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Dr. Nurse Mama Show: Introducing Experts On Sports And Family Discipleship With Brian Smith And Ed Uszynski
: Dr. Nurse Mama show prescribing Hope for healthy families here on American radio. Here's your host, professor, pediatric nurse practitioner and mom of four, Dr. Jessica Peck.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Well, hey there friends and welcome to my favorite time of day. I love getting to spend time with you prescribing Hope for healthy families. And some of you families out there are taking being healthy and active really seriously. You love sports, maybe you love participating, maybe your kids are participating. Maybe you participate yourself. Maybe you are part of the cheer squad and you love to go and cheer on your kids and your grandpa and your grandkids and you, you just love all things sports. I definitely am, in a family like that who loves all Kinds of sports. My kids have done all kinds of sports. And we have been talking to two guys who are experts in this space who have been leading now for a long time, leading their own families and leading sports ministries. And we're back here for part two, but actually third in our series and talking about sports and families. We're talking to Brian Smith and Ed Uszynski, and they have spent decades invested into this sports ministry space. Brian founded the Christian Athlete and he is one of the co authors, along with Ed, of the book we've been talking about, Away Game, A Christian Parents Guide to Navigating Youth Sports and the Christian Athlete Glorifying God in Sports. And I encourage you, if you have not already and you're in this space, get a copy because it's so practical. It's got a lot of research in it and practical application for faith informed families. And Brian also has a master's degree in theology and Sports Studies from Baylor University. Now, Ed yasinski holds a PhD from Bowling Green State University and has more than three decades of experience discipling college and professional athletes. And together, Brian and Ed have helped Christian families think about sports not just as an activity to manage or maybe a person to manage, as we see the increased professionalization of sports, but as a context for discipleship. And I'm so glad that they're back here to continue our conversation because our last two, I feel like, have ended in dot, dot, dot.
Navigating Youth Sports: Healthy Participation Versus Performance And The Potential For Sports To Become An Idol
There's more to be discussed and they are discussing this all the time. You can follow them and their ministries and get more information if you want to be plugged in to more specific content on this stream. But Brian and Ed, I just want to jump right in and continue where we left off. Now, last time we talked, we talked a lot just about the healthy participation in sports, what happens when play becomes performance. And you guys had excellence. Really some tough truths. I hope people put on their tough suit before they listen to it, about what that line is for when we watch our kids. And really, you had some great advice for that. And we also talked about letting them struggle a little bit. You gave us great perspective and being not just a manager, not being the observer, the cheerleader, but being a spotter. And so I encourage people go back and listen to that. And today what I want to talk about is really, is sports a good gift or does it become a guide? God, an idol? And sometimes it's tough to be honest with ourselves about where that line is and keeping sports in its rightful place. Because when I start to Say idol or idolatry. That's a pretty strong word. And most Christian parents are probably going to say, like, okay, yeah, we love sports. We engage. Like, it's important, but it's not an idol. But idols don't always begin as bad things. And you. It, Brian, you actually have an idolatry test in this. So let's start with you. How do sports begin as good gifts from God, but sometimes they gradually become things that we ask to provide what only God can provide. Those things like identity, significance, belonging, status, security, worth.
The Sports Idolatry Test: Examining How Sports Can Function As A Substitute For God In Our Lives
Brian, I'm gonna give it to you to lead us off here.
Brian Smith: Yeah. I had wrote an article a number of years back titled the Sports Idolatry Test. And so within that article, there's like, 10 diagnostic questions that will help somebody. Like, on a scale of 1 to 10, you rate them, and then it kind of gives you a score. Helps you realize, is sport an idol in my life or not? And I mean, like, who really knows? It's just kind of a fun exercise for people to. To see where they stand on things. but when we start talking about idolatry in sport, and you kind of tease this out a little bit, we're really getting at, is sport functioning as a substitute for God in our life? Is sport functioning as something that we are looking for as ultimate satisfaction, hope, worth? And I think a lot of us would probably say, like, no, it's not. But. But the. The test is designed to help people say, like, we might. We might be leaning more towards that than we think. I. I almost think of it as, like, it's not just an on, off switch. It might be more of, like a dimmer switch, where it's just helpful to know, are we trending more in that direction or not? And so for me, there's there's usually like three. Three things that I'm noticing in my own heart that I kind of use to diagnose. Is sport becoming more than I think God wants it to be in my life? And the first thing, especially in the category of youth sports, is am I getting my identity from how my kids play, or am I bringing my identity as a child of God to the field or the court or wherever it is? And so, I have my own sinful tendency when my kid does well or poorly, to feel like that's a reflection on me. And so I become how my kid performs. And when I do that, I'm treating. I'm treating sport as. As an idol. I'm looking to my kid to give me something that Only God has given me. The next thing I'm thinking through is am I, am I responding on the sidelines or the stands in a way that is causing me to need to apologize to somebody afterwards. So, or if it really is supposed to be this beautiful gift that we're supposed to enjoy and have fun and maybe have like appropriate competitiveness even as fans, it shouldn't cause me to say things to a referee or a coach or to gossip about somebody in the stands in a sinful way. And when it does, I'm, I'm thinking I'm probably expecting something more out of sport than it should be giving me. And then the last thing that I'm, I'm often most prone to this, honestly, is that I just, I just find myself when my mind can go anywhere in life, just like in the, in the regular part of the day I'm thinking about sports, I'm thinking about my kid's race coming up or his wrestling match. And I just find that oftentimes my mind is consumed with sport instead of being consumed by God. And again that's, that's kind of a fine line of like, does that necessarily mean it's an idol or it's a, or it's sinful. But when the majority of my day is consumed by sports minded thing, I'm probably trajecting more in a, a space where it's an idol than something that's God honoring.
Self-Awareness and Spiritual Warfare: Recognizing When Good Gifts Become Idolatrous Distortions
So just three things in my life that I found I, I use those most to diagnose it.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Brian. I feel like there's a lot of people who are going to be wondering does that count on Sunday during NFL season? And my mind is consumed for most of the day with sports because it's just game after game. But we'll leave that there. Ed, what are your thoughts?
Ed Uszynski: Well, we talk about this with college athletes all the time. Like it is, it's the, it's the starting point, is to start to become self aware. And I think that's what Brian is really saying too. I like that dimmer switch idea is to become self aware. That actually the best gifts that God has created are going to be most susceptible to being turned into idols. and we don't usually talk about this right away, but there, there really is a spiritual warfare dynamic going on in that when God makes a good thing, his spiritual enemy Satan wants to take that good thing and distort it and turn it into something that takes the place of God. So it's not just for sports. I mean I hope people hear that. You really could apply Brian's test to work to any other extracurricular activity.
God Consciousness and Identity Crisis: The Modern Struggle For Self-Worth In A Digital Age
you know, again, we think, what are the good things that God has created when you think of sexuality and how that gets distorted and it should be such a good thing and yet become such a traumatized thing in our life because Satan invites us to turn it into an idol?
Dr. Jessica Peck: Yeah, that's.
Ed Uszynski: I like the self awareness. Yeah, the self awareness idea and that I want to become more God conscious. I think that is also going along with what Brian is saying. I don't know how much is too much. I know that as I get older, I want to be. I want to see more of my time throughout the day turning back in the direction of God in my own consciousness. And again, nobody knows whether I'm doing that or not. We can't keep track of that for each other. I can only ask myself, am I aware of the presence of God right now? Whether that's during an NFL game or it's on the sideline with my kids, or it's the parking lot at Walmart or it's at church? I mean, sometimes I can be the furthest away from God at church. Isn't that crazy? Because my mind is in so many other places or I'm having negative thoughts towards people or whatever, so it's not so much where I'm at or what I'm doing, but am I consciously aware of God's presence in this moment and am I coming back to that place over and over again?
Dr. Jessica Peck: Those are really good checkpoints, Ed. And I, want to go back to what you said about identity. And I see Gen Z and Gen Alpha having a real identity crisis. Now. Part of this, I think, is because of the pressure that they have, they don't see the message as clear as early, earlier generations did, that your identity is given to you by God. You are made in the image of God. You are a masterpiece. You are the apple of his eye. All of the things that God says about us, instead, what we have is kids are born today with a blank digital footprint and they are impressed with the message. Even if we don't say this so specifically, what culture impresses on them is your job right now is to craft your own identity and then market that identity to the public. And the public will tell you whether or not you are worthy of celebration of anything, what your purpose is in life, who you are, why you're here on this earth, what you were made for, all of those questions that people have, and I Think that's why we're seeing such an identity crisis. As you said, Ed, this isn't just a sports thing. This is a gender thing. This is a sexuality thing. This is a influencer thing.
Kids' Identity in Sports: Separating God-Given Identity From Performance And Marketable Image
I mean, any sort of talent or gift is. Is really filtered through what is marketable, what is desirable, what is sellable. And. But going back to that identity issue in sports, that is something that kids take on as their identity. And it's really hard because how do you separate, you know, the giftedness and the talent that God has given from, you know, being also. You're a holistic person. So, Brian, I want to go back to you because you talked about this a little bit, but I want to tease this more because there's two identities here. You've got the parent identity in the sports and the kid identity in the sports. Which do you want to tackle first?
Brian Smith: Let's talk about kids. Okay, kids.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Excellent. So let's talk about kids and their identity in sports. How do they take pride in what they do in being a track runner or being a, you know, a football player or a soccer player? How do they take pride in that and ownership of that with also. Without letting it also overshadow their identity given to them by God? M. What do you think?
