Hello, and welcome to the Dr. Nurse Mama show, prescribing Hope for Healthy Families here on American Family Radio. Here's your host, professor, pediatric nurse practitioner, and mom of four, Dr. Jessica Peck.

Dr. Jessica Peck: Well, hey there, friends, and welcome to my favorite part of the afternoon, getting to spend time with you, prescribing Hope for Healthy Families. And listen, today as we approach the holidays, I know there are a lot of you who have travel plans coming up, and that travel may be really big. It may be be across the state, it may be across the country, it may be even across the world. For many of you, it may be just across the street or across the neighborhood, but you're going to be seeing families, and a lot of families are going to be seeing grandparents, and that's what we're talking about today. And in a world where our culture just seems to be shifting under our feet, there is constant cultural chaos. We have all kinds of messages that are being thrown out at us to redefine family, to wrestle over identity and values and truths. And today's parents, and that would be me, by the way, are, trying to raise children in a world that's filled with confusion. And honestly, I see a world that is saturated with fear. We just feel fear and anxiety everywhere we go. We have a mental health crisis that's going on. We have anxiety, depression rates skyrocketing and pressure from every side. And.

Dr. Jessica Peck: And this has just become a natural part of daily life for families. And according to today's guests, though, I have some great news for you, because one of God's most underutilized gifts to families in a disintegrating culture is grandparents. I'm talking to to Lori Wildenberg, and she is the author of Grandparents Make Grand Partners, how to have an eternal impact on your grandchild's life. And she believes that grandparents are not just extended family, they are spiritual, spiritual reinforcements for a generation growing up in a post Christian world. And we're going to talk about why grandparents matter. What now more than ever now, before, we get started talking to Lori, I do want to acknowledge that I know there are some of you out there listening who are thinking, well, that's not for me, that my relationship with my parents is strained. We are estranged from my kids. They don't know them as their grandparents, or maybe they've even passed away and they don't have grandparents. And I am going to talk more about that on Friday and what we can do about that and the hope and the help that God has for families who are estranged or strained in any way. So I am going to talk about that. But today we are going to talk about those grandparents who are just engaged and ready to invest in their families and how we can do that. Lori, thanks so much for joining us. I'm so glad to have you here today.

Lori Wildenberg: Oh, Jessica, I am so excited to be here. I'm really looking forward to our conversation. Thank you for having me.

Dr. Jessica Peck: Well, me too. Well, Lori, why don't you just introduce yourself? You. You've already, I hear in your bubbly voice, like I already feel my spirit encouraged. I'm so appreciative of your passion for this. But introduce yourself to our listeners and just tell them a little bit about your story, how you came to know the Lord and how he gave you a platform of grandparent ministry.

Lori Wildenberg: Sure. Well, how I came to know the Lord is kind of more of a Lydia story. there's. It's not a Paul on his way to Damascus story at all. I've always known the Lord ever since I can remember. I grew up in a, A Christian home. what I have realized though is God has taken my faith and exploded it. And a lot of times due to difficult or even suffering type circumstances. And those moments, those hard moments like going through infertility, going through adopting our, our first baby and then having three more the old fashioned way. so I've got four kids too, Jessica. And then, just other various things.

Dr. Jessica Peck: Ah.

Lori Wildenberg: Of you know, struggles that we've been through. I know that you have written your book on mental health and I have one too. It's called Messy help your child overcome anxiety, depression or suicidal ideation. And that's written from a place of pain. And God, God uses those things. The same with my book Messy Journey, how grace and truth offer the prodigal away home. So all of those hard things the Lord has. Actually cultivated in me to be able to help others who are perhaps going through something similar. And anyway, the grandparenting book, I have to say, was a joy to write. And we did, I did tackle some of those tough topics that you're going to be talking about on Friday. And my heart goes out to those folks who are in that. That situation and I, that estrangement situation. And I hope that, they listen to your show on Friday because that will be a blessing to them.

