Host: Welcome to Today's Issues. Join us for the next hour as we offer a Christian response to the issues of the day.
Host: Welcome, everybody, to Today's Issues on Thursday, October 15th, halfway through the month. I'm sitting in for Tim Wildmon this week. I'm joined in the studio by Fred Jackson. Good morning, Fred.
Fred Jackson: Morning to you.
Host: Chris Woodward.
Chris Woodward: Good morning.
Host: That's all we get out of Chris today. Joining us from Florida is Dr. Ray Pritchard. You're in Florida, right?
Dr. Ray Pritchard: Yes, sir, I am.
Host: All right. Well, good morning to you, sir.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: How are you, Ed?
Host: I'm doing well, doing well. All right, it is halfway through the month, folks. We have mentioned it a time or two, but we would like to thank our listeners and supporters for our share-a-thon that we had just over a week ago. Thank you so much for supporting American Family Radio. It is a great encouragement to the staff here. For those who weren't able to give, we certainly understand with difficult economic times. Please continue to pray for this ministry and let your friends know about American Family Radio. We have an app if they don't have a terrestrial radio station in their area. Just have them go wherever they download apps and download American Family Radio. It is a game changer, as Tim frequently says. You can listen to the radio station anywhere you have a good signal.
Host: All right, Chris, why don't we go ahead and get started?
Chris Woodward: We begin with breaking news out of Washington. In a story you can find on AFN.net, President Trump said today that the Pentagon will no longer livestream the firing squad execution of Fort Hood shooter Nidal Malik Hasan after the announcement faced bipartisan criticism. Vice President J.D. Vance said he would not watch it.
Chris Woodward: Trump said on social media that publicly airing the execution might have been a strong deterrent for the world to witness how America deals with terrorists and scum like him. But he went on to say that any very good and well-meaning people would rather not watch him die through streaming or through any other visual device.
Chris Woodward: I believe I mentioned this on the show earlier this week. Some people who were opposed to this were referring to it not as a livestreamed event, but as a death-streamed event.
Host: Ray, I'm going to start with you. You're in the gospel ministry. You've pastored churches, and you've pastored in Chicago for years, didn't you?
Dr. Ray Pritchard: Absolutely.
Host: What was your take on this idea of livestreaming the execution of Nidal Hasan?
Dr. Ray Pritchard: If you want to look at it from a biblical point of view, you really have two questions here. Is capital punishment biblical? Yes, it is. You can see in the Old Testament that God mandated the death penalty for certain terrible, sinful behavior in the nation of Israel. That was carried over into the book of Romans, where it says that the authority does not bear the sword in vain.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: If you're asking the question, does the Bible allow for capital punishment, it does. If you go further and ask, should it be done publicly, the interesting thing is that in the Old Testament there were certain crimes that were so egregious that not only did God mandate the death penalty, but if there was going to be a stoning for certain crimes, it was to be done in public so that the nation of Israel would see the true cost of sin, the true penalty of sin.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: Having said that, America is not operating today under the Old Testament law. I think it is more a question of expediency, wisdom, and, let's face it, political calculation. All I'll say is that I agree with the vice president. I would not have watched it either. I think the president, for reasons both prudential and political, less than three weeks out before the midterm elections, made a wise decision. This was an issue that he did not need percolating any further, and it was good just to say it the way that he did.
Host: Fred, I agree with Ray on this. I, and the vice president, would not have watched it, and for a number of reasons we don't have to get into very much. I do want to ask you about this angle of it. First of all, I don't think that a public execution would be much of a deterrent to terrorists who think God applauds them and rewards them for killing unbelievers.
Host: You mentioned something interesting before we got officially on the air. The news media has basically ignored the fact that Hasan was a Muslim and apparently did this in honor of his religion.
Fred Jackson: He hollered, "Allahu Akbar," as he shot these people. I think he killed at least 13 people and wounded more than a couple dozen others in this Fort Hood incident in 2009. It has been interesting watching the mainstream media. They never mention that he did it in the name of Islam.
Host: Imagine for a moment if, instead of Nidal Hasan, this had been a Christian in the military who shot and killed a group of people at a military facility in the name of Christ. Can you imagine what the mainstream media would do with that? They would have been doing it for the last 17 years.
