Sponsor Message and Introduction to Biblical Worldview and Constitutional Obligations
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Jenna Ellis Jenna Ellis in the morning on American Family Rad.
Jenna Ellis I love talking about the things of God because of truth and the biblical worldview. The U.S. constitution obligates our government to preserve and protect the rights that our founders recognize come from God our creator, not our government. I believe that scripture in the Bible is very clear that God is the one that raised up each of you and God has allowed us to be brought here to this specific moment in time.
Post-Election Analysis: Unexpected Outcomes and the GOP's Path Forward Amidst Policy Priorities
Jenna Ellis This is Jenna Ellis in the Morning.
Jenna Ellis Good morning. It is Friday, November 6th, and we are just a few days after the blue tsunami as it's being typified in the media. The Democrats, winning some unexpected races, winning, you know, of course they, they were anticipated by all accounts in the polls, to, to win some of these races. But some of the really, big surprising wins were the ousting, for example of of now former governor, Greg Abbott out of Texas. just the Senate race in Kansas of all places. I saw Meme saying they showed Kansas on, on the map, blue and said I wasn't aware that Kansas could do that, change colors. I think a lot of us really weren't. And so, you know, the questions of course are where do we go from here and how will the GOP recover? but this really isn't just about party and this isn't just about the leadership of the gop. And this ultimately comes down to the policy priorities that conservatives truly want to advocate for. And one of those major policy priorities, especially to our American family, radio audience, of course, is the issue of life. And so let's welcome in Frank Pavone, who's founder of Priests for Life. And Frank, I want to get first your overall assessment of the election, you know, kind of what happened, where do we go from here? but then also get into this question of where does the fight for life go from here?
Election Response Plan and Historical Patterns of Presidential and Congressional Power Shifts
Good morning.
Frank Pavone Yes, exactly. Good morning. so first of all, we have a five point action plan response to this election and it includes dealing, with abortion. We can talk about that. but Just as we were talking before the election and so many of our listeners came to ProLifeVote, dot com, that's gonna be kind of the cent of operations for responding to this on a, on a pro life level. And, the five point, plan of action is there for people to read. So I want to invite them, first of all to go there for beyond the bounds of this conversation, they can get a lot of info.pro life vote dot com. Now, my overall, reaction to the election is, look, you know, we knew that we were going against the pendulum of American politics. Historically, you lose seats in the midterm. Okay. You know, it's very interesting to notice that in this pendulum of American politics, if you look at the presidential races, over the last, few decades, and you look at the way that voters, voted for House and Senate, a very interesting pattern emerges when the White House changes hands, from one party to another, voters usually give the new president the Congress as well. So this happened with, President Trump, with Biden, with Clinton, with Obama. they brought Congress in with them. They had a trifecta during the first two years of their first term. Now, as a president's term goes on, the American voters tend to, whichever party we're talking about, the American voters tend to take the Congress away from the president. And so, in fact, if you look at, again, these same presidents, it's a pattern. In the last two years of their presidency, they had an opposition Congress, both House and Senate. Of course, we call it divided government. What that means, of course, is that unless it's a very, very bipartisan bill, bills are not going to get signed into law.
Critique of Democratic Agendas and the Choice Between Republican Victory and No Progress
the Congress will pass them anyway if there's something they believe in, but they're going to get vetoed. And I think the president, President Trump, is getting his veto pen ready. and, you know, what the Democrats are going to end up doing is, again, we're just talking about on the congressional level here is a whole lot of political theater. they'll take votes that'll be, you know, largely, you know, messaging votes. they'll do all sorts of, you know, fake investigations, impeachments and whatnot. But as we discuss on this program, because they embrace things that are just totally evil, such as unlimited abortion, but so many other things too, that are anti freedom and anti America. My message is this, that they shouldn't be celebrating. you know, there's a. I said during the election, I might have said it, Jenna, on your program, that this was not a choice between Republicans win or Democrats win. It was not. It was a choice between either Republicans win or nobody wins. And right now the Democrats have put themselves in a position where nobody is winning. Because the things they embrace, and this is what I pray every day they will come to realize, but they haven't come to realize it yet. What they are embracing destroys them. It destroys them. It destroys their own families, it destroys their own freedom, it destroys their own economy, it destroys their own security. and you know, apparently they've chosen to learn this the hard way. That's you know, an overall reaction.
Jenna Ellis Yeah. And absolutely. And I love the way that you framed it was Republicans win or nobody wins.
Voter Wake-Up Calls and Concerns Over Democratic Governance and Policy Priorities
And the people who were part of the Republican base that actually turned out and voted Democrat and we're seeing in a lot of these numbers and the data that's now been released that that's a significant percentage, they're going to be in for a very rude wake up call. And you know, maybe some of their priorities, certainly the Democrats priorities are just to get Trump. I mean that's been their priority since 2015. I don't think that has changed. But when it comes to actually governing, not just overplaying their hand and I think they're going to that's going to be very obvious. They're going to do all of these impeachment nonsense and you know, they were already screaming lawyer up, you know, just minutes, after all of the election drama was over. And so they're going to focus on all of that. They're going to overplay their hand. But when it comes to actually governing, that's where I'm genuinely concerned as an American. Now thankfully you and I live in the free state of Florida that actually held the line because of Governor DeSantis leadership and we are still relatively okay here in the state of Florida. But for the rest of the country, I mean there have been some really concerning shifts like I said, particularly in Texas. And so when it comes to actually governing and looking at the policy not just on the federal level and now in Congress and the Senate, but on the state level, what's the most concerning to you about perhaps the pendulum swinging back toward you know, really insane kinds of things like the trans agenda, pushing you know, all of the, the the parentage questions around the out, the aftermath of the Obergefell and gay marriage about protections for life. I mean what, where and what are you most concerned about?
Frank Pavone Well it's the Democrat trifecta that we have to be most concerned about in the first place. Because that's where, just like we were saying on the federal level, on the state level, it's true as well.
State-Level Dangers in Democrat Trifectas and Observing Legislative Actions on Abortion and Elections
That's when you get legislation passed for better or for worse. and on these extreme matters, that's the only way you get it passed. and they will do that. They will, they will. We will see more laws, I think, in these Democrat trifectas that have been created by this election, like we saw in Massachusetts just before the election, where they removed the only remaining protections in the third trimester of pregnancy for babies, in the womb. So things like that and the transgender nonsense, parental rights, all of this will be, will be in danger. Not to mention that, you know, you look at the economy and crime, these blue. The states that have become blue, cities that have become blue, my goodness, people are going to learn a hard lesson the hard way. Crime is going to, the Democrats don't know how to govern and cities are going to fall into, into disarray. Crime is going to rise. economy is going to go into shambles. Highest gas prices are in blue states. People should understand. And so they're going to just. We're just going to learn from experience. and that's where, you know, I mentioned that I grew up kind of an action plan. And the first part of that is pertinent to what you're saying right now is to watch carefully, take note, and then educate others about exactly what the Democrats are doing. Show people who the Democrats are. for example, when these legislatures, come into, action in January on the state level and also in Washington, what, for example, people should be starting to, I would say, you know, get out a notebook and start making a list or open a Word document and start making the document that says. Okay, few questions. What's the first bill they're going to introduce? Guaranteed in a lot of these places, it's going to be an abortion bill, including in Washington. Washington. I think the first bill these Democrats are going to introduce is either going to be on abortion or it's going to be about election, un. Security, unsecuring our elections. They've tried it before. they've done it before. They're going to do it again. So pay, attention though, because this. They're going to tell us who they are now.
Identifying True Intentions Through Actions and Preparing for Future Elections and Senate Dynamics
They have told us who they are in their messaging during the election season, although some of them tried to moderate it. The closer we got to last Tuesday, But we're not, we're not, we're not fooled by that. But now they're going to tell us who they are by what they do. And we need to pay attention to it, take note of it. What's the first bill they introduce? What's the second? how do the various members in that legislative body vote on these bills? Because all of this now is in preparation for the next election. You know what? That's the beautiful thing about American politics and that's a great consolation. in an election like this. And it's not something we're making up, it's not imagination. The reality is there's another federal election two years from now and that election season starts here and now and we can win back a lot of places where, where the Democrats had pickups this time.
Jenna Ellis Yeah. And I think that is the encouraging thing is that there's always the next election and at least the Democrats will not have the trifecta. on the federal level, they don't have a veto proof majority, ah, for Congress and so we still have President Trump for the next two years. so all of that is good. Governor DeSantis and have said just given the seats in the Senate that will be up in 2028, it is likely that Republicans won't regain the majority in the Senate until 2032. So the election after that, so basically the midterms after the presidential of 2028, so, so it may be more difficult to confirm, good justices, and judges, you know, do some things that only the Senate can. But at least for the presidential election and for this next election that balance of power could ah, shift back.