Dr. Jessica Peck: Well, thank you so much for that, Lori. And you know you say messy and messy is in the title of your two other books that you just mentioned. I've been saying that Word a lot lately too. And it is beautiful to know that, that God is Emmanuel, that he is God with us. And he stepped right, right into the middle of our mess. He did not wait until conditions were perfect. He did not arrive into the world in a way that was social media worthy. He arrived right in the middle of a mess. And when I think about even the situation of Mary and Joseph and what their parents must have thought, you know, we don't have insight on that in the Bible, but I'm sure there were some messy, difficult conversations and strained family relationships over that news. And so this is nothing new, but it is something that is challenging. And I, what I see, Lori, right now is a really big gap, between grandparents and parents, because the world has changed so much in the last couple of decades, in the last generation of raising kids. And we have a generation of parents who are raising kids for the first time in a world that they did not grow up in. And I've said this many times. I think that's why the book the Anxious Generation was so popular, because all of us as parents, we want childhood to look like it did when we were growing up, because that's just more comfortable for us to navigate. And there were things about it that were so much better. But technology is here. What are you seeing and experiencing as some of the greatest challenges facing those parents and grandparents? And as I said, I think that gap that's there is, is the. You know, the parents may think, oh, well, you know, the grandparents don't understand this because they didn't experience this. But there's so much wisdom and life experience. And Solomon said there's nothing new under the sun. All of the heart issues, the sin issues, the character issues, the emotional issues, those are all the same. What do you see as the issues that are facing families today? And how do you see grandparents is ideally positioned to step in?

Lori Wildenberg: You know, I think one of the biggest things is the breakdown of the family. And that is something that is happening across the board. And because of that, there's also then the breakdown of the extended family, which is what the grandparents are a part of. And that I think is something that's really concerning. And as I look at the way that we tend to raise our kids or interact with our kids and also with our adult children, we have a Western mindset that tells us to raise our kids to be independent. And that is not how the Lord has created us. He has created us to be independent, interdependent, to be dependent upon each other, not in a Codependent or an enmeshed sort of a way, but in a way where we can rejoice with each other and mourn with each other and be there with each other. And that is a critical component of being a grandparent, to be part of the system of the family. Not the integral part, but more a, shift a little bit to the side in a supportive, encouraging type of role. But if parents are of the understanding that it is not for us to raise our kids to be independent, but to be interdependent. And I think what we've done is we have confused the words, responsible and independent. We want responsible kids that, of course, we want them responsible for their thoughts, words and deeds, but we don't want to raise them to be independent, because if we do that, what we end up happening is everyone is their own little island within the family, and the family isn't acting like the three musketeers. All for one and one for all. So I think the idea of independence is one of the things that we're actually battling right now in our culture, because a lot of people, parents who raised kids, when I did, that was really a thing that we were supposed to raise kids to be independent. And there's becoming a little bit of a backlash with that. And we're seeing that in some families that are separating. There are a few, I think, other things, you know, the culture's view of what it looks like as we. As we age, perhaps, the idea of retirement, where, you know, now's the time to go take all those trips and, you know, play pickleball and all these great things. Well, there's nothing wrong with any of that. It's just that we don't want those to be the main thing, because here we are at this stage of the game where we may have a little more flexibility, more flexibility than we did when we were parents. So we would be more available to, help out our adult children with their children. And rather than just think of it, you know, this is just all about my happiness now. Right? And, gosh, what a joy to be with your grandkids anyway. So I think the culture's view. I really think that that's another, place where the enemy is trying to distract us from what is the most important thing. And the most important thing is to leave a legacy of faith with our. With our grandkids and hopefully our children as well.

Dr. Jessica Peck: Lori, that's a lot of ground to cover, but such important information and such important things to think about. And when you. What you said at the end is it really encapsulates everything. It's about deciding to intentionally live a legacy.

