Transcript

Because of listeners like you, Preborn has helped to rescue over 67,000 babies

Jenna Ellis: Because of listeners like you, PreBorn has helped to rescue over 67,000 babies. Your $28 to sponsor one ultrasound doubled a baby's chance at life. Your tax deductible gift saves lives. Please join us in this mission. To donate, go to preborn.com afr Jenna. Ellis in the morning on, American Family Radio.

Jenna Ellis: I love talking about the things of God because of truth and the biblical worldview. The U.S. constitution obligates our government to prosper, preserve and protect the rights that our founders recognize come from God, our creator, not our government. I believe that scripture in the Bible is very clear that God is the one that raised up each of you. And God has allowed us to be brought here to this specific moment in time. This is Jenna Ellis in the morning.

The utter disregard for human life has been on display over this weekend

Jenna Ellis: Good morning. It is Monday, December 15th. And before we get to some of the other headlines that I had planned to cover this morning, I want to stop and pause for a moment and talk about the utter lack of respect for life that we're seeing on blatant display not just in this country daily, but across the world. Just over this weekend, we saw the heinous stabbing of a tourist, in a Macy's bathroom in NewSong York. We saw Rob Reiner and his wife murdered, allegedly by their own son. just over the weekend, a Muslim killed three Americans in Syria. five Muslims were arrested for plotting a massacre at a Christmas market in Germany. Paris has, has canceled, other events due to violence. And there Also, were 12 people murdered at a Hanukkah party in Australia. this is just evil. That's the only word that can express how evil. The utter disregard for human life has been on display over this weekend. is something going on right now in this moment in time? because we've seen that evil has persisted since, the fall and, when sin entered the world in Genesis. and we have seen periods of time throughout world history that have shown this, even more blatantly than others, certainly. And then there have been, periods of relative peace or of renewal and revival. Ah, looking to the Lord and, and understanding that every human being is valuable innately and made in God's image. so what's going on in this moment in time?

Father Frank Pavone says disregard for human life is widespread in America

Well, let's welcome in, Father Frank Pavone, who's founder of, of Priests for Life. And I'm so glad that we, had already arranged to have him on this morning. because this is a topic that you have always, Father Frank expressed is the most central to Every other right that we have in this country and every human being has, has had, of course, endowed by God, our creator. But it's also something that's so central to worldview that if you don't get life right for every human being from the moment of conception all the way until natural death, you're going to get everything else wrong. And, and so what do you, what do you see as going on in this moment in time where we're seeing just such an utter, blatant, evil disregard for human life?

Frank Pavone : Well, thanks, Jenna, for having me on and for addressing this point. I think the problem is, to use this analog, you were stepping on the gas and the brakes at the same time. The sanctity of life is a principle that if you break it at any point, it's broken everywhere. we cannot take away protection from any group of people and pretend and expect to keep it for ourselves. Mother Teresa, when she was in, Washington, D.C. back in 1994, she spoke at the National Prayer Breakfast and she spoke on the topic of abortion. And she said, how can, if we allow a mother to kill her own child, how can we tell other people not to kill each other? And we might ask today, how can we tell other people not to kill each other if we continue to banish from our classrooms the words thou shalt not kill? Why are we living in a time when we are branded as right wing extremists, Christian nationalists and people? The left goes into a frenzy and they convince a lot of people in the middle that we're nuts for trying to impose, you know, that we're imposing our religion. Oh, how terrible. This is Bible reading. Oh, this is awful. When all we're aiming at is when you look at the teachings of the Bible, hey, we should be able to walk down the streets of our community without getting stabbed, shot, run, over by a car or bombed. What is so radical about this? I think events like this, Jenna, are like the eruptions of a volcano. And the eruptions get our attention. The volcano might be sitting there dormant for decades, and then the eruption gets our attention, but the eruptions don't exist by themselves. They don't exist in a vacuum. What's the underlying problem? We saw last year, several states, about seven states, ah, put into their state constitutions that you could kill a child, even, a viable child in the womb. This is a right, this is protected, this is constitutional freedom. Whenever tragic incidents like this occur, I sit back and ask myself, how much longer are we going to avoid the central problem here? If somebody has a medical problem or somebody comes in complaining about symptoms, you know, and the doctor starts, you know, pressing around on different parts of your body and what is the doctor looking for? The place where you're going to say, ouch, here's where it really hurts. When you and I, and we do this every day, right? When you and I point to the underlying problem that we are actually teaching people to kill, we are teaching people to justify killing. When it comes to this whole abortion thing, people say, ouch. Not that topic again. No, no, no, no, no. You're reducing everything to that. You're obsessed with that. No, no, no, no, no. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. When are we going to repent as a society of allowing, teaching, justifying, protecting, exalting and shrining the actual killing of innocent human lives until we stop that these other eruptions are just going to keep going because the volcano is still active?