Federal vs. State Level Fights for Life and Identifying States for Potential Pro-Life Gains
so at least on the federal level, hopefully there won't be a brokering agreement between you know, the establishment gop, to pass legislation with the Democrats that then could be that veto override majority because they'll have to own that going into 2028. So I think if there's any sorts of deals that the establishment GOP who hates Trump is going to make with the Democrats, it's going to be m. More along the lines of the investig, the subpoenas, the the impeachment, you know, things that are targeted specifically to the Trump admin, not to their votes and what they would carry over into 2028 and beyond. So hopefully, at least, the federal level is a little more insulated. But when we're talking about the state level, which is really where the Dobbs decision provided for, the, the Fight for life, is really now at the states because it, you know, even though the federal level could have made a lot of headway over the last two years, really, the main headway that's going to be made or the losses will be at the state level. So what states in particular are you, looking at that may still actually be able to accomplish some, some gains, perhaps even after this election?
Navigating Dangers in Democrat Trifectas and Hopes in Republican Trifectas Amidst Legal Battles
Frank Pavone Yeah, well, we're starting to assess that now because we have to see, in each legislative body, you know, who has been elected and start establishing the relationships with them now. But just as we said before, that the biggest dangers are in the Democrat trifectas. the biggest hopes for pro life will be in the Republican, trifectas. And this is an arena where of course a lot of the progress or lack thereof is actually going to be, in the courts. Because we have certain states suing other states over the abortion drugs. And depending on how that, I mean, because states, you know, like Louisiana for example, that have decided that we're going to protect our unborn children, you know, are having abortionists in blue states mailing abortion drugs into their states and killing their own born children. And so it's like saying, hey, wait a second, we have a right to protect our unborn children within this state and if you facilitate the killing of one of them, we're going to hold you responsible. And so this has become a major division, ah, among the states. And this is going to be in the coming months, something that, we'll see working its way through the courts. But we're going to be issuing a challenge, both these red states to take this action and in the blue states to take this defense and it has to do with late term abortion.
Public Consensus Against Late-Term Abortion and Messaging Strategies for the Upcoming Election Cycles
We have a consensus in America against late term abortion. Most Americans oppose abortion after the first three months of the pregnancy. And rightly so. I mean, even if people, you know, take the. And it's a mistaken position that someone has the choice, you know, to kill their baby, you know, you'll have people saying, well, you know, three months is long enough to make that choice, you know, and then. But you start talking about the fourth, fifth month or beyond. No, to most people that's quite, objectionable. So why don't we build on that in the red states, let's start legislating more. I mean, we've got certain states that protect the babies, like Florida starting at about six weeks and other states starting at about 12 weeks. But we need more of them to do that. And that's going to be one of my key priorities is this focusing on all the red states and say, listen again, starting with the trifectas, get this done. And we have the consensus already among the American people that late term abortion should not be permitted. And then even pushing on the federal level now, the Democrats being in control of Congress and in these blue states, it's like, okay, they're going to pass bills making late abortion more and more accessible. But one thing they never do, and I know we've discussed it here before, is they never describe what they defend. And we're going to just double down on that message. Describe Democrats, describe what you're descending. You think this is so great. Make your arguments, pass your bills, but be honest with the American people. Read from the, we're not asking them to read from pro life materials. Read from the medical textbooks on abortion. Describe what you dissent. People hear that they're going to be totally outraged and turned off. And this is the fact that they won't do it shows they're in the wrong here. they're ashamed of the very thing that they're promoting. We need to point that out to the American voters.
Maintaining Christian Conservative Resolve and Boldness Despite Shifting Political Landscapes Post-Dobbs
I think this is a way that we end up branding the Democrat Party again going into the 2028 cycle and say this is the party of barbaric treatment of the tiniest of children. and they don't make any apologies for it, but look at them, they know deep down it's wrong because we can't even get them to describe the very thing that they are defending, promoting and, and forcing us to pay for.
Jenna Ellis Yeah. And you know, one of one of the best keys to what you just said is that Christian conservatives, for us, nothing really has changed, in terms of what we stand for, what we still advocate for, what, what resolve we still have. you know, the elections are going to sway to and fro between parties and, and all of that, but the truth doesn't change and the, the righteous policies that we advocate for haven't changed. And maybe, you know, the playing field has shifted a little bit. Certainly in some of the states, maybe it's a little more difficult now, but it's a lot less difficult than it was before the Dobbs decision. So we can't forget that huge, ah, historic win. and that was because of President Trump and because he was elected in 2016 and he was able to nominate those justices that made that a priority and ah, and held in a way that, was constitutional and was ultimately correct on the issue of life. And so we can't shrink back now and just say, okay, well, because, Republicans aren't as popular now as they were maybe two years ago, then that House. That somehow changes our boldness. I think we need to be even more bold right now. And to say, you know, this isn't about supporting a party or not or, you know, whatever. This is ultimately about the truth. This is about standing firm for what's right. And this is about ensuring that we still make a difference. Absolutely.
Frank Pavone And one of the ways we do that is what I call the phase two of civic participation after voting. It's lobbying. If you voted to put people in office, you went into the voting move to do that.
Phases of Civic Participation: Lobbying and Witnessing Against Undesirable Policies in Public Offices
Now you have to go into their office. If someone was elected in your district or your state that you did not vote for, you went into the voting booth. Now you have to go into their office and be a witness against them. And it's not necessarily to persuade them. I mean, I'm not expecting people in Michigan to go persuade. Abdul El said not to be a jihadist. he is a jihadist, and he's going to continue, on that track. but you can go in there and listen. You live in Michigan. He's, a sense senator representing that state. You make your objections known in person, face to face with his, with his staff. And this is true on the state level. Like we were just talking about these states where these Democrat pro abortion bills will be introduced or pro, trans or whatever, anti parental rights, whatever it's going to be. Go. This is the election, the voting booth. You go in there once. Right. Or whether it's early voting or on election day. Okay, that has now passed for this cycle. But you can go into their offices any day of the week and go into their local offices. You know, I often say to people when I walk the halls of Congress in Washington, the halls are usually empty. I mean, and every one of the doorways, whether on the House side or the Senate side, has the same sign at the door. And it says, welcome, please come. in and let that resonate with us. Now let's go in. And again, it's not necessarily to persuade. It's to witness. And it may be to express severe, opposition, disagreement, always, of course, with kindness and respect. But that doesn't mean we don't have clarity and that we don't have passion. And we have to go in there and do this. I think that it'll Give people a feeling like, hey, there is something I can do. My voice is, I'm not going to sit here. Let's put it this way. The only thing worse that have these Democrats do all the evil that they're going to do on the federal and state level is that we let them do it in secret.
Jenna Ellis M.
Exposing Works of Darkness and Implementing Plans for Civic Engagement and Christian Witness
Frank Pavone Don't let them do it in secret. Go there. We let them do it unopposed. Right? So it can't be unopposed and it can't be in secret because we're going to go in there and we're going to let them know we oppose it and we are going to then tell the world about it. because that's how then, you know, we take this back in 2028. It's like, okay, you guys are going to do this. This is going to destroy you. And it's going to destroy you because not because we're going to do anything evil against you. We don't do evil. We expose, Ephesians 5:11, expose the works of darkness. I want to really call on our people here to do exactly that, make a plan to do that. Maybe we never visited our state legislator's office. Maybe we never visited our federal legislators. Are. Now's the time. This is the season to do that more than ever. And again, we're going to implement this whole plan, on our behalf in our organization. At ProLifeVote.com, we invite people to participate. But I think, Jenna, I think that's the path forward for giving, like you say, this Christian witness in the civic arena.
Engaging More Actively Post-Election to Secure Blessings of Liberty for All, Including the Unborn
Jenna Ellis Yeah. So well said. And we've got to take a break here, but, Frank Pavone. So well said, because this is the time now that instead of, being discouraged and saying, okay, well, you know, my vote didn't matter, or, you know, we've lost and all of that, this is the time to double down and to say we are going to be even more engaged than ever. So that when 2028 comes around, not only can we have some significant wins, but we will be even more invested in the process. Because politics is not the end goal, is not for its own sake. It is so that we can secure the blessings of liberty. And that includes the blessings of liberty to, the. To those who can't advocate for themselves, including the unborn. We've got to continue to stand up for Christian and conservative policy. And so again, you can go to, pro life vote.com and I love, what you have on here. Frank Pavone of, you know, all of these plans this five step plan to respond to this election and you and by saying, we need you. Yes, the fight still needs every single one of us. First and foremost in prayer, but also in action. We'll be right back with more.
Listener Support and the Question of Conservatism's Shift Towards Popularity Over Core Principles
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Jenna Ellis welcome back to Jenna Ellis in the Morning on American Family Radio.