Fred Jackson: Exactly. They would try to paint the picture that this is another example of how violent Christians are, and so forth. But no, they pretty well covered up that he did it in the name of his religion.
Host: Our story on AFN.net has the headline from the Associated Press, "Trump says Pentagon won't livestream execution of Fort Hood shooter." The word shooter kind of tones it down. He's a mass murderer. That's what he did.
Fred Jackson: He was a mass murderer. He went into a medical facility where soldiers were getting ready to be deployed to Afghanistan, and he decided to shoot them up. That's what he did. It was a terrible thing.
Host: Regarding the decision by the president this morning, it was our secretary of war, Pete Hegseth, who first announced that the execution would take place on December 3rd. Hegseth was asked about this, and he said it would be livestreamed. Almost immediately, the vice president, J.D. Vance, backed away from this. The president also said, when he was asked about it, "We're looking at this."
Host: Another interesting aspect of this is that almost immediately, Roman Catholic officials denounced the idea of livestreaming. They actually opposed capital punishment, and I believe one story early on after the announcement from Pete Hegseth said that one of the Catholic officials was encouraging any soldier who might be asked to be part of the firing squad to ask for a religious exemption from that. So there was that element in all of this.
Host: But I agree with Ray. I think President Trump weighed the politics of this and the scene of something like this being livestreamed and decided it was not good.
Host: I can certainly understand this being an issue where religious exemptions should be allowed, because people's consciences do vary. I have no problem with the death penalty for egregious crimes, as long as there are safeguards in place to make sure that the innocent aren't put to death. But at the same time, I wouldn't have watched the livestream.
Host: I remember when I was a youth pastor many years ago, I found out that some of the young men in my youth group liked to watch a video series called Faces of Death. It was a series where, like news reports, people would inadvertently catch someone being killed on camera. I was frankly shocked and spoke to the local video store. I don't remember whether it was Blockbuster or some other store, but I talked to them about whether they should be renting this to underage teenagers.
Host: Teenage boys do all kinds of wacky, idiotic things, but there was something particularly dark about watching other people die for entertainment. Real-life death. This is a matter of conscience, and I respect people who would want to watch it and those who would not want to watch it for their own personal beliefs. But I'm glad this is not going to be done.
Host: All right, the next story, keeping it with politics. A government banking regulator known as the Office of the Comptroller of the Currency, or OCC, has released a report showing that major U.S. banks, including JPMorgan Chase and Bank of America, denied services or closed accounts for people and businesses linked to sensitive political or social topics.
Host: Targets included a pro-democratic education group, a merchant selling Trump merchandise including MAGA hats, a firearm company, an immigration reform organization, and a pro-life organization. When you look at the report and the news reports that have come out to flesh this out, it would appear that some of these decisions to debank these entities were based on the Southern Poverty Law Center labeling these organizations as hate groups.
Host: Somebody who commented on that yesterday was U.S. Representative Mike Haridopolos, a congressman from Florida. He was on Washington Watch to talk about this report and the fact that the banks wrongly used the SPLC as a source.
Mike Haridopolos: They're just a biased group that has an agenda to undercut the basic values of America, and they finally were exposed. I just recently think that you're doing good work, and others, that their agenda would undercut what really makes this country so unique and special. I'm so glad to see the administration go out, find the facts, and see that this group was clearly undermining what basic banking requirements should be.
Host: Fred, this story, in fact, in our story meeting we agreed to move this up. There are always all kinds of things happening in the world, especially around Ukraine and so forth, but this is a particularly frightening story.
Fred Jackson: We have been covering it. It was more anecdotal over the last several years and during the Biden administration, when we heard about banks doing this to individuals or groups. We have tried to expose for well over a decade, maybe a couple of decades, the Southern Poverty Law Center for its blatant hypocrisy and hostility to all things Jesus and anyone working with the Scriptures in mind as their guide.
Fred Jackson: We worked through our news division and so forth, finding out that they were using the Southern Poverty Law Center's hate map and list of so-called hate organizations when training the military and in all kinds of other situations.
Fred Jackson: The first thing I want to say is kudos to the Trump administration, because if they had not sought to expose this, we may never have known other than through a few stories here and there. But this isn't just anecdotal now. There is a report showing that this was systematic. It takes the vast resources and power of the federal government to persecute those of a different political view.