Jenna Ellis: M. It's so true. And I didn't even mention in the opening as well, the Brown University shooting. And it's so horrific. the victim who was, ID'd as a 19 year old and she was the vice president of the Republican Club, her name was Ella Cook. And just beautiful picture online and social media and so just seeing even the senselessness of all of these things because nothing, no event that I mentioned, in the, in the beginning of just what's occurred over the weekend. Father Frank, none of these things were in any way unpreventable. I mean these are things that, These are the intentional infliction of violence when it's such a disregard for human life. I. You're so right that this is what happens to a society that justifies and okays murder for some, then the, the bright line can arbitrarily be moved from there. Because if you say that children in the womb don't deserve protection, the elderly, the end of, the end of life, or if you're, if you don't contribute to society or you're of a, of a certain race, as you know, we've said it certain times, in this country. I mean, if you make any of those exceptions that God himself does not make, then we are arbitrarily moving the line. And it's very easy then to say, well, this other person whose speech I don't like, or this other person who I don't know and so, you know, I don't care, or my parents who, you know, somehow, I hate, like apparently Rob Reiner's, son allegedly, you know, thought or, or any of those exceptions, you can easily rationalize and justify it. And this also just shows the complete breakdown of the family that we're seeing happen. how do we even begin to get back to a city that respects life?

Frank Pavone : Well, sometimes you have to hit into the brick wall, which I think for a lot of people, you know, they're experiencing that now. It's like, okay, this has gone too far. When something really shocks us and we say we start scratching our heads and, and, and shaking our heads and saying, wait a minute, this is too far. I don't know how to solve this, but something's gotta be done. That's the first step right there. Getting to that breaking point. having a broken heart and being shocked enough to sit down and start thinking it through.

Father Frank: Christians have to be bold with their testimony on religious issues

And as we're doing in this discussion, the second point, of course, is, you know, I mentioned briefly about, you know, we took the Ten Commandments out of the schools decades ago, and now with the increase of religious freedom, both by the actions of our president and his administration, by decisions of the Supreme Court over recent years that have really, really, loosened, the stranglehold that has been on religious freedom for, decades. we're in a new era. I think it's time. And some states are starting to do this, to push back and get scripture and the commandments and prayer, back into the entire public school system. It's time. It's time. And we already see the beginnings of these efforts. And yeah, I think that now it's not that. That's a magic wand. We also have to, you know, I think testimony is important. You know, the testimony of loving families, the testimony of families that actually spend time together. testimony to show people not just to teach them, but show them here's the way, and let them be inspired and maybe start out on a new course in this upcoming new year.

Jenna Ellis: Yeah, we have to, as Christians, take responsibility to show the truth and be bold with our testimony. And to also participate in the institutions that God ordained, first and foremost the family and then also the church. And, show the. The younger people and also our own kids, raise them in, in the fear and admonition of the Lord, so that we can show what is good about the family, what is right, what is moral, and lead, with that instead of, taking some of those things, as you mentioned, Father Frank, where people say, well, you know, don't push your religion on me, or I don't believe in God, therefore, you know, how can we, enact morality in society? We have to be bold with those responses and not just say, yeah, well, just, you know, since you don't want to hear about Christianity, I guess I can't speak about it, you know. No, absolutely not. And we have to continue, the measures, the fights in court, the legislative battles.

First Circuit reverses block on Trump's Planned Parenthood funding cuts

And there was one piece of good news, that for the last few minutes, I do want you to speak on. Father Frank Pavone, the First Circuit reversed the block on Trump's Planned Parenthood funding cuts. this is a great opinion. The appeals panel from the First Circuit said that the provision of the one big beautiful bill that had stripped Medicaid funding to Planned Parenthood did not violate the, quote, unquote, reproductive health care, rights that are so called rights that Planned Parenthood, was arguing. So this is good news.

