Darkness and Light: A Call for Believers to Be Ambassadors in a Troubled World
Sammy Hudson Darkness is not an affirmative force. It simply reoccupies the space vacated by the light. This is the, Hamilton Corner on American Family Radio. It should be uncomfortable for a believer to live as a hypocrite, delivering people out of the bondage of mainstream media and the philosophies of this world. God has called you and me to
Alex McFarland be his ambassadors, even in this dark moment. Let's not miss our moment.
Sammy Hudson And now, the, Hamilton Corner.
Alex McFarland The future of America depends on the Christian training of young people. Alex McFarland here.
George Washington's Vision for Christian Training and Host Alex McFarland's Introduction
Guess who said that quote? That's a great quote, isn't it? The future of the country depends on the Christian training of young people. It was our first president, George Washington, who said that. And with that quote, I welcome you to today's edition of the Hamilton corner. Alex McFarland here, sitting in for Abe Hamilton III. And, you may know me from Exploring the Word, which is the Bible teaching show we've done on the American Family Radio Network for more than 16 years now. Praise God. And I've got the great privilege of, guest hosting on a lot of the programs. Also, we've got a very important show today because later on in the show, we're going to have Lauren, Greene from Fox News in NewSong York. you've seen the riots in France, and there are threats now, arson on the cathedral at Notre Dame. Loren Green was there when they rededicated the more than $1 billion restoration. And, we're going to talk about that and more, but. Right. Oh, my goodness. I've got one of my most valued friends and colleagues in the ministry. His name is Sammy Hudson. Sammy is the visionary founder of, really, one of the greatest camps in America. I've rented camps in, I don't know, 25, 28 states. The refuge in Aden, North Carolina. That's down east, kind of east of Raleigh. But the refuge is just, There's nothing like it. I mean, it's just one of the finest Christian camps. And we will be there next summer, July 18 through 23, with another one of our youth apologetics and biblical worldview camps. And, Sammy's just always a very insightful brother and resource. I love to glean his wisdom. We're gonna talk a little bit about the youth and the worldview of our young people. He's made time to be with us now. Welcome to the American Family Radio Network.
Sammy Hudson Discusses The Refuge Christian Camp and Youth Worldviews
Sammy Hudson. Welcome, brother.
Sammy Hudson Hey, Alex, it's so good to be with you. And. And even a very cool privilege to be on the Abraham show with you this evening?
Alex McFarland Yeah, indeed. Hey, before we go any farther, I want to talk about young people because you've got your. Your finger on the pulse of what America's teens believe. but give us a website. Tell us about the Refuge. I just love that place. It's one of my favorite places in the world. But, bring us up to speed on all things Refuge.
Fred Jackson Yes.
Sammy Hudson So we're buzzing right along. the website's North Carolina. Like North Carolina, North Carolina.
Ed Vitagliano Org.
Sammy Hudson And, and there are kids here right now. As we're speaking. We're, outside my window. I see kids canoeing and, learning about God's, creation through water ecology. And so there's all kinds of things going on here, even in the outside of summer months. But, we are excited about what God is doing here. we're busy all the way up to our Christmas light show where we share the gospel in lights, for the month of December. And last year, we had 5,300 cars drive through to see the gospel with Refuge, which is really a cool ministry in itself, but I'm excited about what God is doing, in our country. And, our youth are hungry. just to say it plainly. Ah, there's a lot of things going in some good directions. I know people speak negatively a lot about what's going on with our teenagers, but the reality is they. They know they've been lied to for so long by the culture. They're looking for someone to share truth. And we find it.
Alex McFarland Yeah, I, do think young people are hungry. You know, ever since, Charlie Kirk got shot, in Utah, just days after Charlie Kirk's assassination, Sammy, we had a big citywide evangelistic crusade in the Jackson, Mississippi area near the state capital of Mississipp. we turned away people every night there were. I mean, it was standing room only. Then this past summer of 26, for the first time in 28 years of doing youth camps, I had a waiting list at every camp, literally, Pennsylvania, Montana, Georgia. And so, I guess, I'd love to get your message to the adults out there and maybe, the youth leaders, the volunteers or Sunday school teachers. how receptive are America's middle school, high school teenagers to solid biblical truth? they're hungry, aren't they, Sammy?
Sammy Hudson Yeah, they. They are very hungry. And the, the hard part about it is a lot of the parents feel ill equipped to teach their kids biblical worldview, because the reality is a lot of churches aren't biblical worldview. Churches, they still hold on to a secular worldview of, of evolution.
The Importance of Biblical Foundations and Archeological Evidence Supporting the Bible
And they, miss the idea that the first page of the Bible has to be true for the rest of it to be true.
Alex McFarland Amen, brother. Right on.
Sammy Hudson So it's fun, it's fun to share with them. My wife and I are teaching a class now in our church just about the, the foundations of, of God's Word and why it's all true. And what we realize is the parents, the parents have realized we've been lied to our whole life. And I'm excited that they're thirsty, that they want to grow. But in order for us to, to have good, conversations with the, with the children, with the youth, we have to train the parents, as well. So we just. The reality is we have a, not a fully biblical illiterate society in America, but there's a lot of people that just have not spent time in God's Word. and so that's the real training ground. We certainly get excited about training the students, but if they could go home and have, time with, with their parents in the Word, it changes everything.
Alex McFarland It really does. And, you know, talking about apologetics, for those that may not be aware, apologetics is the, the evidence for the Bible, for Christianity defending the faith. I truly believe, Sammy, that youth, ministry today has got to include an apologetics element about why this is true. We know it's true and we could talk a lot about that. But in your approach, as you create the curriculum for the Refuge summer camp, some, do you share that view that apologetics is really, really significant these days?
Sammy Hudson Yes. In every week, from our elementary weeks through our high school weeks, it's important at every level. And oftentimes people say, well, just share Jesus. And yes, we want to share Jesus, but we have to give the reason why we need to share Jesus. And so we have to start at the very beginning and walk through and train students that the Bible is reliable and be able to give answers. Because the reality is kids are going off to college and they're falling flat on their face because they can't, they don't know the Bible well enough or aren't able to give answers or are not on a solid enough foundation to be able to continue in their faith. And they just, they fall away from church and, in God's Word because they, they're intimidated by the questions that the culture asks. And so we have to train the students on what it is to be able to stand firm and to have Confidence that God's word does not fail. it is secure and never be, torn down in any way.
Alex McFarland You know Sammy, in, in the late 80s when I first became a Christian, I was in college and you know, I was a new believer at age 21. And I just, from the get go I just believed the Bible. But I remember I had college professors who said, well, there was no King David, there never was a man named King David. Or the Exodus never happened. And over the last 40 years folks, the archeological evidence, they have found multiple, multiple inscriptions that reference that reference Abraham, Joshua, King David, the Exodus, King Solomon, who had horse stables that could hold 750 horses each. I was, when I was in college, I was told that was just, exaggeration. Well, I have walked one of those 750 horse stables that has been excavated in the Holy Land. And to me it's so exciting. Yes, we believe by faith we put our trust in Jesus.
The Refuge Camp's Mission: Sharing and Modeling the Hope of Jesus
But over and over and over the archeology and the history has corroborated and validated what the Bible says. And kids need to know this, don't they?
Sammy Hudson Yeah, there's so much evidence just that shows up every day proving the Bible more and more true, not the other way around. I do believe it takes way more faith to trust the secular worldview than to trust the creation or the biblical worldview. of how we got here. That's one of the biggest questions we get asked is how do we get here? Yeah, kids want to know. And and the Bible gives a solid answer. In fact, it gives the only answer that makes sense, in the world that we live in. So we get excited when kids come to camp and they're thirsty. So whether they're in first grade or in a senior in high school, the gospel is shared with them from starting from the beginning and, and walking through. And I, I get amazed every time when kids say the Bible really says that.
Sammy Hudson Like yes, it really says that. And they get so excited when they know now they have something, they're more equipped when they go home. They get excited to share with their parents. And parents have told me we spend hours with our kids when they get home with them asking more questions about the Bible. And so, and same thing happens with me, me and my wife after we listen to afr, we listen to you or Abraham Hamilton. Like we get excited about what's going on in the world that we live in from the biblical worldview and we have questions and God continues to grow us and nurture us in him through his word.
Alex McFarland You know, folks, if you're just tuning in, the voice you're hearing is Sammy Hudson, longtime friend and colleague.
The Refuge Camp's Facilities and Spiritual Growth Through the Lantern Walk
He is the founder and leader of the Refuge, which is a Christian camp in my home state of North Carolina. And we've done a lot of events there over the years. We're going to be back there, July 18 through 23, doing one of our youth camps. And I know right now you're probably thinking less about next summer and more about, you know, fall 26. But here's the thing. Summer of 27 is going to be upon us really soon, and we would love for your youth group to come. I'd love for you to come to my week that I'm going to be there teaching, but, you need to check out the Refuge. And let me say, I've been to camps all over the place. Sammy, when I was there last summer, you were wrapping up with one of the most beautiful chapels over by this massively huge lake. how did you guys finish up that beautiful chapel, Brother?
Sammy Hudson Yeah, it should be finished by the end of the year. We have our first wedding planned to be in there on March 4th. and so it. It needs to be ready by then anyways. And. And here with you, we have begun construction on the seed company, which is where we are going to share the hope of Jesus every day. So we're excited about that.
Alex McFarland Well, at the Refuge, I love it, because what you've done, you've, gotten all these historic buildings, like, kind, of looks like Victorian houses. folks, everything about it is top drawer. There's, a really, really, really big outdoor swimming pool. There's a lake. There's horseback riding. Oh, my goodness. And besides all the great, Bible teaching. But I'm going to tell you, Sammy, if you would describe. And we always do this on the final day after dark, we walk to the other side of one of the lakes and go to the cross. And that's pretty, pretty meaningful, isn't it?