Jenna Ellis Welcome back. Well, as we're talking about conservative policy and being focused on still advocating for the truth, standing up for conservative values, we have to ask the question, when did conservatism, kind of move out of the way of the spotlight in favor of just popularity? And that has been a question, especially from 2024 election and onward and when, you know, Trump has had kind of the loyalty tests and it's been a lot of personality and populism over some core policies.
The Cost of Political Cheerleading Replacing Core Values and an Honest Reckoning of Election Losses
And there's a really excellent article in the Daily Wire, by my next guest, Tim Chapman, who is the president of Advancing American Freedom. And the headline is this is the cost when Political Cheerleading Replaces Core Values. And he says, this process, begins, and the restoration of our movement begins with an honest reckoning of what went wrong. This isn't a narrow defeat. Democrats won Senate seats in South Carolina and Kansas, which that one surprised me along with every statewide office in Texas, Mississippi is coming down to the wire. Some will claim that the party in power always loses seats in a midterm election. Others will point to the unique dynamics of a particular races, from retiring incumbents to less than stellar candidates. These factors are relevant, Tim argues, but not determinative. The unifying thread, tying the losses together, the conservative movement has lost its way. So, Tim Chapman, I could not agree with you more.
Concerns Over 2024 Election Dynamics: Personality Over Policy and the GOP's Core Conservative Values
I think that a lot of us were saying this even in the hesitancy initially to embrace, President Trump in 2016. I was a TED cruiser initially. Everybody knows that, for this exact reason. But, you know, we had Vice President Mike Pence who was there to say, okay, he's, he's the Christian and he's representing our interests. And then, you know, with the Great American Comeback, as, as Trump touted it in 2024, the biggest concern was that the GOP as a party didn't actually have and keep core conservative values. As its mission. And I think that is a really important focus on what needs to happen next.
Tim Chapman Absolutely, Absolutely. Jenna, thanks for having me on. look, I wrote that piece because I think it's time for conservatives to do some soul searching.
2024 Election Analysis: Unleashing Inner ID and the Impact of Departing from Conservative Principles
You look at 2024, and you look at the election of President Trump, and a lot of conservatives were excited. but I think what happened was people cast those ballots. Remember, we had just gone through four years with President Biden and an anemic economy at, ah, best, you know, inflation, a president that was out of touch. And when people cast a ballot for President Trump in 2024, I think a lot of them were thinking about the Trump economy, and the Trump administration from 2016 to 2020. And what they got instead was an administration that was determined to unleash the inner ID of the president himself. and they looked back at their 2016-2020 record, and they thought, oh, there were too many people around the president that were challenging the president on various ideas. And, we need to create an environment in the second term where the president's instincts are what guide the entire movement. I think that was a really bad decision. I think President Trump benefited greatly in his first term from having a diversity of opinion around him. And you can disagree or agree with the cabinet officials that were in that first administration or the staff or whatever, but the product was better, especially when it came to the economy and especially when it came to foreign policy. And the product that we're seeing now is all over the map. And there are a lot of instances that I see of the president, who has, by the way, been very clear with people that he's not ideologically a conservative, he's a pragmatist, and he's a deal cutter, and he. And he kind of flies by the seat of his pants in terms of his own instincts. and that. That has created an environment in the second term where you've seen real departures.
Policy Departures and the Dangers of Outsourcing a Movement's Soul to One Political Personality
I mean, you saw it very early on when they were putting together the GOP platform before the President was even elected. the president's team said, we need to water down the life provisions within the GOP platform. There were efforts to water down talk, about entitlement reform and getting the federal debt and deficit, under control in the GOP platform. And then you saw actual policy departures in the second administration. You saw the embrace of sort of a big government, national conservative, populist economic agenda, and you had Liberation Day tariffs. That did not help in these elections. We saw that for certain. You see the federal government taking ownership stakes in 41 different private companies right now. You see the White House floating populist economic proposals for price controls in the free market. you see, you know, the ideas around potentially a universal basic income for, stay at home moms. You see all sorts of stuff that looks m like it might test well in polls, but it ends up hurting the people that it help, that it intends to help. And so I think this is the problem when you outsource the heart and soul of your movement to one political personality. And we can, you know, all agree to disagree on whether Trump's the best or Trump's not good or what your personal opinion is on him. but I think we can all agree that a movement should be about more than one person and the way that he wakes up and looks at a particular place political issue on any one day.
Jenna Ellis Yeah, 100%.
Negotiating with Pro-Life Voters and the Republican Party's Commitment to Conservative Principles
And, you know, we can acknowledge that President Trump did a lot for, for evangelicals, for conservatives, for the pro life movement, and say, you know, that was also part of perhaps some of the negotiating and the brokering. And so then when the president, as you rightly point out in your piece, walked away from the right to life and treated pro life voters as an afterthought in 2024, because then the Republican Party, you know, watered down those pro life, planks, then we have to ask, where are the conservative principles and what is the standard? Is it just the whim of the art of the deal that favors him and, and whoever happens to be around him, or is this the party that's actually going to stand firm? And the GOP has historically, been reined in because such a huge percentage of its base are conservative evangelical Christians. And when we say we're not going to force you to hold that line, then we're allowing the populist whim to drive the policy.
Correcting the Ship: Moving Beyond Personality Politics to Core Values for 2028 and Beyond
So how do we correct this ship and for 2028 and beyond, have that resolve to say, okay, we've got to get away from the personality politicking and the cheerleading and come back to just good common sense, core values?
Tim Chapman Yeah, I, look, I think the first step is a focus on what we actually believe and what our principles are. you cannot expect, your leaders to do the right thing if you don't prepare the soil in which those leaders grow up beforehand. So we're in that time now of tilling the soil between now and 2020. So the focus right now for conservatives needs to be how do we create an environment in which our eventual leader that emerges, is, is, is, is connected to the values that we all care about.
Intra-Family Conversation: Conservatives Need to Re-Engage on Life, Free Markets, and Foreign Policy
So people need to be engaged and they need to, you know, on the life issue, we need a re. Engagement from the pro life community. On the free markets and limited government issue, we need a recovery of what it means to be a limited government conservative. On the foreign policy issues, we need to talk clearly about what the value of allies are, and how we use American strength and how we achieve peace through strength globally. All of that is critical. And we're in this period now, Jenna, where the soul searching and the intra family conversation I believe is the most important conversation going on in the country. We know what the Democrats will do for the next two years. They're going to misinterpret their mandates, they're going to overreach and at the end of the day I think the policies of the Democrats will be promoting our policies that are out of step with the American people. don't forget in this election you talked about it at the top here. You know, we lost in some real red states.
Ballot Measure Successes Contrasting with Election Results: Repudiation of Personality-Centered Movements
Yeah, we lost, you know, and then we lost, you know, statewide in states like Wisconsin, Ohio, North Carolina, Texas, other states. And in those states, the thing that I found fascinating that was that there were ballot measures that were extremely conservative. Ballot measures to limit the size and scope of government in the state, ballot measures to cap tax rates, ballot measures for voter id. Good, strong ballot measures were conservative. They passed in those states while the states still voted for Democrats. So I don't believe that the American people are signing up for a DSA like platform for the next two, four, six years. I believe what the American people were saying where we don't like a movement that's centered around one political personality, President Trump, and it was a repudiation of that kind of movement that had outsourced his principles to one person. So we have an opportunity here to build a better and different kind of movement. And people should not be cheap dates and sign up for whoever they think the next person to be coronated as leader of the movement is. We need the conversation, we need to vet our leaders.
Creating a Contract with Leaders and Establishing Expectations for Conservative Representation
We need to actually tell them what our values are and set the expectation. Finally, if you back up, back up to 2015 and before we got in, before President Trump won the 2016 election, I actually think that the movement did a very good job of basically creating an environment where there was a contract with President Trump. President Trump knew he needed to appoint pro life judges. He knew he needed to Pursue, tax reform. He knew he needed to pursue a deregulation agenda and he knew he needed to stick by his allies. That was a contract, with the President and the president, because he had good people around him, mostly, mostly adhered to that contract. We ripped the contract up going into 2024 and we deluded ourselves into thinking that one man could bring permanent political success for us. And I just think that was the wrong way to do it. So we need to get back to the idea that we are going to create a contract. And anyone who wants to represent conservatives in this party needs to understand the terms of that contract before they become the leader of this party.
Vetting Future Nominees and Addressing the MAGA Base's Transition into Conservative Mindsets
Jenna Ellis Yeah, absolutely. I could not agree more. And I just want to underscore that, that the next presidential nominee should not be someone who is coordinated or just because they have the Trump endorsement means that there is no conversation and everybody on social media is silencing everybody else, just saying, well, this is the person that we're going to nominate. No, we need to take a really hard look and genuinely, as you said, Tim, vet the next person to know that they will have the policy courage to stand firm and to say, these are our priorities based on principle and here's what we're going to get done. So when you look at the demographic of Republican voters and some of these, registered Republicans that now, as we're seeing in the exit polling and all of, what, what the data is on the midterm election that some and a significant percentage of registered Republicans ended up voting Democrat, to me, one of the things that this highlights is the MAGA base that became Republican because they followed the personality of Trump, were not genuinely converted into Republican mindset and a conservative mindset.