Frank Pavone : This is very good news. You know, it was great news. It was the biggest victory since Dobbs when we finally got the defunding of the biggest, the biggest chunk of funding, we should say. Congress, had to act. Congress did act. Praise God for that. and, it came into effect with the big beautiful bill. Now, we expected, obviously the other side always does this. They challenge it. Court fully expected that. But when I saw the reasoning coming out of that Massachusetts court for putting an injunction on this, on this prohibition of, funding abortion, businesses, right away I said, this is no way this is going to succeed. They were trying to say that this was amounted to a bill of attainder, you know, that they were punishing, these abortion businesses without, a sufficient, you know, reason or trial or anything like that. It's not a punishment. It's not. It doesn't refer to past action. They're giving them a choice. The government doesn't have any obligation to fund any of these businesses, but they're giving them a choice. You want to receive Medicaid funding? Okay, stop doing abortions, and, stop doing abortions. You can continue getting the funding. Whether you've done abortions in the past is not the issue. It's not a punishment for past actions. So that was one of the issues at stake. Another one was, you know, the freedom of association. Oh, you know, some of our affiliates at Planned Paranoid, we don't do abortions. Okay, well then, well then you don't have anything to worry about. Present those facts, that you don't do and don't intend to do abortions, and be done with it. the other question was, in regard to, oh, equal protection, under the law. Oh, you know, well, not all these abortion businesses are being defunded. Listen, Congress controls the spending. It has the right to draw lines. As long as all those on one side of the line are being treated, you know, the same way versus those on the other side. It doesn't mean you can't draw the line to have the law say, well, you know, here's businesses that make a certain amount or whatever other qualifications they want to put into the law, as the abortion industry, you know, they don't care about law, they don't care about logic, they don't care about any of this stuff. They just care about killing babies. So I was happy to see this decision out of the first circuit. I was expecting a victory like this. and, I think we'll see more victories on this, because the bottom line is the people don't. People in America don't want to pay for somebody else's abortion, even if they think it's a right, at least in certain circumstances, but they don't want to be the ones paying for it. And, we shouldn't be having our money going to that kind of a practice.

Father Frank Pavone: Christian taxpayers should not fund abortions

Jenna Ellis: Well said. Well, we have to take a break here, but, Father Frank Pavone always appreciate, your thoughts overall and absolutely, I mean there's, there, has been few commentaries on, you know, the representation for, ah, Christian taxpayers to say, you know, I certainly don't want any of my tax dollars going, to pay for abortions or funding evil or funding anything that is antithetical to, to how the government should operate in a legitimate moral society under the truth of the Lord. So this is, at least a great opinion. And, in the midst of, you know, the, the malevolence of this weekend, at least we're seeing, some good news. So always appreciate it. Again, follow, Frank Pavone at Fr. Frank Pavone on X and elsewhere and also follow priests for life. They're doing such great work. And we will be right back with more. We're living in a time when truth is under attack. Lies are easy to tell, easy to spread and easy to believe. But truth, truth is costly. And nowhere is the cost greater than for mothers in crisis. When a woman is told abortion is her only option, silence and lies surround her. But when she walks into a preborn network clinic, she's met with compassion, support, and the truth about the growing life inside her. That moment of truth happens through a free ultrasound and it's a game changer when A mother sees her baby and hears that heartbeat, it literally doubles the chance she will choose life. Preborn network clinics are on the front lines, meeting women in their darkest hour, loving them, helping them choose life and sharing the truth. Friend, this is not the time to be silent. It is the time for courage, for truth and for life. Just $28 provides one ultrasound and the opportunity for a mother to see her baby. To help her choose truth and choose life. Please donate today. Call £250 and say baby. That's £250 baby. Or give online@ah preborn.com afr that's preborn.com afr.

Jenna Ellis: Islam has been getting out of control recently

Welcome back to Jenna Ellis in the Morning on American Family Radio.