Sammy Hudson Yeah, we. We call it our, our lantern walk. So we have lanterns set up around the cross, and kids, we share the gospel, and they have a chance to walk to the cross in their own time, in their own space. We break them up as a group. They journey the cross by themselves and spend time with the Lord, and they leave with a lantern, kind of signifying, rebirth or the Holy Spirit walking with them, being a lamp unto their feet. But it's a time for students to recognize that they can speak to God. They can spend time with Him. He's very personal.
The Transformative Power of Encountering God at The Refuge Camp
He wants to know them. It's a very emotional time. Even though our faith is not emotional, it can be, but accepting Christ is not an emotional thing. It's a true thing. God gives us hope through Jesus. And, so that moment is really powerful. To watch the lanterns walk back around the lake in each of these hands, realizing that they just encountered the God that created everything out of nothing in a new way. And he hears them when they speak, just the same way he hears us. And he wants to know us intimately. He already does. The question is, do we want to know him intimately? And so that door is open. So we allow students to have that space. And our counselors spend time waiting there, ready to pray with them and to hang out with them and to love on them. And so it's a very powerful moment, for sure. Thanks for asking about that.
Alex McFarland Well, yeah, because you and I both, I speak, you speak. We've got, you know, great speakers, including some AFR personalities that we've had there. But, on that last day, I mean, we really call the youth to a commitment. About two weeks ago, I haven't told you this, but I was on the road, and whenever I'm in the mid Atlantic regions, you know, I meet people that have been to the refuge and I met a young person who said, I'm really walking with Jesus. and I said, how'd you commit to Christ? And they said, the final night of my time at the refuge made that walk to the cross and they're living it. Hey, we got to take a break, Sammy. I hear some music before we take a brief break. Give your website, please.
Promoting The Refuge Camp and Listener Support for American Family Radio
Sammy Hudson ncrefuge.org you can find out about us there.
Alex McFarland Ncrefuge.org I'll be there July, 18th through 23. Hey, we've got more with Sammy Hudson plus Lauren Greene from Fox News. Alex McFarland here. Stay tuned. The AFR Network is back after this brief break. Don't go away.
Sammy Hudson Hello, I'm Abraham Hamilton iii. Did you know that this content is listener supported? Without people like you, this podcast would not exist. That's why we need you. A generous monthly gift of any amount will help sustain American Family Radio and specifically this podcast. Please consider becoming a monthly financial partner today by visiting afr.netgive that's afr.
Alex McFarland's Ministry: Exploring the Word and Revive Us Tour
Shining light into the darkness. This is the Hamilton corner on American Family Radio.
Alex McFarland Welcome back to the program. Alex McFarland here. Always an honor to be sitting in for Abe Hamilton. He is the host of the Hamilton Corner. And I get the great privilege of subbing for him sometimes when he's traveling. And so by the way, if you like Bible teaching, we are on exploring the word 3 to 4pm Central, 4 to 5, 4 to 5 Eastern, Monday through Friday. Right now we're wrapping up the Book of Matthew. And in the last 16 years, I think Bert Harper and I have taught through the complete Word of God like three times, like every single verse. And so check out Exploring the Word and all the good programming on the American Family Radio Network. By the way, my website is just my name, alexmcfarland.com We've got a lot going on. One of the things that I've got next summer we're doing a tour called Revive Us and we've got a big, big event in Florence, Alabama. That's right near Huntsville, Alabama, Rocket City, if you know where Huntsville is. And we'll be in the Florence Lauderdale Coliseum.
The Refuge Camp: An Interdenominational Hub for Christian Growth and Redemption
That's August, five, six, seven. I'll be there with E.W. jackson. A whole lot of things going on. We'll be in Bentonville, Arkansas at doing one of our Revive Us tour events and all over the country. And so if you're interested, all of our deal. And I know Sammy Hudson would concur, we love to see the body of believers work together, no matter your denomination. But look, if you're a friend of Jesus, we, we're family and we need to pray together, work together, bring people, especially young people, under the sound of the gospel. if you want further information about all that I feel God has called me to do, to travel America and stir up the body of Christ, you can reach me through Alex mcfarland.com But Sammy the Refuge, you're correct me if I'm wrong, but I would say interdenominational. Solidly Christian, solidly biblical. But Christians, of all strata come to the refuge, don't they?
Sammy Hudson Yeah, from, from all walks of life. They come with strong faiths, they come with no faiths. But we want them to hear about Jesus when they come to camp. And so we welcome anybody who who wants to learn and grow in their faith. And that's, that's what we're here for. Our mission is to share and model the hope of Jesus. And that's who we are at our core. And so yes, we have different denominations that come in. They're part of what we do, some non denominations. So it's really not about the divisions that we create on earth. It's about the unity in the body of Christ together. And so that's what we. We offer here at the refuge.
Alex McFarland Amen. when did you start this camp?
Sammy Hudson Yeah, so my wife and I stepped out in faith in 2007. Ah. So this is our 20th year coming up. So we're excited about that. And, believe it or not, the 165 acres we sit on was the unofficial trash dump of our county.
Alex McFarland Oh, really?
Sammy Hudson God redeemed this land. And then we move old farmhouses out here off of an old foundation and put them on a new foundation here at the refuge. So he redeems the buildings that kids stay in so he can bring kids here and introduce himself, so they can become a new creation in him. So this whole place is a story of redemption for Jesus. And so it's.
Alex McFarland It.
Sammy Hudson That's why it's a special place, because it's something that only God could put together.
Alex McFarland exactly.
God's Work Through Inadequacy: The Refuge Camp's Story and Divine Assignments
And, I've known you a few years. for one thing, I admire you for. Well, you stand on the Bible unapologetically, and you're zealously teaching God's word. I think that's how you and I got to be kind of brothers in arms. But, you got a work ethic that I admire, and I just appreciate that. Do you ever look back at you and your wife started this camp, and you've got staff and you've got counselors every summer. But do you ever look back and say, what was I thinking?
Sammy Hudson A lot of times, for sure. But then we have those moments, like my wife and I come over in the evening after campers have gone, and we watch the sunset across the lake, and we just look at each other, and we're so grateful that God called us to be a part of this together. And, because it really has been an incredible journey, I am totally not adequate to do what God has done here through me. but. But he calls people that just don't feel equipped to do things that only he can do. And, So it's been a joy.
Alex McFarland Well, you wrote a book about that. And by the. I don't feel adequate either. you know, but how God takes our humility and our inadequacy, and he works through us, doesn't He?
Sammy Hudson Yes. Every day.
Alex McFarland So here's my. I want to throw this to you. People are listening all across America. And look, there are unsaved people. There are youth that need direction. They need Christ. They need to build their Life on the unshakable rock of God's holy word. What do you say to the person listening who's somewhere in America? And they say, okay, sure, God had a vision for Sammy Hudson, but what about me?
Serving God in the Everyday: The Importance of Obedience and Small Acts of Faith
Does God have. Does God have assignments for every believer? Sammy?
Sammy Hudson Yeah, he's prepared good works in advance for us to do. so the reality is if you're not feeling that you're in the middle of that calling, he's preparing you for that calling. and so be aware that God is in your circumstances, whatever they may be at that moment, he's preparing you for something that he has planned in advance for you to do. And it's not always the grand things here on Earth. We don't. We oftentimes we think, hey, it's gonna be some big grand thing that in the scheme of things. But we measure that by earthly standards and God's standards are very different. So it may not be something that we see as a huge deal on earth, but it's a huge deal in heaven. And so we're following the King of Kings and Lord of Lords, and he's in the middle of preparing you for something that is grand in eternity.
Alex McFarland And so I've heard it, yeah, go ahead. Grand. Yeah, yeah, I heard somebody say that. You know, everybody, we like to think we would do great things for God. Oh, I would do magnificent great things for God. But I think we need to think about doing the quote unquote, little things for God. You know, be there on Sundays at a good Bible believing church, help set out the chairs for Sunday school, be a part of a prayer team. And you know, Sammy, you and I both have been privileged to do some kind of visible thing, public things. But I read Matthew 6:33, and folks, listen to this says, seek first the kingdom of God and his righteousness, and all these other things will be added to you. I think, number one, we gotta every day say, look, I'm gonna walk with Jesus. I'm a disciple, I'm going to serve the Lord, I'm going to love my spouse and family, I'm going to be a part of a church. And before we do the quote, unquote, great things, we got to be obedient in the everyday things, the little things, don't we?
Sammy Hudson Yeah.
The Unsung Ministry of Wives and the Grandeur of God's Work at The Refuge
And you and I are both blessed with great brides. amen. And my wife's, you know, she would, she would see her ministry to our kids and you know, to the homeschool groups and stuff. She's a part of as her greatest ministry. But the reality is her greatest ministry is the day to day things that she does for me and that she doesn't get applauded for most of the time because I don't, I don't jump and shout for joy as much as I should. But we're both blessed men because of all the little things, the day to day things that our brides do for us and hopefully we return back to them. And so yes, it's even the Refuge. It's not a grand thing. I believe it's a, it's a big and a grand camp. But it's every day walking the journeys, little things every day that add up to something that only God can do is the reality.
Passing the Baton of Faith: Encouraging Youth Camps and Supporting The Refuge
Alex McFarland Well, I want to commend you. I've been there many, many times. When we drive onto the premises, I feel the presence of the Lord. I really do. And I know there's been a lot of prayer bathed over those acres. What did you say? 165 acres? Something like that.
Ed Vitagliano Yes.
Sammy Hudson Yeah.
Alex McFarland so listen folks, we're talking about passing the baton of faith to the next generation. I want to encourage you, even if you've got one or two or three, be a part of Sunday school with children and youth. consider coming to one of our summer camps. But go to the website ncrefuge.org and by the way, Tim Wildmon, the president of the American Family association, he knows about our camps and all that we do. And he told me, we were on radio about, I don't know, three weeks ago. He said, look, you have my blessing. You promote, promote, promote those youth camps. And so that's what we're doing. But, hey man, we're keeping you in prayer. I know you got a lot going on, so, we'll be talking. And Sammy Hudson of the Refuge, thank you for what you're doing, for God and country.
Sammy Hudson God bless Alex. You have a great evening.
Alex McFarland God bless you. Thanks very much.