Brian Smith: It's going to be a lot. It's going to be a lot easier for them to allow that sports identity to become absorbed into their life. And again, let's define what that means. It means that who I am is a result of my latest performance, plus what other people have to say about me. Like that's. That's our identity in sport oftentimes. And, and we say it's the result of our latest performance because any of us involved in sport know, like, you can have an amazing game or competition and people love you and affirm ah, you and celebrate you, but you have to do it again to keep that affirmation and attention and uphold that identity as a winner. If you do that one week and then come back the next week and blow the game, you're no longer a winner. Now you're a choke artist. And so sport is. It's just it disciples, us to believe that who we are is a direct extension of our latest performance. And so how do we, how do we help kids overshadow that? They need to understand their primary identity is not the result of their latest performance. They need biblical teaching on what it actually means to be an identity of. Of having an identity rooted as a child of God. And so you even mentioned some of this Kids need to know that they are God's masterpiece. Kids need to know that they are beloved, that they are cherished. That ah, Zephaniah is going to say that God sings over his people. Like how many kids have ever heard that God actually sings over you? And so kids need to be taught this at ah, a young age so that when things in sport go good or bad, parents can then come back and say hey, can I just remind you of what God says is true about you. And so we're constantly competing on behalf of God for our kids identity.
Dr. Jessica Peck: That is so true. we're already coming up on our first break.
Preparing For Adversity: Addressing Identity Crises When Athletes Face Injuries And Setbacks
This is why every question is like dot dot, dot. When we come back we'll pick up with Ed and talk more about kids identity and how we can help them intentionally recognize and embrace their identity given to them by God. And we'll also talk about parents identity in sports. But on your tough suit, it's really hard, I know, but it can relate to any sort of competitive endeavor or any sort of successful gifting that your child has is not just athletes. And this is not just a sports problem because we can idolize academics or college acceptance or musical achievement or any sort of recognition and fame. But we'll talk about putting sports in its rightful place and enjoying God's gift of that of play when we come back right after this break.
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I Believe You by Megan Woods: I be lying if I said that I'm m okay. Cause right now on the lost and lost count of the broken prayers I've prayed and it's true that some days it'd be easier to doubt ah but your word has never let me down. So I believe you when you say you're fighting for me. I believe you when you tell me that my story isn't over just yet. I will rise up again. You promise me that I will make it through. And I believe you.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Welcome back friends. That is I believe you by Megan woods. And that's really what we're talking about about today with Brian Smith and Ed Uszynski
Leaning Into God During Pain: Finding Purpose And Redemption In Sports Injuries And Setbacks
I'm in my third conversation with them about sports and its role in Christian family life. They are co authors of the book Away Game A Christian Parents Guide to Navigating Youth Sports. And I encourage you to get a copy because youth, the youth sports complex is really growing. And I remember they said last time, if you're looking for investments and opportunities for business, it is right here. But there's a greater opportunity for families to lean in, to use sports as a healthy tool of discipleship. And right before the break, we're right in the middle of talking about identity. And Ed, I want to come to you because I think that a lot of times families or youth athletes even will say, my identity is not found in sports. But the real test of that I find is when you lose your ability to compete in that sports. And I see this, I've shared this with you before. As a nurse practitioner. I'm seeing kids who are coming in with injuries that take them out of the game. And usually their first question, they don't care about long term function or arthritis later on in life. They only care like, when can I go back and play? And even now I'm thinking of a family friend that we have who is, have a really talented athlete who had a pretty devastating injury that's, you know, taken him out of the, of the sports for the foreseeable future for a season and a really special time that's super, super hard. How do we, how do we, you know, prepare for those moments whether they come or not so that when the real test comes about identity, they're able to stand firm and grounded in the truth of God's word?
Ed Uszynski: Yeah, you're asking such great questions that as you said, deserve way more than just, just a one minute answer. They really do. Like, that's a great, like we want
Dr. Jessica Peck: to hug the family first.
Ed Uszynski: It's a small group discussion topic.
Building Character Through Sports: Preparing Kids For Life's Challenges By Fostering Growth Over Performance
Well, and Brian and I have said this for years and again, we've had chances to experience it in our own lives personally, we've experienced it with our kids, with other people's kids. And I think what I keep coming back to is one, I want to be okay with just stepping into people's pain without having to resolve it right away, which can be so difficult to do, especially as a parent when you're hurting too and you, you want to try to bring perspective right away. I think I need to do a better job and we all probably need to do a better job of just, just sit in the yuckiness of it and it's okay to hurt, it's okay to be super discouraged and cry and, and it's just going to Ache for a while. It's so disappointing. one of our closest friends right now in our, in our youth sports circle, their son is probably going to be one of the best running backs in Ohio. He's a sophomore this year and he blew his knee out a couple weeks before the season started. And so we've been sitting with them at every game with him, standing on the sideline, just feeling it with them. And we feel disappointed. We want to watch him. So, you know, we're feeling this on so many different levels. So just to stay in that for a while and then it takes some discernment, I think, to also then at some point be able to say, God's got a bigger picture here than just this moment. This moment is a part of your larger story that he's weaving in your life, which is so hard to say to a 14 year old. It's hard to say to a 44 year old. There's, there's something that God is doing with your life right now in the midst of the pain that he wants to redeem and use in some other way. That, that just is always true. And I'm not going to make predictions about what that is. What we're going to try to do right now is lean into God. And I just, like I said earlier, we're going to, we're going to try to, when you start to feel, you know, anger and the different emotions that come with it, turn them to God, just like the psalmist did when he bad things were happening to him. Lean into trusting that God has His reasons and at some point it will be revealed. Let's, let's see what we can learn about him and about ourselves in the midst of it.
Purpose Beyond Play: Utilizing Sports To Foster Relational Skills And Character Development
And you still, in the context of sports, actually have a purpose here with your teammates. You, it was always about more than just the sport itself for you to be on this team now you can actually play. So maybe you can see even clearer that maybe God wants to use you just to be a really good friend to your teammates right now. Maybe you become the person that becomes the really good question asker on your team and has conversations with other teammates. Maybe you're the one that says, let's put our phones away. Let's make this a no phone zone trip right now on the bus and talk about X. That would be like a growth step. That would be a step of maturity in the midst of your pain to say maybe, maybe God wants to use you somehow relationally in the midst of this. So Brian, what else would you Would you say?
Brian Smith: I would say all of that that you said becomes a lot easier and a lot more receivable if you have begun to build those categories in your kid's life before that happens.
Integrating Growth into Sports: Shifting Focus From Winning To Personal Development And Team Enjoyment
Like, if all we talk about with our kids is how the game go, how did you play, Maybe next time do this. Then when m. When they get the injury for you to have a posture of actually, maybe this is a great time for you to see your teammates or to, you know, build bigger perspective that. That just feels like a brand new category is being introduced at a time when they are kind of going through this trauma. But if it's a normal part of your conversation to help them explore, what does it look like to see other people out there? What does it look like for them to build categories of what's actually fun in sport beyond just having success and beyond what happens when they're playing. What do you enjoy about being with your teammates out there? I think it opens the door up a little bit more when they're hurt and injured and maybe, maybe even just riding the bench to be able to help them see, these other parts that you enjoy about sport or maybe that God would have you available in sport for are still accessible whether your knee is fully healthy or not.
Ed Uszynski: Brian, I saw a quote the other day, you just made me think of this that said something to the effect of stop focusing so much on performance and winning and spend more energy paying attention to growth, try to grow. and so even, you know, when you're trying to pick a team like this has so many different applications in the context of sports, but usually we're worried more about performance than winning, and growth is back here somewhere. We've said that's what the youth sport industrial complex has turned into.
Prioritizing Growth Over Performance: Parents' Role In Cultivating Character And Identity In Youth Sports
It's hard to find coaches or administrators that are concerned about more than just, you know, the latest performance. Like Brian said, said, we of all people, though, as parents, we've got to work to flip that around. We've got to make growth more of a priority. And I love what Brian just said. If that, if it's already been a priority when our kid was 6, 7, 8, 9, they'll already have the framework and the language and the perspective so that when something happens when they're 14, 15, 16 years old, it still hurts. Again, I think that's important.
Brian Smith: Ed, I think that was brilliant for you to say that it still hurts, if not to minimize it. It's not say like, well, you're hurt. It doesn't matter. You can still see Other people. And it's like, no, there, there is something human about just sitting and being present in somebody's pain. But again, if you have built those other categories, it allows you maybe an easier on ramp through that pain.
Ed Uszynski: You can, you can draw on them for sure. And again, is that not true for us as adults also? So that's what I thought the whole time when you were talking about identity, Brian, is everything you said I still need as a 58 year old. The more difficult thing in being I think, an adult is that I not only have the responsibility of having perspective for myself, but I have to have that before I'm going to be able to give perspective to my kid. It's like being on the airplane when they talk about putting the, you know, the oxygen mask on yourself first. And sometimes really the heart renewal has to happen inside of me. There has to be a work done there before I'm going to be able to do anything meaningful with my kids in this area.
Dr. Jessica Peck: This is so good.