We see record numbers of millennials going no contact with their parents

And I want to bring up two points from what you said, because I think that you're really touching on two of the issues that I see really commonly that can impact the relationship dynamic between parents and grandparents. The first one is that estrangement. And we see record numbers of, of a generation, of a generation, mostly millennials, who are going what they call no contact with their parents. Now, there is a time and a place for healthy boundaries. There's even a time and in place for intentional estrangement. If there is abuse, if there are other circumstances that are really severe, there is a time and a place for that. But there's always a balance. And I see a lot of, a lot of people just defaulting to that. And I think that what is influencing that is even the way that we talk to each other on social media, we just talk to each other digitally, and there's reduced in person interactions. And so you just, it's easier to avoid somebody. I'm just not going to answer their text, I'm not going to answer their call. I'm just not going to answer them, going to ghost them. And we kind of do that in person. And we've got to learn how to have healthy conflict management between parents and grandparents. So sometimes when, you know, those boundaries need to be reset, saying, hey, my husband and I have decided these are the rules for our kids, and we need you to abide by those. There's just a balance to all of this on either side. So I think that's one thing that we really need to do. And you can do that. You can learn better conflict skills by being discipled by walking with other people who are in the same life stage, in a life group and having accountability and, and, and maybe even counsel that is needed. The second one is the other side of that, where you have the grandparents, the kids who want their grandparents to be involved, but like you said, they want to play pickleball. And I'll tell you, Lori, for me as a nurse, I hear so many stories from my nursing friends who say people think pickleball is, a very safe sport, but we see a lot of older people get hurt because they think, oh, that looks easy. And then the next thing you know, you, are on crutches. I'm not telling you not to go play pickleball. It's great. But I think that, you know, you really. There are. I see a lot of kids who say, Hey, I want my parents to be involved but they're off living their own life. They're on a vacation, they're playing pickleball, they're doing their own thing. And so we've got to have both and right. You've got to have the grandparents who say yeah, I want to have that legacy and you've got to have the kids who say yeah, I want to give you that access and that's going to best benefit the family. And I'll tell you Lori, I'm so grateful because my husband's parents are just definitely living examples of that. When my father in law retired, he said we want to invest in our grandkids. They moved. They, even though they had a house that was paid for, they picked up and moved just so they could live a few minutes from us, so that they could be there for the little league games and for the Sunday dinners and for all of the ways that they were integrally involved in my kids lives. And now that I see my kids as adults, they really are reaping the benefits of, of that investment because my kids adore them. And that is a really beautiful thing to see. Listen, we will be right back with more from Lori Wildenberg talking about grandparents making grand partners when we come back. A recent Danish study revealed something heartbreaking. Just one year after an abortion, women were 50% more likely to need psychiatric treatment and 87% more likely to accept experience, personality or behavioral disorders. That's not women's health care, that's trauma. But at preborn, women find the real kind of care, the kind that heals. When a woman walks into one of preborn's network clinics, she's welcomed with open arms. She's introduced to her baby through an ultrasound. And for the first time she sees life not loss And she's offered hope filled choices. When she chooses life, PreBorn continues walking with her for up to two years, providing maternity clothes, diapers, counseling and so much more. Preborn cares for the whole woman, body, mind and soul and the precious baby growing inside her. As you think about your year end giving, consider the greatest investment you could ever make. The gift of Life. Dial pound 250 and say the keyword baby. That's pound 250 baby or visit preborn.com/drnursemama that's preborn.com/drnursemama all gifts are tax- deductible and PreBorn is a five star rated charity. preborn.com/AFR Joy to the world the.

JOY! by Elevation Rhythm and Elevation Worship: Lord is come Let earth receive her king. Let every Heart prepare him room and heaven and nature sing and heaven and nature sing and heaven and heaven and nature sing.

Dr. Jessica Peck: Welcome back, friends. That is Joy! by elevation rhythm. And I hope that you are feeling joyful today, no matter where you are. If you are in the hustle and bustle of getting ready for the holidays, if you're dreading it, if you're looking forward to it, if you wish it would go slower, if you wish it would, would go faster, wherever you are, I pray that God will bless you today.

We're talking about grandparents and grandparents being grand partners

And we are blessed today by my guest, Lori Wildenberg, talking about something that I feel really passionate about. We're talking about grandparents and grandparents being grand partners. And many grandparents really want to be close to their grandchildren. but sometimes it's really hard to know how do you now navigate that delicate balance between being supportive and being intrusive? And Lori's already talked to us about that. Even some cultural perspectives of how independence versus responsibility, which was really thought provoking. And especially once those adult children start their own families. You've got blended families, you've got in law dynamics, you've got unspoken expectations, you've got conflict or trauma. These things can either strengthen your relationship, believe it or not, because conflict is the pathway to relational intimacy, or they can slowly create distance and resentment. And Laurie is reminding us that healthy grandparenting begins with wisdom and humility and intentional connection, not control. So we're going to talk honestly about the relational dynamics that determine whether grandparents become trusted partners or distant relatives.