Transitioning to Lauren Green: Notre Dame's Rededication and Unrest in France
Alex McFarland here. This is the American Family Radio Network and we are on the Hamilton corner. I'm going to shift gears just a little bit. another colleague in the work is Lauren Greene of Fox News and she was at the rededication of the cathedral at Notre Dame a couple of years ago. And I want to talk about that because there's been, as everyone knows, a lot of rioting and just dangerous, stuff going on in France.
Lauren Green's Fox News Journey: From First Hired Anchor to Cable Network Evolution
We'll get to that. But first of all, I want to say, Loren Green, thanks for making time to be with us. Good morning.
Lauren Green Good morning to you. Thank you so much for asking me.
Alex McFarland Well, thank you. on very short notice, but I appreciate you very much. a lot of news of the day that I want to talk about. By the way, Lauren and I will be at the COVID next summer, the Billy Graham Training center in Western North Carolina. and, Lauren, we'll be talking about Biblical Worldview, and very honored that you are one of the speakers. But, congratulations on, an incredible career still in process with Fox News.
Lauren Green Oh, thank you so much. I can't believe We've been here 30 years. it's just been an amazing journey. And of course, you know, I started here when I was 10, so.
Alex McFarland Exactly, exactly. So, well, you know, a couple of weeks ago, I was on the road in. I was in, like, five states in about three days. And it seemed like every hotel lobby that I was going through or every airport, there were monitors, talking about 30 years of Fox News, and most of it showed you. tell us about that, because you were. Were you the first on air anchor?
Lauren Green It was the first on air person hired for Fox News Channel. And I still remember the interview today because I had come to NewSong York to. From Chicago. I was working in Chicago. I'm from Minnesota, but I was working in Chicago. And I really wanted to kind of work in NewSong York because of my interest in the arts. You know, I'm a pianist, so arts is really big. And so I had a couple of interviews set up. my agent had interviews set up, you know, the. The normal, you know, networks. And while I was in town, he said, oh, by the way, f would really like to get, get an interview with you because they're starting this cable network. And I was like, oh, cable. Oh, my goodness. You know, because it was such a, you know, the ugly, you know, the poor stepchild of the TV business. So, and. But he said, you know what? The people who are putting this together, you've got, you know, Murdoch, Roger Ailes is amazing. And he said, you know, you really need to talk with these people. and so I went into the interview and we had a great conversation.
Alex McFarland And.
Lauren Green And, and that was. That was it, you know, I got hired. So I was really excited to come to Chicago, to come to NewSong York.
Alex McFarland Well, and, you know, I remember those days, too. There was the big three. ABC, NBC, CBS.
Lauren Green Right.
Alex McFarland And, 30 years later, I mean, it's the absolute inverse of that cable Is, isn't it? Right.
Unforgettable Stories: Conclaves in Rome and Meeting Pope Benedict XVI
Lauren Green Cable is big. I mean, I think the networks are still very much prominent in the news business, but they all have some kind of cable, you know, network going as, as well. I mean, I think what it was, ABC is still, you know, there's tentacles into ESPN and you know, the streaming of that. of course NBC has msnbc, CBS has something too. I broke out with it. But I mean, they're all kind of in that streaming cable network because that's really where people are getting their news and their information and their entertainment really too as well.
Alex McFarland what are some of the most unforgettable stories that you've covered, in the journey so far?
Lauren Green Well, it has to be all of the conclaves in Rome. this conclave now that elected Pope Leo XIV is my third conclave. I was there for Pope Benedict and then Pope Francis and then Pope Leo. So the sadness of all of those events is usually a Pope dies. In the case of Benedict, of course, he didn't die, resigned. So that was a very odd kind of conclave. but in terms of Pope Francis, you know, it's very, you realize the journey of life when you're there when the Pope is elected and then you're there when he dies and you're there when, his successor is elected. And it just shows this process of life and how the journey of the Church keeps going, no matter who's in power, no matter who's in, you know, the seat. And then that's true of all the faiths, not just Catholicism.
Alex McFarland Did you meet, Benedict xvi?
Lauren Green I did, I did meet Pope Benedict xvi, but when he was retired, he was an emeritus Pope. I actually played the piano for him in a concert at the Vatican.
Theological Acumen: Pope Benedict XVI's Role and Influence in the Catholic Church
I, was one of three artists in a private concert. I was the only pianist. There's a, an opera singer, vocalist, and then a violinist and me. And so we performed for the Pope, probably about a 45 minute, concert, in honor of his brothers, Monsignor Ratzinger's 90th birthday. And so, I still have the picture, in my office of when he came up after me afterwards and thanked me and, and he was very, he was just so complimentary for my playing. And I just, I always remember that moment.
Alex McFarland yeah, you know, back in the 80s, he contributed, well, 80s and early 90s to some apologetics books. A lot of people don't know that the man that will become Pope Benedict xvi, well, he was considered really,
Lauren Green I mean, in terms of, you know, the Catholic Church, probably one of the greatest theologians, on the same line as Aquinas, you know, and, you know, the doctors of the church. And that was ring for, Jon Paul ii, is that he was the theological mind behind Jon Paul ii. So I think when Jon Paul II died, the cardinals were just, of course, wanting to preserve that theological mind and ins and insight through, Cardinal Ratzinger, who became Pope Benedict xvi. And he wanted to retire. He just wanted to go back home to Regensburg and do what he always did, which is write theological books.
Alex McFarland Indeed. Indeed. we're talking with Loren Green of Fox News. We're going to talk about France and the fire. And, I want to talk a little bit about the, cathedral at Notre Dame in April of 2019. It was a devastating fire, and yet the cathedral was rebuilt. And you were there at the rededication, weren't you?
Notre Dame's Rededication and the Spiritual Battle Behind Arson Threats in France
Lauren Green I was. You know, it was such an emotional moment to be there at the rededication of this, of this Grand Dom, you know, this cathedral, even though it's part of Roman Catholicism, it is part of Christianity's landmark heritage. And, you know, early on, of course, there was this feeling that, oh, the fire, oh, it must have been set by, you know, Islamic extremists. But it turned out.
Alex McFarland We've got a break. Lauren, forgive me. We've got to pull away for a break. we've got a brief break. We're going to come back on the American Family Radio Network with Loren Green talking about the danger of arson, in France. So stay tuned. We're back after this.
Christian Responsibility in Politics: Addressing Abortion, Socialism, and Societal Values
Ed Vitagliano Well, Fred, it is, today is three weeks away from the election, midterm election, and a, lot of talk about how this is going to go for Republicans especially, probably going to maybe lose the House and the Senate. there is always talk at election time that Christians should stay out of the political process. Just be spiritual and win lost souls. All that is important. what would you say to people who are wondering whether they should go out, get registered if there's still time and vote?
Fred Jackson Well, political, issues are Christian issues. When we talk about things like abortion, when we talk about, men who say there are women and want to go into women's restrooms and play in women's sports. I mean, that's not just a political issue. It is a Christian issue. And, been reading some interesting articles in Decision magazine. Franklin Graham talking about this, gentleman from the Colson Center. Socialism is a Christian issue. Socialism, is about making man God. The system that America has made America success is obedience to God's word. And yes, there are problem areas, but there is a huge difference. And it is a spiritual issue because when socialism comes in, it's man celebrating man. Man becomes God. Man oversees everything. And I'll tell you what, we just have to look at other countries, Ed, that have tried socialism. They basically want to chase, Christianity out of the scene.
The Role of Government and the Church in a Nation: Election Night Coverage
Ed Vitagliano That's right, because it's a competing ideology. I, heard Dr. Ray Pritchard say that, yes, we all understand as Christians that government can't say, save our nation, but it sure can hurt our nation and can do a lot to damage the church and to become an obstacle to the preaching of the gospel, which of course is the most important. But, Jesus says to be salt and light. And I think it's fair to say that voting and standing up for biblical values is at least part of that in a country where you're free to vote. And we will be covering here at American Family Radio election night on November 3rd. You'll be able to tune in to American Family Radio and we'll have staff from AFR from our news team and special guests talking about the election and what those results mean for, the next two years as we prepare for a presidential election in 2028.
Upcoming Events: Biblical Worldview Teaching at The Cove and with Dylan Burroughs
Sammy Hudson The Hamilton quarter podcast and one minute comedy commentaries are available at afr.net back to the Hamilton corner on American Family Radio.
Alex McFarland Welcome back to the program. Alex McFarland here subbing for attorney, pastor, broadcaster Abe Hamilton III, always honored to be on. We're talking with Loren Greene of Fox News. And by the way, Lauren and I will be at the COVID the Billy Graham Training center in Western North Carolina, July 12th through 16th next year teaching on biblical worldview. And, if you've never heard Loren Green speak in person, I urge you to be there. By the way, the COVID is phenomenal. Five star chef, incredible accommodations and we think some, some pretty relevant teaching. And so the website is thecove.org t h e c o v e the and it always fills up. I've been so blessed to be there for like 21 or 22 summers. And also there, Dillon Burroughs, who is with the Colson center. Dillon Burroughs, Dr. Dillon Burroughs is a scholar. He helps out on exploring the Word very often. Fantastic young thinker. And he's going to be their, prolific author as well.
Commentary on French Riots: Marxist, Muslim, and Insurrectionist Influences
But you might want to, next summer come to Western North Carolina and get some Great Bible teaching, biblical worldview content. And you'll have the privilege of hearing in person Lauren Greene and more. But, before the break, Lauren, I kind of ran over the top and I apologize.
Lauren Green Soft serve at the COVID is really fantastic too.
Alex McFarland Oh, there's a yogurt. Now. Here's, here's the, the, the, the secret hack. Get some soft serve and then top it off with hot chocolate. It's phenomenal. but, anyway, Lauren, before the break, I was talking about the fact that, in, I believe it was December of 24, you were at the rededication of the cathedral. So Sunday night a couple days ago, I was on the road. and I want your commentary on the rioting in France. maybe, maybe as many as 800,000 people. Very historic. Courthouse was burned and there were threats to burn Notre Dame, which I believe would be a global tragedy.