Fred Jackson: This isn't far off, and I don't think this is hyperbole, from what the communists and the Nazis used to do.
Host: Absolutely. We've heard Democrats saying lately that the Trump administration is weaponizing itself against its political enemies. It almost chokes you to think that they would accuse the Trump administration of weaponizing the Justice Department when you look at what the Biden administration was doing.
Host: There were nine banks in total, folks, and you need to know this: JPMorgan Chase, Bank of America, Citibank, Wells Fargo, U.S. Bank, Capital One, PNC, TD Bank, and BMO Bank. Those were the ones mentioned in this government report.
Fred Jackson: Those are some of the biggest banks in the world.
Host: Yes, big banks here in America. I wanted to give an example. Among the examples in the report is JPMorgan Chase's payment operation, WePay, closing the account of a merchant. What did that merchant do?
Fred Jackson: They sold merchandise promoting President Trump and the Make America Great Again brand, claiming it promoted hate, violence, or racial intolerance.
Host: So they shut the account down?
Fred Jackson: They shut the account down. In other cases, they were watching who was buying MAGA hats.
Host: That may be one of the most absurd parts about this story.
Fred Jackson: Yes. You buy a MAGA hat, you go on the list. They're watching you.
Host: MAGA was a keyword, a search word, that these banks were using. Folks, like you said, this is what communists do. They not only disagree with you if you disagree with them. They say, "We're going to shut you down. We're going to punish you."
Host: When I was reading this story this morning, I was reminded of what Prime Minister Trudeau did to those truckers protesting in Canada. "We're going to freeze your bank account. You can't do this. We're going to put you out of business. We're not going to allow you to withdraw $20 from your bank account."
Host: This is how the left works. The left loves to describe itself as being towers of tolerance. No, you're not. You're not tolerant at all.
Host: This story is out there, and we're getting reaction from various sources. We want to underline over and over again that this is what the Democrats did during the Biden administration. I believe if they get in power again, you're going to see this on steroids.
Host: Ray, I don't want to oversell or overhype this, although it may sound like that's exactly what I want to do when I mention the book of Revelation. Whatever your theological view, it is clear that we have a picture of a tyrannical government that uses, or will use, the power of economic control to coerce people into worshiping the beast.
Host: If you believe that is a futuristic coming reality, we can at least see hints of that through communism or fascism, or in this case, the Democratic Party starting to lean that way. I would feel this strongly if Republicans were doing it. But saying, "If you believe something different, you can't buy or sell," is a terrifying thing to consider.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: Friends, if you want to see where this ends, read Revelation 13. In these days, there is hardly any chapter more important for Christians and conservatives to read and think about.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: Revelation 13 says that in those last terrible days before the coming of Jesus Christ to establish His kingdom, during the tribulation period, the Antichrist is going to say, "You take the mark on your hand or your forehead, or you will not buy and you will not sell."
Dr. Ray Pritchard: What Bank of America, Chase, and these other banks did, these are not just American banks. These are banks with branches and power that stretch around the world. What starts with what we're talking about in this news story ends up in Revelation 13. I don't think you're overhyping it at all.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: The sad and shocking part is not that the left-wing, incredibly liberal Democrats did this, or that the Biden administration did this. The shocking part is that these banks, led by people who ought to know better, went along with it.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: I'm hardly ever surprised when we hear there has been government misconduct. But it is truly sad to think that the banks could be coerced into putting people on a list whose only crime was buying a MAGA hat. It is terrifying to think about. It is totalitarian. It is communistic. It is fascistic, if you want to say it that way. We're not saying that people are communists, but we are saying that this is what communists do.
Host: I just want to give a couple more examples that came from this report from the federal agency yesterday, again dealing with JPMorgan's WePay. In the bank's internal tracking system, employees described the organization as a "right-wing, religious conservative nonprofit with strong anti-LGBTQ rhetoric."
Host: They didn't like them because they spoke out against homosexuality, same-sex marriage, and so forth.
Host: Citibank pressured a payment processor to terminate a religious nonprofit because of its views on same-sex marriage. They were looking at what you believe, folks. As Christians, what you believe, and they were going to punish you. They were going to shut down your bank account because of what you believe about homosexuality, and I'm sure there were those who were targeted because of their views about abortion as well.
