking about. He said, why is it talk about being filled? He said, we're filled because we leak.

>> Alex McFarland: Uh-huh.

>> Bert Harper: Now, again, the feeling of the Holy Spirit is him moving in our lives. So, yes, at that moment in we're, we're baptized, we're indwelled by the Holy Spirit, but again, we walk in the Spirit as well, and that is his fill. In as we give him. As you said it, Alex, we give him more and more and more of our lives. We have all of him. He needs to have all of us, doesn't he?

>> Alex McFarland: he does. He does. I gotta tell you this. I love DL Moody. One of my heroes. He was going to Scotland to do meetings, and he had a pastor's meeting, and some pastor kind of didn't like DL Moody said, who does DL Moody think he is? Does he have a monopoly on the Holy Spirit? And somebody said, no, but the Holy Spirit has a monopoly on DL Moody.

>> Bert Harper: Hallelujah. I read that quote. I love it, too.

>> Alex McFarland: Amen. Dina in Alabama, do I have your name correct? Is it Dina?

>> sue: Yes, it's Dinah.

>> Alex McFarland: Well, thanks for holding. What, you got Dina?

>> dina: You're welcome. Well, I called a few years ago.

>> Bert Harper: Try it again. Dina, you started breaking up.

>> Alex McFarland: Start over, please. Yeah, it buffered. I'm sorry.

>> dina: Okay. Exact same question. And you answered it. Well. Well, it's came up again. but I keep hearing a lot of teachings on, that the fallen angels got with women and that, you know, that's where we got a lot of the demonic, I guess, beings. is that a false teaching? Because I've always been told that angels cannot procreate with humans. And then people bring up the nephilim and the giants, and so I'm m wondering, is this a false teaching, or is it really not have any significance in our lives today?

>> Bert Harper: Okay, we're talking about, Genesis 6, and I'll. And let me just say this now. Let's. Let me turn it over to you. Always look at. See what's before, what's after this passage of scripture. And in Genesis chapter 5, you'll find out the list of men. and I think that has something to do with chapter six. Alex, you go ahead, brother. You may disagree with that, but you look at the context, and you see what took place in chapter five. And I think it does affect what we read in chapter six and how to interpret that.

>> Alex McFarland: Yeah, you know, a few good commentators have said the Genesis 6, 4, about the Nephilim, the sons of God. may be the most complicated passage in the Bible, hardest to understand. I tend to think that, angels, fallen angels, could not impregnate human women. for one thing, Genesis 1 and 2 says everything reproduces after its kind. and in other words, there isn't interspecies procreation, and so humans reproduce with humans. But nevertheless, Genesis 6, 2, 4, the sons of God. and it talks about the giants that were, on the earth at that time, the Nephilim. Now, were they a half hybrid demonic race, unredeemable, or were they carnal men from the line of Seth? Yeah, I tend to take it that way. There is something in the Book of Enoch, which is not scripture, by the way, although a lot of people are very enamored with it, that talks about spirits and flesh being commingled. humans can definitely be demonically influenced. But in terms of angels, fallen or non fallen, impregnating human women, I just. Scripturally and biologically, I don't think that's possible.

>> Bert Harper: Again, when you read chapter five and you see these sons, of, God, you know, that he's talking about. And then in chapter six, now, you know. Anyway, I see that connection myself. Alex.

Roger in Texas wants mother and father to do daughter's baptism

>> Alex McFarland: let's, try to get the last two calls in. First of all, Roger in Texas. Roger, thanks for holding. Welcome to the program.

>> roger: Thank you.

>> Alex McFarland: Yes, you're on. Yes.

>> roger: Okay. Yes. yeah, I've been talking about baptisms, and my daughter get baptized, and, she wants me and her mother to do the baptism ourselves. and I don't feel comfortable with it because I've never been baptized. I'm a believer, but I've always put off being baptized. And I wonder if there's anywhere in scripture that describes what a person, if a person, there's a qualification in order to baptize.

>> Bert Harper: Okay, Roger, thank you. We understood breaking up, but we understood. Alex. Matthew 28, 1920, it was given to the disciples, the church, to do the work that God has called us to do. And part of that is the baptism, the water baptism of believers. A church, in my opinion, a local church, can, and it should be a part of that. Now you get to where we find out in the Book of Acts, when, Philip was going to baptize the Ethiopian, I think he already had that authority. Would you comment on all that?

>> Alex McFarland: Yeah. And I want to say this. Look, I realize it's very special family things. And I have seen where someone might be, ordained in some capacity, whether it's a deacon or a missionary, and they would baptize a child. But Ephesians 4, 11, 12 says God gave pastors, teachers and evangelists for equipping the saints for the work of the ministry. I think it's great for parents to be there. the main argument, and I've talked to young people, they'll say, well, I want my dad to baptize me. I understand that. But Just because you want it doesn't mean we can circumvent NewSong Testament ecclesiology. And Bert is right that it's given to the church. And I think a water baptism, it identifies us with the local church, and with the church worldwide and with Christ. And I just think it ought to be. The protocol should be followed. We shouldn't colloquialize it too much. Burke.

>> Bert Harper: Well, let me just say the church itself, you know, we at the last church where I pastored, we had children that were saved and their dads, and, they were walking with the Lord. And the church made a decision. Yeah. and with the pastor's approval. It's like a female speaking in a congregation, if they're under the authority of the pastor, like if going way back. Bertha Smith that I heard at the Southern Baptist Convention several times, speaking to men and women, you know, by the thousands, you know, but she was under the authority of the president that gave her that. I see nothing wrong with that, Alex. That's my thoughts on it.

>> Alex McFarland: Kirk, in Indiana. I'm sorry we didn't get to you. We just ran out of time.

Every Sunday we should celebrate Jesus' resurrection, Bert says

Hey, we're going to begin Monday in the book of Malachi. Thank you all for listening. And you know what? We always say this. Tell, somebody about exploring the Word, if you would. But most of all, tell everybody about Jesus. Bert, where ought people to be Sunday?

>> Bert Harper: They need to be gathered together with God's people in a local church celebrating the resurrection of our Lord Jesus Christ. Every Sunday we should celebrate his resurrection. So do that. Join a body of believers praising God, fellowshipping, testifying and obeying the word of God. Thank you for listening to exploring the Word. Tell someone about it, but more importantly, tell them about Jesus.

The views and opinions expressed in this

broadcast may not necessarily reflect those of

the American Family association or American Family Radio.

>> Bert Harper: PreBorn's whole mission is to rescue babies from abortion and lead their families to Christ. Last year, PreBorn's network of clinics saw 8,900 mothers come to Christ. Please join us in this life saving mission. To donate, go to preborn.com afr.