Spiritual Warfare in France: The Devil's Anger at Rising Faith and Competing Worldviews
Just, your thoughts on the combination of Marxist Muslims insurrectionist political messaging set forth by looting and vandalism. Your thoughts, Loren Green?
Lauren Green Well, my thoughts always go to the spiritual element. And I, and I always talk about Ephesians 6. We wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms. I mean, you're really wrestling against spiritual forces behind this. And I can't help but think, you see, Pope Leo was in France, in Paris, and get. And oversaw mass for like 800,000 people assembled in the Champs Elysees, the major thoroughfare for Paris. And it was amazing, all of these young people just so excited about their faith. And I see this sort of spiritual movement happening in the Catholic Church. And then the Pope leaves, and not long after that you've got these riots. What is this about? So these spiritual forces, I'm thinking from a spiritual point of view, you've got the devil, who's very angry at this. At, the, at ah, the rise of Catholicism, the rise of Christianity, and the rise of people devoted to Jesus. You got the devil kind of really upset. So what can I do to get into the minds and the hearts of people to upset this? Well, in my mind, okay, it's. Are, these riots now let's bring it down to more of an earthly kind of level. And now you've got people who are upset about the schools. You've got students protesting. But now from the evidence that we've seen, and Fox Digital has done this, okay, there's like 36 or 56 groups of those. Maybe there are about 16 student groups. The rest are just people glomming on to the opportunity to, loot, to steal, to upset the Western values that France, really stands for, to upset Christianity. Because the greatest enemy of Islamic extremists is Christianity because, you know, you go for Christians and you really get the Jews as well, you know, or you can start Jews and go to Christians many. Either way, they are the big enemies of Islamic extremists. and, you know, this is not to say that all Muslims are like this, right? But one of the things you and I understand and I. And this is one of the things that's very hard for Western people kind of droning up in the basking, and basking of the Enlightenment is that, you know, people are equal, but ideas are not. Not all religions are equal, invalid paths to God.
Alex McFarland Amen.
Lauren Green This is reality that modern people just have to face up to. I love my Muslim neighbors. I love my Hindu neighbors. I love every person, whatever their belief is, I love that person. But their religion is not an equal path to God. It can't be. Jesus said, I am the way, the truth and the life, and no one comes to the Father but through me. Now, you cannot believe it, but make no mistake, Jesus is very sure about who he is and what he came to do. Now you got to make a decision about whether you're going to believe that and worship that or believe something else.
Alex McFarland Amen.
The Decline of Christianity and the Rise of Other Ideologies: A Global Perspective
Well said. people are equal, but ideas, philosophies, religious statements are not all equal. You know, Richard Dawkins, famed atheist, he and I have emailed back and forth and, but even Richard Dawkins, Easter of 25, he said, that he was taking a walk in London on Easter morning and he didn't hear the church bells of Christendom. He heard the minarets. And he said there was almost a fear that went through him. And suddenly, here's this arch atheist, Richard Dawkins, who, said, and I quote, he said, I miss Christianity because, among other things, the Christian DNA of the British culture held back other worldviews and cultural trends. And Lauren, do you think in the seats of cultural leadership, with the rise of Marxism, the rise of insurrection and lawlessness, the rise of jihadism, are leaders beginning to see what happens in the vacuum, that was once occupied by Christianity, but now Christianity is not there as it once was? Are people saying, oh, not, good here?
Lauren Green M. Well, there are a couple of things I really have to say about this and a couple of people that I want to bring up. First of all, though, I want to talk about, Why I think it's so important to evangelize to just everyday Christians because most Christians, if they're sort of reading, as David W. Miller talked about, breathing the air of Christianity, they don't, they're more willing to acquiesce and bend to sort of the whims of a secular age because they don't understand their own faith. And I bring up David W. Miller, who is just retiring from Princeton University, who created the faith, and works, ah, department at Princeton. And he's retiring and they're not replacing him or the department as far as I understand. But the idea is that, you know, when you've got, in the 50s and 60s, the whole community, the whole country was infused with Christianity. you know, we said Christmas vacation and Easter vacation, not winter vacation and spring vacation. These things, these vacations were created around the Christian holiday of Christmas and Easter. So you've got a Protestant kind of led church that in the 50s and 60s sort of demystified the faith. They sort of took the miracles out. Well, Jesus was a great teacher of love and you know, I can be good without going to church. there's another person that I want to bring up is Jay Warner Wallace. I know you know Jay Warner Wallace who is cold case Christianity.
Works-Based vs. Grace-Based Religions: The Uniqueness of Christianity and Church's Role
One of the things he said, because I interviewed him and he's in the new book that I'm writing and coming out in spring. He talked about when you have, he didn't talk about the difference between Islam and whatever, but he says the difference is when you have a religion that is a works based religion that makes all the difference in your worldview and a workspace. Religion is saying I am good by doing the certain things, by saying these prayers, by you know, helping my neighbor or it can be really good things. But the idea is that I'm saved by what I do and not what, but what somebody else has done for me. Amen. Christianity is totally unique in that way. It is the only religion that says you cannot earn your credit, your, your, your, your, your salvation because Jesus already has paid that price. This is, this is, this is such a different thing. So when you look at religion from that point of view, then you understand that yeah, on a certain level there are some very good similarities. But on another level they're very different. And I get mad at churches, I get mad at church. In fact, the Catholic Church, the Catholic bishops in France just came out with this statement about what's going on in France, about how we need to understand what's going on. How we need to, you know, sort of understand what young people need. And yes, there are a few people who were upsetting the apple cart here, but no, we need to understand. It's like, no, you need to preach the gospel.
Alex McFarland Amen.
Lauren Green That's what you need to be doing.
Alex McFarland Amen.
Lauren Green I mean, that's the only thing that's happening, is that they're losing sight of the gospel. Instead of praying for different things, instead of praying, you know, and being at the city council or, the government seats and actually praying for them to make better decisions, they are destroying their own environment.
The American Pulpit's Impact: Lack of Gospel Focus and Objective Morality
Alex McFarland Rick Metaxas, longtime friend. Oh, my goodness. Very close colleague. And I'm sure you've interviewed Rick many times.
Lauren Green Yeah, I love Rick.
Alex McFarland Yeah, he's brilliant. And, just, he is so real. Let me say this, Rick Metaxas is as authentic a Christian leader as it gets. He put out a tweet yesterday. He said, what's ruining the American church is the American pulpit. And listen, I love the church. I've spoken in 2200American churches over nearly 40 years. I love the church. I'm not bashing the church necessarily. But Rick is right about something. And believe me, I've been to the rodeo and back. Rick said, the American pulpit is ruining the American church. These sermons that are just, motivational talks. There's no call to the gospel. Follow Jesus. He rose from the dead. And I hear what you're saying. Like these bishops in France, they need to say, look, this is wrong. There is, objective morality. Looting, rioting, violence. This is objectively evil.
Lauren Green I've got an example for you. I've got a much better example for you. I just heard last Wednesday evening, I believe, the Rowan Williams, who is the former Archbishop of Canterbury, the Cambridge Archbishop of camp. Yeah.
The Waning of Christianity: Preaching Social Justice Over the Gospel in the UK
The head of the Anglican Church, the head of the Church of England. He was the former, archbishop. So he came to speak at, St. Thomas Church in connection with the 9 11, 25th year of the 911 attacks. And I was very excited to hear him speak. He, was speaking on solidarity and some other things. And then I realized through his entire speech, 30, 30, 40 minute speech, he mentioned Jesus maybe three times. And it was in passing, not as a center piece of his, of his talk. Now, this is the former Archbishop of Canterbury. I mean, this is the guy who's in charge of the Anglican Church in England. And then I realized, this is why Christianity is waning in places like the United Kingdomnomics, because they don't preach the gospel. They preach social justice. they preach, you know, political diplomacy. They don't preach the gospel.
Alex McFarland I got a quote for you. and by the way, folks, the voice you're hearing is that of Loren Green, longtime anchor of Fox News, just one of the great figures in American journalism and, an unapologetic follower of christ.
Winning Christians to Christianity: Faith as an Accessory vs. Fundamental Trust
in 1908, Lauren, G.K. chesterton wrote a biography of Thomas Aquinas. It's a great book. And in the introduction, and here's what I'd like your response to. this is, you know, 100 years ago, Chesterton says, as much as we need to win the loss to Christianity, more and more, we need to win the Christians to Christianity.
Lauren Green Amen to that. Amen to that. Well, I talk to a lot of Christians, at church and, ah, around town and various places, and one of the things that's very apparent is that they do. Well, many of them treat their, their faith as sort of, an accessory. Not, not center point, not the center of their faith, not the center of their lives. It's kind of an accessory. It's sort of a talisman. It's a good, like a good luck charm. And that is not what Christianity is. And not only that, it's not what any religion is. Because when you understand what religion actually is, it's your fundamental trust. What is it you're worshiping every single day of your life? Are you saying prayers to God? Are you just saying these, you know, sort of, you know, fly in the sky kind of prayers to, you know, for good fortune, for blessings, or are you really exploring the Word, of God? I mean, you know, we know that they're two different. There are two different books of God.
Exploring God's Word and the Importance of Prayer for Societal Change
There's the book of nature, which is, you know, sciences and all that, and then there's his holy scriptures. So are you exploring His Word? These things really agree? Are you exploring his words or something else becoming your fundamental trust? And I think the key here. Go ahead. I know you want to take a look.
Alex McFarland We're almost out of time. We got to have you back on when your third book is released. In the meantime, I'm assuming people can find [email protected] Our guest, Lauren Greene.
Praying for France: Restoring Christianity Amidst Unrest and Cultural Shifts
Thank you very much. And folks, pray for France, not only for the, the unrest to be smoothed out, but for Christianity to be restored. The views and opinions expressed in this broadcast may not necessarily reflect those of the American Family association or American Family Radio.