Converting New Voters Through Policy Execution and Painting a Clear Contrast with the Left
they were following along and then as soon as they don't like the personality, they'll go and vote for the opponent. So they're, they're kind of fair weather voters. so with that and also what you're talking about, of making sure that conservatives, true conservatives, know what our principles are and will turn out and vote our values. How do we have a majority just in terms of the math, but actually assimilate people into the core of conservative values?
Tim Chapman Well, it's all about policy and execution. Okay, so I think that was the great tragedy here of the last two years, is, as you pointed out, Jenna, President Trump, and I think we need to give him credit for this, brought new voters into the Republican coalition that had traditionally been Democratic voters. But they came into the coalition mostly because they were looking, looking especially on the economic side, at what had. What had successfully occurred in the first Trump administration. And the only way to convert them is results. So your ideas need to matter and your ideas need to work.
Maintaining Coalitions Through Policy Execution and Commitment to Values Post-Election Setbacks
So we will have an opportunity over the next two years because, as I said earlier, the Democrats will overreach. The American people have not bought into this DSA platform. We will have an opportunity to paint a clear contrast between what the left is offering and what the right can offer. But then you need to execute. If you had executed, if the last two years we didn't go on these exploratory ventures with things like Liberation Day tariffs, if we weren't pushing all these different, other populist, agenda items, if we were not, falling back from our commitment to life and our commitment to values, I think you could keep those people in the coalition. But the people in the coalition that came that were sort of Joni. Come lately to the Republican Party, they fell away because nothing was working and they felt it and then they voted it. So execution policy, a commitment to your values is the way you keep the coalition together.
Jenna Ellis Yeah. And last question for you, Tim.
Engaging Evangelical Christians and Catholic Conservatives in the Conversation for Future Leadership
And again, this article is so great and I would encourage listeners, to read it. It's in the Daily Wire. This is the cost when political cheerleading replaces core values by my guest, Tim Chapman. I read that in the Daily Wire. Follow him. And also advancing American freedom on X. but when you're looking then at the conversation for 2028, who should be involved in that conversation in terms of looking at the next generation or the next era of leadership?
Tim Chapman So before I, you know, before I think about who the leader could be, I think about who the people engaged should be. So I look at evangelical Christians and I look at evangelical Christians because I think that the evangelical movement has been one of the, strongest forces for good within the Republican coalition for 50 years. and the evangelical movement needs to come in to this conversation, and express their values front and center. I think I look at, I look at, Catholic conservatives who need to engage, and who need to engage, with their values. In the same way I look at the limited government part of our movement, who need to re. Engage all, all of the different coalitional, aspects that are out there need to be part of the family conversation. So what we're talking about is like what we are for before we talk about who we are for. And then you're going to see leaders out there who come in our direction. You're already seeing people throw their hat in the ring.
Creating an Environment for the Best Leaders to Rise Based on Values and Coalition Representation
I mean, you're seeing Senator Cruz throw his hat in the ring. It's sure looking like Governor Desantis, is getting more and more engaged. But our job is to create the environment that allows the best people to rise to the top. Or even if it's not the best person who rises to the top, it's a version of the person that looks more like the coalition. So we need to focus first and foremost on our values and what we care about and engage at that level.
Distilling Conservative Identity and Building Policy and Leadership Selections for the Future
If we get it right about what we are for, we will, we will ultimately get it right about who we are for.
Jenna Ellis So well said. And I hope that every conservative leader and voter will take that message to heart and actually listen to it and, and recognize that we do need to have this, you know, identity distillation moment to say, what does conservatism actually look like and mean moving forward into 2028 and then build up our policy and especially our leadership selections from there. So, Tim Chapman, as always, really appreciate it so much. And again, thank you for the work that you and everyone at Advancing America Freedom, does for this country, for policy.
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Core Principles of Civil Government: Promoting Good, Restraining Evil, and Protecting God-Given Rights
Jenna Ellis Welcome back to Jenna Ellis in the Morning on American Family Radio.
Jenna Ellis Welcome back. When we're talking about where the conservative movement goes from here, what leadership, we should select, let's remember to go Back to the basic core principles of the purpose of government. And so we talk often on this show about the three institutions that God has ordained. The church government, the family government and the civil government. And the civil government is instituted by God for our good, to promote good, restrain evil, and to protect the rights that come from God our Creator. Our founders recognized that in our Declaration of Independence which provided the mandate for the U.S. constitution in its original form. And we've talked extensively this week about possibilities of amending or going back to the original text of the US Constitution in certain processes and distribution of powers, separation of powers and so forth. And we need to also though remember that the process is just the nuts and bolts it the policy and the worldview that is paramount. And so when we talk about being a conservative, what that actually means is that we understand that government does have a legitimate function. We are not the the extreme anarchists. We're not even the capital L libertarians or the small L libertarians that are, you know, stay off my lawn and government should have as minimal involvement in my life as possible. You might think that about your hoa and I would agree with you. But but the government itself, the civil government, does have responsibilities and legitimate functions. And that's more than just arbitration of contract disputes.
Limits of Government Power and the Importance of Parental Rights in Family Welfare and Education
that is actually engagement in standards, in regulations, in criminalization of certain conduct, in ah, providing incentives for for good conduct. You know, all of these, all of these areas there, there is legitimacy in. Now I'm also a conservative because I see the limits of government's power and I see that government should actually operate with the least possible intrusion into private lives, especially has no business arbitrating or regulating anything with respect to the church with what we believe, what we preach on Sundays with church activities, you know, those sorts of things. Unless there's criminal activity going on. Obviously there's some overlap there. As well as the family, the rights of parents are not absolute. Yes, there can be criminal activity that we should prohibit and punish from the civil government, but the right of parents to be responsible for determining the welfare of their children, for determining their education for make it for decision making, those things need to reside with the the rights and the powers of parents. And so the government, the civil government should be the least involved in terms of our everyday lives and the opportunities that we have under liberty's framework to make decisions for ourselves and our families and provides the most opportunity for human flourishing. And so with that we need to recognize that conservative policy values that Christians should carry in championing champion toward 2028 include strengthening families and communities not through welfare and more government, but by supporting the parents role. And by parent I mean marriage as one man, one woman for life.
Strengthening Families, Upholding Justice, and Promoting Responsible Government with Constitutional Limits
That parentage resides you know, solely within the, the marital union. And and of course there are single parents because of you know of tragedies obviously but that the, the ideal is for a husband ah and a wife and a mother and a father. And that we don't use these artificial procedures like IVF to commoditize children for the personal preferences of adults. like to same sex so called parents or to even single parents to adopt children. We need to maintain the integrity of, of the family unit that is defined by natural law. Right. the only context in which a child can be conceived is through one man and only one man, one woman and only one woman. That's the the husband and wife and the mother and the father of, of that child. sometimes it's not the husband and wife but you know that, that gets into some of those morality concerns. But we need to strengthen families, we need to upload, uphold justice and equal treatment under law, expect fair laws, not all of this law fair from either side, but genuine accountability.
Protecting the Nation, Secure Borders, Public Safety, and the Dangers of Socialism vs. Personal Property
Promote responsible government favor constitutional limits, fiscal discipline and states powers as well. Decisions that are made as close to families and communities as practical. And rein in the federal government, protect the nation and its people. We need to support secure borders, public safety and a capable defense. We need to have practical and practice also stewardship, a care for creation and public resources while weighing the costs and the consequences and the common good. And to actually show the dangers of what it means to have socialism in a nation. To say that no personal property is not an evil thing. You can own things and be happy. It is not that you should own nothing and be happy. privacy is a really big issue.
Core Conservative Values: Fiscal Discipline, States' Powers, Limited Government, and a Biblical Worldview Framework
I mean all of these things limiting us spending, all of these things are core conservative values. And to build up our policy on a biblical worldview framework that reigns in the purpose of government and bookends it within those two extreme dreams of not having so little government that you can't arbitrate fairness and justice and promote good and restrain evil, but not also allow the worst accesses of government. And we need to appoint leaders who understand this, who get this and who have a track record of actual policy wins. So this needs to be our view moving forward and I think, think we can do that if we really, really work hard. Preborn has rescued over 400,000 babies from abortion and every day their network clinics rescue 200 babies lives.
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Sponsor Message and Introduction to Biblical Worldview and Constitutional Obligations
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Jenna Ellis Jenna Ellis in the morning on American Family Rad.
Jenna Ellis I love talking about the things of God because of truth and the biblical worldview. The U.S. constitution obligates our government to preserve and protect the rights that our founders recognize come from God our creator, not our government. I believe that scripture in the Bible is very clear that God is the one that raised up each of you and God has allowed us to be brought here to this specific moment in time.