Jenna Ellis: Welcome back. And as we've been discussing, the utter and complete lack of respect for human life has been on display this weekend and over the last few months and I would even say the last few years, especially specifically, Islam has been getting out of control and we've seen a lot of violence perpetrated by Muslims. And you have to remember that Islam is not just a religion. It is actually a government system. It is a way of life. I did an entire show on this with a former Muslim who actually was born and grew up in Iran and thankfully became a Christian and is now talking about the truth of Islam. And you can go back to afr.net or go to our app and download that episode and listen to it with Sharam Haitian. Really important information but as we mentioned in the beginning, over the last 24 hours a Muslim has killed three Americans in Syria. Five Muslims arrest were arrested for plotting a massacre at a Christmas market in Germany. A Paris concert was canceled due to Muslim violence. Violence. Two Muslims murdered 12 people at a Hanukkah party in Australia. this is just showing a worldwide problem, and I think a rising conflict with Islam and the West. So let's welcome in raw egg nationalist. he is an anon on social media. his real name is Charles Cornishdale and we appreciate him so much. He's a prolific author and writer and is also in the UK so has a unique perspective coming from that area and region. And so with the rise of this specific type of violence, what do you attribute this to? And good morning.

Raw Egg Nationalist: it's great to be back speaking with you Jenna. So yeah, I think what's interesting actually I think is that this is new I think to most Americans. I mean obviously there were the nine, 11 attacks, you know, a spectacular instance of, of Islamic terror on the American homeland. Thousands killed, you know, launched the global war on terror which lasted two decades and, and you know, drained huge amounts of blood and treasure from the US and didn't really achieve very much at all. But actually I think that you know, it's in Europe really where we've, where we've seen the, the real kind of cultural, religious fault lines emerge over decades. Europeans have a much deeper experience, I think, of the incompatibility of Islam with Western Christian civilization. You only need to look at something like the grooming gang scandal in the uk, you know, this terrible, terrible stain on the national soul and the national reputation of Britain. Tens of thousands of maybe even more than tens of thousands, maybe hundreds of thousands of young white working class girls deliberately targeted, sexually abused, raped and even murdered by south, Asian Muslim immigrants and the, and the you know, sons and grandsons of South Asian Muslim immigrants simply for being white non Muslims. so I mean in. And we've also had terror attacks, regular terror attacks in Europe, the July 7th bombings in London, which were devastating, attacks on Christmas markets, the Bataclan massacre in Paris, lorry attack in Nice. I mean it's been coming thick and fast for a long time. But I think that Americans actually are only just starting to wake up, I think to this sort of fundamental incompatibility. You know, you're starting to see, particularly in the aftermath of the October 7 attacks with all of these sort of Palestinian, pro Palestinian marches across the US on university campuses. But then events in places like Dearborn, Michigan and also in Minnesota, you know, where you've got this huge, huge Somali population which is involved in all sorts of fraud and political, kind of back, back door dealings and all this kind of stuff. So it's been, it's been a long time brewing. But I think, but I think that fundamentally it is, it is about the nature of Islam and how different Islam is from Christianity. Like you say Islam is a totalizing religion. you know, you have a separation of church and state in Christianity and that's allowed the development of government independent of, independently of religion. I mean it took a long time, it took the length of the Middle Ages for us to end up with a, with a real kind of notion of secular government that is, that is separate from the religious beliefs of of the citizenry but nevertheless reflects its values in many ways. but that's never happened in Islam. And I Don't. I don't think that Muslim practitioners really anywhere in the world, have that kind of idea. So we are talking about, I think, fundamental clash of values. And even. I think even when Muslims aren't necessarily violent, I think they nevertheless, sympathize with violence. I think that they never, nevertheless, they condone violence against their enemies. And they do see non Muslims. Muslims as being, apostates. Because of course, you know, Muslims believe basically that everybody was originally created a Muslim by God. And so if you convert to Islam, you're actually what's known as a revert, meaning you've reverted back to Islam from apostasy. So, I think. I think it's. I think we are definitely talking about a fundamental clash of values, a fundamental clash of orientations. And increasingly in the west, throughout the west, whether we're talking about America or Australia, as the population of Muslims within the country grows, the hostility grows too. So you start off, you know, with small numbers, and it seems like it's okay. They build up demographic, strength through immigration and through reproduction over generations. And all of a sudden they become much more brazen, much more open in their hostility. And you get, you know, deadly, deadly attacks like we've seen over the last couple of days and weeks.