Darkness and Light: A Call for Believers to Be Ambassadors in a Troubled World
Sammy Hudson Darkness is not an affirmative force. It simply reoccupies the space vacated by the light. This is the, Hamilton Corner on American Family Radio. It should be uncomfortable for a believer to live as a hypocrite, delivering people out of the bondage of mainstream media and the philosophies of this world. God has called you and me to
Alex McFarland be his ambassadors, even in this dark moment. Let's not miss our moment.
Sammy Hudson And now, the, Hamilton Corner.
Alex McFarland The future of America depends on the Christian training of young people. Alex McFarland here.
George Washington's Vision for Christian Training and Host Alex McFarland's Introduction
Guess who said that quote? That's a great quote, isn't it? The future of the country depends on the Christian training of young people. It was our first president, George Washington, who said that. And with that quote, I welcome you to today's edition of the Hamilton corner. Alex McFarland here, sitting in for Abe Hamilton III. And, you may know me from Exploring the Word, which is the Bible teaching show we've done on the American Family Radio Network for more than 16 years now. Praise God. And I've got the great privilege of, guest hosting on a lot of the programs. Also, we've got a very important show today because later on in the show, we're going to have Lauren, Greene from Fox News in NewSong York. you've seen the riots in France, and there are threats now, arson on the cathedral at Notre Dame. Loren Green was there when they rededicated the more than $1 billion restoration. And, we're going to talk about that and more, but. Right. Oh, my goodness. I've got one of my most valued friends and colleagues in the ministry. His name is Sammy Hudson. Sammy is the visionary founder of, really, one of the greatest camps in America. I've rented camps in, I don't know, 25, 28 states. The refuge in Aden, North Carolina. That's down east, kind of east of Raleigh. But the refuge is just, There's nothing like it. I mean, it's just one of the finest Christian camps. And we will be there next summer, July 18 through 23, with another one of our youth apologetics and biblical worldview camps. And, Sammy's just always a very insightful brother and resource. I love to glean his wisdom. We're gonna talk a little bit about the youth and the worldview of our young people. He's made time to be with us now. Welcome to the American Family Radio Network.
Sammy Hudson Discusses The Refuge Christian Camp and Youth Worldviews
Sammy Hudson. Welcome, brother.
Sammy Hudson Hey, Alex, it's so good to be with you. And. And even a very cool privilege to be on the Abraham show with you this evening?
Alex McFarland Yeah, indeed. Hey, before we go any farther, I want to talk about young people because you've got your. Your finger on the pulse of what America's teens believe. but give us a website. Tell us about the Refuge. I just love that place. It's one of my favorite places in the world. But, bring us up to speed on all things Refuge.
Fred Jackson Yes.
Sammy Hudson So we're buzzing right along. the website's North Carolina. Like North Carolina, North Carolina.
Ed Vitagliano Org.
Sammy Hudson And, and there are kids here right now. As we're speaking. We're, outside my window. I see kids canoeing and, learning about God's, creation through water ecology. And so there's all kinds of things going on here, even in the outside of summer months. But, we are excited about what God is doing here. we're busy all the way up to our Christmas light show where we share the gospel in lights, for the month of December. And last year, we had 5,300 cars drive through to see the gospel with Refuge, which is really a cool ministry in itself, but I'm excited about what God is doing, in our country. And, our youth are hungry. just to say it plainly. Ah, there's a lot of things going in some good directions. I know people speak negatively a lot about what's going on with our teenagers, but the reality is they. They know they've been lied to for so long by the culture. They're looking for someone to share truth. And we find it.
Alex McFarland Yeah, I, do think young people are hungry. You know, ever since, Charlie Kirk got shot, in Utah, just days after Charlie Kirk's assassination, Sammy, we had a big citywide evangelistic crusade in the Jackson, Mississippi area near the state capital of Mississipp. we turned away people every night there were. I mean, it was standing room only. Then this past summer of 26, for the first time in 28 years of doing youth camps, I had a waiting list at every camp, literally, Pennsylvania, Montana, Georgia. And so, I guess, I'd love to get your message to the adults out there and maybe, the youth leaders, the volunteers or Sunday school teachers. how receptive are America's middle school, high school teenagers to solid biblical truth? they're hungry, aren't they, Sammy?
Sammy Hudson Yeah, they. They are very hungry. And the, the hard part about it is a lot of the parents feel ill equipped to teach their kids biblical worldview, because the reality is a lot of churches aren't biblical worldview. Churches, they still hold on to a secular worldview of, of evolution.
The Importance of Biblical Foundations and Archeological Evidence Supporting the Bible
And they, miss the idea that the first page of the Bible has to be true for the rest of it to be true.
Alex McFarland Amen, brother. Right on.
Sammy Hudson So it's fun, it's fun to share with them. My wife and I are teaching a class now in our church just about the, the foundations of, of God's Word and why it's all true. And what we realize is the parents, the parents have realized we've been lied to our whole life. And I'm excited that they're thirsty, that they want to grow. But in order for us to, to have good, conversations with the, with the children, with the youth, we have to train the parents, as well. So we just. The reality is we have a, not a fully biblical illiterate society in America, but there's a lot of people that just have not spent time in God's Word. and so that's the real training ground. We certainly get excited about training the students, but if they could go home and have, time with, with their parents in the Word, it changes everything.
Alex McFarland It really does. And, you know, talking about apologetics, for those that may not be aware, apologetics is the, the evidence for the Bible, for Christianity defending the faith. I truly believe, Sammy, that youth, ministry today has got to include an apologetics element about why this is true. We know it's true and we could talk a lot about that. But in your approach, as you create the curriculum for the Refuge summer camp, some, do you share that view that apologetics is really, really significant these days?
Sammy Hudson Yes. In every week, from our elementary weeks through our high school weeks, it's important at every level. And oftentimes people say, well, just share Jesus. And yes, we want to share Jesus, but we have to give the reason why we need to share Jesus. And so we have to start at the very beginning and walk through and train students that the Bible is reliable and be able to give answers. Because the reality is kids are going off to college and they're falling flat on their face because they can't, they don't know the Bible well enough or aren't able to give answers or are not on a solid enough foundation to be able to continue in their faith. And they just, they fall away from church and, in God's Word because they, they're intimidated by the questions that the culture asks. And so we have to train the students on what it is to be able to stand firm and to have Confidence that God's word does not fail. it is secure and never be, torn down in any way.
Alex McFarland You know Sammy, in, in the late 80s when I first became a Christian, I was in college and you know, I was a new believer at age 21. And I just, from the get go I just believed the Bible. But I remember I had college professors who said, well, there was no King David, there never was a man named King David. Or the Exodus never happened. And over the last 40 years folks, the archeological evidence, they have found multiple, multiple inscriptions that reference that reference Abraham, Joshua, King David, the Exodus, King Solomon, who had horse stables that could hold 750 horses each. I was, when I was in college, I was told that was just, exaggeration. Well, I have walked one of those 750 horse stables that has been excavated in the Holy Land. And to me it's so exciting. Yes, we believe by faith we put our trust in Jesus.
The Refuge Camp's Mission: Sharing and Modeling the Hope of Jesus
But over and over and over the archeology and the history has corroborated and validated what the Bible says. And kids need to know this, don't they?
Sammy Hudson Yeah, there's so much evidence just that shows up every day proving the Bible more and more true, not the other way around. I do believe it takes way more faith to trust the secular worldview than to trust the creation or the biblical worldview. of how we got here. That's one of the biggest questions we get asked is how do we get here? Yeah, kids want to know. And and the Bible gives a solid answer. In fact, it gives the only answer that makes sense, in the world that we live in. So we get excited when kids come to camp and they're thirsty. So whether they're in first grade or in a senior in high school, the gospel is shared with them from starting from the beginning and, and walking through. And I, I get amazed every time when kids say the Bible really says that.
Sammy Hudson Like yes, it really says that. And they get so excited when they know now they have something, they're more equipped when they go home. They get excited to share with their parents. And parents have told me we spend hours with our kids when they get home with them asking more questions about the Bible. And so, and same thing happens with me, me and my wife after we listen to afr, we listen to you or Abraham Hamilton. Like we get excited about what's going on in the world that we live in from the biblical worldview and we have questions and God continues to grow us and nurture us in him through his word.
Alex McFarland You know, folks, if you're just tuning in, the voice you're hearing is Sammy Hudson, longtime friend and colleague.
The Refuge Camp's Facilities and Spiritual Growth Through the Lantern Walk
He is the founder and leader of the Refuge, which is a Christian camp in my home state of North Carolina. And we've done a lot of events there over the years. We're going to be back there, July 18 through 23, doing one of our youth camps. And I know right now you're probably thinking less about next summer and more about, you know, fall 26. But here's the thing. Summer of 27 is going to be upon us really soon, and we would love for your youth group to come. I'd love for you to come to my week that I'm going to be there teaching, but, you need to check out the Refuge. And let me say, I've been to camps all over the place. Sammy, when I was there last summer, you were wrapping up with one of the most beautiful chapels over by this massively huge lake. how did you guys finish up that beautiful chapel, Brother?
Sammy Hudson Yeah, it should be finished by the end of the year. We have our first wedding planned to be in there on March 4th. and so it. It needs to be ready by then anyways. And. And here with you, we have begun construction on the seed company, which is where we are going to share the hope of Jesus every day. So we're excited about that.
Alex McFarland Well, at the Refuge, I love it, because what you've done, you've, gotten all these historic buildings, like, kind, of looks like Victorian houses. folks, everything about it is top drawer. There's, a really, really, really big outdoor swimming pool. There's a lake. There's horseback riding. Oh, my goodness. And besides all the great, Bible teaching. But I'm going to tell you, Sammy, if you would describe. And we always do this on the final day after dark, we walk to the other side of one of the lakes and go to the cross. And that's pretty, pretty meaningful, isn't it?
Sammy Hudson Yeah, we. We call it our, our lantern walk. So we have lanterns set up around the cross, and kids, we share the gospel, and they have a chance to walk to the cross in their own time, in their own space. We break them up as a group. They journey the cross by themselves and spend time with the Lord, and they leave with a lantern, kind of signifying, rebirth or the Holy Spirit walking with them, being a lamp unto their feet. But it's a time for students to recognize that they can speak to God. They can spend time with Him. He's very personal.