Post-Election Analysis: Unexpected Outcomes and the GOP's Path Forward Amidst Policy Priorities
Jenna Ellis This is Jenna Ellis in the Morning.
Jenna Ellis Good morning. It is Friday, November 6th, and we are just a few days after the blue tsunami as it's being typified in the media. The Democrats, winning some unexpected races, winning, you know, of course they, they were anticipated by all accounts in the polls, to, to win some of these races. But some of the really, big surprising wins were the ousting, for example of of now former governor, Greg Abbott out of Texas. just the Senate race in Kansas of all places. I saw Meme saying they showed Kansas on, on the map, blue and said I wasn't aware that Kansas could do that, change colors. I think a lot of us really weren't. And so, you know, the questions of course are where do we go from here and how will the GOP recover? but this really isn't just about party and this isn't just about the leadership of the gop. And this ultimately comes down to the policy priorities that conservatives truly want to advocate for. And one of those major policy priorities, especially to our American family, radio audience, of course, is the issue of life. And so let's welcome in Frank Pavone, who's founder of Priests for Life. And Frank, I want to get first your overall assessment of the election, you know, kind of what happened, where do we go from here? but then also get into this question of where does the fight for life go from here?
Election Response Plan and Historical Patterns of Presidential and Congressional Power Shifts
Good morning.
Frank Pavone Yes, exactly. Good morning. so first of all, we have a five point action plan response to this election and it includes dealing, with abortion. We can talk about that. but Just as we were talking before the election and so many of our listeners came to ProLifeVote, dot com, that's gonna be kind of the cent of operations for responding to this on a, on a pro life level. And, the five point, plan of action is there for people to read. So I want to invite them, first of all to go there for beyond the bounds of this conversation, they can get a lot of info.pro life vote dot com. Now, my overall, reaction to the election is, look, you know, we knew that we were going against the pendulum of American politics. Historically, you lose seats in the midterm. Okay. You know, it's very interesting to notice that in this pendulum of American politics, if you look at the presidential races, over the last, few decades, and you look at the way that voters, voted for House and Senate, a very interesting pattern emerges when the White House changes hands, from one party to another, voters usually give the new president the Congress as well. So this happened with, President Trump, with Biden, with Clinton, with Obama. they brought Congress in with them. They had a trifecta during the first two years of their first term. Now, as a president's term goes on, the American voters tend to, whichever party we're talking about, the American voters tend to take the Congress away from the president. And so, in fact, if you look at, again, these same presidents, it's a pattern. In the last two years of their presidency, they had an opposition Congress, both House and Senate. Of course, we call it divided government. What that means, of course, is that unless it's a very, very bipartisan bill, bills are not going to get signed into law.
Critique of Democratic Agendas and the Choice Between Republican Victory and No Progress
the Congress will pass them anyway if there's something they believe in, but they're going to get vetoed. And I think the president, President Trump, is getting his veto pen ready. and, you know, what the Democrats are going to end up doing is, again, we're just talking about on the congressional level here is a whole lot of political theater. they'll take votes that'll be, you know, largely, you know, messaging votes. they'll do all sorts of, you know, fake investigations, impeachments and whatnot. But as we discuss on this program, because they embrace things that are just totally evil, such as unlimited abortion, but so many other things too, that are anti freedom and anti America. My message is this, that they shouldn't be celebrating. you know, there's a. I said during the election, I might have said it, Jenna, on your program, that this was not a choice between Republicans win or Democrats win. It was not. It was a choice between either Republicans win or nobody wins. And right now the Democrats have put themselves in a position where nobody is winning. Because the things they embrace, and this is what I pray every day they will come to realize, but they haven't come to realize it yet. What they are embracing destroys them. It destroys them. It destroys their own families, it destroys their own freedom, it destroys their own economy, it destroys their own security. and you know, apparently they've chosen to learn this the hard way. That's you know, an overall reaction.
Jenna Ellis Yeah. And absolutely. And I love the way that you framed it was Republicans win or nobody wins.
Voter Wake-Up Calls and Concerns Over Democratic Governance and Policy Priorities
And the people who were part of the Republican base that actually turned out and voted Democrat and we're seeing in a lot of these numbers and the data that's now been released that that's a significant percentage, they're going to be in for a very rude wake up call. And you know, maybe some of their priorities, certainly the Democrats priorities are just to get Trump. I mean that's been their priority since 2015. I don't think that has changed. But when it comes to actually governing, not just overplaying their hand and I think they're going to that's going to be very obvious. They're going to do all of these impeachment nonsense and you know, they were already screaming lawyer up, you know, just minutes, after all of the election drama was over. And so they're going to focus on all of that. They're going to overplay their hand. But when it comes to actually governing, that's where I'm genuinely concerned as an American. Now thankfully you and I live in the free state of Florida that actually held the line because of Governor DeSantis leadership and we are still relatively okay here in the state of Florida. But for the rest of the country, I mean there have been some really concerning shifts like I said, particularly in Texas. And so when it comes to actually governing and looking at the policy not just on the federal level and now in Congress and the Senate, but on the state level, what's the most concerning to you about perhaps the pendulum swinging back toward you know, really insane kinds of things like the trans agenda, pushing you know, all of the, the the parentage questions around the out, the aftermath of the Obergefell and gay marriage about protections for life. I mean what, where and what are you most concerned about?
Frank Pavone Well it's the Democrat trifecta that we have to be most concerned about in the first place. Because that's where, just like we were saying on the federal level, on the state level, it's true as well.
State-Level Dangers in Democrat Trifectas and Observing Legislative Actions on Abortion and Elections
That's when you get legislation passed for better or for worse. and on these extreme matters, that's the only way you get it passed. and they will do that. They will, they will. We will see more laws, I think, in these Democrat trifectas that have been created by this election, like we saw in Massachusetts just before the election, where they removed the only remaining protections in the third trimester of pregnancy for babies, in the womb. So things like that and the transgender nonsense, parental rights, all of this will be, will be in danger. Not to mention that, you know, you look at the economy and crime, these blue. The states that have become blue, cities that have become blue, my goodness, people are going to learn a hard lesson the hard way. Crime is going to, the Democrats don't know how to govern and cities are going to fall into, into disarray. Crime is going to rise. economy is going to go into shambles. Highest gas prices are in blue states. People should understand. And so they're going to just. We're just going to learn from experience. and that's where, you know, I mentioned that I grew up kind of an action plan. And the first part of that is pertinent to what you're saying right now is to watch carefully, take note, and then educate others about exactly what the Democrats are doing. Show people who the Democrats are. for example, when these legislatures, come into, action in January on the state level and also in Washington, what, for example, people should be starting to, I would say, you know, get out a notebook and start making a list or open a Word document and start making the document that says. Okay, few questions. What's the first bill they're going to introduce? Guaranteed in a lot of these places, it's going to be an abortion bill, including in Washington. Washington. I think the first bill these Democrats are going to introduce is either going to be on abortion or it's going to be about election, un. Security, unsecuring our elections. They've tried it before. they've done it before. They're going to do it again. So pay, attention though, because this. They're going to tell us who they are now.
Identifying True Intentions Through Actions and Preparing for Future Elections and Senate Dynamics
They have told us who they are in their messaging during the election season, although some of them tried to moderate it. The closer we got to last Tuesday, But we're not, we're not, we're not fooled by that. But now they're going to tell us who they are by what they do. And we need to pay attention to it, take note of it. What's the first bill they introduce? What's the second? how do the various members in that legislative body vote on these bills? Because all of this now is in preparation for the next election. You know what? That's the beautiful thing about American politics and that's a great consolation. in an election like this. And it's not something we're making up, it's not imagination. The reality is there's another federal election two years from now and that election season starts here and now and we can win back a lot of places where, where the Democrats had pickups this time.
Jenna Ellis Yeah. And I think that is the encouraging thing is that there's always the next election and at least the Democrats will not have the trifecta. on the federal level, they don't have a veto proof majority, ah, for Congress and so we still have President Trump for the next two years. so all of that is good. Governor DeSantis and have said just given the seats in the Senate that will be up in 2028, it is likely that Republicans won't regain the majority in the Senate until 2032. So the election after that, so basically the midterms after the presidential of 2028, so, so it may be more difficult to confirm, good justices, and judges, you know, do some things that only the Senate can. But at least for the presidential election and for this next election that balance of power could ah, shift back.