Celebrating Wins and Embracing Pain: Tying Identity to Character Rather Than Performance
I mean really, because I can see so many athletes in this conversation. It's important to celebrate the wins, you know, if you're going to be the best running back in Ohio. Like that's exciting to go and cheer on and to see the ways that God has gifted you in that success and, and in the pain and the taking away of that. Just like you said, important to say, yeah, this stinks. I mean this really hurts. But it all goes back to identity. And as I'm listening to you both talk about it, it's just very clear that you have two choices. You can build your identity on your performance or you can build it on your character. And that's where the under work, you know, kind of takes place. That foundational groundwork is making sure that, yes, while we're celebrating whatever the giftedness is and we're equipping them for success in that way that is not tied to their identity. Their identity is tied to character. And so how do we build character in that? Because I, as you were talking, Ed, I mean, I'm picturing this kid, I know, on the sidelines in crutches like it's breaking everybody's heart that's watching. But to see the character that that kid has to show up and to show out and to cheer them on even when, you know, he wants to be out there so bad and everybody would totally understand if he sat mopey on the, on the bench or even if he wasn't there to have that charact character. It's good, but that's the character that we need to build.
Building Character Through Affirmation: The Power of Hugs, Love, and Belonging in Family Life
So what are ways that we can build our kids character and make sure that we're tying that intentionally back to identity? Ed, what do you think?
Ed Uszynski: Well, and Brian and I have just been repeating these same things over and over again. It's like the prodigal story of the prodigal son who comes home after he realizes he's done a lot of really bad stuff and he's got nowhere else to go. And he finds a father who is waiting for him with his arms wide open, who embraces him fully because of his identity as a son. And so we just keep saying what are. What are practical ways that we can keep reaffirming identity for our sons? We can hug them. We literally can get our arms wide open and wrap them around them when we see them multiple times a day. Both fathers and mothers need to do that. That, maybe especially fathers as kids get older with their sons, they need that touch. They need to just be grabbed and hugged. They need to hear, I love you, man. That's it. I just want you to hear that again. I'm proud of you. I'm proud of you for stepping into another day. It's not an easy. It's not easy to do that as a teenager. I feel it as a grown man. I love you today, and I'm just proud of you, and I'm glad you're here. And just to keep reiterating again, that sounds so mundane. I think we are desperate for that. I just got to speak at an event for a, halfway house that is trying to create space for men and women to not only go through recovery, but also to get sent back out into the world with purpose. And the theme was the need for identity. amongst these adults, there were 400 people there. That was the theme of the night. We're all desperate to hear m. I love you and you belong here. I'm proud of you, and I've got a reason for you to be here. You know, you belong here.
Ministry Beyond Sports: Celebrating God's Creation and Purpose in Every Individual's Life
There's something for you to do that's bigger than the smallness of what your life feels like. I need to keep finding ways to say that to my kids and my wife and my friends.
Dr. Jessica Peck: For sure. Yes.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Yeah.
Ed Uszynski: And my friends and everybody. We, we. That's what it means actually to do ministry, I think, in this day and age is to start by being somebody that is just regularly celebrating, everything. We just said that God created you. God has a purpose for you. You're loved and accepted and not Let that become corny to us. Or cliche.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Absolutely. And Brian, it goes the opposite way, too. Not just good athletes who maybe, you know, have an injury or good athletes who are good. I've shared with you both before, athleticism is not my giftedness. But, you know, I'll tell you, I have this very vivid memory of being in elementary school and early junior high, and I was always picked last for everything. If there was a schoolyard pick, like, nobody wanted me on their team. But, you know, I'm really grateful that I had PE Coaches who looked at that and they said, okay, we don't want her. Her, you know, self esteem to be totally crushed because she's last. Let's just make her the official scorekeeper for everything because she's really good at keeping records and she's observant and she doesn't want to participate any. Anyway, so let me tell you, I became the manager for the school basketball team. I was the manager for several of the girls sports teams. And that opened up a whole new pathway for me so that my identity wasn't, oh, that's the girl you're gonna pick. The one with the big thick Coke bottle glasses and the pastel sweater vest. Like, don't pick her. It became, hey, she's good. She'll. She'll give you credit for what she's doing. I think there's so much opportunity for that.
Navigating Struggle in Sports: Teaching Kids Their Worth Is Not Tied to Performance or Being Picked Last
Brian, how do we. How do we help our kids with identity in a season of struggle where they feel like, in a slump? They're in a. Whatever sports word you want to use for. I'm m not crushing it right now.
Brian Smith: Yeah, I think a couple things you can. You start with doing exactly what Ed talked about earlier. You can meet them in the pain and not try to put some spiritual platitude on it of like, they. They might need to hear at some point, hey, God has you in this season for a purpose. But probably the most helpful thing for them to hear is that's really hard right now. It.
Brian Smith: It's not fun to get picked last. And I'm sorry about that. Even as you're saying that, though, I'm just wondering, like, what is it about sport culture that has created this value system where, you know, you got pick last or you're struggling? Why. Why is that a reflection on our sense of self worth? Like that is. It's interesting to think about that. Like, I really do believe in my guts that we will play sports and have a. And I think we'll be picking teams.
Parental Identity in Sports: Avoiding the Pitfall of Taking Children's Successes as Our Own
I think we'll be picking teams and I think in a, lot of people real happy. I think in the new world though that some people get picked last, some people will get picked last and it won't be this like weird reflection on your sense of self worth. It'll just be what it is. And so we, we do need to help teach our kids and this comes with how they succeed but also how they fail. That regardless of how you do, it's not a reflection of, of, of who you are. And so maybe, maybe being careful of putting labels on kids early on, in both directions I think would be helpful.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Yeah, that label would be nerd or you know, whatever it is. I definitely felt that. But clearly it did not impact my self esteem. So way to go for the PE coaches. I found my giftedness in other areas. Listen guys, we're already at our second break. Time is flying as it always does and when we come back we're going to tackle that tough. I want to go back to the parent identity because it is really hard. I see parents who do put their identity in their kids performance, whether it's sports or academics or whatever success that it is. It's so hard. How do we know when we're crossing the line into cheering them on to success as to taking that success as our own identity. We'll be right back with Brian and Ed after, after this. Don't miss it.
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And my father, your great grandfather, fought in World War II. Really? He was a gunner on the big ship out in the Pacific Ocean. Wow. Your great grandmother did her part too. Was she on a ship? Oh no, she stayed back home. She and a lot of worked really hard in a factory because the men had gone off to war and they held scrap metal drives to help in the war effort. The folks back home were heroes too.
Jeff Chamblee: Here at the American Family association, we consider you the heroes back home as you fulfill your responsibility of caring for your family day to day. Your partnership with us is crucial as we fight the enemies of freedom in America. Thank you for your commitment to the American Family Association. Grandpa, what's a scrap metal drive? Let's get some cookies and I'll tell you all about it.
Because He Lives (Amen) by Matt Maher: I believe in the Son I believe in the risen one. I believe I overcome by the power of his blood. Amen. Amen. I'm alive. I'm alive because he lives. Amen. Let my M song join the world that never ends. Because he lives.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Welcome back friends. That is because he lives. Amen.
Dr. Jessica Peck: By Matt Maher and because he lives we can face tomorrow. And maybe some of you have sports things scheduled for tomorrow or the week, weekend, or just every day. I'm talking today to Brian Smith and Ed Uszynski We are continuing our conversation that resulted from me reading their book Away Game A Christian Parents Guide to Navigating Youth Sports. And I encourage you, if you are in any way involved in youth sports, get a copy of this book. It is a really great perspective shift and helps us to use sports as a discipleship tool and an outreach ministry.
The Soccer Mom Identity: Healthy Engagement Versus Idolization of Roles in Youth Sports
And we're just right in the middle of talking about things like I. We've heard claims that there will be sports in heaven and we will be picking teams. And I do not have the theological chops to say whether that is true or not, but if it is true, I will be keeping score. And I hope, I hope it's baseball. That's all I have to say about that. But Ed, I'm going to give you a fastball here, right there. and talk to you about parents taking on their kids identity. We talked about this a lot, a little bit before, but I think that is really hard when we're having an identity crisis and remembering who we are. Sometimes our can feel the pressure when our identity becomes, I mean we know it because it's marketed right as the soccer mom. Like I'm the soccer mom. There's T shirt, dance mom. It is marketable. It's a marketable identity. How do we embrace that in a healthy way while all also recognizing when we've crossed the line and our priorities are not right?
Ed Uszynski: Yeah, well, first of all, just like we did before, I don't think there's anything wrong with feeling joy in being the soccer mom. it's funny because I just texted Brian the other day my son was in a golf match and was doing really well and beat a kid that he probably shouldn't have beat. And I texted him somewhat tongue in cheek and said trey just beat a kid who's number one in the conference. I feel really great about myself because we talk about this all the time, you know, and when they do good, you're gonna feel good. And when they do poorly, it's pretty natural to feel lousy. I don't think those feelings in and of themselves should have to go away. So there is some natural identity. He's he or she has your name and they look kind of like you. And there's going to be something to that. I think again where it's that that dimmer switch idea is when I can't function anymore because they've been, they've done poorly. I don't want to talk to people around me because I'm ashamed. I think, think, okay, no, that's. Something's gone off the rails there. When I start to feel like that, or worse, I turn on them when they get in the car or I, you know, I'm chilly with them. after they perform poorly, it's a lot easier, I think, to celebrate them. But you end up celebrating them in a way that is actually subtly communicating. I get really, really, really excited when you do well and you won't see me get like this any other time. That's a problem. I should be able to get really, really excited for them when I see them do something that exhibits character like you talked about, if I have eyes for it. When I see them having a conversation with the kid as they're walking down the fairway from the other team. And I know that you're the one that initiated it when you came up to a kid that was visiting from a college with my wife at church yesterday and you initiated shaking hands with them and introducing yourself. Needed my excitement to say, dude, that's, that's a man move right there. That was great what you just did. You're following what I'm saying. So there should be some other places where they get that same excitement from me and they should never feel like I've turned on them because they did poorly. Like I. Which again means I need to have done my work. I need to do work in my own soul and make sure that my identity is secure before I get into the stadium or the practice or wherever. That never goes away. I don't think for us as adults to have to keep checking ourselves.
