AFA offers biblical insight on issues that others aren't willing to touch

>> Jeff Chamblee: Every day, AFA offers biblical insight on issues that others aren't willing to touch in the hopes that you'll become a world changer. That's why we're offering an in depth, worldview training course called Activate. Thirteen different professors teaching 18 sessions, all available online, including a printed workbook to help you apply what you've learned and one year access to AFA streaming content to give you even more resources. Find out more about Activate and sign up today at Acctivate.AFA.net.

>> Fred Jackson: Welcome to today's Issues. Join us for the next hour as we offer a Christian response to the issues of the day. Here's your host, Ed Mantagliano.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Well, good morning and welcome to Today's Issues. Ed Fattagliano sitting in for Tim Wildmon. This week I'm joined in studio by Fred Jackson. Good morning, Fred.

>> Fred Jackson: Hi there, Ed.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Tony Fattagliano, off the bench and in. Good morning to you. And then Chris Woodward, our news reporter extraordinaire. Good morning. Good morning to you, Chris.

American Family Radio is partnering with Truth for Youth Bible Week this week

It is Thursday, August 7th, and, we're just motoring through. Fred, Motoring through the, month of August. Hard to believe we're already past the first couple of months of summer, but the first week in August, kind of sorta it's is Truth for Youth Bible Week. I always love this week and what we're doing. Why don't you let our listeners know what Truth for Youth Bible Week is all about?

>> Fred Jackson: Well, for the 25th year in a row, American Family Radio has teamed up with the Truth for Youth Ministry. What is this all about? Well, Revival Fires International, and many of our listeners have become used to, accustomed to this great week that we have, and Revival Fires International. Here's how it works. You, call 8007-3347-3780-0733-4737. What Revival Fires International does they give you one free truth for Youth Bible. You give that Bible to your daughter, your son, your grandson, your granddaughter, and they take it to school with them and they offer to a student that they believe has yet to accept Jesus Christ as their personal savior. It's as simple as that. And over the years, 25 years, more than a million of these Bibles have been distributed into public schools. As you have been pointing out, Ed, this is perfectly legal. You don't have to worry about the ACLU or other liberal groups coming and saying, hey, you can't do that. No, it's perfectly legal for a student to, to give another student a Bible Right. Perfectly legal. So, once again, the number to call, folks. 800-733-4737. These truth for youth Bibles, as we've talked about, they contain the New Testament, but they also contain, what would be called comic images that tell the biblical story. And so, this is so important, Tim, Todd, who heads Revival Fires International, was telling us the other day that at least, at least over the last 25 years, at least 30,000 kids have indicated because of these Bibles, they've given their lives to Jesus Christ. So if you think this doesn't have an eternal impact, folks, it does. Probably many more than 30,000.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Yeah, those are just the ones who have filled out the little card that's in the Bible and taken the step of mailing it in. There's no. Only God knows.

>> Fred Jackson: Yes.

>> Ed Vitagliano: How many young people have given their hearts to Christ over this.

>> Fred Jackson: What a simple way for you, the listener, for any who's listening right now, you can be involved with evangelism, Right. Simply by making a phone call. 800-733-4737. Our goal this year, this week is, is to give 65,000 Bibles out. And you say, well, that's a lot. Hey, listen, folks, we got a lot of generous listeners up there. They want to get involved with this great evangelistic outreach. You can do that right now.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Well, and by the way, folks, if you have two or three teenagers in your home, you can get as many Bibles as you have. Teenagers.

>> Fred Jackson: Yes.

>> Ed Vitagliano: one free, one for each is what I'm saying. And, grandparents, if you've got five or six grandkids who are in junior high to high school age, ages 13 through 18, you can get one free Bible for each of them as long as they agree to give it. Give it away. Yes, that's the, that's the whole point of our faith anyway. By the way, these comics at the front of the Bible, they deal with a whole host of issues. very well done, by the way. And they're. When I say comics, they're. They're not funny. No, this is not Peanuts, or Snoopy. these deal with the issues like drugs, witchcraft, ah, homosexuality, sex outside of marriage, alcohol, all those kinds of issues. That's what all those comics are intended to, to speak to. And, that's why these, Bibles are popular, because you hand someone a New Testament with just the words, of course, that is powerful. We, we certainly agree with that. But you got to get kids to open it, and that's what the comics are intended to do, and they hit all of these issues from a biblical perspective, including Scripture references. by the way, Tim Todd, who is in the office with us here in studio with us on Monday. he said they have just completed a new comic that'll be in the next year's printing, which deals with the issue of gender identity and transgender ideology. So, that'll be a great one for next year as well. So help us get 65,000 Bibles into the hands of teens. By the way, you can buy boxes of these Bibles and give them away to kids in your church or give them away to, you know, young people in your neighborhood. Those boxes of a hundred, I mean, of 50, those boxes, Revival Fires Ministry will sell those Bibles for $2 a piece. So $100 gets you 50 of these Bibles. It's a great price and a great outreach. Help us reach 65,000 Bibles and get those into the hands of teens. You get them for free. Listeners. Here's how you do it. Call this number, 800-733-4737. That's 800-733-4737. You can visit online TFY.org that stands for Truth for Youth, TFY.org or you can go to afr.net and front and center is this campaign, and you can get started there, but help us reach that, goal and get the Bible into the hands of young people.