Host: AFA may not have fallen victim to this particular movement, although it may have. We have fallen victim to this with at least one credit card processor that refused to do business with us. They had been processing payments so that when people gave to the ministry, they could use a particular credit card, but the processor that handled all credit cards refused to process them. Discover Card also would not do business with us.
Host: This processor did the same thing. It would not process our payments, and it did it without warning. It was just before the end of the year, when it would hurt us the most. This happened probably four or five years ago.
Host: But think about this tactic. That's banking. What if internet providers said, "You're a hate group according to the SPLC, so we're not doing business with you. Find somebody else to take care of your internet"? What if phone providers, Android phones, Apple phones, or carriers said they were not going to sell to you? You could get to the place where even energy companies could say, "You're a hate group. You're an enemy of the people, so we're not going to do business with you."
Host: You get to that point, and it really echoes the things we read in the Bible. That is one of the reasons why AFA has become more involved with shareholder activism. We get a share in a company so we can confront a chief executive officer or the president of an organization face to face and raise the issue with shareholders, many of whom have no idea that the company in which they have money does this kind of thing.
Host: The other thing I want to point out is that all the information we have shared so far on this debanking report is on the Today's Issues Facebook page. In one post, we have a link to the report itself. In another, we have related news stories and a link to the Washington Watch show that had the Mike Haridopolos interview about this very topic.
Host: We are covering this.
Fred Jackson: Yes, we're in the process. After the show today, I've got some calls lined up with various organizations, so stick around.
Host: Because it's breaking news, right?
Fred Jackson: It is.
Host: All right, folks, that's an eye-opener for a Thursday. There are some more things coming up about banks and so on. There are a lot of players in the political and cultural chaos engulfing our country. Which way will America go? Some big players are choosing sides.
Host: We're going to take a short break. When we come back, more of Today's Issues right here on the American Family Radio Network.
Host: Welcome back. I'm sitting in for Tim Wildmon this week. I am joined in the studio by Fred Jackson and Chris Woodward, and from his home in Florida, Dr. Ray Pritchard.
Host: Fred, we were talking about banks before the break. I'm looking here at American Family News' website, AFN.net. There's another story here about banks behaving badly.
Fred Jackson: We mentioned Bank of America as being one of the nine that has been targeted in this government report about treating conservatives unfairly. Just about two days ago, Bank of America was hit with a $1.2 billion fine, not million, a $1.2 billion fine, for allegedly violating anti-money-laundering and sanctions laws.
Fred Jackson: This is what the government said: "When a bank of this size fails to meet its anti-money-laundering and sanctions obligations, the consequences extend far beyond its own walls, exposing the entire U.S. financial system to significant illicit financial risks."
Fred Jackson: In a statement, the Treasury Department said its Financial Crimes Enforcement Network assessed the $1.2 billion penalty for Bank of America's "failure to mitigate and report priority national security risks, including Chinese money-laundering networks and illicit finance along the southwest border."
Fred Jackson: The phrase "Chinese money-laundering networks" is in capital letters. They are actually looking at China, and we shouldn't be surprised by this. China is a bad character. They really are. We could talk about the fact that they're aiding Iran and Russia, and all the bad players in the world, including North Korea. They are friends with all these people.
Fred Jackson: But what Bank of America apparently has been fined for is that they weren't being diligent enough in going after these money-laundering operations from bad characters moving money through the system in order to clean it up. That's why it's called laundering.
Host: Ray, this story on AFN.net also states that Bank of America reached an $11.6 million settlement with the Treasury Department's Office of Foreign Assets Control over apparent violations of numerous sanctions programs. So this isn't just the money laundering. They were doing business with countries that had sanctions against them, including Iran and Russia, as well as narcotics and global terrorism.
Host: It is a bizarre situation where they are apparently doing business with narcotics and global terrorist groups, countries that are hostile to the United States and the free West, while they are looking at American citizens who buy a MAGA hat and shuttering their businesses.
Host: Look, I'm no expert on the law, but I do watch a lot of episodes of Law & Order, so I qualify to make at least this comment. You see it in these dramas, and it always ends up the same way: follow the money. Follow the money, and it will lead you to the bad guys. It will lead you to the truth.