Federal vs. State Level Fights for Life and Identifying States for Potential Pro-Life Gains
so at least on the federal level, hopefully there won't be a brokering agreement between you know, the establishment gop, to pass legislation with the Democrats that then could be that veto override majority because they'll have to own that going into 2028. So I think if there's any sorts of deals that the establishment GOP who hates Trump is going to make with the Democrats, it's going to be m. More along the lines of the investig, the subpoenas, the the impeachment, you know, things that are targeted specifically to the Trump admin, not to their votes and what they would carry over into 2028 and beyond. So hopefully, at least, the federal level is a little more insulated. But when we're talking about the state level, which is really where the Dobbs decision provided for, the, the Fight for life, is really now at the states because it, you know, even though the federal level could have made a lot of headway over the last two years, really, the main headway that's going to be made or the losses will be at the state level. So what states in particular are you, looking at that may still actually be able to accomplish some, some gains, perhaps even after this election?
Navigating Dangers in Democrat Trifectas and Hopes in Republican Trifectas Amidst Legal Battles
Frank Pavone Yeah, well, we're starting to assess that now because we have to see, in each legislative body, you know, who has been elected and start establishing the relationships with them now. But just as we said before, that the biggest dangers are in the Democrat trifectas. the biggest hopes for pro life will be in the Republican, trifectas. And this is an arena where of course a lot of the progress or lack thereof is actually going to be, in the courts. Because we have certain states suing other states over the abortion drugs. And depending on how that, I mean, because states, you know, like Louisiana for example, that have decided that we're going to protect our unborn children, you know, are having abortionists in blue states mailing abortion drugs into their states and killing their own born children. And so it's like saying, hey, wait a second, we have a right to protect our unborn children within this state and if you facilitate the killing of one of them, we're going to hold you responsible. And so this has become a major division, ah, among the states. And this is going to be in the coming months, something that, we'll see working its way through the courts. But we're going to be issuing a challenge, both these red states to take this action and in the blue states to take this defense and it has to do with late term abortion.
Public Consensus Against Late-Term Abortion and Messaging Strategies for the Upcoming Election Cycles
We have a consensus in America against late term abortion. Most Americans oppose abortion after the first three months of the pregnancy. And rightly so. I mean, even if people, you know, take the. And it's a mistaken position that someone has the choice, you know, to kill their baby, you know, you'll have people saying, well, you know, three months is long enough to make that choice, you know, and then. But you start talking about the fourth, fifth month or beyond. No, to most people that's quite, objectionable. So why don't we build on that in the red states, let's start legislating more. I mean, we've got certain states that protect the babies, like Florida starting at about six weeks and other states starting at about 12 weeks. But we need more of them to do that. And that's going to be one of my key priorities is this focusing on all the red states and say, listen again, starting with the trifectas, get this done. And we have the consensus already among the American people that late term abortion should not be permitted. And then even pushing on the federal level now, the Democrats being in control of Congress and in these blue states, it's like, okay, they're going to pass bills making late abortion more and more accessible. But one thing they never do, and I know we've discussed it here before, is they never describe what they defend. And we're going to just double down on that message. Describe Democrats, describe what you're descending. You think this is so great. Make your arguments, pass your bills, but be honest with the American people. Read from the, we're not asking them to read from pro life materials. Read from the medical textbooks on abortion. Describe what you dissent. People hear that they're going to be totally outraged and turned off. And this is the fact that they won't do it shows they're in the wrong here. they're ashamed of the very thing that they're promoting. We need to point that out to the American voters.
Maintaining Christian Conservative Resolve and Boldness Despite Shifting Political Landscapes Post-Dobbs
I think this is a way that we end up branding the Democrat Party again going into the 2028 cycle and say this is the party of barbaric treatment of the tiniest of children. and they don't make any apologies for it, but look at them, they know deep down it's wrong because we can't even get them to describe the very thing that they are defending, promoting and, and forcing us to pay for.
Jenna Ellis Yeah. And you know, one of one of the best keys to what you just said is that Christian conservatives, for us, nothing really has changed, in terms of what we stand for, what we still advocate for, what, what resolve we still have. you know, the elections are going to sway to and fro between parties and, and all of that, but the truth doesn't change and the, the righteous policies that we advocate for haven't changed. And maybe, you know, the playing field has shifted a little bit. Certainly in some of the states, maybe it's a little more difficult now, but it's a lot less difficult than it was before the Dobbs decision. So we can't forget that huge, ah, historic win. and that was because of President Trump and because he was elected in 2016 and he was able to nominate those justices that made that a priority and ah, and held in a way that, was constitutional and was ultimately correct on the issue of life. And so we can't shrink back now and just say, okay, well, because, Republicans aren't as popular now as they were maybe two years ago, then that House. That somehow changes our boldness. I think we need to be even more bold right now. And to say, you know, this isn't about supporting a party or not or, you know, whatever. This is ultimately about the truth. This is about standing firm for what's right. And this is about ensuring that we still make a difference. Absolutely.
Frank Pavone And one of the ways we do that is what I call the phase two of civic participation after voting. It's lobbying. If you voted to put people in office, you went into the voting move to do that.
Phases of Civic Participation: Lobbying and Witnessing Against Undesirable Policies in Public Offices
Now you have to go into their office. If someone was elected in your district or your state that you did not vote for, you went into the voting booth. Now you have to go into their office and be a witness against them. And it's not necessarily to persuade them. I mean, I'm not expecting people in Michigan to go persuade. Abdul El said not to be a jihadist. he is a jihadist, and he's going to continue, on that track. but you can go in there and listen. You live in Michigan. He's, a sense senator representing that state. You make your objections known in person, face to face with his, with his staff. And this is true on the state level. Like we were just talking about these states where these Democrat pro abortion bills will be introduced or pro, trans or whatever, anti parental rights, whatever it's going to be. Go. This is the election, the voting booth. You go in there once. Right. Or whether it's early voting or on election day. Okay, that has now passed for this cycle. But you can go into their offices any day of the week and go into their local offices. You know, I often say to people when I walk the halls of Congress in Washington, the halls are usually empty. I mean, and every one of the doorways, whether on the House side or the Senate side, has the same sign at the door. And it says, welcome, please come. in and let that resonate with us. Now let's go in. And again, it's not necessarily to persuade. It's to witness. And it may be to express severe, opposition, disagreement, always, of course, with kindness and respect. But that doesn't mean we don't have clarity and that we don't have passion. And we have to go in there and do this. I think that it'll Give people a feeling like, hey, there is something I can do. My voice is, I'm not going to sit here. Let's put it this way. The only thing worse that have these Democrats do all the evil that they're going to do on the federal and state level is that we let them do it in secret.
Jenna Ellis M.
Exposing Works of Darkness and Implementing Plans for Civic Engagement and Christian Witness
Frank Pavone Don't let them do it in secret. Go there. We let them do it unopposed. Right? So it can't be unopposed and it can't be in secret because we're going to go in there and we're going to let them know we oppose it and we are going to then tell the world about it. because that's how then, you know, we take this back in 2028. It's like, okay, you guys are going to do this. This is going to destroy you. And it's going to destroy you because not because we're going to do anything evil against you. We don't do evil. We expose, Ephesians 5:11, expose the works of darkness. I want to really call on our people here to do exactly that, make a plan to do that. Maybe we never visited our state legislator's office. Maybe we never visited our federal legislators. Are. Now's the time. This is the season to do that more than ever. And again, we're going to implement this whole plan, on our behalf in our organization. At ProLifeVote.com, we invite people to participate. But I think, Jenna, I think that's the path forward for giving, like you say, this Christian witness in the civic arena.
Engaging More Actively Post-Election to Secure Blessings of Liberty for All, Including the Unborn
Jenna Ellis Yeah. So well said. And we've got to take a break here, but, Frank Pavone. So well said, because this is the time now that instead of, being discouraged and saying, okay, well, you know, my vote didn't matter, or, you know, we've lost and all of that, this is the time to double down and to say we are going to be even more engaged than ever. So that when 2028 comes around, not only can we have some significant wins, but we will be even more invested in the process. Because politics is not the end goal, is not for its own sake. It is so that we can secure the blessings of liberty. And that includes the blessings of liberty to, the. To those who can't advocate for themselves, including the unborn. We've got to continue to stand up for Christian and conservative policy. And so again, you can go to, pro life vote.com and I love, what you have on here. Frank Pavone of, you know, all of these plans this five step plan to respond to this election and you and by saying, we need you. Yes, the fight still needs every single one of us. First and foremost in prayer, but also in action. We'll be right back with more.
Listener Support and the Question of Conservatism's Shift Towards Popularity Over Core Principles
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Jenna Ellis welcome back to Jenna Ellis in the Morning on American Family Radio.
Jenna Ellis Welcome back. Well, as we're talking about conservative policy and being focused on still advocating for the truth, standing up for conservative values, we have to ask the question, when did conservatism, kind of move out of the way of the spotlight in favor of just popularity? And that has been a question, especially from 2024 election and onward and when, you know, Trump has had kind of the loyalty tests and it's been a lot of personality and populism over some core policies.