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu meeting with security officials about expanding Gaza war

All right, Chris?

>> Chris Woodward: Yeah. One of the things the Bible tells us, is to pray, pray often, pray without ceasing, and also pray for the peace of Jerusalem. And now would be a good time to do that, because right now, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu is meeting with security officials, to talk about efforts expanding the Gaza war. As we've discussed on this program and on American Family News, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu says, they are looking to, expand operations in Gaza and bring an end to the war with Hamas terrorists. That, by the way, started all this, when they attacked Israel on October 7th of 2023. I've got some audio that we just aired on our ten, o' clock newscast of Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu talking to Fox's, Fox News channel about this very issue. Clip 13.

>> Fred Jackson: You will go immediately into a meeting.

>> Ed Vitagliano: With your security cabinet.

>> Fred Jackson: Will Israel take control of all of Gaza?

>> Jeff Chamblee: We intend to, in order to, assure our security, remove Hamas there, enable the population to be free of Gaza and to pass it to civilian governance. that is not Hamas and not anyone advocating, the destruction of Israel. That's what we want to do. We want to liberate ourselves and liberate the people of Gaza from the awful terror of Hamas. And you were in the Gaza, Strip today. You met Palestinians who are fighting Hamas because finally they see that they have a future. They can rid themselves of this awful tyranny that not only holds our hostages, but holds 2 million Palestinians in Gaza hostage.

>> Ed Vitagliano: You know, Fred, this is, one of the things we, we have mentioned this on the show, but sometimes we forget that there are Palestinians, there are Arabs, who for the most part, are Muslim. But, I don't know how many Christian Arabs are in that Gaza Strip. But the point is they're living under a terror regime, and they have very little choice but to go along with, Hamas. And it's. And it's much like, I assume I've never lived, I didn't live in New York in the 30s or Chicago, in the 20s and 30s when there were, you know, Mafia families that ran things. And you didn't, you didn't try to overthrow that. You didn't try to resist that because you could be the next one who wound up disappeared. And so, I do like the emphasis that Benjamin Netanyahu just had on freeing the Palestinian people there to have a, a say in their future that does not involve living under the heel of a terrorist organization.

>> Fred Jackson: Yeah.

The Israeli cabinet is meeting to discuss what to do next regarding Gaza

As we sit here right now, it is early evening in Jerusalem, and, Prime Minister Netanyahu did this interview with Bill Hammer of Fox News. Bill Hammer normally hosts a program based out of New York, but he's been in Gaza and been in Israel this week. He just did this interview with Netanyahu before this cabinet meeting began. So, as I say, as we sit here, the Israeli cabinet is meeting to discuss what to do next. Now, you heard Prime Minister Netanyahu. Here's what he wants. He basically wants to finish off Hamas, that we have to go in there and finish up the job. He's basically saying the time for negotiation is over. Hamas is not interested in a ceasefire. this is not going to happen. As they were airing this interview 10 minutes ago, there was a missile that came out of northern Gaza, and the Iron Dome took care of it, which is a signal that Hamas is still armed.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Right.

>> Fred Jackson: They still want to fight. the other thing that Netanyahu made very clear in this interview is Israel wants to turn Gaza over to a civilian government. That's what he says. How possible is that? It's hard to imagine because, as we reported many times, the Palestinian people, most of them have grown up being taught to hate Israel and that their future, if they have a good future, it must involve getting rid of Israel and the Jewish people. So he says that's what he wants, for Gaza. There are a lot of other elements in this. You have an Israeli military that has been fighting now for almost two years.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Two years, yeah.

>> Fred Jackson: They're tired. Hundreds of Israeli soldiers have died. So there is a lot of tension inside of Israel. Some say Netanyahu, just give it up. We want our hostages home. That is all we want. We have seen these pictures of the hostages in recent days, just they are being starved to death. They are being threatened every day. There are about 20 that are still alive. That is what is believed. Apparently these hostages, according to the reports that I was just listening to, are being held in a very small area in what would be central Gaza along the coast. Gaza is about 26 miles long along that coast of the Mediterranean. So what, what the Israeli army would have to do if the order comes out of this cabinet meeting, they would have to take that portion. Israel now controls about 75% of Gaza, but they would have to take that last 25%, which is where Hamas is based at the moment. That would involve displacing a million Palestinians. It's still small order, a lot of pressure. The Western countries like Canada, uk, France, they're all talking about, you know, statehood for the Palestinians, all of that sort of thing. The mainstream media all over the world, Israel is causing Palestinians to starve to death, all of those sorts of things. So we need to be praying right now for this Cabinet meeting, a lot on the shoulders of Benjamin Netanyahu. He may get opposition from his own cabinet ministers. I mean, they may just say, no, we can't do this. let's just try to negotiate or whatever the case may be. So we will keep track as best we can today of what comes out of this Cabinet meeting, but these are very critical hours in Israel.