Host: The bad guys have a lot of money. Drug dealers have a boatload of money, really billions of dollars gained through evil activities. You take these two stories together and wonder, what is wrong with the banks?
Host: You don't expect the banks to take part in politics one way or the other. You want the bank to take care of your money. Our money is in one of the banks that has already been mentioned on this program today. All I want from them is to take care of my money and make sure nothing happens to it. If they can make me some money and increase it a little bit, that's enough for a bank to do.
Host: They shouldn't be getting in bed with arms dealers, terrorists, and drug dealers. But the problem is, follow the money, guys. It isn't going to lead to me. The real money is going to lead somewhere else. That's always the temptation.
Host: I'm glad the Trump administration, the Justice Department, Treasury, and whoever else are bringing this to light, because the only way things are going to change is through a little sunlight on these misdeeds behind closed doors.
Fred Jackson: Kudos to the Trump administration for this. I can give you two answers as to what's wrong with banks. From my years of helping AFN cover this, number one, left-leaning people and organizations go to shareholder meetings and issue shareholder resolutions. They are also very good at using social media to raise a stink about what a bank is doing or what it has done, and whom it has held accounts for.
Fred Jackson: The left is very good at all of those things, which is why a number of right-leaning people have said, "We have to get involved here, otherwise they're going to wreak havoc."
Fred Jackson: The other thing, and this is probably an even bigger reason, is that a lot of the asset-holder management companies that basically do the work for Bank of America or JPMorgan Chase, where they have investments and all that other stuff, have for several years been big drivers of DEI, ESG, and CRT.
Fred Jackson: Those people in boardrooms and through phone calls, emails, and other means are a big reason why Bank of America or somebody else does this silly stuff.
Host: One of the things we've talked about here is that at AFA, we've gotten our people into some of those shareholder meetings, and we've seen some amazing results. In this case, the left-leaning people got there first. But our experience shows that when we get the right people in the right place and they speak up at shareholder meetings behind closed doors, we can see things change.
Host: This is a great teaching moment for many, although not all. A lot of our listeners are already active. All the things we're talking about can be changed, or at least balanced and leveled, if Christians simply get involved. If you don't get involved, guess who will? The devil's crowd.
Host: I'm not saying everybody on the opposite end of the political or cultural spectrum from conservatives is of the devil. But I am talking about those who want to shut people down because of their political beliefs, religious beliefs, or groups like ours that stand for Christian values.
Host: To level the playing field, you have to get involved. I want to issue what I call a commercial. If you go to AFA.net, as soon as that website pops up, on the right side it says AFA Insider, and you can subscribe. We usually send just one action alert a week, and we do all the legwork for you.
Host: The one that's up there right now is to tell the WNBA to define eligibility based on biological sex. That is the Women's National Basketball Association. It is very simple. You can take action, send an email, and have your voice heard.
Host: A lot of times these AFA Insider alerts go to corporations, the federal government, or a congressman's or congresswoman's office. We do all the legwork for you. All you have to do is subscribe, and you'll get these opportunities to take action and take a stand.
Host: Don't cede the territory to the people who want to destroy our country and take away our freedoms. One day, if we're not active, we may wake up and find that our bank account has been canceled, wondering what happened and why nobody did something. You and I, everyone here, and everyone in your family, among your friends and church members, can be part of the group that does something.
Host: I have a text message here from Rob West. He wants to book us for Faith and Finance tomorrow. Is that right?
Fred Jackson: Yes.
Host: All right. Next story.
Chris Woodward: This is a very big and serious situation that we're continuing to follow. Do stick with AFN for radio and print coverage on what I'm about to talk about. A group of pastors in the state of Kansas has written a letter to Adam Hamilton.
Chris Woodward: Adam Hamilton is a Methodist pastor. He's also a Democratic candidate for Senate in the state of Kansas. These pastors, including Kyle Lamont, have written an open letter to Adam Hamilton because they went through his sermons and found that he is preaching all kinds of woke ideas. He's pushing things on the campaign trail that they have deemed heresy. They are calling for him to repent of his heresy and also to drop out of the Senate race.
Chris Woodward: Let's begin with audio of Kyle Lamont, a pastor who is part of this effort to try to get Adam Hamilton to repent of his sins and also drop out of the race.