The Cost of Political Cheerleading Replacing Core Values and an Honest Reckoning of Election Losses
And there's a really excellent article in the Daily Wire, by my next guest, Tim Chapman, who is the president of Advancing American Freedom. And the headline is this is the cost when Political Cheerleading Replaces Core Values. And he says, this process, begins, and the restoration of our movement begins with an honest reckoning of what went wrong. This isn't a narrow defeat. Democrats won Senate seats in South Carolina and Kansas, which that one surprised me along with every statewide office in Texas, Mississippi is coming down to the wire. Some will claim that the party in power always loses seats in a midterm election. Others will point to the unique dynamics of a particular races, from retiring incumbents to less than stellar candidates. These factors are relevant, Tim argues, but not determinative. The unifying thread, tying the losses together, the conservative movement has lost its way. So, Tim Chapman, I could not agree with you more.
Concerns Over 2024 Election Dynamics: Personality Over Policy and the GOP's Core Conservative Values
I think that a lot of us were saying this even in the hesitancy initially to embrace, President Trump in 2016. I was a TED cruiser initially. Everybody knows that, for this exact reason. But, you know, we had Vice President Mike Pence who was there to say, okay, he's, he's the Christian and he's representing our interests. And then, you know, with the Great American Comeback, as, as Trump touted it in 2024, the biggest concern was that the GOP as a party didn't actually have and keep core conservative values. As its mission. And I think that is a really important focus on what needs to happen next.
Tim Chapman Absolutely, Absolutely. Jenna, thanks for having me on. look, I wrote that piece because I think it's time for conservatives to do some soul searching.
2024 Election Analysis: Unleashing Inner ID and the Impact of Departing from Conservative Principles
You look at 2024, and you look at the election of President Trump, and a lot of conservatives were excited. but I think what happened was people cast those ballots. Remember, we had just gone through four years with President Biden and an anemic economy at, ah, best, you know, inflation, a president that was out of touch. And when people cast a ballot for President Trump in 2024, I think a lot of them were thinking about the Trump economy, and the Trump administration from 2016 to 2020. And what they got instead was an administration that was determined to unleash the inner ID of the president himself. and they looked back at their 2016-2020 record, and they thought, oh, there were too many people around the president that were challenging the president on various ideas. And, we need to create an environment in the second term where the president's instincts are what guide the entire movement. I think that was a really bad decision. I think President Trump benefited greatly in his first term from having a diversity of opinion around him. And you can disagree or agree with the cabinet officials that were in that first administration or the staff or whatever, but the product was better, especially when it came to the economy and especially when it came to foreign policy. And the product that we're seeing now is all over the map. And there are a lot of instances that I see of the president, who has, by the way, been very clear with people that he's not ideologically a conservative, he's a pragmatist, and he's a deal cutter, and he. And he kind of flies by the seat of his pants in terms of his own instincts. and that. That has created an environment in the second term where you've seen real departures.
Policy Departures and the Dangers of Outsourcing a Movement's Soul to One Political Personality
I mean, you saw it very early on when they were putting together the GOP platform before the President was even elected. the president's team said, we need to water down the life provisions within the GOP platform. There were efforts to water down talk, about entitlement reform and getting the federal debt and deficit, under control in the GOP platform. And then you saw actual policy departures in the second administration. You saw the embrace of sort of a big government, national conservative, populist economic agenda, and you had Liberation Day tariffs. That did not help in these elections. We saw that for certain. You see the federal government taking ownership stakes in 41 different private companies right now. You see the White House floating populist economic proposals for price controls in the free market. you see, you know, the ideas around potentially a universal basic income for, stay at home moms. You see all sorts of stuff that looks m like it might test well in polls, but it ends up hurting the people that it help, that it intends to help. And so I think this is the problem when you outsource the heart and soul of your movement to one political personality. And we can, you know, all agree to disagree on whether Trump's the best or Trump's not good or what your personal opinion is on him. but I think we can all agree that a movement should be about more than one person and the way that he wakes up and looks at a particular place political issue on any one day.
Jenna Ellis Yeah, 100%.
Negotiating with Pro-Life Voters and the Republican Party's Commitment to Conservative Principles
And, you know, we can acknowledge that President Trump did a lot for, for evangelicals, for conservatives, for the pro life movement, and say, you know, that was also part of perhaps some of the negotiating and the brokering. And so then when the president, as you rightly point out in your piece, walked away from the right to life and treated pro life voters as an afterthought in 2024, because then the Republican Party, you know, watered down those pro life, planks, then we have to ask, where are the conservative principles and what is the standard? Is it just the whim of the art of the deal that favors him and, and whoever happens to be around him, or is this the party that's actually going to stand firm? And the GOP has historically, been reined in because such a huge percentage of its base are conservative evangelical Christians. And when we say we're not going to force you to hold that line, then we're allowing the populist whim to drive the policy.
Correcting the Ship: Moving Beyond Personality Politics to Core Values for 2028 and Beyond
So how do we correct this ship and for 2028 and beyond, have that resolve to say, okay, we've got to get away from the personality politicking and the cheerleading and come back to just good common sense, core values?
Tim Chapman Yeah, I, look, I think the first step is a focus on what we actually believe and what our principles are. you cannot expect, your leaders to do the right thing if you don't prepare the soil in which those leaders grow up beforehand. So we're in that time now of tilling the soil between now and 2020. So the focus right now for conservatives needs to be how do we create an environment in which our eventual leader that emerges, is, is, is, is connected to the values that we all care about.
Intra-Family Conversation: Conservatives Need to Re-Engage on Life, Free Markets, and Foreign Policy
So people need to be engaged and they need to, you know, on the life issue, we need a re. Engagement from the pro life community. On the free markets and limited government issue, we need a recovery of what it means to be a limited government conservative. On the foreign policy issues, we need to talk clearly about what the value of allies are, and how we use American strength and how we achieve peace through strength globally. All of that is critical. And we're in this period now, Jenna, where the soul searching and the intra family conversation I believe is the most important conversation going on in the country. We know what the Democrats will do for the next two years. They're going to misinterpret their mandates, they're going to overreach and at the end of the day I think the policies of the Democrats will be promoting our policies that are out of step with the American people. don't forget in this election you talked about it at the top here. You know, we lost in some real red states.
Ballot Measure Successes Contrasting with Election Results: Repudiation of Personality-Centered Movements
Yeah, we lost, you know, and then we lost, you know, statewide in states like Wisconsin, Ohio, North Carolina, Texas, other states. And in those states, the thing that I found fascinating that was that there were ballot measures that were extremely conservative. Ballot measures to limit the size and scope of government in the state, ballot measures to cap tax rates, ballot measures for voter id. Good, strong ballot measures were conservative. They passed in those states while the states still voted for Democrats. So I don't believe that the American people are signing up for a DSA like platform for the next two, four, six years. I believe what the American people were saying where we don't like a movement that's centered around one political personality, President Trump, and it was a repudiation of that kind of movement that had outsourced his principles to one person. So we have an opportunity here to build a better and different kind of movement. And people should not be cheap dates and sign up for whoever they think the next person to be coronated as leader of the movement is. We need the conversation, we need to vet our leaders.
Creating a Contract with Leaders and Establishing Expectations for Conservative Representation
We need to actually tell them what our values are and set the expectation. Finally, if you back up, back up to 2015 and before we got in, before President Trump won the 2016 election, I actually think that the movement did a very good job of basically creating an environment where there was a contract with President Trump. President Trump knew he needed to appoint pro life judges. He knew he needed to Pursue, tax reform. He knew he needed to pursue a deregulation agenda and he knew he needed to stick by his allies. That was a contract, with the President and the president, because he had good people around him, mostly, mostly adhered to that contract. We ripped the contract up going into 2024 and we deluded ourselves into thinking that one man could bring permanent political success for us. And I just think that was the wrong way to do it. So we need to get back to the idea that we are going to create a contract. And anyone who wants to represent conservatives in this party needs to understand the terms of that contract before they become the leader of this party.
Vetting Future Nominees and Addressing the MAGA Base's Transition into Conservative Mindsets
Jenna Ellis Yeah, absolutely. I could not agree more. And I just want to underscore that, that the next presidential nominee should not be someone who is coordinated or just because they have the Trump endorsement means that there is no conversation and everybody on social media is silencing everybody else, just saying, well, this is the person that we're going to nominate. No, we need to take a really hard look and genuinely, as you said, Tim, vet the next person to know that they will have the policy courage to stand firm and to say, these are our priorities based on principle and here's what we're going to get done. So when you look at the demographic of Republican voters and some of these, registered Republicans that now, as we're seeing in the exit polling and all of, what, what the data is on the midterm election that some and a significant percentage of registered Republicans ended up voting Democrat, to me, one of the things that this highlights is the MAGA base that became Republican because they followed the personality of Trump, were not genuinely converted into Republican mindset and a conservative mindset.