Tony Frum: I don't know what alternative Israel has to Gaza

>> Ed Vitagliano: Well, Tony, one of the things that, President Trump said early on was, that he wanted Gaza to be kind, of a shining example of what could happen in the Middle East. He wanted to develop it, and he wanted it to be free, and he wanted to be outside the control of a terrorist organization. But all of this, all the things that Fred's talked about, what President Trump wants, it is a long road to ho, as they say. As long as Hamas is in existence, proved by the fact that another missile was fired. Nobody doubts that if Hamas was, ah, allowed to remain, in existence and in control of Gaza, this whole thing would probably repeat itself in another few years.

>> Whitney Vitagliano: Yeah, there's a few aspects of this that kind, of intersect with each other. So there is the, First of all, I don't know what the alternative would be apart from Israel occupying Gaza. I mean, Gaza as is no longer what it was. I mean, Gaza City flat, flattened. Yeah, you know, Rafa, flattened. I mean, it's pretty much all rubble. so, you know, apart from an alternative, I don't know what alternative there would be to Israel just occupying it. And I believe Israel, I don't think anybody could argue that if Israel decides, if the cabinet meets and decides that the, the, to complete the mission Israel will need to occupy it. I don't see the, the civilian government that they would turn this over to not being very closely tied, shall we say, to the Israeli government. I, just don't think you leave it up to chance because they've done this before. Right. Israel has tried to hand over, they invade, they hand over control back to the, you know, the people and let the people decide on what government they want. so you've got that aspect. The other aspect of this is, the tremendous suffering, that the Palestinian people, the innocent, you know, the innocent people are going through is, that is heartbreaking. But they have to decide at some point they're going to have to decide which way they want to go and they will have to dispel and uproot Hamas from their own ranks. I mean, there will be, it's just I mentioned this Tuesday, the, the pragmatic approach to this conflict, any conflict is once you are defeated, you either turn over and surrender to the person who has defeated you and remove from your ranks any type of resistance, to the person who's, or the country who's defeated you, or you'll continue to suffer. Right. And it's not that Israel desires to make the Palestinian people suffer, it's just that Hamas, if you don't uproot Hamas from your own ranks, Hamas will continue to resist, which leaves Israel no choice but to continue military offensives, to continue attacks. And Hamas is. No, they're not idiots either. You know, they'll relocate. They also have a, presence in central Gaza where there's a lot of these refugee camps.

>> Ed Vitagliano: They're.

>> Whitney Vitagliano: Wherever the people are, that's where they're going to relocate. And so it's going to fall Heavily, on the people themselves to decide what. What future do we want? Because there is no future. If we continue to support Hamas, if we continue to hide them, if we continue to. To aid and abet them in one way or the other. this are. We don't really have a future. that's. That's kind of how I. Rubble.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Rubble is their future.

>> Whitney Vitagliano: Yeah.

>> Ed Vitagliano: I mean, so I'm not saying that what President Trump was promising, which was kind of like. I forget the words he used, but he wanted it to be like a,

>> Fred Jackson: Riviera.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Yeah, like a Riviera. Did he say use the word Riviera?

>> Fred Jackson: I think he did at one point. Yeah.

>> Ed Vitagliano: So I don't know that you can get there, but you can head in that direction.

>> Whitney Vitagliano: I don't think you can get there unless you get the Palestinian people to say they want. They want to go there.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Yes.

>> Whitney Vitagliano: The fact of the matter is, is you aren't going to be able to. No country around that area has expressed interest in taking in millions of Palestinian refugees. As much as they want to talk about their suffering and what Israel's doing to them, they haven't offered to take them in. You're not going to be able to disperse that many people around the world. certainly not with some of the leadership we have in the west now. so they've got nowhere to go. So they've. They've got to decide do we want to rebuild and if we rebuild, do we want to rebuild towards something that will just be more of what we've had for the past couple of decades, or do we want to go a. For a new future?

>> Ed Vitagliano: and I'm. And I'm pessimistic. Ah, about that. I absolutely agree with what you said, Tony. This is. These are their two paths. But the problem in my mind, and this goes through a lot of the Middle east, is if you choose, you can either choose Western values, which you see in countries like Turkey, like Saudi Arabia, like Jordan. They're Muslim majority countries, but even though they don't have full freedoms like we have in the west, they have the mindset that we want to prosper. Okay? And you. You either adopt that, or if you stay under the radical Islamic ideals of groups like Hezbollah or Hamas, certainly being pushed by Iran, Okay? They. Those kinds of values don't want to prosper.