I think rise of secularism has allowed Islam to come in

Jenna Ellis: Yeah. And it's interesting that you bring up the. The notion of secular government and And how we have, progressed, if I can use that term kind of in air quotes, as an overall, you know, Western society, because I actually see that as part of the fundamental problem. And so while we had, as you rightly point out, you know, in the Middle Ages and And even, you know, earlier on with, you know, coming out of the Roman Empire and all of this, this kind of, miscon. Construing of a, Of a church that was over the state and you had this kind of, intertwining that the jurisdictions were not separate as our founders here in America understood. the jurisdiction of the church and the jurisdiction of the civil government are distinct. and yet we. We have for too long viewed government, at least here in America. I think the UK has done the same thing. you know, Ireland, France, I mean, you know, across Europe, that the secular state is then what we need to strive for and eliminating, God and morality in society. And that's why we are in the problem that we're in today. Because government cannot be secular and eradicate God and morality. Otherwise we're left with suggesting that anybody's religion should be codified. Into law or not codified at all. And we're left kind of adrift, without a moral compass. And what America uniquely understood and recognized is that we have to understand the law of nature and the nature and nature's God, and we have to put the principal proper jurisdictional values, into the church and also to the state. And I think it's the rise of secularism that has allowed Islam to come in. Because if we were truly a Christian nation in recognizing that God is the ultimate authority, and you know, uk, the UK used to be a Christian nation as well, we wouldn't have allowed this type of infiltration to begin with. And we certainly would never allow Sharia law, to be in pockets like what we've seen in Dearborn, Michigan and other places in the United States. So it's actually the rise of a secular government that I think has yielded now to welcoming, this type of frankly, enemy within. And if we don't understand the, the truth about the morality of civil government, this is only going to continue.

Raw Egg Nationalist: Yes. And, you know, I, I think people also, I think, have some funny ideas about the American founding. I mean, you know, when the founders were talking about a separation between church and state, they could never have envisaged that America would be anything other than a Christian nation. You know, they were talking about different Christian denominations and not favoring one over the other, but, but they didn't have any conception that actually what you might then have is 80,000 Muslims, in Minnesota. Not that Minnesota was, you know, part of America, the founding. But, you know, so, I mean, people, you know, it's, it's one thing to say, look, we, you know, we shouldn't discriminate among Christian denominations. And another thing to say we should have every single one of the world religions in our country. And also what we should actually have is we should have a large aggressive minority moving towards perhaps, you know, in decades or maybe a century, a majority of people who actually have absolute, who share absolutely no values with us and who actually just want to destroy our system. And you know, in the uk, for example, now you've seen moves towards an Islamic, basically an Islamic blasphemy law where you have Islamic members of parliament saying, look, we need to codify into law, we need to have a blasphemy law against any form of insult against the Prophet Muhammad or, or the Quran or, or, Islam as a religion. You know, I mean, that, you know, that, that would have been unthinkable decades ago. But the thing is, you know, even in the Middle of the last century. But because of demographic change. This is the big driver is demographic change. then it is now currently thinkable and you have in the British Parliament, single issue MPs. There was a big split, at the last general election because of Israel, Palestine, where the Labour Party, the traditionally left wing party which generally wins the, the Muslim vote, people actually broke away from, from the Labour Party because they said the Labour Party wasn't tough enough on, on Gaza and wasn't, you know, was supporting both sides, was supporting Israel as well as the Palestinians. And so you had independent mps who won seats purely on the basis of their stance towards Gaza. I mean, we're seeing this kind of reorientation actually of Western politics away from domestic issues to the Third World. And you know, there's a, there's a, there's a mantra that's kind of common on, on Twitter and social media. Import the Third World, become the Third World. And that is really what is happening. You know, we've imported large numbers of people from the third World, and they've brought their politics and they're reorientating, they're reorienting domestic politics actually a way from these Western nations. So you've got, you know, we've got this big, developing Somali corruption case in Minnesota where huge amounts of money, huge amounts of remittances have been pouring back into somalia from the U.S. u.S. Taxpayer money that's then being used to fund Al Shabaab, an Islamic terrorist organization. I mean, it's crazy. I mean, if. Imagine trying to explain that to Thomas Jefferson. Imagine trying to tell George Washington, you know, this is what America's going to be like in 250 years.