Lori: God's goal for our families is reconciliation

And Laurie, you and I were talking in the break and you, you have, we were talking about those difficult relationships that are real, all too real. And you have a message of hope and encouragement you'd like to share.

Lori Wildenberg: I just like to really remind everyone that the Lord is in the business of reconciliation and for us to do our part, our best to reconcile with one another. And in the middle of, as we discuss the mess, and that does take humility and intentionality and to remember that we all do mess up and have grace in certain situations. But I think if we can remember that God's goal for our families, for our relationships is reconciliation. Now there are situations where, as you had mentioned, Jessica, that, that, that is something that may not be the best given abusive type situations or something to that, that level. But having open and honest communication and coming in with humility and I think a lot of times the reconciliation, it really is up to the grandparent or the parent of the adult child to do their best to reach out. And even if you Think that you only own 5% of the fault, you still have 5% of the fault. And we can come at things with humility. We are called to be peacemakers, not peacekeepers. And Jessica, you had mentioned conflict resolution. And, you know, start with where you hopefully both care about things like, you know, we would like to continue to have a relationship that would be important to us. Hopefully, The people on the other side of the, of the conflict would be able to respond in kind. If you can find the one thing where you agree, then there's hope to move forward. So I just, I just want to say that there, there is hope, and the Lord would be for that. So, you're right. Remember those things.

Dr. Jessica Peck: It's such a good distinction between a peacemaker and a peacekeeper. And in keeping the peace, sometimes you don't speak up when you should, and then fester and they sit and to. Making peace sometimes requires conflict, but you've got to do what you've got, what you need to do to acquire some healthy skills in that. And sometimes it's hard because you've got generational patterns of dysfunctional communication. But just working through that, I have found great hope in that. I have found great hope in seeing my children, you know, just pursue healthy ways of communication from unlearning and relearning ways. And we have so much wisdom in God's word.

The type of grandparent that we become depends largely on how our adult children view our role

And, you know, Laurie, you've said that the type of grandparent that we become depends largely on how our adult children view our role. What do you mean by that?

Lori Wildenberg: Yeah, I think that when I was researching for my book, Grandparents Make Grand Partners, that is the thing that I believe most of the grandparents were very surprised about how their role really was determined a lot by their adult children. So in the extreme examples, sometimes grandparents are canceled. Right? And that is the adult child has, has canceled them, and that's not their choice. And other times it's maybe the, adult children mostly see the grandparents in a babysitting type position. Or maybe they only view them as like the cheerleaders, the spectators for the sports. they also determine the adult child really determines how much time and the where and the when of the gatherings. It really is basically a lot up to the adult child, of those, the. The parent of those grandkids. And I think that's such a shift and it's such a surprise because before you're a grandparent, you've been a parent and you're used to making all those decisions and calling the shots, and then your Adult kids move out from under your roof and they're starting to make their own decisions. But once those grandkids arrive, it's almost as if you feel like you're back into that. That parent role, but you're not, but you sort of sense it. And I, I remember one time. my mom said something like, well, she was the mom. And I said, well, mom, you're the grandmom. Because she just kind of forgot. And I didn't at the time have a lot of grace for that attitude because I thought, I'm the mom and you're the grandmom. You're not the mom. And it hadn't dawned on me that she needed to make the shift. And she hadn't fully made the shift yet. We had the first grandkids. And so I think it is, it's a whole mental thing of making that shift, sliding to the side and, and remembering that we are the grandparent. And then also how our kiddos view us is how we are going to be able to interact, you know, how much time and, and all of that with our grandkids.

Dr. Jessica Peck: Well, tell us about some of the different grandparenting styles that you have in your book. And Lori, that's such good advice. And making that shift, and sometimes it's hard, but that requires communication, you know, to say, okay, this I don't. And maybe the grandparents think, I don't want to be seen as just the babysitter. I don't want to be just the spectator. I want to be more engaged. That requires communication and kind of some articulation about what is that grandparenting style. So what, can you give listeners some food for thought on what their grandparenting style might be if they've never thought about that before?