>> Fred Jackson: No, no.

>> Ed Vitagliano: They. They want to subjugate. And their total existence is built on removing Israel from what they view is, Islamic, territory. And that is their whole purpose for living. That's why they don't care about Palestinians dying in bombings and hospitals getting blown. They have their missile launchers near hospitals or even on the roofs of hospitals. They don't care if their own people die because this is an Islamic purpose. And so I would love for the Palestinian people to choose the way of, of Saudi Arabia and Jordan and saying we want to prosper.

>> Ed Vitagliano: but man, that is going to be a difficult thing to, especially with Hamas still in existence because you're going to have the threat of a bullet if you speak up too loudly about moving away from what they've been living under, as you said, Tony, for the last couple decades, at least.

>> Chris Woodward: I'm sorry to speak over you there. I did dig up here, how many Arab Christians we think might be in Gaza. According to Open Doors, which is an organization we use for international foreign policy mission stories at AFN, Open Doors said in November of 2024 There are approximately 600 Arab Christians in Gaza, down from the 1,070 before the war started. What happened to the other 400?

>> Ed Vitagliano: I'm not sure it was, I knew it was very small because Hamas is brutal towards Christians. Bottom line, there's ISIS and other groups of like mind. all right, let's go ahead and take our break just a little bit early. Rather than start another story, we're going to take a short break. When we come back, Jan Markell, founder of Olive Tree Ministries will be joining us. And top, of the hour course, Steve Paisley Jordal will be with us.

Todd Stern: The number to call for youth Bible week is 800-73347

Want to remind you here as we come up on the break, the number to call if you want to get Bibles into the hands of your teenagers ages 13 through 18. This is truth for youth Bible week is 800-73347. That's 800-733-4737. By the way, you can go to afr.net front and center is the information about Truth for Youth Bible Week. We're trying to get 65,000 Bibles this week into the hands of teenagers who give them to their unsaved friends. We'll be right back.

>> Todd: Hello Americans. I'm Todd Stern. Stand by for news and commentary.

Nearly 3 million kids attended VBS at Southern Baptist churches over the summer

Next. Vacation Bible school may be old school, but it's still very popular among kids across the fruited plain. CBN News reports nearly 3 million kids attended VBS at Southern Baptist churches over the summer. Some 70,000 making a personal decision to follow Christ Vacation Bible School, a week long affair hosted by churches featuring fun adventure themes for kids along with arts and crafts, singing, and lots of recreation, many churches turn snack time into an art form. You know, when I was a kid, I got to double dip. I went to my family's Baptist church, vbs. Then I attended my grandparents VBS at the Methodist Church. Now the Methodist had a lot better snacks. Almost switched denominations as a second grader. Because of that, the surge in VBS attendance could be a sign that more young families are now returning to the traditions of our faith. And the best part, kids actually want to get up early to go to VBS public school. And not so much. I'm Todd Stearns.

>> Fred Jackson: This is Today's Issues. Email your comments to commentsfr.net Past broadcast of today's Issues are available for listening.

>> Jeff Chamblee: And viewing in the [email protected] now back.

Jan Markell is founder of Olive Tree Ministries

>> Fred Jackson: To more of, Today's Issues.

>> Ed Vitagliano: And welcome back to. Welcome to Today's Issues. Ed Vitagliano sitting in for Tim Wildmon this week. I'm, joined in studio by Fred Jackson, Tony Vitagliano and Chris Woodward. And we want to welcome a good friend of the ministry, Jan Markell, founder of Olive Tree Ministries. Jan, welcome back to Today's Issues.

>> Amber Brown: Well, thank you for having me.

Jan Friedman: Benjamin Netanyahu says Israel needs to finish off Hamas

>> Ed Vitagliano: Well, Fred, we just got done talking a little bit about, what's happening in the Middle east and in Israel with Benjamin Netanyahu in a cabinet meeting right now. What's, what do you want to talk to Jan about?

>> Fred Jackson: Well, Jan, before this cabinet meeting started, Netanyahu had an interview with Fox News, and basically he said, going into this cabinet meeting, here's what I would like. He says, we need to finish off Hamas. We cannot stop. We cannot stop here. We have to finish off Hamas. We have to create now these, this is his hope. We have to create a Gaza area, that it's run by a civilian Palestinian government. He said very clearly Israel does not want to occupy Gaza. What do you think? What do you think this cabinet meeting is going to give us? Because there is division in Israel over whether to continue this war. is Netanyahu on the right track? Where do you see it going?