Kyle Lamont: Adam Hamilton is first and foremost an ordained minister of the gospel. As an ordained minister of the gospel, there is an oath, a vow, that pastors hold to: the authority of God's Word. They should stand on the correct side of issues such as sexuality, abortion, and even the inerrancy and exclusivity of Jesus Christ as the way for salvation through faith alone.
Kyle Lamont: Pastor Hamilton rejects these convictions and these oaths. As far as we're aware, Hamilton has not responded to this call for him to repent and step away from the Senate race.
Chris Woodward: Steve Jordan has done a nice job providing us with a little bit of sound from Adam Hamilton. This is an excerpt of something he preached a few years ago, where he took time out of a church service to talk about greenhouse gas emissions and climate change, including meat consumption.
Adam Hamilton: Then there are the carbon dioxide sinks that are to take away the carbon dioxide, things like forests in parts of the world where there is deforestation. We are sometimes raising crops, tilling up the ground, and taking away part of the ground's capacity for absorbing some of the oxygen.
Adam Hamilton: Some of the things that we grow because we like to eat them, like cattle, end up producing more carbon dioxide than other crops we could grow or other forms of food that we could have. In all of these ways, we are creating or adding to the amount of greenhouse gases in our world.
Host: You have preached, and Ray has preached as well, that we should be good stewards of the environment. That's scriptural. But should a church service sound like a climate summit?
Fred Jackson: You asked me that question. Yes, yes, no. That is a legitimate question.
Host: Fred, the Gospel of Mark clearly lays out a plan to reduce greenhouse gases.
Fred Jackson: No, no, it doesn't.
Host: I know that's in Hezekiah. First Hezekiah.
Host: Pastors will sometimes go outside the lines a little bit and talk about different issues. You might want to talk about crime or something. But in my opinion, when you go outside the box to talk about cultural or political issues, you should at least tie them to something in the Bible.
Host: Greenhouse gases, first of all, are a load of baloney in terms of what they have predicted is happening or going to happen to the world. But I don't know where you would tie this into Scripture. You can extrapolate a little bit and talk about what we might do to Nidal Hasan, but you have to have some sort of principle in Scripture to build on. That's my opinion. What's yours?
Dr. Ray Pritchard: You're absolutely right. When we think of churches, pastors, and sermons, the sermon ought to be based on a portion of Scripture for that day that God has laid on the heart of the pastor.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: I find it very difficult to believe that this pastor, whose church is the largest Methodist church in the country, would make this the focus. This isn't a small corner church. I also want to point out that he is running as a Democrat against the incumbent, Senator Roger Marshall.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: He is running for a party that fully advocates for the killing of unborn babies. Can you defend that from Scripture, sir? He is running for a party that is all in on boys going into girls' bathrooms and boys playing on girls' teams. Can you find me in Scripture where a boy transitions to a girl? Can you find that for me? And there are so many other things, including same-sex marriage. You have to write down the list and go down it. So I'm troubled by this.
Host: I am glad that this group of pastors has written a letter. I don't think they expected him to step away from this.
Fred Jackson: They didn't.
Host: But they are putting their concerns on record to this gentleman. I think this Senate race is fairly close. It could go either way. It's one of those toss-ups they're talking about. This is really going to be a test for the people of Kansas, and we have a lot of Kansas listeners. Are you okay with this and what he believes?
Host: You've got a big decision there in Kansas. This is quite the opposite of the current senator in terms of where this pastor stands on the issues. The people of Kansas are not going to be able to say, "I didn't know he believed that." He's out there with what he believes and what his priorities are. I think the differences are very distinct.