Lori Wildenberg: Yeah, you are so right that having those conversations and talking about expectations regarding the grandparent role is huge. I've got, like, a little fun quiz that I could do with your, listeners if. Are. Are you up for that?

Dr. Jessica Peck: I'm always. Am I up for fun? I. I am a pediatric nurse. I'm always up for fun. Go for it.

Lori Wildenberg: Okay, so chances are you find yourself in a number of these roles. But just for fun, we're going to pretend that your grandchild asks you if you can have a cookie. All right, Grandma, Grandpa, Mimi, Papa, can I have a. Can I have a cookie? And if you respond with, sure, anything you want, you might be the chum grandparent. If you say, well, perhaps after dinner, you might be the captain grandparent.

Dr. Jessica Peck: Hm.

Lori Wildenberg: Well, let's ask your parent. That would be the consultant grandparent. Can I have a cookie? Do you mean may I have a cookie?

Dr. Jessica Peck: You are the ceremony.

Lori Wildenberg: You're the not ceremonial grandparents. You're the ceremonial grandparents. Well, if it's gluten, dairy or sugar free, yes. So you could be the cool grandparent. if you just decide across the board, whatever it is you decide, you are probably the surrogate grandparent. The one who is the watches the kids a lot. Maybe not full time, you know, not all the time, because then you really function as a parent. But, a surrogate grandparent would be one that does a lot of childcare. Oh, Christian coach, let's ask your parents and then let's say thank you to Jesus for the cookie. you're checked out if you're completely unengaged and that question isn't even coming to you. And then the canceled, sadly not available and blocked by parents. So you can be a number of these, but I think each one has its sort of pluses and its pitfalls. With the exception with the Christian coach is really, we hope that that one weaves into a lot of the others because we want to be intentional with our faith, with our grandkids, and communicate that on a regular basis.

Dr. Jessica Peck: that was fun. I appreciate that, Lori. And I'm not a grandparent yet, but I'm already thinking, what would I do? I don't know, because I've got some. You know, part of me wants to be the fun, the chum grandparent, but part of me is the nurse thinking, what is the. What is the healthy option? But I think communication about that is so important. And kids need those different kinds of personalities in their life. There is always room for more love. There is always room for someone. And that's what that was really an attitude that I adopted as a mom. If someone is going to invest in my child and they're a good role model and they're demonstrating healthy relationship, there's always room for more love in my child's life. And one of the things that's really hard is that I think there are a lot of parents who put what you call conditional connections on, conditional connections on that. What. Why is that so damaging? Where are do you see grandparents offering but parents thinking, I'm m not sure I'm ready to receive that?

Lori Wildenberg: Yeah, those conditional connections are, are really, they are not healthy. And it gives the child the idea that they need to earn their grandparents or their parents love. And one thing that happened to me as a parent, Jessica that just completely flipped my parenting upside down. I thought that my kids knew that I love them unconditionally, no matter what. What I thought, it was obvious, right? But you have to say it. And my son came up to me. You know how kids always ask you questions when you're not prepared for it? Oh, yeah. And I was washing dishes, and he was probably five at the time. And he came up to me as I was washing dishes, and he said, mom, you wouldn't love me if I got arrested, would you?

Dr. Jessica Peck: Oh, my goodness.

Lori Wildenberg: And. And, well, first of all, if I'd been a smart mom, I would have thought, why are we asking this question? What's that about? But I was so shocked at his question. I said, of course, no matter what you would do, I would always love you. But he thought his behavior was tied into my love for him. And our kids, our grandkids, need to know that we will never leave nor forsake them. Just like our Father in heaven will never leave nor forsake us, that we have Emmanuel God with us, always with us. He is not leaving or forsaking us. And that's something that we need to keep in mind. I, was interviewing again people for the book, and it was, ah. I was asking people for examples of conditional connections. And one mom shared with me that, she had a grandparent in the car with her kids, and one of her kids was misbehaving. And the grandparents said, if you don't stop misbehaving, we're going to pull over to the side of the road and let you stand in the parking lot by yourself, and we're leaving. Oh, and that's a conditional connection. Right. But it could also be as small as, we're going to go without you if you don't get in the car. Right. Sometimes we say stuff like that, but not to do the threatening, to avoid that. we. We want them to know, no matter what, we are there for them and with them. And their behavior does not determine our love for them, just as our behavior does not determine our Lord's love for us.