Guardrails for Parents: Confronting Ego, Dismissal, and Idolatry in Youth Sports
Dr. Jessica Peck: Brian, what do you think? You know, you're a track coach. You shared with that you've got kids who are athletes. So you experience this as a coach and you see parents on the sideline. I'm sure you see great examples and examples that perhaps are not so great, but still a learning opportunity. And I know you experienced this as a dad. What are the guardrails that you see that are helpful for us to put in place? Place?
Brian Smith: Yeah, I, I can keep it. I don't even have to look to parents that I, that are kind of in my circle. I can keep it in my own heart because I feel like I embody enough in myself to represent most people. I, I think when I. Let me phrase it this way, I feel like I'm in the best sense. I'M I'm beginning to have a growing awareness of when my kid or my teams do well. I'm sensing this weird ego about me where when I walk into church or when my cross country team performs well and I go to the football game later that day, I have this weird feeling like everybody should know about what my team just did and affirm, me and just realizing that's idolatry, that's identity. And I need to confess that really, really quickly. And so part of that's just the human nature in me. I experience success and I want people to know and affirm it, whether it's the kids I coach or my own kid. And I just need to be really careful in my own heart about letting that sink too deep into my soul. so ego is a big thing that I feel like I'm confessing often. Ed talked about, like, when your kid or kids maybe perform poorly, needing to hide. I find what I default to is a, I, like, I will find some way to, like, dismiss the poor performance. Well, it's because the ref made this call or we actually, one of our top runners was hurt, so there's a reason we took second instead of first. And so, like, what, what is it in me that needs to try to dismiss maybe why we didn't perform or my kid perform as well as they should? It's. It's identity issues and it's idolatry issues that's coming from me. There's something in me that feels like. Like I need to prevent, or present a different version of reality that makes me and my kid look good, even though the scoreboard just said they took second instead of third. So I'm. I feel like I'm having this growing awareness where I am realizing that, and it really stinks because I'm realizing even though I speak about this and write about it, I'm still really far away from practicing it as well as I want to. But it is making me do what I feel like Christians need to do and just say God. God. There it is again. I'm sorry. Transform me.
The Litmus Test of Faith: Ensuring Sports Strengthens Relationships With God and Others
Make me new. Would you help me to experience a different pathway forward?
Dr. Jessica Peck: Brian, I'm really stunned at your honesty. I mean, I think you have just voiced what many, many parents feel in their heart but wrestle with and maybe don't even say out loud to themselves, you know, kind of. I think sometimes when we wrestle with those thoughts, we disassociate from them, you know, and just kind of think through them, but don't really take Time to think about what we're thinking about. That's metacognition. You thinking about what we're thinking about. And is, and ultimately you talked about this being an issue of identity and idolatry. And if our identity is rooted in Christ, that's going to protect us from idolatry, making sports an idol. And that is, that is really the litmus test that you both have talked about is, is engaging in this sport as a family, as an individual athlete, is it strengthening your faith or is it, is it pulling you away from your faith? Ah, is it tempting you to idolize things you shouldn't idolize to, you know, fall into despair or to arrogance? And Ed, how do we use that litmus test to really think, okay, is this strengthening my faith? Is this pulling me closer to God? Is this really strengthening my relationship with him? Or is this putting distance because of sin that it's introducing? How can we navigate this? That, that line.
Ed Uszynski: Do you think it's interesting because the whole time you were saying that I just. But the word that was going through my mind again is awareness. It's self awareness. It's not either or it's going to do those things. Let's just say that that space is naturally wired to become idolatrous for us. That space is naturally wired to become our identity. Let's just say that that the very way that it's made up. And again, I feel like we could take a whole another hour and just talk about what it means to live in a post Christian Age where 50 years ago the air we breathed had much more Judeo Christian identity aspects to it that you could more easily absorb. When we were all a go to church type communities and even the, even the public schools kind of had more of that vibe to them in the air care. And that's gone now. So we're gonna look for other things like you said earlier, Dr. Peck, that take the place of that. So let's, let's start there. It's going to do that to you. So am I self aware enough to realize when it's happening and walk with God? Confess it like Brian just said. I love how Brian just described all that. When I'm aware that it's happening. Confess God. I think this is becoming too important to me right now, God. I think, I think this negative feeling that I'm starting to have is probably something that's not going to be God honoring. Would you help me to be patient towards him when he gets in the car or when she, you know, when, when she strikes out again. Would you give me the words to say that would actually comfort instead of condemn? I mean that, that's, that's.
Walking With God: Staying Self-Aware andministering to Others in Sports and Life
It's called walking with God in the midst of it. You know, I, I don't, I know that sounds almost too simplistic, but if I'm not God conscious, it's going to become an idol and it's going to take over my identity in ways that are never healthy. I need to keep pushing back on that. And one of the things too, I don't know if we've said this enough. I think one of the things that's helped me is to pay more attention to other people's kids instead of just my own own. It's to. If I know all this is true, everything we just talked about, that's going on with everyone that's sitting around me right now. And I'm not in competition with these people. I actually could be a minister by recognizing their kid, by seeing them. There's so many chances just to say, I see your kid or I saw something that he or she did that maybe even just goes beyond the sports mode moment and say that out loud to them, like breathe life into other people that are struggling around me instead of just trying to pull life from them for myself.
Leading Families Through Sports: Honesty, Apology, and Creating Space Beyond the Game
And that's like big boy, big girl thinking, you know, it really is. That's like really adult, mature Christian thinking. And I want to keep scratching and clawing my way in that direction instead of just worrying about me and what everybody thinks about me and my kids performance in this moment moment when I know there's so much more, bigger things going on. Can I get caught up in those and ask God to help me see them every time I go back out? Because I, will talk about this right now and I'm going to a golf match in three hours and if I don't reconnect to what we just talked about, I'll be a complete idiot on the golf. That's what I'm going to be pulled back towards. So I need to be self aware and keep turning my consciousness in the direction of godly things.
Dr. Jessica Peck: I love that you are just not giving the, the church answers, you know, the, the Jesus answers. Because these things are complex and we've talked about that a lot just sitting in these. And you know, Brian, going back to you, you've talked about your own personal struggle with remarkable candor, both of you have. You've been extremely honest and authentic and I think very relatable. And that's where the power Is. So as a dad, how do you lead your family? And then this space, how do you say, okay, I'm struggling, and yet I have the responsibility for shepherding this, for stewarding this season. And, I want to, you know, speak life over us. I want this sports to draw us closer to God. What advice would you have?
Dr. Jessica Peck: What.
Dr. Jessica Peck: What can we do? What encouragement?
The Power of Apology and Balanced Conversations: Keeping Sports in Its Proper Place
How can dads step up and lead their families?
Brian Smith: Well, yeah, a couple things, I think. One, when we inevitably make mistakes, when we care too much, when we maybe overstep with. With what we're saying, the mechanism of growth in godliness that God has given us is confession and repentance. And so we, yes, we can do that with God, but there's massive power in just apologizing to our kids or our spouse, too. So to be able to say, like, hey, I said this after the game and I'm really sorry. This is what was going on in me. and I just want to apologize. Will you forgive me? Like, what, man? What would it do for a generation of our kids to grow up with parents who. Who apologize and to learn what that looks like from their parents? And then two, I'm. I'm trying to get better at this. Just like sport is something we do for a few hours a week, it does not need to be the entire air that we breathe 24 7. And so when my. My, my sophomore son, who's a cross country athlete, when he's not running, we don't need to be talking about running. We can talk about our football team that we cheer for, the Lions. We can talk about what he's learning in the Bible. We can talk about school and relationships and other things. We don't need to. We don't need to bring what's happening at practice or at the course back home with us. It can just be something we do and not the totality of who we are. But it starts with me just making sure. I'm checking the conversations that I'm having. It does not always employees, and it should not always revolve around sport. Yes.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Although it can be other sports. Lions, huh? Well, I'm gonna say I'm rooting for the Texans, even though, you know, that's complicated.
Conclusion and Blessing: Encouragement for Families Navigating Sports and Life with Faith
We do live in a sports family. Once again, guys, I feel like this conversation is dot, dot, dot, and I'm going to pin you down right here and just say you need to come back and we need to talk about using sports as an outreach ministry, as a. Sports as a medium to show share our faith. So I'm hoping that you'll come back and do that and I hope that you listening will get a copy of the book. If you are involved with youth sports at all, really get a copy of that book Away Game the Christian Parents Guide. It is so helpful. And as you do whatever sports you're watching or cheering or not watching or cheering or playing, wherever you are, whatever you're doing, I pray as I always do, that the Lord will bless you and keep keep you and make his face to shine upon you and be gracious to you and give you peace no matter the score. We'll see you back here next time.