Jenna Ellis: It just as you, you're absolutely right. It's absurd. And you're also absolutely right that the problem is that we are importing our own demise, across the west, or Christendom as it used to be known. and this is why fundamentally, not only should we be looking at, the areas of returning God to society, we need to return to being a Christian nation in terms of the morality of our laws and not, looking to someone else's or some other system of government and its laws, including Sharia law, blasphemy laws, you know, some of these other things, but we also need to encourage, at least here in America, the America first agenda that includes mass deportations and not importing, people with different ideas that refuse to assimilate into, American society and want to bring the values, the custom, the culture the religion, the, the law and preferences of their society into America. Otherwise we're seeing in real time raig that this clash of culture cannot coexist. And I think for far too long the left and now somehow increasingly on the right, we're believing this lie that somehow all of these different views and systems can, can, peaceably be compatible with each other and they simply can't. One is going to win out. And when you are the pacifist and you keep saying, well, no, you know, that the First Amendment suggests that we have to, you know, allow anybody to come into this country, say anything they want and, and you are the total pacifist, then you're going to lose to the worldview perspective that wants to dominate and literally kill you, like what we're seeing with the rise of, this type of violence. And so I think that immigration is a key issue to this aspect of worldview.

Raw Egg Nationalist: Oh yeah, absolutely. I mean it's. It's only been through immigration that we've, that we've reached this, this juncture. It's been mass immigration. I mean, in the UK we've, you know, after the Second World War, large numbers of Pakistani people were brought to the UK to work in the north in factories and textile factories and other factories. but really it's since 1997, since Tony Blair's new Labour government and the real beginning of the, of the mass immigration policy, that these trends have accelerated to such an extent, you know, within a generation, within a generation, then the demographics of Britain have been fundamentally altered. And the projections for the future, for the near future, for the next few decades are, dire. Really, really dire in the uk, in France, in other European countries. You know, we could be, could be looking at, you know, white, white minorities, and, and mus. And Islam basically being a, you know, a significant, demographic, force and also obviously for that reason, a significant political force. We're only seeing the beginning really I think, of the rise of, of an Islamic influence over European politics. So I think Americans really need to look to, to Europe as a warning. Europe is a warning that assimilation does not work. We've tried to assimilate for decades and decades, millions, tens of millions of people, especially from the Third World, from places like Pakistan, the subcontinent, and also from Africa who just can't be assimilated. And it's, it's leading to catastrophe, really. To catastrophe, to bloodshed, to catastrophe, to the replacement of the native populations of European nations. So I think Americans do really need to pay attention to what's gone wrong in Europe and if they can do something about it. And that does obviously involve, a new immigration policy. It involves deportations, and it involves changes, I think, to, the kind of people that America lets in and allows to come to the US in the first place.

Jenna Ellis: Absolutely. Well, we have to take a break here, but, raw egg nationalists M. So, so accurate. And I think we also need to recognize that in addition to this type of policy, with immigration, with understanding who we let into the society, we also have to, recognize, what type of society we want, to be. And we need to seriously roll back this notion of a secular government, secular society. We have to get back to the truth of the laws of nature and of nature's God, which recognizes that God is the, ultimate lawgiver. He is the divine authority. And we need to get back to the legitimacy of civil government, also the church in society and also the family. And we have to become very, very serious about worldview in this country. We'll be right back with more.

Jenna Ellis returns to American Family Radio with Pastor John Amonchukwu

welcome back to Jenna Ellis in the Morning on American Family Radio.