Dr. Jessica Peck: That is so convicting. And I have definitely seen that myself as a mom. You think, of course I love you. Isn't it obvious? I've given my life for you. I spend all of my money on you. I spend all of my time on you. I look at you adoringly. But it is really amazing to me how fragile that can feel for a child. And I think that, you know, they're born and they know that you're Spending all your time, all your money, all your effort on them. And they're constantly asking that question in the back of their heart, am I worth it? Like, do you. Do you love me? Are you glad that I was born? Do you love who I am? And we cannot tell them enough until they are rolling their eyes and saying, yes, Mimi, yes, Meemaw, whatever it is. Yes, Mama, yes, yes, I know. Then we're not saying it enough. Listen, we've got so much more to talk about. There's so many issues that we have just scratched the surface because we've got in laws, we've got blended families, we've got. What do you do to get a grandparent more involved? Or what do you do as a grandparent? Engage more with your kids. We will talk more about fostering grandparent relationships with Lori Wildenberg when we come back. Here's Dr. Carl Trueman from the American Family Studios documentary the God who Speaks.

Dr. Carl Trueman: The early church fathers viewed the scriptures as divinely inspired. Often they would use the image of, a musical instrument, as if scripture had been written in the way that, say, notes come out of a flute when it's played by a flute player, as if the writer was the flute and the spirit was that which was creating the tune. Certainly they regarded scripture as authoritative. When you look at the writings of the Apostolic Fathers, they're very happy to quote scripture and consider that to have closed down the argument. So obviously, the Apostolic Fathers rooted tremendous authority in the actual words of scripture itself, which implies they had a very high view of its inspiration. Visit thegodwhospeaks.org.

What A Glorious Night by Sidewalk Prophets: The shepherds came to see the baby stood by his mother's side. Here lay the savior inside a manger oh, what a glorious night. Oh, what a glorious night. I hear the angels singing hallelujah let the earth receive her king I know that love has come Sing it out. Jesus Christ is born. Jesus Christ is. Born.

Dr. Jessica Peck: Welcome back, friends. That is what a Glorious Night by Sidewalk Prophets. Let me tell you, my producer and I sitting here doing the sign language to that that we once taught a very large children's choir. And one of the things I remember most about that children's choir that we taught that song to is all of the grandparents who were sitting in the congregation, taking pictures, just beaming at their grandbabies, singing that song and just sharing the joy of Christmas. And that's what we're talking about today, is grandparenting.

Lori Wildenberg writes a book about how to influence your grandchildren

My guest is Lori Wildenberg, and she has written a book called Grandparents Make Grand Partners how to have an Eternal impact on your grandchild's life. And I was just talking to Lori during the break. We have so much to talk about and so little time. So we're going to try to pack it in here because this is an issue that is so near and dear to so many families, and it impacts every family, because every single family has some sort of parent and grandparent dynamics. Whether they're great, whether they're absent, whether they're strained, it is there. And every grandparent, really, we want those grandparents to hold hope that every grandparent has the opportunity to leave something meaningful behind, to really build a legacy. But Laurie is challenging families to really aim higher than just memories or inheritance or fun, although those things are important and have their place. But she's inviting grandparents to pursue something eternal, from that spiritual influence to moments that mark a child's heart forever. We're talking about creating a legacy of faith, a legacy of the blessing, and a family culture of emotional safety. Now, this is not about being perfect, because there is no perfect grandparent. I know some of you probably beg to differ and you'll say, but my grandparent is perfect. And if you have that perfect grandparent for you, I think that is such a blessing. Call them today. Pick up the phone and call them. Or if they're really tech savvy, you can text them. I remember the first time my granny texted me. she was texting me on a flip phone and she texted me and I said. I responded back to her and said, who has kidnapped you? Who has your phone? This is very concerning. And about 20 minutes later, she texted me back, because you know how it is to text on a flip phone. But I'm so grateful for the legacy of my granny. She is probably the most influential person in my life. I adore her, Lori. I could talk about her forever. So I just. And Christmas was her favorite. So I need to. To.

Dr. Jessica Peck: I need to pull it back in.