The Transformative Power of Encountering God at The Refuge Camp
He wants to know them. It's a very emotional time. Even though our faith is not emotional, it can be, but accepting Christ is not an emotional thing. It's a true thing. God gives us hope through Jesus. And, so that moment is really powerful. To watch the lanterns walk back around the lake in each of these hands, realizing that they just encountered the God that created everything out of nothing in a new way. And he hears them when they speak, just the same way he hears us. And he wants to know us intimately. He already does. The question is, do we want to know him intimately? And so that door is open. So we allow students to have that space. And our counselors spend time waiting there, ready to pray with them and to hang out with them and to love on them. And so it's a very powerful moment, for sure. Thanks for asking about that.
Alex McFarland Well, yeah, because you and I both, I speak, you speak. We've got, you know, great speakers, including some AFR personalities that we've had there. But, on that last day, I mean, we really call the youth to a commitment. About two weeks ago, I haven't told you this, but I was on the road, and whenever I'm in the mid Atlantic regions, you know, I meet people that have been to the refuge and I met a young person who said, I'm really walking with Jesus. and I said, how'd you commit to Christ? And they said, the final night of my time at the refuge made that walk to the cross and they're living it. Hey, we got to take a break, Sammy. I hear some music before we take a brief break. Give your website, please.
Promoting The Refuge Camp and Listener Support for American Family Radio
Sammy Hudson ncrefuge.org you can find out about us there.
Alex McFarland Ncrefuge.org I'll be there July, 18th through 23. Hey, we've got more with Sammy Hudson plus Lauren Greene from Fox News. Alex McFarland here. Stay tuned. The AFR Network is back after this brief break. Don't go away.
Sammy Hudson Hello, I'm Abraham Hamilton iii. Did you know that this content is listener supported? Without people like you, this podcast would not exist. That's why we need you. A generous monthly gift of any amount will help sustain American Family Radio and specifically this podcast. Please consider becoming a monthly financial partner today by visiting afr.netgive that's afr.
Alex McFarland's Ministry: Exploring the Word and Revive Us Tour
Shining light into the darkness. This is the Hamilton corner on American Family Radio.
Alex McFarland Welcome back to the program. Alex McFarland here. Always an honor to be sitting in for Abe Hamilton. He is the host of the Hamilton Corner. And I get the great privilege of subbing for him sometimes when he's traveling. And so by the way, if you like Bible teaching, we are on exploring the word 3 to 4pm Central, 4 to 5, 4 to 5 Eastern, Monday through Friday. Right now we're wrapping up the Book of Matthew. And in the last 16 years, I think Bert Harper and I have taught through the complete Word of God like three times, like every single verse. And so check out Exploring the Word and all the good programming on the American Family Radio Network. By the way, my website is just my name, alexmcfarland.com We've got a lot going on. One of the things that I've got next summer we're doing a tour called Revive Us and we've got a big, big event in Florence, Alabama. That's right near Huntsville, Alabama, Rocket City, if you know where Huntsville is. And we'll be in the Florence Lauderdale Coliseum.
The Refuge Camp: An Interdenominational Hub for Christian Growth and Redemption
That's August, five, six, seven. I'll be there with E.W. jackson. A whole lot of things going on. We'll be in Bentonville, Arkansas at doing one of our Revive Us tour events and all over the country. And so if you're interested, all of our deal. And I know Sammy Hudson would concur, we love to see the body of believers work together, no matter your denomination. But look, if you're a friend of Jesus, we, we're family and we need to pray together, work together, bring people, especially young people, under the sound of the gospel. if you want further information about all that I feel God has called me to do, to travel America and stir up the body of Christ, you can reach me through Alex mcfarland.com But Sammy the Refuge, you're correct me if I'm wrong, but I would say interdenominational. Solidly Christian, solidly biblical. But Christians, of all strata come to the refuge, don't they?
Sammy Hudson Yeah, from, from all walks of life. They come with strong faiths, they come with no faiths. But we want them to hear about Jesus when they come to camp. And so we welcome anybody who who wants to learn and grow in their faith. And that's, that's what we're here for. Our mission is to share and model the hope of Jesus. And that's who we are at our core. And so yes, we have different denominations that come in. They're part of what we do, some non denominations. So it's really not about the divisions that we create on earth. It's about the unity in the body of Christ together. And so that's what we. We offer here at the refuge.
Alex McFarland Amen. when did you start this camp?
Sammy Hudson Yeah, so my wife and I stepped out in faith in 2007. Ah. So this is our 20th year coming up. So we're excited about that. And, believe it or not, the 165 acres we sit on was the unofficial trash dump of our county.
Alex McFarland Oh, really?
Sammy Hudson God redeemed this land. And then we move old farmhouses out here off of an old foundation and put them on a new foundation here at the refuge. So he redeems the buildings that kids stay in so he can bring kids here and introduce himself, so they can become a new creation in him. So this whole place is a story of redemption for Jesus. And so it's.
Alex McFarland It.
Sammy Hudson That's why it's a special place, because it's something that only God could put together.
Alex McFarland exactly.
God's Work Through Inadequacy: The Refuge Camp's Story and Divine Assignments
And, I've known you a few years. for one thing, I admire you for. Well, you stand on the Bible unapologetically, and you're zealously teaching God's word. I think that's how you and I got to be kind of brothers in arms. But, you got a work ethic that I admire, and I just appreciate that. Do you ever look back at you and your wife started this camp, and you've got staff and you've got counselors every summer. But do you ever look back and say, what was I thinking?
Sammy Hudson A lot of times, for sure. But then we have those moments, like my wife and I come over in the evening after campers have gone, and we watch the sunset across the lake, and we just look at each other, and we're so grateful that God called us to be a part of this together. And, because it really has been an incredible journey, I am totally not adequate to do what God has done here through me. but. But he calls people that just don't feel equipped to do things that only he can do. And, So it's been a joy.
Alex McFarland Well, you wrote a book about that. And by the. I don't feel adequate either. you know, but how God takes our humility and our inadequacy, and he works through us, doesn't He?
Sammy Hudson Yes. Every day.
Alex McFarland So here's my. I want to throw this to you. People are listening all across America. And look, there are unsaved people. There are youth that need direction. They need Christ. They need to build their Life on the unshakable rock of God's holy word. What do you say to the person listening who's somewhere in America? And they say, okay, sure, God had a vision for Sammy Hudson, but what about me?
Serving God in the Everyday: The Importance of Obedience and Small Acts of Faith
Does God have. Does God have assignments for every believer? Sammy?
Sammy Hudson Yeah, he's prepared good works in advance for us to do. so the reality is if you're not feeling that you're in the middle of that calling, he's preparing you for that calling. and so be aware that God is in your circumstances, whatever they may be at that moment, he's preparing you for something that he has planned in advance for you to do. And it's not always the grand things here on Earth. We don't. We oftentimes we think, hey, it's gonna be some big grand thing that in the scheme of things. But we measure that by earthly standards and God's standards are very different. So it may not be something that we see as a huge deal on earth, but it's a huge deal in heaven. And so we're following the King of Kings and Lord of Lords, and he's in the middle of preparing you for something that is grand in eternity.
Alex McFarland And so I've heard it, yeah, go ahead. Grand. Yeah, yeah, I heard somebody say that. You know, everybody, we like to think we would do great things for God. Oh, I would do magnificent great things for God. But I think we need to think about doing the quote unquote, little things for God. You know, be there on Sundays at a good Bible believing church, help set out the chairs for Sunday school, be a part of a prayer team. And you know, Sammy, you and I both have been privileged to do some kind of visible thing, public things. But I read Matthew 6:33, and folks, listen to this says, seek first the kingdom of God and his righteousness, and all these other things will be added to you. I think, number one, we gotta every day say, look, I'm gonna walk with Jesus. I'm a disciple, I'm going to serve the Lord, I'm going to love my spouse and family, I'm going to be a part of a church. And before we do the quote, unquote, great things, we got to be obedient in the everyday things, the little things, don't we?
Sammy Hudson Yeah.
The Unsung Ministry of Wives and the Grandeur of God's Work at The Refuge
And you and I are both blessed with great brides. amen. And my wife's, you know, she would, she would see her ministry to our kids and you know, to the homeschool groups and stuff. She's a part of as her greatest ministry. But the reality is her greatest ministry is the day to day things that she does for me and that she doesn't get applauded for most of the time because I don't, I don't jump and shout for joy as much as I should. But we're both blessed men because of all the little things, the day to day things that our brides do for us and hopefully we return back to them. And so yes, it's even the Refuge. It's not a grand thing. I believe it's a, it's a big and a grand camp. But it's every day walking the journeys, little things every day that add up to something that only God can do is the reality.
Passing the Baton of Faith: Encouraging Youth Camps and Supporting The Refuge
Alex McFarland Well, I want to commend you. I've been there many, many times. When we drive onto the premises, I feel the presence of the Lord. I really do. And I know there's been a lot of prayer bathed over those acres. What did you say? 165 acres? Something like that.
Ed Vitagliano Yes.
Sammy Hudson Yeah.
Alex McFarland so listen folks, we're talking about passing the baton of faith to the next generation. I want to encourage you, even if you've got one or two or three, be a part of Sunday school with children and youth. consider coming to one of our summer camps. But go to the website ncrefuge.org and by the way, Tim Wildmon, the president of the American Family association, he knows about our camps and all that we do. And he told me, we were on radio about, I don't know, three weeks ago. He said, look, you have my blessing. You promote, promote, promote those youth camps. And so that's what we're doing. But, hey man, we're keeping you in prayer. I know you got a lot going on, so, we'll be talking. And Sammy Hudson of the Refuge, thank you for what you're doing, for God and country.
Sammy Hudson God bless Alex. You have a great evening.
Alex McFarland God bless you. Thanks very much.