Jenna Ellis: Welcome back. And, you know, I was just telling my producer Adam during the break that, days like today where we see just so much evil in the world and we have to sift through terrible headlines and comment on things that are just absolutely horrific. I am so grateful for American Family Radio and the fact that we can talk about these things on this network from a truthful biblical worldview perspective. Because if the only news that you are getting is from, you know, maybe at best a conservative or Republican or point of view, that is not going to tell you the whole story. That is not going to give you the solutions that are found only in the redemptive gospel of Christ, that is not going to, to explain what's going on in the world from the truth of the reality to which we're presented. And the reason that I am a Christian, as I've always said, like what C.S. lewis writes in Mere Christianity, is not just because I believe in the God of the Bible, but because I recognize that the Christian gospel message is the only one that explains the reality to which we're presented. And the reality today is so dark and bleak. And we've been talking for months now about the assassination of Charlie Kirk that's still rocking, this country in, in so many different ways. And, if we did not have the hope of the truth of the gospel of Christ, and knowing that there is hope in, salvation and in spending eternity with Christ. this is how you get to a depression, to hopelessness, and to a, ultimately to a lack of respect for human life. And so I'm just so grateful that we can talk about these things, with the truth at the fore and and more. Churches obviously need to be doing this, not just teaching what they think are feel good messages or, you know, how to live your life in a motivational TED Talk, but they need to be speaking to the headlines of today in the sense of speaking to the heart of where individuals and our country is also at. And I saw this statistic on X this weekend, that shows a, ah, data From a AH, PRI 2023 clergy survey, in cooperation with the Cooperative election study of 2024 that says basically, a person who is sitting in the pews of a mainline church in America is three times more likely to identify as a conservative Republican compared to their pastor. The pastor is nearly twice as likely to identify as a liberal Democrat. Now if that doesn't tell you the utter state of the American church, I don't know what will. But let's welcome in Pastor John Amonchukwu, who is a preacher and author and he's also part of TP USA Faith and is someone who definitely does not, back down from speaking the truth or shy away from that. And Pastor John, I just find this, very revealing why the church in America today seems to be so weak and ineffective.

John Amanchukwu: Jenna, thank you so much for having me on. What a joy it is to be with you.

Berean: Many pastors confuse compassion with compromise in sermons

There, there, there are many reasons why this has taken place. number one, fear of man is driving the divide. Proverbs 29:25 says, the fear of man bringeth a snare. And so pastors fear, fear cancellation, but people fear God. The pew reads scripture and votes conscience. The pulpit often hesitates where scripture speaks clearly. So that's one of the leading reasons why this has taken place. In addition, many pastors confuse compassion with compromise. Ephesians 4:15 tells us to speak the truth and love. But compassion without truth becomes sentimental deception. And the pew still believes sin is sin and truth is truth. However, some pastors soften doctrine to avoid offense. In addition, pastors spend more time with elites, but people live with consequences. Isaiah 10, verse one tells us, Woe unto them m that decree unrighteous decrees. Pastors often move in nonprofit, academic or activist circles. The people in the pew live with crime, inflation, broken schools and collapsing families. The sheep connect policy to pain. But pastors often speak in abstract manners. And so the pastors have to get back to expounding upon the word of God, preaching expositional sermons, calling sin sin, calling evil evil, and calling things that are demonic, demonic. You know, I recently did that in a sermon. I was speaking on a TPUSA faith platform, talking about a person who has been doing some evil and demonic things. And I received a firestorm of people, angry at me, upset with me, people unfollowed me. I've never received so many hateful comments in my life. But, hey, I've been preaching the Bible for 22 years and, you know, the word evil is in the Bible nearly 680 times. In the new King James Version, the word, demon or devil is mentioned nearly 70 times. So why are people alarmed that I would label what Candace Owens is doing currently right now as demonic and evil? But I can't back away from it because it is the truth. And that's the same thing that these pastors need to do in their congregations.

Jenna Ellis: M. Amen and amen. And, we do need to be calling evil evil. And yet, and I saw it. I saw that, the clip that went viral and the hate, that you received, that was just, completely unfounded. And it showed to me, Pastor John Amanchuku, my special guest this morning, that so many people are so deceived, even those who may call themselves Christians or think that they're on the side of, you know, what's right. It seems like the deception of this age is so advanced compared to, what may have been, present even, you know, 70, 80 years ago in this country where people used to have at least a little bit more discernment overall. And. And perh. Perhaps it was because pastors were teaching some of these, you know, kind of fire and brimstone or at least very, pointed scripturally sufficient messages. the family, the nuclear family was intact overall in society. But, do you see a great deception that has come across, especially, I mean, I think worldwide, but especially here in America today?