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Jeff Chamblee: opinions expressed in this broadcast may not necessarily reflect those of the American Family association or American Family Radio.
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Dr. Nurse Mama Show: Introducing Experts On Sports And Family Discipleship With Brian Smith And Ed Uszynski
: Dr. Nurse Mama show prescribing Hope for healthy families here on American radio. Here's your host, professor, pediatric nurse practitioner and mom of four, Dr. Jessica Peck.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Well, hey there friends and welcome to my favorite time of day. I love getting to spend time with you prescribing Hope for healthy families. And some of you families out there are taking being healthy and active really seriously. You love sports, maybe you love participating, maybe your kids are participating. Maybe you participate yourself. Maybe you are part of the cheer squad and you love to go and cheer on your kids and your grandpa and your grandkids and you, you just love all things sports. I definitely am, in a family like that who loves all Kinds of sports. My kids have done all kinds of sports. And we have been talking to two guys who are experts in this space who have been leading now for a long time, leading their own families and leading sports ministries. And we're back here for part two, but actually third in our series and talking about sports and families. We're talking to Brian Smith and Ed Uszynski, and they have spent decades invested into this sports ministry space. Brian founded the Christian Athlete and he is one of the co authors, along with Ed, of the book we've been talking about, Away Game, A Christian Parents Guide to Navigating Youth Sports and the Christian Athlete Glorifying God in Sports. And I encourage you, if you have not already and you're in this space, get a copy because it's so practical. It's got a lot of research in it and practical application for faith informed families. And Brian also has a master's degree in theology and Sports Studies from Baylor University. Now, Ed yasinski holds a PhD from Bowling Green State University and has more than three decades of experience discipling college and professional athletes. And together, Brian and Ed have helped Christian families think about sports not just as an activity to manage or maybe a person to manage, as we see the increased professionalization of sports, but as a context for discipleship. And I'm so glad that they're back here to continue our conversation because our last two, I feel like, have ended in dot, dot, dot.
Navigating Youth Sports: Healthy Participation Versus Performance And The Potential For Sports To Become An Idol
There's more to be discussed and they are discussing this all the time. You can follow them and their ministries and get more information if you want to be plugged in to more specific content on this stream. But Brian and Ed, I just want to jump right in and continue where we left off. Now, last time we talked, we talked a lot just about the healthy participation in sports, what happens when play becomes performance. And you guys had excellence. Really some tough truths. I hope people put on their tough suit before they listen to it, about what that line is for when we watch our kids. And really, you had some great advice for that. And we also talked about letting them struggle a little bit. You gave us great perspective and being not just a manager, not being the observer, the cheerleader, but being a spotter. And so I encourage people go back and listen to that. And today what I want to talk about is really, is sports a good gift or does it become a guide? God, an idol? And sometimes it's tough to be honest with ourselves about where that line is and keeping sports in its rightful place. Because when I start to Say idol or idolatry. That's a pretty strong word. And most Christian parents are probably going to say, like, okay, yeah, we love sports. We engage. Like, it's important, but it's not an idol. But idols don't always begin as bad things. And you. It, Brian, you actually have an idolatry test in this. So let's start with you. How do sports begin as good gifts from God, but sometimes they gradually become things that we ask to provide what only God can provide. Those things like identity, significance, belonging, status, security, worth.
The Sports Idolatry Test: Examining How Sports Can Function As A Substitute For God In Our Lives
Brian, I'm gonna give it to you to lead us off here.
Brian Smith: Yeah. I had wrote an article a number of years back titled the Sports Idolatry Test. And so within that article, there's like, 10 diagnostic questions that will help somebody. Like, on a scale of 1 to 10, you rate them, and then it kind of gives you a score. Helps you realize, is sport an idol in my life or not? And I mean, like, who really knows? It's just kind of a fun exercise for people to. To see where they stand on things. but when we start talking about idolatry in sport, and you kind of tease this out a little bit, we're really getting at, is sport functioning as a substitute for God in our life? Is sport functioning as something that we are looking for as ultimate satisfaction, hope, worth? And I think a lot of us would probably say, like, no, it's not. But. But the. The test is designed to help people say, like, we might. We might be leaning more towards that than we think. I. I almost think of it as, like, it's not just an on, off switch. It might be more of, like a dimmer switch, where it's just helpful to know, are we trending more in that direction or not? And so for me, there's there's usually like three. Three things that I'm noticing in my own heart that I kind of use to diagnose. Is sport becoming more than I think God wants it to be in my life? And the first thing, especially in the category of youth sports, is am I getting my identity from how my kids play, or am I bringing my identity as a child of God to the field or the court or wherever it is? And so, I have my own sinful tendency when my kid does well or poorly, to feel like that's a reflection on me. And so I become how my kid performs. And when I do that, I'm treating. I'm treating sport as. As an idol. I'm looking to my kid to give me something that Only God has given me. The next thing I'm thinking through is am I, am I responding on the sidelines or the stands in a way that is causing me to need to apologize to somebody afterwards. So, or if it really is supposed to be this beautiful gift that we're supposed to enjoy and have fun and maybe have like appropriate competitiveness even as fans, it shouldn't cause me to say things to a referee or a coach or to gossip about somebody in the stands in a sinful way. And when it does, I'm, I'm thinking I'm probably expecting something more out of sport than it should be giving me. And then the last thing that I'm, I'm often most prone to this, honestly, is that I just, I just find myself when my mind can go anywhere in life, just like in the, in the regular part of the day I'm thinking about sports, I'm thinking about my kid's race coming up or his wrestling match. And I just find that oftentimes my mind is consumed with sport instead of being consumed by God. And again that's, that's kind of a fine line of like, does that necessarily mean it's an idol or it's a, or it's sinful. But when the majority of my day is consumed by sports minded thing, I'm probably trajecting more in a, a space where it's an idol than something that's God honoring.
Self-Awareness and Spiritual Warfare: Recognizing When Good Gifts Become Idolatrous Distortions
So just three things in my life that I found I, I use those most to diagnose it.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Brian. I feel like there's a lot of people who are going to be wondering does that count on Sunday during NFL season? And my mind is consumed for most of the day with sports because it's just game after game. But we'll leave that there. Ed, what are your thoughts?
Ed Uszynski: Well, we talk about this with college athletes all the time. Like it is, it's the, it's the starting point, is to start to become self aware. And I think that's what Brian is really saying too. I like that dimmer switch idea is to become self aware. That actually the best gifts that God has created are going to be most susceptible to being turned into idols. and we don't usually talk about this right away, but there, there really is a spiritual warfare dynamic going on in that when God makes a good thing, his spiritual enemy Satan wants to take that good thing and distort it and turn it into something that takes the place of God. So it's not just for sports. I mean I hope people hear that. You really could apply Brian's test to work to any other extracurricular activity.
God Consciousness and Identity Crisis: The Modern Struggle For Self-Worth In A Digital Age
you know, again, we think, what are the good things that God has created when you think of sexuality and how that gets distorted and it should be such a good thing and yet become such a traumatized thing in our life because Satan invites us to turn it into an idol?
Dr. Jessica Peck: Yeah, that's.
Ed Uszynski: I like the self awareness. Yeah, the self awareness idea and that I want to become more God conscious. I think that is also going along with what Brian is saying. I don't know how much is too much. I know that as I get older, I want to be. I want to see more of my time throughout the day turning back in the direction of God in my own consciousness. And again, nobody knows whether I'm doing that or not. We can't keep track of that for each other. I can only ask myself, am I aware of the presence of God right now? Whether that's during an NFL game or it's on the sideline with my kids, or it's the parking lot at Walmart or it's at church? I mean, sometimes I can be the furthest away from God at church. Isn't that crazy? Because my mind is in so many other places or I'm having negative thoughts towards people or whatever, so it's not so much where I'm at or what I'm doing, but am I consciously aware of God's presence in this moment and am I coming back to that place over and over again?
Dr. Jessica Peck: Those are really good checkpoints, Ed. And I, want to go back to what you said about identity. And I see Gen Z and Gen Alpha having a real identity crisis. Now. Part of this, I think, is because of the pressure that they have, they don't see the message as clear as early, earlier generations did, that your identity is given to you by God. You are made in the image of God. You are a masterpiece. You are the apple of his eye. All of the things that God says about us, instead, what we have is kids are born today with a blank digital footprint and they are impressed with the message. Even if we don't say this so specifically, what culture impresses on them is your job right now is to craft your own identity and then market that identity to the public. And the public will tell you whether or not you are worthy of celebration of anything, what your purpose is in life, who you are, why you're here on this earth, what you were made for, all of those questions that people have, and I Think that's why we're seeing such an identity crisis. As you said, Ed, this isn't just a sports thing. This is a gender thing. This is a sexuality thing. This is a influencer thing.
Kids' Identity in Sports: Separating God-Given Identity From Performance And Marketable Image
I mean, any sort of talent or gift is. Is really filtered through what is marketable, what is desirable, what is sellable. And. But going back to that identity issue in sports, that is something that kids take on as their identity. And it's really hard because how do you separate, you know, the giftedness and the talent that God has given from, you know, being also. You're a holistic person. So, Brian, I want to go back to you because you talked about this a little bit, but I want to tease this more because there's two identities here. You've got the parent identity in the sports and the kid identity in the sports. Which do you want to tackle first?