>> Amber Brown: I think the, pro Israel community, who has some very expert analysts, I think. I mean, we all know some of them, Joel Rosenbergs and Gary Bowers, et cetera. I mean, they just, we just feel that, you know, Hamas does need to be finished off. If you don't, they just remain like cockroaches in their underground facilities and continue to send rockets, throughout Israel. so I'm hoping that President Trump, whose calls as it concerns Israel. His judgment calls as it concerns Israel have been 95% very right on. He seems to. And I think he's got some good advisors speaking into him as it concerns Israel. I mean I can tell you that Benjamin Netanyahu is, you know, the left in Israel doesn't like him, like the left in America doesn't like President Trump. So m, that poor man, he can't win over there. I wouldn't want to be Bibi Netanyahu for anything in the whole world. but honestly. And we can go back to 2005 and this is where it all began. Israel never should have pulled out. That was a George W. Bush fiasco that set this whole thing in motion. And, Israel gave up that land and that was the first two state solution. Well, how did that work out? Same way any future 2 state solution will work out. It'll be a catastrophe.

>> Fred Jackson: Yeah, but you know, you're disagreeing with the Prime Minister of Canada, with.

>> Amber Brown: Oh, well, that ruins my day because.

>> Fred Jackson: We know Canada, the UK and Macron in France, ah, just in recent days have all endorsed the idea. They think the solution in the Middle east is a two state solution. And people who have looked at things there over the years are just scratching their heads and saying, you're not dealing with reality here.

>> Amber Brown: And that is it in a sentence, you are not dealing with reality. I mean, how does it work? I mean again, Gaza was the illustration. how did that work out? But you're right, there's, it's the endless delusion, it never goes away, that if these so called Palestinians, I'm sorry, but that's kind of an invented name anyway. But if these Arabs in Israel could just have their own state, there would be peace and harmony and we'd all be, you know, we'd all be singing happy songs. Well, not going to happen because, my friend Carol Matriciano made a film 20 years ago, great Christian filmmaker calling these folks the new barbarians. Now that doesn't mean all of them, of course not. But the mindset of the terrorists among them, those are the new barbarians. Those are the barbarians who broke through on October 7, 2023 and did things you and I can't even talk about here on radio. so how do you make peace side by side in peace and security with some in Palestinian leadership who truly are barbarians? It just doesn't work, gentlemen. And that is the delusion that the Macrons and the leaders of France and these other places have.

>> Chris Woodward: Hey, it's Chris here. Now we're talking with you about Hamas. but this relates to something you've talked with us about for a long time. Now. I'm looking at a Reuters story from 18 minutes ago, and they're reporting that the US has presented Lebanon with a proposal for disarming Hezbollah by the end of the year. given what you know about Lebanon and Hezbollah, do you see that terrorist group just laying down their arms and walking away?

>> Amber Brown: No, I don't. because the Lebanese government is such a weak government, my goodness, I'm surprised they're still functioning at all. No, Hezbollah has virtually taken over country. And what I'm told is, literally every. Every other house in Lebanon is, tied to Hezbollah in some way. I mean, cooperating, with Hezbollah. So it's a nation that's been destroyed. Now, can it come back? Sure. But not with any. Not with Hezbollah leadership. Absolutely no way. No.

The west generally does not seem to understand Islamo fascism, Jan says

>> Ed Vitagliano: Jan, last, question. the west, generally speaking, and I would include Israel, that. Although I think Israel is maybe the one country, and the United States, especially with President Trump at the helm, those two countries seem to have a good grasp on what they are dealing with in terms of Islamo fascism. Some people call it that, or a fascist ideology. now, not everyone in this country has a good grasp on that. Probably not everybody in Israel either. But the west generally does not seem to understand what it's dealing with in terms of the ideology. They just. They just think that this is, you know, two groups of people that can't get along, and if you give each side something, they'll negotiate a kind of a truce, and then they'll all get along together. But you've studied that part of the world your whole life. You understand biblical prophecy. what is the difference between an ideology that you can't, make a deal with, you can't negotiate with, and ordinary people who just want to live and let live?

>> Amber Brown: Well, I think that the very nature of Islamicism, and I think there is a difference between Islamicism and, some of your ordinary Muslims who are just trying to get along. remember, I live in twin cities, Minneapolis, St. Paul. We have 100,000 Somalis here, and one of them is running for mayor of Minneapolis. And my goodness, sorry, but I wouldn't want to be in a dark corner with. I, can't think of his name at this point, and I don't know him. You know, maybe he's a fine person, but, it's very questionable. Let's just leave it at that. My only point being Is we live side by side with a lot of Islamists, and then we live side by side with some who are just trying to. A few are trying to assimilate. Very few. Very few. Those who will assimilate, you know, and accept Western values, that's fine. But otherwise, you know, they maintain a mentality that is not what your average American is used to. And your average American would be shocked to see what this other mentality is all about. and maybe you have to experience it to understand it. And I'm not advising that anybody do that. But if you find yourself living in some of these communities, well, it's not a pretty picture, and I think I need to leave it right there.

>> Ed Vitagliano: are you talking about Omar Fateh? Yeah, I've just looked it up. He's running for mayor of Minneapolis. He's the first Somali American, elected to the Minnesota State Senate. And now he's running.