John Amanchukwu: Yes, I have. You know, second Timothy, chapter four, verse two says, preach the word the instant in season and out of season, reprove, rebuke, exhort, with all long suffering and doctrine, for the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine. We're at that place now. It goes on to say, but after their own lust shall heap to themselves teachers having itching ears, and they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and. And shall be turned unto fables, fables meaning fiction, tales, lies, gossip, innuendo. they shall become fans of people who like to insinuate things while claiming that they're just asking questions. You know, that's where we are today. This is biblical. The apostle Paul, bequeathed this message to his understudy Timothy to remind him of what would take place. So we can't be alarmed by it. We can't be caught off guard by it. We just. We have to know that this has been prophesied and spoken of in scripture, and we have to address it. Paul also told us that after his departure that grievous wolves would come in, not sparing the flock. There will be people that come into the Christian church that want to rip the church to shreds. And so we have to be sensitive to the voice of the spirit, know what the Bible says. We have to become Berean. We have to be men and women of Berea who search the scriptures and, have a clear understanding of what God has said so that we're not duped.

Jenna Ellis: Amen to that as well. And we can see that, progression into utter depravity in Romans 1, where Paul says that he's not ashamed of the Gospel of Christ because it is the power of God that brings salvation to everyone who believes. but when we. Who knew God, and. And who know God and, And I would say, you know, as a. As a Christian nation, when we are turning from him and don't glorify him or give thanks, but become as. As, Romans 1 says, become futile, in our thinking. And the foolish hurts that were darkened. They claimed to be wise but became fools. They exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like mortal human beings and birds and animals and reptiles. But God gives, then gives them over to their sinful desires. And this is the key, I think, Pastor John. They exchanged the truth for a lie. And that's what we're seeing so often with a lot of these, these influencers and all of these. I mean, and whether we want to talk about, you know, the. The heinous headlines of, you know, the murder of Charlie Kirk to the murder of Rob Reiner just last night. I mean, all the. The rise of Muslim, violence, you know, to even just the. The people who say, oh, I'm just asking questions that are exchanging. Actually pursuing truth for a lie. These people that are following Candace Owens, I will stand with you and say it is utterly evil. What should she is doing? She is exchanging truth for a lie. And the people that are following her, I believe, are greatly deceived. And this is where we have to, as Christians, pray for discernment in this moment.

John Amanchukwu: Yes, you, you're so right. just. Just think about how sin entered into the world in Genesis, chapter three. You know, it says verse one. Now, the serpent was more subtle than any beast of the field which the Lord God had made.

John Amanchukwu: Christians must seek discernment and seek truth

And he said unto the woman, yea, hath God said, you shall not eat of every tree of the garden. He knew, he knew that he was trying to off put her and to create, division and to create this mindset where maybe God didn't say what he said, you know, just, just trying to throw her off. And we've heard it said before that there's no such thing as a dumb question or a bad question. But, I think we need to go back and reassess that. We saw sin come into the world through a serpent, a subtle serpent, asking questions, but not simply asking questions, but intentionally sowing discord. That's what he was doing.

Jenna Ellis: did God really say.

John Amanchukwu: Yes, did, did God really say it? You know, is, did you hear that the right way? You know, and then the woman said to the serpent, we may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden, but of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, you shall not eat of it, neither shall you touch it, lest you die. And the serpent said unto the woman, you shall not surely die. And see, there it is misleading the heart of Eve with the intent of duping her, causing division and causing her to fall out of the grace of God. These people who do this, Jenna, they are operating under seducing spirits. These are spirits that are charismatic, that are articulate, that are winsome. You know, rat poison is 99% good ingredients, but it's the 1% that will kill you. And we have to be mindful of this.

Jenna Ellis: Yes, absolutely. And we're already out of time. Pastor John, we'll have to have you back on this week, hopefully, to talk more about this, especially because, Candace owns a. And Erica Kirk are meeting today in a private in person discussion. We need to be praying for that, that, all parties would come to the table in good faith, that there can be, some actually good and productive outcome to that. But the bottom line for this whole message this morning is that we as individual Christians must seek discernment and seek the truth, not go to just, the headlines or, you know, what we think maybe an influencer is saying that sounds good and right. or whatever our pastor may be speaking to or isn't speaking to. We have to be discerning Christians and seeking the truth. John Amanchukwu, thanks so much and as always you can reach me and my team. Jenna fr.mnet PreBorn's whole mission is to rescue babies from abortion and lead their families to Christ. Last year PreBorn's network of clinics saw 8,900 mothers come to Christ. Please join us in this life saving mission. To donate, go to preborn.com afr.