Transitioning to Lauren Green: Notre Dame's Rededication and Unrest in France
Alex McFarland here. This is the American Family Radio Network and we are on the Hamilton corner. I'm going to shift gears just a little bit. another colleague in the work is Lauren Greene of Fox News and she was at the rededication of the cathedral at Notre Dame a couple of years ago. And I want to talk about that because there's been, as everyone knows, a lot of rioting and just dangerous, stuff going on in France.
Lauren Green's Fox News Journey: From First Hired Anchor to Cable Network Evolution
We'll get to that. But first of all, I want to say, Loren Green, thanks for making time to be with us. Good morning.
Lauren Green Good morning to you. Thank you so much for asking me.
Alex McFarland Well, thank you. on very short notice, but I appreciate you very much. a lot of news of the day that I want to talk about. By the way, Lauren and I will be at the COVID next summer, the Billy Graham Training center in Western North Carolina. and, Lauren, we'll be talking about Biblical Worldview, and very honored that you are one of the speakers. But, congratulations on, an incredible career still in process with Fox News.
Lauren Green Oh, thank you so much. I can't believe We've been here 30 years. it's just been an amazing journey. And of course, you know, I started here when I was 10, so.
Alex McFarland Exactly, exactly. So, well, you know, a couple of weeks ago, I was on the road in. I was in, like, five states in about three days. And it seemed like every hotel lobby that I was going through or every airport, there were monitors, talking about 30 years of Fox News, and most of it showed you. tell us about that, because you were. Were you the first on air anchor?
Lauren Green It was the first on air person hired for Fox News Channel. And I still remember the interview today because I had come to NewSong York to. From Chicago. I was working in Chicago. I'm from Minnesota, but I was working in Chicago. And I really wanted to kind of work in NewSong York because of my interest in the arts. You know, I'm a pianist, so arts is really big. And so I had a couple of interviews set up. my agent had interviews set up, you know, the. The normal, you know, networks. And while I was in town, he said, oh, by the way, f would really like to get, get an interview with you because they're starting this cable network. And I was like, oh, cable. Oh, my goodness. You know, because it was such a, you know, the ugly, you know, the poor stepchild of the TV business. So, and. But he said, you know what? The people who are putting this together, you've got, you know, Murdoch, Roger Ailes is amazing. And he said, you know, you really need to talk with these people. and so I went into the interview and we had a great conversation.
Alex McFarland And.
Lauren Green And, and that was. That was it, you know, I got hired. So I was really excited to come to Chicago, to come to NewSong York.
Alex McFarland Well, and, you know, I remember those days, too. There was the big three. ABC, NBC, CBS.
Lauren Green Right.
Alex McFarland And, 30 years later, I mean, it's the absolute inverse of that cable Is, isn't it? Right.
Unforgettable Stories: Conclaves in Rome and Meeting Pope Benedict XVI
Lauren Green Cable is big. I mean, I think the networks are still very much prominent in the news business, but they all have some kind of cable, you know, network going as, as well. I mean, I think what it was, ABC is still, you know, there's tentacles into ESPN and you know, the streaming of that. of course NBC has msnbc, CBS has something too. I broke out with it. But I mean, they're all kind of in that streaming cable network because that's really where people are getting their news and their information and their entertainment really too as well.
Alex McFarland what are some of the most unforgettable stories that you've covered, in the journey so far?
Lauren Green Well, it has to be all of the conclaves in Rome. this conclave now that elected Pope Leo XIV is my third conclave. I was there for Pope Benedict and then Pope Francis and then Pope Leo. So the sadness of all of those events is usually a Pope dies. In the case of Benedict, of course, he didn't die, resigned. So that was a very odd kind of conclave. but in terms of Pope Francis, you know, it's very, you realize the journey of life when you're there when the Pope is elected and then you're there when he dies and you're there when, his successor is elected. And it just shows this process of life and how the journey of the Church keeps going, no matter who's in power, no matter who's in, you know, the seat. And then that's true of all the faiths, not just Catholicism.
Alex McFarland Did you meet, Benedict xvi?
Lauren Green I did, I did meet Pope Benedict xvi, but when he was retired, he was an emeritus Pope. I actually played the piano for him in a concert at the Vatican.
Theological Acumen: Pope Benedict XVI's Role and Influence in the Catholic Church
I, was one of three artists in a private concert. I was the only pianist. There's a, an opera singer, vocalist, and then a violinist and me. And so we performed for the Pope, probably about a 45 minute, concert, in honor of his brothers, Monsignor Ratzinger's 90th birthday. And so, I still have the picture, in my office of when he came up after me afterwards and thanked me and, and he was very, he was just so complimentary for my playing. And I just, I always remember that moment.
Alex McFarland yeah, you know, back in the 80s, he contributed, well, 80s and early 90s to some apologetics books. A lot of people don't know that the man that will become Pope Benedict xvi, well, he was considered really,
Lauren Green I mean, in terms of, you know, the Catholic Church, probably one of the greatest theologians, on the same line as Aquinas, you know, and, you know, the doctors of the church. And that was ring for, Jon Paul ii, is that he was the theological mind behind Jon Paul ii. So I think when Jon Paul II died, the cardinals were just, of course, wanting to preserve that theological mind and ins and insight through, Cardinal Ratzinger, who became Pope Benedict xvi. And he wanted to retire. He just wanted to go back home to Regensburg and do what he always did, which is write theological books.
Alex McFarland Indeed. Indeed. we're talking with Loren Green of Fox News. We're going to talk about France and the fire. And, I want to talk a little bit about the, cathedral at Notre Dame in April of 2019. It was a devastating fire, and yet the cathedral was rebuilt. And you were there at the rededication, weren't you?
Notre Dame's Rededication and the Spiritual Battle Behind Arson Threats in France
Lauren Green I was. You know, it was such an emotional moment to be there at the rededication of this, of this Grand Dom, you know, this cathedral, even though it's part of Roman Catholicism, it is part of Christianity's landmark heritage. And, you know, early on, of course, there was this feeling that, oh, the fire, oh, it must have been set by, you know, Islamic extremists. But it turned out.
Alex McFarland We've got a break. Lauren, forgive me. We've got to pull away for a break. we've got a brief break. We're going to come back on the American Family Radio Network with Loren Green talking about the danger of arson, in France. So stay tuned. We're back after this.
Christian Responsibility in Politics: Addressing Abortion, Socialism, and Societal Values
Ed Vitagliano Well, Fred, it is, today is three weeks away from the election, midterm election, and a, lot of talk about how this is going to go for Republicans especially, probably going to maybe lose the House and the Senate. there is always talk at election time that Christians should stay out of the political process. Just be spiritual and win lost souls. All that is important. what would you say to people who are wondering whether they should go out, get registered if there's still time and vote?
Fred Jackson Well, political, issues are Christian issues. When we talk about things like abortion, when we talk about, men who say there are women and want to go into women's restrooms and play in women's sports. I mean, that's not just a political issue. It is a Christian issue. And, been reading some interesting articles in Decision magazine. Franklin Graham talking about this, gentleman from the Colson Center. Socialism is a Christian issue. Socialism, is about making man God. The system that America has made America success is obedience to God's word. And yes, there are problem areas, but there is a huge difference. And it is a spiritual issue because when socialism comes in, it's man celebrating man. Man becomes God. Man oversees everything. And I'll tell you what, we just have to look at other countries, Ed, that have tried socialism. They basically want to chase, Christianity out of the scene.
The Role of Government and the Church in a Nation: Election Night Coverage
Ed Vitagliano That's right, because it's a competing ideology. I, heard Dr. Ray Pritchard say that, yes, we all understand as Christians that government can't say, save our nation, but it sure can hurt our nation and can do a lot to damage the church and to become an obstacle to the preaching of the gospel, which of course is the most important. But, Jesus says to be salt and light. And I think it's fair to say that voting and standing up for biblical values is at least part of that in a country where you're free to vote. And we will be covering here at American Family Radio election night on November 3rd. You'll be able to tune in to American Family Radio and we'll have staff from AFR from our news team and special guests talking about the election and what those results mean for, the next two years as we prepare for a presidential election in 2028.
Upcoming Events: Biblical Worldview Teaching at The Cove and with Dylan Burroughs
Sammy Hudson The Hamilton quarter podcast and one minute comedy commentaries are available at afr.net back to the Hamilton corner on American Family Radio.
Alex McFarland Welcome back to the program. Alex McFarland here subbing for attorney, pastor, broadcaster Abe Hamilton III, always honored to be on. We're talking with Loren Greene of Fox News. And by the way, Lauren and I will be at the COVID the Billy Graham Training center in Western North Carolina, July 12th through 16th next year teaching on biblical worldview. And, if you've never heard Loren Green speak in person, I urge you to be there. By the way, the COVID is phenomenal. Five star chef, incredible accommodations and we think some, some pretty relevant teaching. And so the website is thecove.org t h e c o v e the and it always fills up. I've been so blessed to be there for like 21 or 22 summers. And also there, Dillon Burroughs, who is with the Colson center. Dillon Burroughs, Dr. Dillon Burroughs is a scholar. He helps out on exploring the Word very often. Fantastic young thinker. And he's going to be their, prolific author as well.
Commentary on French Riots: Marxist, Muslim, and Insurrectionist Influences
But you might want to, next summer come to Western North Carolina and get some Great Bible teaching, biblical worldview content. And you'll have the privilege of hearing in person Lauren Greene and more. But, before the break, Lauren, I kind of ran over the top and I apologize.
Lauren Green Soft serve at the COVID is really fantastic too.
Alex McFarland Oh, there's a yogurt. Now. Here's, here's the, the, the, the secret hack. Get some soft serve and then top it off with hot chocolate. It's phenomenal. but, anyway, Lauren, before the break, I was talking about the fact that, in, I believe it was December of 24, you were at the rededication of the cathedral. So Sunday night a couple days ago, I was on the road. and I want your commentary on the rioting in France. maybe, maybe as many as 800,000 people. Very historic. Courthouse was burned and there were threats to burn Notre Dame, which I believe would be a global tragedy.
Spiritual Warfare in France: The Devil's Anger at Rising Faith and Competing Worldviews
Just, your thoughts on the combination of Marxist Muslims insurrectionist political messaging set forth by looting and vandalism. Your thoughts, Loren Green?