Host: Ray, as we mentioned, we're coming back to you. You are a former pastor, but you're still a minister and a preacher and teacher of God's Word. A tip of the hat to these pastors for the reasons we just stated. They're not sitting quietly on this. They're not saying, "Just let this United Methodist Church go." By the way, it has gone completely off the rails, and John Wesley would be rolling over in his grave about what the UMC has become.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: This is the pastor of the largest Methodist church in the country, and at least these pastors are standing up and saying that what this man believes and teaches is not scriptural or biblical. We're not going to sit by and do nothing.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: I agree with Fred. I don't think this group of pastors thinks this pastor is going to repent of his views, step down, and leave the race. But at the same time, they're not going to let him try to take the high ground and say, "As a pastor, I think the Democratic Party is the way to go." These pastors are speaking out and helping the voters of Kansas come to grips with what this man actually believes.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: Two or three things about all of this. Number one, as someone who until recently lived in Kansas, I have to say I'm not surprised that it is a close race. Roger Marshall has been a fine senator for Kansas, but he's not flamboyant or extravagant. He's simply a faithful man serving in the Senate, and he's done a really good job.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: On the other hand, Adam Hamilton is liberal, but he knows how to speak language that evangelicals could understand. He's way to the left, but he is well spoken. He's what I would expect a pastoral candidate to be. He's a good communicator and knows how to get in touch with people's feelings and problems in life, as pastors should be able to do. So I'm not surprised that the race is close.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: I think Kansas is still conservative enough, outside of Kansas City itself, that Roger Marshall is going to get reelected. But it will be closer than most people thought.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: I also want to make a comment about this pastoral letter. It is worth reading and very well done. If a pastor is going to put out a letter like this, he has to couch it in a way that it comes from his calling as a minister of the gospel. That's what this pastor did, the Wichita pastor who wrote the public letter to Adam Hamilton.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: When you read the letter online, you see the list of signatories underneath it. There are at least 179 Kansas pastors who have signed on, and then there are hundreds of laypeople who have signed on. I looked and saw that one of the Bible study leaders from the church we attended back in Kansas had signed the letter.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: I say all that to say this: if you want to know how pastors can approach a situation like this, this is the way to do it. It is perfectly biblical for pastors to join together and call their people to stand up for biblical, righteous, noble, God-honoring values. So kudos to the pastor and to the others who have signed on.
Chris Woodward: A couple of days ago on this very program, we were talking about the ongoing efforts by Dr. Willie Rice, the president of the Southern Baptist Convention, for pastors to be more involved and more vocal about these kinds of issues and politics, and to encourage their congregants to register and vote.
Chris Woodward: Check out AFN.net for that story, because we're still getting reaction to it. The other thing I would highly recommend is that, in addition to listening to this program and other great things on AFR, like Exploring the Word, we believers all need to get into the Word of God and study Scripture. That way we can know if the person behind the pulpit is preaching a bunch of gobbledygook.
Chris Woodward: You're not going to realize that James Talarico is twisting things out of context if you don't know what the verse says. Second Timothy 3:16 tells us that all Scripture is given to us for reasons including instruction and correction.
Chris Woodward: The King James Version of that verse might say "the man of God," but that is not just talking about your male pastor. That verse applies to everybody. We all need to be in the Word so that we can know whether what a person is preaching is wrong.
Host: Let me ask you quickly in terms of logistics. Ray has recommended that people read the letter. Is that going to be up on AFN, or how will people get access to it if they want to read it?
Chris Woodward: We are in the process of putting that story together for the website. But I can tell you right now, if you'll go to the Today's Issues Facebook page, there is a link to an article from our friends at The Washington Stand, which is the Family Research Council's news outlet.
Chris Woodward: The headline is "Kansas Pastors Urge Adam Hamilton to Repent of Unbiblical Teachings and Withdraw from Senate Race." Click on that, and inside the article, in the very first paragraph, the second sentence, there is a link to the letter. It says that in an open letter, Kansas pastor Kyle Lamont called for the pastor to repent. We will have a link to it when we get our story up.
Host: Fred, let me ask you this, and then we can move from this story, although we've got a break coming up. It seems to me that, maybe slowly, the body of Christ seems to be waking up to its danger.
Host: This started under COVID, when Christian parents began finding out what their kids were being taught in schools. It also happened during the Biden administration, as Christians started waking up to transgender ideology and the borders being flung wide open. I think those two issues especially helped get President Trump elected.
Host: Now we see things like this happening with Talarico and Hamilton. Do you think pastors are waking up to the danger even more?
Fred Jackson: I believe it. Chris just referenced the president of the Southern Baptist Convention coming out and saying that pastors have to get involved. We've got to stop this separation where people say, "That's a political issue. This is a spiritual issue."