What advice do you have for navigating family dynamics during the holidays?

But, Lori for Christmas, there are a lot of families who are dealing with a lot of dynamics here. We've got in laws, We've got sharing families. We have families who are divorced, families who are blended. All of those parenting and grandparenting dynamics are difficult. What advice do you have going into the holidays? What wisdom can you share for navigating those family dynamics with Grace?

Lori Wildenberg: Again, just as you have been saying, Jessica, that communication is really important and an attitude, again, of humility and grace regarding some of these holidays because we don't have to necessarily be so stuck on the day. if we have. If we can look at our adult children. If the grandparents can look at their adult children and see that they have a lot of pulls and tugs, especially if you are living in the same proximity. They could have at least a couple sets of grandparents that they are supposed to spend time with or expected to spend time with over the holidays. they could have more than that if there are like step family type situations. So to recognize that they are being pulled in a lot of ways just as we were when we were parents and talk about what your expectations are and what those things look like and perhaps to be willing to let go of, some of those traditions or particular days that you are stuck on and to be flexible regarding the days and the times of getting together. And, the parents are also trying to navigate just day to day stuff, trying to keep life normal for their kids during the holidays, such as keeping them on a nap schedule. These things are hard and there's a lot of pressure. So if we can be the grandparent that is flexible, that is willing to maybe be the one to travel. When my, when our first grandson, our first grandchild was born, they wanted to do Christmas at their house, but there was no way that they could make the Christmas dinner. There was just too much going on. So we decided, we'll make the dinner, we'll bring all the food, we can travel. And we drove to their place and we had, a lovely Christmas at their house where they were able to put, you know, our grandson down for a nap when he needed it because we were at their house and they didn't have the stress of making the meal or even worrying about cleaning. So to be flexible and to be willing and to be creative, perhaps you're not together during the holidays. we have one, of our families, my daughter and son in love and their three kiddos. they live on the west coast and so FaceTime will have to do and then times for us again to be willing to travel to them. My daughter actually asked me over Thanksgiving, hey, mom, would you guys ever be willing to, you know, come this way for the holidays? And we're like, sure. So we're planning on being there for Easter. It was the first one that came up. And we're going to go there for Easter. So yes, be willing and to ask what. Ask our adult children. Tell me what you're hoping for and what this will look like. Because the grandparents can be the flexible ones and we need to be. So I think those are some really three good tips for us to recall as grandparents that we can be flexible, we can be creative, we can be willing to do these different things.

Dr. Jessica Peck: That's such a great advice. And remember, you know, there's a lot of. Again, all of this comes back to communication. Lori. I'm so convicted about that because sometimes it's really hard for each to communicate that expectation. And I remember as a young mom, young, I had four kids, my in laws had always gone to a really nice dinner on Christmas. That was the kind of their tradition. They like to get dressed up to go out and to have a nice dinner and they wanted us to go with them. I was too scared to tell them like I have four little kids, like I don't think this is going to be a good idea. And one of my children, I had told them like, do not fidget, do not ask to go to the bathroom. And and so of course what happened was one of my children may or may not have tossed their cookies, so to speak, all over this beautiful restaurant dinner. T and I looked at that child, I said, why didn't you say something? And this child said you told me not to ask to go to the bathroom.

Lori Wildenberg: And so I didn't.

Dr. Jessica Peck: But of course they had been at another grandparents house, you know, where they had fed them cookies all afternoon, no nap, lots of sugar. So when you were talking about that Lori, I thought, oh yes. But thankfully my in laws were so gracious they could not stop laughing. I mean it was really pretty tragic. But they showed grace in that situation. And I think that's another thing that the grandparents can do when the kids act up and the parents are trying so hard and they feel so judged, you know, not to say, well, are you going to do something about that? Are you going to let your kid act that way? Like what are just being gracious in the moment and offering words of affirmation saying hey, you're doing a good job connecting with your kid. You know, what can I do to help you in that way? What would you say?

Lori Wildenberg: Or even I can I interject. Or even the opposite it.

Dr. Jessica Peck: Yes.