Brian Smith: Let's talk about kids. Okay, kids.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Excellent. So let's talk about kids and their identity in sports. How do they take pride in what they do in being a track runner or being a, you know, a football player or a soccer player? How do they take pride in that and ownership of that with also. Without letting it also overshadow their identity given to them by God? M. What do you think?
Brian Smith: It's going to be a lot. It's going to be a lot easier for them to allow that sports identity to become absorbed into their life. And again, let's define what that means. It means that who I am is a result of my latest performance, plus what other people have to say about me. Like that's. That's our identity in sport oftentimes. And, and we say it's the result of our latest performance because any of us involved in sport know, like, you can have an amazing game or competition and people love you and affirm ah, you and celebrate you, but you have to do it again to keep that affirmation and attention and uphold that identity as a winner. If you do that one week and then come back the next week and blow the game, you're no longer a winner. Now you're a choke artist. And so sport is. It's just it disciples, us to believe that who we are is a direct extension of our latest performance. And so how do we, how do we help kids overshadow that? They need to understand their primary identity is not the result of their latest performance. They need biblical teaching on what it actually means to be an identity of. Of having an identity rooted as a child of God. And so you even mentioned some of this Kids need to know that they are God's masterpiece. Kids need to know that they are beloved, that they are cherished. That ah, Zephaniah is going to say that God sings over his people. Like how many kids have ever heard that God actually sings over you? And so kids need to be taught this at ah, a young age so that when things in sport go good or bad, parents can then come back and say hey, can I just remind you of what God says is true about you. And so we're constantly competing on behalf of God for our kids identity.
Dr. Jessica Peck: That is so true. we're already coming up on our first break.
Preparing For Adversity: Addressing Identity Crises When Athletes Face Injuries And Setbacks
This is why every question is like dot dot, dot. When we come back we'll pick up with Ed and talk more about kids identity and how we can help them intentionally recognize and embrace their identity given to them by God. And we'll also talk about parents identity in sports. But on your tough suit, it's really hard, I know, but it can relate to any sort of competitive endeavor or any sort of successful gifting that your child has is not just athletes. And this is not just a sports problem because we can idolize academics or college acceptance or musical achievement or any sort of recognition and fame. But we'll talk about putting sports in its rightful place and enjoying God's gift of that of play when we come back right after this break.
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I Believe You by Megan Woods: I be lying if I said that I'm m okay. Cause right now on the lost and lost count of the broken prayers I've prayed and it's true that some days it'd be easier to doubt ah but your word has never let me down. So I believe you when you say you're fighting for me. I believe you when you tell me that my story isn't over just yet. I will rise up again. You promise me that I will make it through. And I believe you.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Welcome back friends. That is I believe you by Megan woods. And that's really what we're talking about about today with Brian Smith and Ed Uszynski
Leaning Into God During Pain: Finding Purpose And Redemption In Sports Injuries And Setbacks
I'm in my third conversation with them about sports and its role in Christian family life. They are co authors of the book Away Game A Christian Parents Guide to Navigating Youth Sports. And I encourage you to get a copy because youth, the youth sports complex is really growing. And I remember they said last time, if you're looking for investments and opportunities for business, it is right here. But there's a greater opportunity for families to lean in, to use sports as a healthy tool of discipleship. And right before the break, we're right in the middle of talking about identity. And Ed, I want to come to you because I think that a lot of times families or youth athletes even will say, my identity is not found in sports. But the real test of that I find is when you lose your ability to compete in that sports. And I see this, I've shared this with you before. As a nurse practitioner. I'm seeing kids who are coming in with injuries that take them out of the game. And usually their first question, they don't care about long term function or arthritis later on in life. They only care like, when can I go back and play? And even now I'm thinking of a family friend that we have who is, have a really talented athlete who had a pretty devastating injury that's, you know, taken him out of the, of the sports for the foreseeable future for a season and a really special time that's super, super hard. How do we, how do we, you know, prepare for those moments whether they come or not so that when the real test comes about identity, they're able to stand firm and grounded in the truth of God's word?
Ed Uszynski: Yeah, you're asking such great questions that as you said, deserve way more than just, just a one minute answer. They really do. Like, that's a great, like we want
Dr. Jessica Peck: to hug the family first.
Ed Uszynski: It's a small group discussion topic.
Building Character Through Sports: Preparing Kids For Life's Challenges By Fostering Growth Over Performance
Well, and Brian and I have said this for years and again, we've had chances to experience it in our own lives personally, we've experienced it with our kids, with other people's kids. And I think what I keep coming back to is one, I want to be okay with just stepping into people's pain without having to resolve it right away, which can be so difficult to do, especially as a parent when you're hurting too and you, you want to try to bring perspective right away. I think I need to do a better job and we all probably need to do a better job of just, just sit in the yuckiness of it and it's okay to hurt, it's okay to be super discouraged and cry and, and it's just going to Ache for a while. It's so disappointing. one of our closest friends right now in our, in our youth sports circle, their son is probably going to be one of the best running backs in Ohio. He's a sophomore this year and he blew his knee out a couple weeks before the season started. And so we've been sitting with them at every game with him, standing on the sideline, just feeling it with them. And we feel disappointed. We want to watch him. So, you know, we're feeling this on so many different levels. So just to stay in that for a while and then it takes some discernment, I think, to also then at some point be able to say, God's got a bigger picture here than just this moment. This moment is a part of your larger story that he's weaving in your life, which is so hard to say to a 14 year old. It's hard to say to a 44 year old. There's, there's something that God is doing with your life right now in the midst of the pain that he wants to redeem and use in some other way. That, that just is always true. And I'm not going to make predictions about what that is. What we're going to try to do right now is lean into God. And I just, like I said earlier, we're going to, we're going to try to, when you start to feel, you know, anger and the different emotions that come with it, turn them to God, just like the psalmist did when he bad things were happening to him. Lean into trusting that God has His reasons and at some point it will be revealed. Let's, let's see what we can learn about him and about ourselves in the midst of it.
Purpose Beyond Play: Utilizing Sports To Foster Relational Skills And Character Development
And you still, in the context of sports, actually have a purpose here with your teammates. You, it was always about more than just the sport itself for you to be on this team now you can actually play. So maybe you can see even clearer that maybe God wants to use you just to be a really good friend to your teammates right now. Maybe you become the person that becomes the really good question asker on your team and has conversations with other teammates. Maybe you're the one that says, let's put our phones away. Let's make this a no phone zone trip right now on the bus and talk about X. That would be like a growth step. That would be a step of maturity in the midst of your pain to say maybe, maybe God wants to use you somehow relationally in the midst of this. So Brian, what else would you Would you say?
Brian Smith: I would say all of that that you said becomes a lot easier and a lot more receivable if you have begun to build those categories in your kid's life before that happens.
Integrating Growth into Sports: Shifting Focus From Winning To Personal Development And Team Enjoyment
Like, if all we talk about with our kids is how the game go, how did you play, Maybe next time do this. Then when m. When they get the injury for you to have a posture of actually, maybe this is a great time for you to see your teammates or to, you know, build bigger perspective that. That just feels like a brand new category is being introduced at a time when they are kind of going through this trauma. But if it's a normal part of your conversation to help them explore, what does it look like to see other people out there? What does it look like for them to build categories of what's actually fun in sport beyond just having success and beyond what happens when they're playing. What do you enjoy about being with your teammates out there? I think it opens the door up a little bit more when they're hurt and injured and maybe, maybe even just riding the bench to be able to help them see, these other parts that you enjoy about sport or maybe that God would have you available in sport for are still accessible whether your knee is fully healthy or not.
Ed Uszynski: Brian, I saw a quote the other day, you just made me think of this that said something to the effect of stop focusing so much on performance and winning and spend more energy paying attention to growth, try to grow. and so even, you know, when you're trying to pick a team like this has so many different applications in the context of sports, but usually we're worried more about performance than winning, and growth is back here somewhere. We've said that's what the youth sport industrial complex has turned into.
Prioritizing Growth Over Performance: Parents' Role In Cultivating Character And Identity In Youth Sports
It's hard to find coaches or administrators that are concerned about more than just, you know, the latest performance. Like Brian said, said, we of all people, though, as parents, we've got to work to flip that around. We've got to make growth more of a priority. And I love what Brian just said. If that, if it's already been a priority when our kid was 6, 7, 8, 9, they'll already have the framework and the language and the perspective so that when something happens when they're 14, 15, 16 years old, it still hurts. Again, I think that's important.
Brian Smith: Ed, I think that was brilliant for you to say that it still hurts, if not to minimize it. It's not say like, well, you're hurt. It doesn't matter. You can still see Other people. And it's like, no, there, there is something human about just sitting and being present in somebody's pain. But again, if you have built those other categories, it allows you maybe an easier on ramp through that pain.
Ed Uszynski: You can, you can draw on them for sure. And again, is that not true for us as adults also? So that's what I thought the whole time when you were talking about identity, Brian, is everything you said I still need as a 58 year old. The more difficult thing in being I think, an adult is that I not only have the responsibility of having perspective for myself, but I have to have that before I'm going to be able to give perspective to my kid. It's like being on the airplane when they talk about putting the, you know, the oxygen mask on yourself first. And sometimes really the heart renewal has to happen inside of me. There has to be a work done there before I'm going to be able to do anything meaningful with my kids in this area.