>> Amber Brown: Correct, but mayor. But we also have Ilhan Omar as our representative. The, fifth district, I believe.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Yeah.

>> Amber Brown: Ilhan Omar from Somalia, yes.

>> Ed Vitagliano: So that.

>> Amber Brown: And how much does she love America?

>> Ed Vitagliano: Right. Yeah, I don't, I don't know if it's just a weakness with Democratic slash Republican, countries. This, this seems to have been the, the same problem that the west faced in the lead up to World War II. Maybe, maybe you just assume that everybody wants to live and let live so that everyone can have a piece of the pie. but when you're dealing with an ideology, whether it's Nazism, specifically, or fascism more broadly, communism, here, even cultural Marxism, you're not, you're dealing with ideologues who want the whole pie. They're not looking for their part and they're willing to run you over in order to get it. so that seems to be a kind of an eternal weakness on the part of Western democracies. and that seems to be what we're facing when we're talking about radicalized Islam and Islamo fascism and, so on and so forth.

>> Amber Brown: Hey, Jan. That's the distinction, you see. Islamo fascism, Islamo, those kinds of terms. Those are important to understand is all I'm saying. Because that's not your traditional, perhaps next door Muslim. Yes, but it's scary is what it is.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Yes. All right, Jan, thank you so much as always, for being on with us. Your wealth of knowledge and experience and thinking through these issues from a biblical perspective. And so we appreciate that and thank you for being on, with us again.

>> Amber Brown: Thanks for having me.

A civilian Palestinian government in Gaza to replace Hamas is unlikely to happen

>> Ed Vitagliano: All right, goodbye. Now take care.

>> Fred Jackson: You know, it's. I heard what Prime Minister Netanyahu said this morning. This is his plan. A civilian Palestinian government in Gaza to replace Hamas. He said, we don't want to occupy. Netanyahu is a very smart man, been around a long time. I think in the back of his mind he knows the idea of a Palestinian civilian government that would be good neighbors for Israel ain't never going to happen.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Right.

>> Fred Jackson: It's not just because of the indoctrination of the Palestinian people to hate Israel. So the only way this is going to happen is, Israel is going to have to in some form govern that area of Gaza. That's the only way you're going to have peace in that area.

>> Whitney Vitagliano: He may be just trying, staging. Yeah. It states its statecraft. He's trying to get the Palestine, maybe trying to get the Palestinian people because they, I feel like at. Still at this point, even with the tremendous, you know, suffering that Hamas refusing to surrender and everything is brought upon them. Ah, would still, I guess balk at the idea of Israeli occupation.

>> Fred Jackson: Yes.

>> Whitney Vitagliano: So he may be just trying to use language that seems neutral, but in reality, nobody, you know, the, the west will play the major role in rebuilding Gaza. Right. And Israel are our greatest ally in that area, in that part of the world is right next door to it. They will play a major role in that rebuilding. Which means they will be there occupying it.

>> Fred Jackson: Yeah.

>> Whitney Vitagliano: And whenever the time comes, you know, however many years down the road, it is, for this government to, to step in, I think you're. We would all be fooling ourselves to think, and I would hope that the Israeli government, would not have a heavy hand in, in who is going to take, over.

>> Ed Vitagliano: I, I gotta say, I am grateful for. I'm grateful that Donald Trump is our president.

>> Ed Vitagliano: For our sakes.

>> Fred Jackson: Yes.

>> Ed Vitagliano: But also I got to say for Israel's sake. If this had been Kamala Harris's administration, with all that's going on within the Democratic Party, pushing against Israel, pushing in favor of even Hamas, it's hard to believe that we can say that, but certainly in favor of the Palestinian side of this issue, Israel would be totally alone. I don't know who else would stand with them.

>> Fred Jackson: We saw that, remember when Netanyahu came to visit the White House when Biden was still president. Kamala Harris didn't want to be in the room.

>> Ed Vitagliano: President Obama left Netanyahu waiting.

>> Fred Jackson: Yeah.

>> Ed Vitagliano: you know, usually you invite right in. They, he left them out there.

>> Fred Jackson: Yeah.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Listen, there's a lot going on here and there's a lot of, you know, I'm thinking of jugglers, a lot of balls up in the air. Yeah, okay. And there's a lot of things going on, but I'm grateful to God that Donald Trump is the president for us and for Israel, because they would be in a really tough spot. frankly, just understanding human nature and the things we just talked about with Jan, about ideologies and especially oppressive ideologies like radical Islam slash Islamo fascism, I don't know how this gets fixed. And that's kind of what the Bible says, is it doesn't get fixed until Jesus returns. But just from a temporal standpoint and a practical standpoint, you cannot make a deal with an organization like Hamas and X percent of the people of Gaza, I don't know what the percentage is, who have been raised up to hate Israel, and that is their purpose for living. Unless you can find a way to convince them there's a better purpose for your life, and that is to clean up this rubble and have jobs and have tourism like Jordan. Okay. And like Israel, where you can have a wealthy future, unless you can convince the Palestinian people there in Gaza that that's the way to go. Man, this is hard. And so when we say pray for Israel and pray for that situation, only God, only God can sort this out in a way that will postpone what the Bible seems to indicate is inevitable in that part of the world.