Lauren Green Well, my thoughts always go to the spiritual element. And I, and I always talk about Ephesians 6. We wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms. I mean, you're really wrestling against spiritual forces behind this. And I can't help but think, you see, Pope Leo was in France, in Paris, and get. And oversaw mass for like 800,000 people assembled in the Champs Elysees, the major thoroughfare for Paris. And it was amazing, all of these young people just so excited about their faith. And I see this sort of spiritual movement happening in the Catholic Church. And then the Pope leaves, and not long after that you've got these riots. What is this about? So these spiritual forces, I'm thinking from a spiritual point of view, you've got the devil, who's very angry at this. At, the, at ah, the rise of Catholicism, the rise of Christianity, and the rise of people devoted to Jesus. You got the devil kind of really upset. So what can I do to get into the minds and the hearts of people to upset this? Well, in my mind, okay, it's. Are, these riots now let's bring it down to more of an earthly kind of level. And now you've got people who are upset about the schools. You've got students protesting. But now from the evidence that we've seen, and Fox Digital has done this, okay, there's like 36 or 56 groups of those. Maybe there are about 16 student groups. The rest are just people glomming on to the opportunity to, loot, to steal, to upset the Western values that France, really stands for, to upset Christianity. Because the greatest enemy of Islamic extremists is Christianity because, you know, you go for Christians and you really get the Jews as well, you know, or you can start Jews and go to Christians many. Either way, they are the big enemies of Islamic extremists. and, you know, this is not to say that all Muslims are like this, right? But one of the things you and I understand and I. And this is one of the things that's very hard for Western people kind of droning up in the basking, and basking of the Enlightenment is that, you know, people are equal, but ideas are not. Not all religions are equal, invalid paths to God.
Alex McFarland Amen.
Lauren Green This is reality that modern people just have to face up to. I love my Muslim neighbors. I love my Hindu neighbors. I love every person, whatever their belief is, I love that person. But their religion is not an equal path to God. It can't be. Jesus said, I am the way, the truth and the life, and no one comes to the Father but through me. Now, you cannot believe it, but make no mistake, Jesus is very sure about who he is and what he came to do. Now you got to make a decision about whether you're going to believe that and worship that or believe something else.
Alex McFarland Amen.
The Decline of Christianity and the Rise of Other Ideologies: A Global Perspective
Well said. people are equal, but ideas, philosophies, religious statements are not all equal. You know, Richard Dawkins, famed atheist, he and I have emailed back and forth and, but even Richard Dawkins, Easter of 25, he said, that he was taking a walk in London on Easter morning and he didn't hear the church bells of Christendom. He heard the minarets. And he said there was almost a fear that went through him. And suddenly, here's this arch atheist, Richard Dawkins, who, said, and I quote, he said, I miss Christianity because, among other things, the Christian DNA of the British culture held back other worldviews and cultural trends. And Lauren, do you think in the seats of cultural leadership, with the rise of Marxism, the rise of insurrection and lawlessness, the rise of jihadism, are leaders beginning to see what happens in the vacuum, that was once occupied by Christianity, but now Christianity is not there as it once was? Are people saying, oh, not, good here?
Lauren Green M. Well, there are a couple of things I really have to say about this and a couple of people that I want to bring up. First of all, though, I want to talk about, Why I think it's so important to evangelize to just everyday Christians because most Christians, if they're sort of reading, as David W. Miller talked about, breathing the air of Christianity, they don't, they're more willing to acquiesce and bend to sort of the whims of a secular age because they don't understand their own faith. And I bring up David W. Miller, who is just retiring from Princeton University, who created the faith, and works, ah, department at Princeton. And he's retiring and they're not replacing him or the department as far as I understand. But the idea is that, you know, when you've got, in the 50s and 60s, the whole community, the whole country was infused with Christianity. you know, we said Christmas vacation and Easter vacation, not winter vacation and spring vacation. These things, these vacations were created around the Christian holiday of Christmas and Easter. So you've got a Protestant kind of led church that in the 50s and 60s sort of demystified the faith. They sort of took the miracles out. Well, Jesus was a great teacher of love and you know, I can be good without going to church. there's another person that I want to bring up is Jay Warner Wallace. I know you know Jay Warner Wallace who is cold case Christianity.
Works-Based vs. Grace-Based Religions: The Uniqueness of Christianity and Church's Role
One of the things he said, because I interviewed him and he's in the new book that I'm writing and coming out in spring. He talked about when you have, he didn't talk about the difference between Islam and whatever, but he says the difference is when you have a religion that is a works based religion that makes all the difference in your worldview and a workspace. Religion is saying I am good by doing the certain things, by saying these prayers, by you know, helping my neighbor or it can be really good things. But the idea is that I'm saved by what I do and not what, but what somebody else has done for me. Amen. Christianity is totally unique in that way. It is the only religion that says you cannot earn your credit, your, your, your, your, your salvation because Jesus already has paid that price. This is, this is, this is such a different thing. So when you look at religion from that point of view, then you understand that yeah, on a certain level there are some very good similarities. But on another level they're very different. And I get mad at churches, I get mad at church. In fact, the Catholic Church, the Catholic bishops in France just came out with this statement about what's going on in France, about how we need to understand what's going on. How we need to, you know, sort of understand what young people need. And yes, there are a few people who were upsetting the apple cart here, but no, we need to understand. It's like, no, you need to preach the gospel.
Alex McFarland Amen.
Lauren Green That's what you need to be doing.
Alex McFarland Amen.
Lauren Green I mean, that's the only thing that's happening, is that they're losing sight of the gospel. Instead of praying for different things, instead of praying, you know, and being at the city council or, the government seats and actually praying for them to make better decisions, they are destroying their own environment.
The American Pulpit's Impact: Lack of Gospel Focus and Objective Morality
Alex McFarland Rick Metaxas, longtime friend. Oh, my goodness. Very close colleague. And I'm sure you've interviewed Rick many times.
Lauren Green Yeah, I love Rick.
Alex McFarland Yeah, he's brilliant. And, just, he is so real. Let me say this, Rick Metaxas is as authentic a Christian leader as it gets. He put out a tweet yesterday. He said, what's ruining the American church is the American pulpit. And listen, I love the church. I've spoken in 2200American churches over nearly 40 years. I love the church. I'm not bashing the church necessarily. But Rick is right about something. And believe me, I've been to the rodeo and back. Rick said, the American pulpit is ruining the American church. These sermons that are just, motivational talks. There's no call to the gospel. Follow Jesus. He rose from the dead. And I hear what you're saying. Like these bishops in France, they need to say, look, this is wrong. There is, objective morality. Looting, rioting, violence. This is objectively evil.
Lauren Green I've got an example for you. I've got a much better example for you. I just heard last Wednesday evening, I believe, the Rowan Williams, who is the former Archbishop of Canterbury, the Cambridge Archbishop of camp. Yeah.
The Waning of Christianity: Preaching Social Justice Over the Gospel in the UK
The head of the Anglican Church, the head of the Church of England. He was the former, archbishop. So he came to speak at, St. Thomas Church in connection with the 9 11, 25th year of the 911 attacks. And I was very excited to hear him speak. He, was speaking on solidarity and some other things. And then I realized through his entire speech, 30, 30, 40 minute speech, he mentioned Jesus maybe three times. And it was in passing, not as a center piece of his, of his talk. Now, this is the former Archbishop of Canterbury. I mean, this is the guy who's in charge of the Anglican Church in England. And then I realized, this is why Christianity is waning in places like the United Kingdomnomics, because they don't preach the gospel. They preach social justice. they preach, you know, political diplomacy. They don't preach the gospel.
Alex McFarland I got a quote for you. and by the way, folks, the voice you're hearing is that of Loren Green, longtime anchor of Fox News, just one of the great figures in American journalism and, an unapologetic follower of christ.
Winning Christians to Christianity: Faith as an Accessory vs. Fundamental Trust
in 1908, Lauren, G.K. chesterton wrote a biography of Thomas Aquinas. It's a great book. And in the introduction, and here's what I'd like your response to. this is, you know, 100 years ago, Chesterton says, as much as we need to win the loss to Christianity, more and more, we need to win the Christians to Christianity.
Lauren Green Amen to that. Amen to that. Well, I talk to a lot of Christians, at church and, ah, around town and various places, and one of the things that's very apparent is that they do. Well, many of them treat their, their faith as sort of, an accessory. Not, not center point, not the center of their faith, not the center of their lives. It's kind of an accessory. It's sort of a talisman. It's a good, like a good luck charm. And that is not what Christianity is. And not only that, it's not what any religion is. Because when you understand what religion actually is, it's your fundamental trust. What is it you're worshiping every single day of your life? Are you saying prayers to God? Are you just saying these, you know, sort of, you know, fly in the sky kind of prayers to, you know, for good fortune, for blessings, or are you really exploring the Word, of God? I mean, you know, we know that they're two different. There are two different books of God.
Exploring God's Word and the Importance of Prayer for Societal Change
There's the book of nature, which is, you know, sciences and all that, and then there's his holy scriptures. So are you exploring His Word? These things really agree? Are you exploring his words or something else becoming your fundamental trust? And I think the key here. Go ahead. I know you want to take a look.
Alex McFarland We're almost out of time. We got to have you back on when your third book is released. In the meantime, I'm assuming people can find [email protected] Our guest, Lauren Greene.
Praying for France: Restoring Christianity Amidst Unrest and Cultural Shifts
Thank you very much. And folks, pray for France, not only for the, the unrest to be smoothed out, but for Christianity to be restored. The views and opinions expressed in this broadcast may not necessarily reflect those of the American Family association or American Family Radio.
In this episode, Guest Host, Alex McFarland takes the helm of the Hamilton Corner, discussing the critical role of Christian training for the youth of America. Joined by Sammy Hudson, founder of the Refuge Christian Camp, they delve into the pressing need for a strong biblical worldview among teenagers today. Additionally, the episode features insights from Lauren Green of Fox News, who shares her experiences covering significant events and the current state of unrest in France.
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