Converting New Voters Through Policy Execution and Painting a Clear Contrast with the Left
they were following along and then as soon as they don't like the personality, they'll go and vote for the opponent. So they're, they're kind of fair weather voters. so with that and also what you're talking about, of making sure that conservatives, true conservatives, know what our principles are and will turn out and vote our values. How do we have a majority just in terms of the math, but actually assimilate people into the core of conservative values?
Tim Chapman Well, it's all about policy and execution. Okay, so I think that was the great tragedy here of the last two years, is, as you pointed out, Jenna, President Trump, and I think we need to give him credit for this, brought new voters into the Republican coalition that had traditionally been Democratic voters. But they came into the coalition mostly because they were looking, looking especially on the economic side, at what had. What had successfully occurred in the first Trump administration. And the only way to convert them is results. So your ideas need to matter and your ideas need to work.
Maintaining Coalitions Through Policy Execution and Commitment to Values Post-Election Setbacks
So we will have an opportunity over the next two years because, as I said earlier, the Democrats will overreach. The American people have not bought into this DSA platform. We will have an opportunity to paint a clear contrast between what the left is offering and what the right can offer. But then you need to execute. If you had executed, if the last two years we didn't go on these exploratory ventures with things like Liberation Day tariffs, if we weren't pushing all these different, other populist, agenda items, if we were not, falling back from our commitment to life and our commitment to values, I think you could keep those people in the coalition. But the people in the coalition that came that were sort of Joni. Come lately to the Republican Party, they fell away because nothing was working and they felt it and then they voted it. So execution policy, a commitment to your values is the way you keep the coalition together.
Jenna Ellis Yeah. And last question for you, Tim.
Engaging Evangelical Christians and Catholic Conservatives in the Conversation for Future Leadership
And again, this article is so great and I would encourage listeners, to read it. It's in the Daily Wire. This is the cost when political cheerleading replaces core values by my guest, Tim Chapman. I read that in the Daily Wire. Follow him. And also advancing American freedom on X. but when you're looking then at the conversation for 2028, who should be involved in that conversation in terms of looking at the next generation or the next era of leadership?
Tim Chapman So before I, you know, before I think about who the leader could be, I think about who the people engaged should be. So I look at evangelical Christians and I look at evangelical Christians because I think that the evangelical movement has been one of the, strongest forces for good within the Republican coalition for 50 years. and the evangelical movement needs to come in to this conversation, and express their values front and center. I think I look at, I look at, Catholic conservatives who need to engage, and who need to engage, with their values. In the same way I look at the limited government part of our movement, who need to re. Engage all, all of the different coalitional, aspects that are out there need to be part of the family conversation. So what we're talking about is like what we are for before we talk about who we are for. And then you're going to see leaders out there who come in our direction. You're already seeing people throw their hat in the ring.
Creating an Environment for the Best Leaders to Rise Based on Values and Coalition Representation
I mean, you're seeing Senator Cruz throw his hat in the ring. It's sure looking like Governor Desantis, is getting more and more engaged. But our job is to create the environment that allows the best people to rise to the top. Or even if it's not the best person who rises to the top, it's a version of the person that looks more like the coalition. So we need to focus first and foremost on our values and what we care about and engage at that level.
Distilling Conservative Identity and Building Policy and Leadership Selections for the Future
If we get it right about what we are for, we will, we will ultimately get it right about who we are for.
Jenna Ellis So well said. And I hope that every conservative leader and voter will take that message to heart and actually listen to it and, and recognize that we do need to have this, you know, identity distillation moment to say, what does conservatism actually look like and mean moving forward into 2028 and then build up our policy and especially our leadership selections from there. So, Tim Chapman, as always, really appreciate it so much. And again, thank you for the work that you and everyone at Advancing America Freedom, does for this country, for policy.
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Core Principles of Civil Government: Promoting Good, Restraining Evil, and Protecting God-Given Rights
Jenna Ellis Welcome back to Jenna Ellis in the Morning on American Family Radio.
Jenna Ellis Welcome back. When we're talking about where the conservative movement goes from here, what leadership, we should select, let's remember to go Back to the basic core principles of the purpose of government. And so we talk often on this show about the three institutions that God has ordained. The church government, the family government and the civil government. And the civil government is instituted by God for our good, to promote good, restrain evil, and to protect the rights that come from God our Creator. Our founders recognized that in our Declaration of Independence which provided the mandate for the U.S. constitution in its original form. And we've talked extensively this week about possibilities of amending or going back to the original text of the US Constitution in certain processes and distribution of powers, separation of powers and so forth. And we need to also though remember that the process is just the nuts and bolts it the policy and the worldview that is paramount. And so when we talk about being a conservative, what that actually means is that we understand that government does have a legitimate function. We are not the the extreme anarchists. We're not even the capital L libertarians or the small L libertarians that are, you know, stay off my lawn and government should have as minimal involvement in my life as possible. You might think that about your hoa and I would agree with you. But but the government itself, the civil government, does have responsibilities and legitimate functions. And that's more than just arbitration of contract disputes.
Limits of Government Power and the Importance of Parental Rights in Family Welfare and Education
that is actually engagement in standards, in regulations, in criminalization of certain conduct, in ah, providing incentives for for good conduct. You know, all of these, all of these areas there, there is legitimacy in. Now I'm also a conservative because I see the limits of government's power and I see that government should actually operate with the least possible intrusion into private lives, especially has no business arbitrating or regulating anything with respect to the church with what we believe, what we preach on Sundays with church activities, you know, those sorts of things. Unless there's criminal activity going on. Obviously there's some overlap there. As well as the family, the rights of parents are not absolute. Yes, there can be criminal activity that we should prohibit and punish from the civil government, but the right of parents to be responsible for determining the welfare of their children, for determining their education for make it for decision making, those things need to reside with the the rights and the powers of parents. And so the government, the civil government should be the least involved in terms of our everyday lives and the opportunities that we have under liberty's framework to make decisions for ourselves and our families and provides the most opportunity for human flourishing. And so with that we need to recognize that conservative policy values that Christians should carry in championing champion toward 2028 include strengthening families and communities not through welfare and more government, but by supporting the parents role. And by parent I mean marriage as one man, one woman for life.
Strengthening Families, Upholding Justice, and Promoting Responsible Government with Constitutional Limits
That parentage resides you know, solely within the, the marital union. And and of course there are single parents because of you know of tragedies obviously but that the, the ideal is for a husband ah and a wife and a mother and a father. And that we don't use these artificial procedures like IVF to commoditize children for the personal preferences of adults. like to same sex so called parents or to even single parents to adopt children. We need to maintain the integrity of, of the family unit that is defined by natural law. Right. the only context in which a child can be conceived is through one man and only one man, one woman and only one woman. That's the the husband and wife and the mother and the father of, of that child. sometimes it's not the husband and wife but you know that, that gets into some of those morality concerns. But we need to strengthen families, we need to upload, uphold justice and equal treatment under law, expect fair laws, not all of this law fair from either side, but genuine accountability.
Protecting the Nation, Secure Borders, Public Safety, and the Dangers of Socialism vs. Personal Property
Promote responsible government favor constitutional limits, fiscal discipline and states powers as well. Decisions that are made as close to families and communities as practical. And rein in the federal government, protect the nation and its people. We need to support secure borders, public safety and a capable defense. We need to have practical and practice also stewardship, a care for creation and public resources while weighing the costs and the consequences and the common good. And to actually show the dangers of what it means to have socialism in a nation. To say that no personal property is not an evil thing. You can own things and be happy. It is not that you should own nothing and be happy. privacy is a really big issue.
Core Conservative Values: Fiscal Discipline, States' Powers, Limited Government, and a Biblical Worldview Framework
I mean all of these things limiting us spending, all of these things are core conservative values. And to build up our policy on a biblical worldview framework that reigns in the purpose of government and bookends it within those two extreme dreams of not having so little government that you can't arbitrate fairness and justice and promote good and restrain evil, but not also allow the worst accesses of government. And we need to appoint leaders who understand this, who get this and who have a track record of actual policy wins. So this needs to be our view moving forward and I think, think we can do that if we really, really work hard. Preborn has rescued over 400,000 babies from abortion and every day their network clinics rescue 200 babies lives.
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What comes next for conservatives after a surprising midterm election—and how can pro-life advocates keep moving forward? Jenna Ellis talks with Priests for Life founder Frank Pavone about the election’s impact, the battle over abortion policy at the state level, and practical ways citizens can stay engaged beyond Election Day. Pavone urges listeners to track legislation, speak directly with elected officials, and make sure policy debates happen in public.Then, Tim Chapman, president of Advancing American Freedom, joins Jenna to examine what happens when political loyalty and cheerleading displace conservative principles. They discuss the need for a renewed commitment to core values, policy accountability, and a thoughtful process for choosing future leaders—not simply rallying behind a personality. Jenna closes with a reflection on the role and limits of civil government, constitutional principles, family, and a biblical worldview.
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