>> Chris Woodward: Unfortunately, until the Lord returns, we're going to have comments from anti Israel people, including activist Mahmoud Khalil, who is an individual we've talked about on this program and heard from.

Anti Israel activist Mahmoud Khalil interviewed Ezra Klein about October 7th attack

I, bring it up because, again, anti Israel activist Mahmoud Khalil is in the news. He sat down for a podcast with Ezra, Klein, a Jewish person, to talk about things like, Israel and Hamas and the October 7th terrorist, attack. I've got like 90 seconds worth, of audio here.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Explain who he is again, for people.

>> Chris Woodward: Yeah, he's the anti Israel activist, that has made the news because, he's made comments outside of Colombia and some other places, protesting, Israel and its response to the October 7th terrorist attack, which, by the way, Khalil says the Hamas terror attacks were a desperate attempt by, Hamas to be heard. He's fed up with how Israel is treating the terrorists, of all people. clip 11.

>> Ezra Klein: On some level, I understood that as something Hamas must have wanted, right? Pull Israel into this attack, pull it into some kind of war. Maybe you involve other players in the Middle east, but a lot of lives are being used there as kind of chips on the table. was that your perception, or did you see this as something that needed to happen to break the equilibrium?

>> Ed Vitagliano: Yeah.

>> Mahmoud Khalil: I think it's more the latter, like just to break the cycle, to break that Palestinians are not being heard. And to me it's a desperate attempt to the word that Palestinians are here, that Palestinians are part of the equation. that was my interpretation of why Hamas did the October 7th attacks on Israel.

>> Ezra Klein: October 7th was obviously an operation that did kill a lot of civilians. Do you see that as unavoidable, that Hamas had no other choice? Do you see it as a mistake?

>> Mahmoud Khalil: What I know is targeting civilians is wrong. that's why we've been calling for an international independent investigation, to hold perpetrators into accountability. But also, like, there's another point to this, Ezra. Ah, Palestinians, don't have to be perfect victims.

>> Ed Vitagliano: All right, okay. So there's just so much wrong with this. And, first of all, I'm not sure I like the way, Ezra Klein, kind of establish, the parameters of the question. This wasn't a one time thing. Now Hamas has been doing this for years with now. It. Now it was clearly a well planned, you know, attack. it, in other words, it had been considered and planned, probably down to, you know, a lot of final details. But Hamas has been a constant source of missile and rocket barrages against Israel. It may not have been to that extent. So this is not an attempt to get, the, minds of the world onto the issue of the fact that the Palestinians are here. Israel gave them their own piece of land to run. This is craziness, what Khalil is saying here.

>> Fred Jackson: but he represents the mindset that Jan was talking about, that we've talked about. They live in a mindset that, that Jewish people are the enemy and anything you do to them. I hesitate somewhat to say this, but it is a Hitler mentality. Yeah, Hitler did not want to negotiate with the Jews in Poland. He wanted them killed.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Right?

>> Whitney Vitagliano: Yeah, that's, that's like saying, did, did Hitler want. Just want to break the cycle by invading Poland and removing Jews from, from Warsaw and sending them to concentration. That's what a, what an idiotic perspective.

>> Fred Jackson: But, but remember this guy, Mahmoud Khalil was allowed to exist and spread this venom on the university campus, Columbia University campus in New York. In fact, he was a leader. He was out there in front of, of these Israel hating students within hours after 1200 Israeli men, women and children were massacred, is there any wonder why our Secretary of State, Marco Rubio wants him out of the country?

>> Ed Vitagliano: Right.

>> Fred Jackson: He's only out there today doing these interviews. By the way, Ezra Klein works for the New York Times.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Yeah.

>> Fred Jackson: All right. He's Jewish. He was probing the question, and I think he was trying to get the answer out that Mahmoud Khalil did not have a problem with what happened on October 7th. It was just like it gave them a voice. No, they killed men, women and children. They demonstrated Hamas on that day. Demonstrated where Hamas is and its thinking.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Yep.

>> Fred Jackson: And it was a clear indication, by the way, he was later asked in this interview about, do you think we have an anti Semitism problem in this country? And Mahmoud Khalil says, no, I don't think so. I don't think there's a problem with anti Semitism on Columbia University.

>> Whitney Vitagliano: Well, well, Fred, it goes back to it. Even beyond, their hatred of the Jews. It doesn't matter what the situation is. If there is an oppressor and an oppressed group that they. That's in their minds, you know, Israel is the oppressor, America is the oppressor. You know, anybody in the west is the oppressor, the oppressed group, which should be scary to us, the people with radical views like his. The oppressed group is justified in whatever they so choose to do.