Lori Wildenberg: So I mean I have to say everything my grandkids do, I think is completely adorable. And so they, you know, and they might be a little on that they might be doing something a little naughty. Well, oh my goodness, to not laugh is really hard. Yes, but, but if, you know, laughing. My son has said to us, mom, you and dad, we're trying to, we're trying to teach them not to do this stuff, so please don't laugh. You know, so there is the Opposite of that, rather than, you know, feeling judged, there's the opposite of perhaps feeling undermined. And of course, we do not want to undermine our children in their important role as parents. So, not to, you know, laugh when they are being a little naughty.

Dr. Jessica Peck: That's so true. Very, very true. I know there were a few times where I would, be laughing so hard. I would just be like, mommy's crying because she's so sad that you're disobeying. But I was really laughing. It's so true. Well, Lori, I want you to talk to those grandparents who are walking into a situation. Maybe, maybe at Christmas everything is great and they think everything is fine. Maybe it's a little strained. Maybe it's got. They've got a lot of. Of just dread, you know, just thinking, okay, this. There's a lot of relational dynamics to navigate here. What would you tell them to do right now to initiate communication about that expectation, to extend grace? What are things that they can do right now to make their Christmas better?

Lori Wildenberg: Yeah, I think to identify what your expectations are, sometimes we've. We don't identify it. We just sort of know it when it doesn't happen. And, we need to identify that and then have the conversation with the parents, with the adult children of, hey, this is kind of what I was thinking or hoping. Does this line up with what you're thinking or hoping and talk about that so that neither party is leaving the situation feeling either hugely disappointed or even angry? I think by voicing our expectations and then realizing, is this a reasonable expectation? Is it reasonable? It may not be. Especially if you've got a lot of little kids and they're really busy and expecting them. Maybe just to sit through, a show or a fancy dinner, perhaps. So, yeah, I think to be able to verbalize that as we go into the Christmas, season, I think is actually really quite important and what you think your hopes are and to be able to let go of some things.

Dr. Jessica Peck: Well, tell us about the phrase that you use, grand blessing. What is that?

Lori Wildenberg: Yes, we can give our grandkids a blessing such as, may the Lord bless you and keep you. May the Lord make his face shine upon you and be gracious to you. May the Lord lift up his countenance upon you and give you his peace. In the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit. We can give our grandkids blessings like that. And in the book Grandparents Make Grandpartners, there are all kinds of blessings that are written out for grandmoms, granddads Mimi's and papas, and, you know, to give to their grandkids. And also, there are prayers that are written out in the book, various things that we can pray for for our grandkids and pray with our grandkids. What I've. As I put the book together, the very first part of the book is just like what we talked about, Jessica. Relationships. It's all about relationships and how to have healthy, strong, good relationships, godly relationships. And the last half of the book is very practical. How to give a blessing, how to pray, how to weave Christ into birthdays, Christmas, Thanksgiving, NewSong Year's, all of those various holidays. what we've done with our grandkids is we do something called an identity birthday party where they can see as they go through and do a scavenger hunt, that they are created in the image of Christ and they come across verses and also like little trinkets or toys that. That go along with that. And, it's all laid out in the book very clearly, so it's easily implemented. But the first part, again, is the relationship stuff, and then the last part is the how to. How do we do these things?

Dr. Jessica Peck: Well, Lori, I so appreciate the words of encouragement and blessing that you've given us. And as grandparents are looking at their grandkids wish list and trying to think about what they might get them for Christmas, I'm telling you, there is nothing greater than you, that you can give your grandchildren than the gift of a Christian legacy, the gift of words of blessing spoken over them. They may not remember that piece of technology that you got, but they will remember a word of blessing spoken over them. And I pray that as you go into the family, into the Christmas season, that your family, just as Lori said, will that the Lord will bless you and keep you and make his face to shine upon you. May he lift up his countenance upon you and give you peace. Thanks so much for joining us today. We'll see you right back here tomorrow. And if you want to hear more, get a copy of Lori's book, Grandparents Make Grand Partners. We got a really great show tomorrow. Don't miss it.

Jeff Chamblee: The views and opinions expressed in this broadcast may not necessarily reflect those of the American Family association or American Family Radio.

Lori Wildenberg talks with Jessica about how Grandparents can make grand partners.

Rx for Hope: Grandparents Make Grand Partners

https://loriwildenberg.com/