Dr. Jessica Peck: This is so good.
Celebrating Wins and Embracing Pain: Tying Identity to Character Rather Than Performance
I mean really, because I can see so many athletes in this conversation. It's important to celebrate the wins, you know, if you're going to be the best running back in Ohio. Like that's exciting to go and cheer on and to see the ways that God has gifted you in that success and, and in the pain and the taking away of that. Just like you said, important to say, yeah, this stinks. I mean this really hurts. But it all goes back to identity. And as I'm listening to you both talk about it, it's just very clear that you have two choices. You can build your identity on your performance or you can build it on your character. And that's where the under work, you know, kind of takes place. That foundational groundwork is making sure that, yes, while we're celebrating whatever the giftedness is and we're equipping them for success in that way that is not tied to their identity. Their identity is tied to character. And so how do we build character in that? Because I, as you were talking, Ed, I mean, I'm picturing this kid, I know, on the sidelines in crutches like it's breaking everybody's heart that's watching. But to see the character that that kid has to show up and to show out and to cheer them on even when, you know, he wants to be out there so bad and everybody would totally understand if he sat mopey on the, on the bench or even if he wasn't there to have that charact character. It's good, but that's the character that we need to build.
Building Character Through Affirmation: The Power of Hugs, Love, and Belonging in Family Life
So what are ways that we can build our kids character and make sure that we're tying that intentionally back to identity? Ed, what do you think?
Ed Uszynski: Well, and Brian and I have just been repeating these same things over and over again. It's like the prodigal story of the prodigal son who comes home after he realizes he's done a lot of really bad stuff and he's got nowhere else to go. And he finds a father who is waiting for him with his arms wide open, who embraces him fully because of his identity as a son. And so we just keep saying what are. What are practical ways that we can keep reaffirming identity for our sons? We can hug them. We literally can get our arms wide open and wrap them around them when we see them multiple times a day. Both fathers and mothers need to do that. That, maybe especially fathers as kids get older with their sons, they need that touch. They need to just be grabbed and hugged. They need to hear, I love you, man. That's it. I just want you to hear that again. I'm proud of you. I'm proud of you for stepping into another day. It's not an easy. It's not easy to do that as a teenager. I feel it as a grown man. I love you today, and I'm just proud of you, and I'm glad you're here. And just to keep reiterating again, that sounds so mundane. I think we are desperate for that. I just got to speak at an event for a, halfway house that is trying to create space for men and women to not only go through recovery, but also to get sent back out into the world with purpose. And the theme was the need for identity. amongst these adults, there were 400 people there. That was the theme of the night. We're all desperate to hear m. I love you and you belong here. I'm proud of you, and I've got a reason for you to be here. You know, you belong here.
Ministry Beyond Sports: Celebrating God's Creation and Purpose in Every Individual's Life
There's something for you to do that's bigger than the smallness of what your life feels like. I need to keep finding ways to say that to my kids and my wife and my friends.
Dr. Jessica Peck: For sure. Yes.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Yeah.
Ed Uszynski: And my friends and everybody. We, we. That's what it means actually to do ministry, I think, in this day and age is to start by being somebody that is just regularly celebrating, everything. We just said that God created you. God has a purpose for you. You're loved and accepted and not Let that become corny to us. Or cliche.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Absolutely. And Brian, it goes the opposite way, too. Not just good athletes who maybe, you know, have an injury or good athletes who are good. I've shared with you both before, athleticism is not my giftedness. But, you know, I'll tell you, I have this very vivid memory of being in elementary school and early junior high, and I was always picked last for everything. If there was a schoolyard pick, like, nobody wanted me on their team. But, you know, I'm really grateful that I had PE Coaches who looked at that and they said, okay, we don't want her. Her, you know, self esteem to be totally crushed because she's last. Let's just make her the official scorekeeper for everything because she's really good at keeping records and she's observant and she doesn't want to participate any. Anyway, so let me tell you, I became the manager for the school basketball team. I was the manager for several of the girls sports teams. And that opened up a whole new pathway for me so that my identity wasn't, oh, that's the girl you're gonna pick. The one with the big thick Coke bottle glasses and the pastel sweater vest. Like, don't pick her. It became, hey, she's good. She'll. She'll give you credit for what she's doing. I think there's so much opportunity for that.
Navigating Struggle in Sports: Teaching Kids Their Worth Is Not Tied to Performance or Being Picked Last
Brian, how do we. How do we help our kids with identity in a season of struggle where they feel like, in a slump? They're in a. Whatever sports word you want to use for. I'm m not crushing it right now.
Brian Smith: Yeah, I think a couple things you can. You start with doing exactly what Ed talked about earlier. You can meet them in the pain and not try to put some spiritual platitude on it of like, they. They might need to hear at some point, hey, God has you in this season for a purpose. But probably the most helpful thing for them to hear is that's really hard right now. It.
Brian Smith: It's not fun to get picked last. And I'm sorry about that. Even as you're saying that, though, I'm just wondering, like, what is it about sport culture that has created this value system where, you know, you got pick last or you're struggling? Why. Why is that a reflection on our sense of self worth? Like that is. It's interesting to think about that. Like, I really do believe in my guts that we will play sports and have a. And I think we'll be picking teams.
Parental Identity in Sports: Avoiding the Pitfall of Taking Children's Successes as Our Own
I think we'll be picking teams and I think in a, lot of people real happy. I think in the new world though that some people get picked last, some people will get picked last and it won't be this like weird reflection on your sense of self worth. It'll just be what it is. And so we, we do need to help teach our kids and this comes with how they succeed but also how they fail. That regardless of how you do, it's not a reflection of, of, of who you are. And so maybe, maybe being careful of putting labels on kids early on, in both directions I think would be helpful.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Yeah, that label would be nerd or you know, whatever it is. I definitely felt that. But clearly it did not impact my self esteem. So way to go for the PE coaches. I found my giftedness in other areas. Listen guys, we're already at our second break. Time is flying as it always does and when we come back we're going to tackle that tough. I want to go back to the parent identity because it is really hard. I see parents who do put their identity in their kids performance, whether it's sports or academics or whatever success that it is. It's so hard. How do we know when we're crossing the line into cheering them on to success as to taking that success as our own identity. We'll be right back with Brian and Ed after, after this. Don't miss it.
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Because He Lives (Amen) by Matt Maher: I believe in the Son I believe in the risen one. I believe I overcome by the power of his blood. Amen. Amen. I'm alive. I'm alive because he lives. Amen. Let my M song join the world that never ends. Because he lives.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Welcome back friends. That is because he lives. Amen.
Dr. Jessica Peck: By Matt Maher and because he lives we can face tomorrow. And maybe some of you have sports things scheduled for tomorrow or the week, weekend, or just every day. I'm talking today to Brian Smith and Ed Uszynski We are continuing our conversation that resulted from me reading their book Away Game A Christian Parents Guide to Navigating Youth Sports. And I encourage you, if you are in any way involved in youth sports, get a copy of this book. It is a really great perspective shift and helps us to use sports as a discipleship tool and an outreach ministry.
The Soccer Mom Identity: Healthy Engagement Versus Idolization of Roles in Youth Sports
And we're just right in the middle of talking about things like I. We've heard claims that there will be sports in heaven and we will be picking teams. And I do not have the theological chops to say whether that is true or not, but if it is true, I will be keeping score. And I hope, I hope it's baseball. That's all I have to say about that. But Ed, I'm going to give you a fastball here, right there. and talk to you about parents taking on their kids identity. We talked about this a lot, a little bit before, but I think that is really hard when we're having an identity crisis and remembering who we are. Sometimes our can feel the pressure when our identity becomes, I mean we know it because it's marketed right as the soccer mom. Like I'm the soccer mom. There's T shirt, dance mom. It is marketable. It's a marketable identity. How do we embrace that in a healthy way while all also recognizing when we've crossed the line and our priorities are not right?
Ed Uszynski: Yeah, well, first of all, just like we did before, I don't think there's anything wrong with feeling joy in being the soccer mom. it's funny because I just texted Brian the other day my son was in a golf match and was doing really well and beat a kid that he probably shouldn't have beat. And I texted him somewhat tongue in cheek and said trey just beat a kid who's number one in the conference. I feel really great about myself because we talk about this all the time, you know, and when they do good, you're gonna feel good. And when they do poorly, it's pretty natural to feel lousy. I don't think those feelings in and of themselves should have to go away. So there is some natural identity. He's he or she has your name and they look kind of like you. And there's going to be something to that. I think again where it's that that dimmer switch idea is when I can't function anymore because they've been, they've done poorly. I don't want to talk to people around me because I'm ashamed. I think, think, okay, no, that's. Something's gone off the rails there. When I start to feel like that, or worse, I turn on them when they get in the car or I, you know, I'm chilly with them. after they perform poorly, it's a lot easier, I think, to celebrate them. But you end up celebrating them in a way that is actually subtly communicating. I get really, really, really excited when you do well and you won't see me get like this any other time. That's a problem. I should be able to get really, really excited for them when I see them do something that exhibits character like you talked about, if I have eyes for it. When I see them having a conversation with the kid as they're walking down the fairway from the other team. And I know that you're the one that initiated it when you came up to a kid that was visiting from a college with my wife at church yesterday and you initiated shaking hands with them and introducing yourself. Needed my excitement to say, dude, that's, that's a man move right there. That was great what you just did. You're following what I'm saying. So there should be some other places where they get that same excitement from me and they should never feel like I've turned on them because they did poorly. Like I. Which again means I need to have done my work. I need to do work in my own soul and make sure that my identity is secure before I get into the stadium or the practice or wherever. That never goes away. I don't think for us as adults to have to keep checking ourselves.