>> Fred Jackson: Yeah.

>> Whitney Vitagliano: no matter what level of heinous violence they were being oppressed, it was to give them, you know, a voice, the very essence of what it is to resist. that in their minds, their worldview is so twisted that it doesn't matter what the situation is. If there is an oppressor and an oppressed, the. The oppressed is justified and justifies the means, which.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Which is proven demonstrably by the fact that despite what Mahmoud Khalil just said, by the fact that Hamas said after October 7th, we're going to do this next month and the month after that and the month after that. Remember when they said. They said, we are going to continue to do that? They weren't trying to get anybody's attention on their political plight.

>> Whitney Vitagliano: No.

>> Ed Vitagliano: They were declaring their intent to continue doing this until Israel is gone and every Jew dead.

>> Fred Jackson: Yes.

>> Ed Vitagliano: And, I understand that Ezra Klein was probably that. That he was on eggshells kind of thing, because you want to keep that interview going. To get to the, to the main point, I'm not fault inclined on this, but for, For Mahmoud Khalil, to say that there is no anti Semitism problem in this country. It is finding its home in the Democratic Party.

>> Fred Jackson: Yes. Yeah.

>> Ed Vitagliano: And if the Democratic Party doesn't make, it clear that they reject Hamas and the ideology of the quote, unquote, oppressed, they're going to wind up being in favor of Hamas doing this over and over and over again.

>> Chris Woodward: Keep in mind, this is the same Democratic Party that didn't want Kamala Harris to pick Josh Shapiro because he's a Jewish person.

>> Whitney Vitagliano: Right.

>> Ed Vitagliano: That's as far as we know.

>> Chris Woodward: And that is, Yeah, I mean that's, that's what's widely reported speculated or whatnot.

Pro Hamas, pro Palestinian, anti Israel faction in Democratic Party

I mean, we might be having a different conversation today about how is the Harris administration going to handle this because Josh Shapiro would have been a more favored running mate than Governor Tim Walsh.

>> Ed Vitagliano: he may have turned, Listen, he may have turned the election.

>> Chris Woodward: Yeah. He could have beaten J.D. vance in a debate. It's possible.

>> Ed Vitagliano: And could have potentially led to Kamala Harris carrying Pennsylvania and maybe some of these other toss up states, battleground states. So think about this, think about the fact that the pro Hamas, pro Palestinian, anti Israel faction and the Democratic Party was so strong that they turned away from the better.

>> Chris Woodward: Yeah.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Presidential candidate.

>> Fred Jackson: Yes.

>> Chris Woodward: To, to win, to, to pick a guy from a state they were already going to win. It made no sense. Now this is also the same Democratic Party that I think during the Obama administration booed God at a political convention.

>> Ed Vitagliano: That was in 2012.

>> Chris Woodward: So that makes, that might explain why they booed Israel.

>> Whitney Vitagliano: Yeah.

>> Chris Woodward: Oh yeah.

>> Ed Vitagliano: They booed for both of those.

>> Chris Woodward: So if you're against God, you're against. Is. I mean like it, it's hard to logicize the illogical, but these are some of the greatest hits from the Democratic Party.

>> Ed Vitagliano: I remember that during the convention. I forget who was kind of chairing the, the, the, the, the meeting, so to speak, when the delegates were asked about these two questions. The pro God question was booed roundly. Okay. And whoever was chairing it said if there's no objections, it passes. He did not want to even give them a chance to vote on, on the pro God thing, but they booed Israel as, as well.

>> Fred Jackson: Yeah.

>> Ed Vitagliano: So this, this has been, this has been unfolding in the Democratic Party for a while and I don't think, Fred, I don't think they can escape this. No, this, we are, we are, we are seeing things heading, what's the expression, coming to a head.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Throughout the world. And it's unavoidable And I just, this is just me. I don't speak for afa. It seems to me that God wanted Donald Trump in office both in 2016 and in 2024 to rip the smiley face off. The evil that is under the surface in the Democratic Party and in our, colleges and universities. And these things are coming to a head. What's happening in the Middle east is coming to a head. What's happening within the Democratic Party is coming to a head. And, in the next several years, we're going to see how all this plays out. But the momentum, I think, is unstoppable. The Democratic Party is either going to abandon its energetic, foot soldiers, all these young people, or it's going to fracture and become a non viable political entity in the next four or five years.

>> Fred Jackson: You are sure?

>> Ed Vitagliano: I can see any other way around it. All right, five minute break for news. We'll be right back.

>> Whitney Vitagliano: The views and opinions expressed in this broadcast may not necessarily reflect those of the American Family association or American Family Radio.

Ed, Tony and Fred talk with Chris on top news headlines of the day. Also, Jan Markell joins the program to give an update on the latest with Israel.