Guardrails for Parents: Confronting Ego, Dismissal, and Idolatry in Youth Sports
Dr. Jessica Peck: Brian, what do you think? You know, you're a track coach. You shared with that you've got kids who are athletes. So you experience this as a coach and you see parents on the sideline. I'm sure you see great examples and examples that perhaps are not so great, but still a learning opportunity. And I know you experienced this as a dad. What are the guardrails that you see that are helpful for us to put in place? Place?
Brian Smith: Yeah, I, I can keep it. I don't even have to look to parents that I, that are kind of in my circle. I can keep it in my own heart because I feel like I embody enough in myself to represent most people. I, I think when I. Let me phrase it this way, I feel like I'm in the best sense. I'M I'm beginning to have a growing awareness of when my kid or my teams do well. I'm sensing this weird ego about me where when I walk into church or when my cross country team performs well and I go to the football game later that day, I have this weird feeling like everybody should know about what my team just did and affirm, me and just realizing that's idolatry, that's identity. And I need to confess that really, really quickly. And so part of that's just the human nature in me. I experience success and I want people to know and affirm it, whether it's the kids I coach or my own kid. And I just need to be really careful in my own heart about letting that sink too deep into my soul. so ego is a big thing that I feel like I'm confessing often. Ed talked about, like, when your kid or kids maybe perform poorly, needing to hide. I find what I default to is a, I, like, I will find some way to, like, dismiss the poor performance. Well, it's because the ref made this call or we actually, one of our top runners was hurt, so there's a reason we took second instead of first. And so, like, what, what is it in me that needs to try to dismiss maybe why we didn't perform or my kid perform as well as they should? It's. It's identity issues and it's idolatry issues that's coming from me. There's something in me that feels like. Like I need to prevent, or present a different version of reality that makes me and my kid look good, even though the scoreboard just said they took second instead of third. So I'm. I feel like I'm having this growing awareness where I am realizing that, and it really stinks because I'm realizing even though I speak about this and write about it, I'm still really far away from practicing it as well as I want to. But it is making me do what I feel like Christians need to do and just say God. God. There it is again. I'm sorry. Transform me.
The Litmus Test of Faith: Ensuring Sports Strengthens Relationships With God and Others
Make me new. Would you help me to experience a different pathway forward?
Dr. Jessica Peck: Brian, I'm really stunned at your honesty. I mean, I think you have just voiced what many, many parents feel in their heart but wrestle with and maybe don't even say out loud to themselves, you know, kind of. I think sometimes when we wrestle with those thoughts, we disassociate from them, you know, and just kind of think through them, but don't really take Time to think about what we're thinking about. That's metacognition. You thinking about what we're thinking about. And is, and ultimately you talked about this being an issue of identity and idolatry. And if our identity is rooted in Christ, that's going to protect us from idolatry, making sports an idol. And that is, that is really the litmus test that you both have talked about is, is engaging in this sport as a family, as an individual athlete, is it strengthening your faith or is it, is it pulling you away from your faith? Ah, is it tempting you to idolize things you shouldn't idolize to, you know, fall into despair or to arrogance? And Ed, how do we use that litmus test to really think, okay, is this strengthening my faith? Is this pulling me closer to God? Is this really strengthening my relationship with him? Or is this putting distance because of sin that it's introducing? How can we navigate this? That, that line.
Ed Uszynski: Do you think it's interesting because the whole time you were saying that I just. But the word that was going through my mind again is awareness. It's self awareness. It's not either or it's going to do those things. Let's just say that that space is naturally wired to become idolatrous for us. That space is naturally wired to become our identity. Let's just say that that the very way that it's made up. And again, I feel like we could take a whole another hour and just talk about what it means to live in a post Christian Age where 50 years ago the air we breathed had much more Judeo Christian identity aspects to it that you could more easily absorb. When we were all a go to church type communities and even the, even the public schools kind of had more of that vibe to them in the air care. And that's gone now. So we're gonna look for other things like you said earlier, Dr. Peck, that take the place of that. So let's, let's start there. It's going to do that to you. So am I self aware enough to realize when it's happening and walk with God? Confess it like Brian just said. I love how Brian just described all that. When I'm aware that it's happening. Confess God. I think this is becoming too important to me right now, God. I think, I think this negative feeling that I'm starting to have is probably something that's not going to be God honoring. Would you help me to be patient towards him when he gets in the car or when she, you know, when, when she strikes out again. Would you give me the words to say that would actually comfort instead of condemn? I mean that, that's, that's.
Walking With God: Staying Self-Aware andministering to Others in Sports and Life
It's called walking with God in the midst of it. You know, I, I don't, I know that sounds almost too simplistic, but if I'm not God conscious, it's going to become an idol and it's going to take over my identity in ways that are never healthy. I need to keep pushing back on that. And one of the things too, I don't know if we've said this enough. I think one of the things that's helped me is to pay more attention to other people's kids instead of just my own own. It's to. If I know all this is true, everything we just talked about, that's going on with everyone that's sitting around me right now. And I'm not in competition with these people. I actually could be a minister by recognizing their kid, by seeing them. There's so many chances just to say, I see your kid or I saw something that he or she did that maybe even just goes beyond the sports mode moment and say that out loud to them, like breathe life into other people that are struggling around me instead of just trying to pull life from them for myself.
Leading Families Through Sports: Honesty, Apology, and Creating Space Beyond the Game
And that's like big boy, big girl thinking, you know, it really is. That's like really adult, mature Christian thinking. And I want to keep scratching and clawing my way in that direction instead of just worrying about me and what everybody thinks about me and my kids performance in this moment moment when I know there's so much more, bigger things going on. Can I get caught up in those and ask God to help me see them every time I go back out? Because I, will talk about this right now and I'm going to a golf match in three hours and if I don't reconnect to what we just talked about, I'll be a complete idiot on the golf. That's what I'm going to be pulled back towards. So I need to be self aware and keep turning my consciousness in the direction of godly things.
Dr. Jessica Peck: I love that you are just not giving the, the church answers, you know, the, the Jesus answers. Because these things are complex and we've talked about that a lot just sitting in these. And you know, Brian, going back to you, you've talked about your own personal struggle with remarkable candor, both of you have. You've been extremely honest and authentic and I think very relatable. And that's where the power Is. So as a dad, how do you lead your family? And then this space, how do you say, okay, I'm struggling, and yet I have the responsibility for shepherding this, for stewarding this season. And, I want to, you know, speak life over us. I want this sports to draw us closer to God. What advice would you have?
Dr. Jessica Peck: What.
Dr. Jessica Peck: What can we do? What encouragement?
The Power of Apology and Balanced Conversations: Keeping Sports in Its Proper Place
How can dads step up and lead their families?
Brian Smith: Well, yeah, a couple things, I think. One, when we inevitably make mistakes, when we care too much, when we maybe overstep with. With what we're saying, the mechanism of growth in godliness that God has given us is confession and repentance. And so we, yes, we can do that with God, but there's massive power in just apologizing to our kids or our spouse, too. So to be able to say, like, hey, I said this after the game and I'm really sorry. This is what was going on in me. and I just want to apologize. Will you forgive me? Like, what, man? What would it do for a generation of our kids to grow up with parents who. Who apologize and to learn what that looks like from their parents? And then two, I'm. I'm trying to get better at this. Just like sport is something we do for a few hours a week, it does not need to be the entire air that we breathe 24 7. And so when my. My, my sophomore son, who's a cross country athlete, when he's not running, we don't need to be talking about running. We can talk about our football team that we cheer for, the Lions. We can talk about what he's learning in the Bible. We can talk about school and relationships and other things. We don't need to. We don't need to bring what's happening at practice or at the course back home with us. It can just be something we do and not the totality of who we are. But it starts with me just making sure. I'm checking the conversations that I'm having. It does not always employees, and it should not always revolve around sport. Yes.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Although it can be other sports. Lions, huh? Well, I'm gonna say I'm rooting for the Texans, even though, you know, that's complicated.
Conclusion and Blessing: Encouragement for Families Navigating Sports and Life with Faith
We do live in a sports family. Once again, guys, I feel like this conversation is dot, dot, dot, and I'm going to pin you down right here and just say you need to come back and we need to talk about using sports as an outreach ministry, as a. Sports as a medium to show share our faith. So I'm hoping that you'll come back and do that and I hope that you listening will get a copy of the book. If you are involved with youth sports at all, really get a copy of that book Away Game the Christian Parents Guide. It is so helpful. And as you do whatever sports you're watching or cheering or not watching or cheering or playing, wherever you are, whatever you're doing, I pray as I always do, that the Lord will bless you and keep keep you and make his face to shine upon you and be gracious to you and give you peace no matter the score. We'll see you back here next time.
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Jeff Chamblee: opinions expressed in this broadcast may not necessarily reflect those of the American Family association or American Family Radio.
Discover how to navigate youth sports through a biblical lens with Brian Smith and Ed Uszynski on The Dr. Nurse Mama Show. Learn how to balance performance, prevent sports idolatry, and build your child's identity on character rather than the scoreboard.
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