Fred Jackson: More and more pastors and Christians are understanding that the politicians over there are threatening what I believe, threatening biblical values, and threatening the freedom I have to express those biblical values. I think they are waking up and starting to be more bold.
Host: From woke to waking up, folks. We'll be right back.
Host: Welcome to Today's Issues. Join us for the next hour as we offer a Christian response to the issues of the day.
Host: Welcome, everybody, to Today's Issues on Thursday, October 15th, halfway through the month. I'm sitting in for Tim Wildmon this week. I'm joined in the studio by Fred Jackson. Good morning, Fred.
Fred Jackson: Morning to you.
Host: Chris Woodward.
Chris Woodward: Good morning.
Host: That's all we get out of Chris today. Joining us from Florida is Dr. Ray Pritchard. You're in Florida, right?
Dr. Ray Pritchard: Yes, sir, I am.
Host: All right. Well, good morning to you, sir.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: How are you, Ed?
Host: I'm doing well, doing well. All right, it is halfway through the month, folks. We have mentioned it a time or two, but we would like to thank our listeners and supporters for our share-a-thon that we had just over a week ago. Thank you so much for supporting American Family Radio. It is a great encouragement to the staff here. For those who weren't able to give, we certainly understand with difficult economic times. Please continue to pray for this ministry and let your friends know about American Family Radio. We have an app if they don't have a terrestrial radio station in their area. Just have them go wherever they download apps and download American Family Radio. It is a game changer, as Tim frequently says. You can listen to the radio station anywhere you have a good signal.
Host: All right, Chris, why don't we go ahead and get started?
Chris Woodward: We begin with breaking news out of Washington. In a story you can find on AFN.net, President Trump said today that the Pentagon will no longer livestream the firing squad execution of Fort Hood shooter Nidal Malik Hasan after the announcement faced bipartisan criticism. Vice President J.D. Vance said he would not watch it.
Chris Woodward: Trump said on social media that publicly airing the execution might have been a strong deterrent for the world to witness how America deals with terrorists and scum like him. But he went on to say that any very good and well-meaning people would rather not watch him die through streaming or through any other visual device.
Chris Woodward: I believe I mentioned this on the show earlier this week. Some people who were opposed to this were referring to it not as a livestreamed event, but as a death-streamed event.
Host: Ray, I'm going to start with you. You're in the gospel ministry. You've pastored churches, and you've pastored in Chicago for years, didn't you?
Dr. Ray Pritchard: Absolutely.
Host: What was your take on this idea of livestreaming the execution of Nidal Hasan?
Dr. Ray Pritchard: If you want to look at it from a biblical point of view, you really have two questions here. Is capital punishment biblical? Yes, it is. You can see in the Old Testament that God mandated the death penalty for certain terrible, sinful behavior in the nation of Israel. That was carried over into the book of Romans, where it says that the authority does not bear the sword in vain.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: If you're asking the question, does the Bible allow for capital punishment, it does. If you go further and ask, should it be done publicly, the interesting thing is that in the Old Testament there were certain crimes that were so egregious that not only did God mandate the death penalty, but if there was going to be a stoning for certain crimes, it was to be done in public so that the nation of Israel would see the true cost of sin, the true penalty of sin.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: Having said that, America is not operating today under the Old Testament law. I think it is more a question of expediency, wisdom, and, let's face it, political calculation. All I'll say is that I agree with the vice president. I would not have watched it either. I think the president, for reasons both prudential and political, less than three weeks out before the midterm elections, made a wise decision. This was an issue that he did not need percolating any further, and it was good just to say it the way that he did.
Host: Fred, I agree with Ray on this. I, and the vice president, would not have watched it, and for a number of reasons we don't have to get into very much. I do want to ask you about this angle of it. First of all, I don't think that a public execution would be much of a deterrent to terrorists who think God applauds them and rewards them for killing unbelievers.
Host: You mentioned something interesting before we got officially on the air. The news media has basically ignored the fact that Hasan was a Muslim and apparently did this in honor of his religion.
Fred Jackson: He hollered, "Allahu Akbar," as he shot these people. I think he killed at least 13 people and wounded more than a couple dozen others in this Fort Hood incident in 2009. It has been interesting watching the mainstream media. They never mention that he did it in the name of Islam.
Host: Imagine for a moment if, instead of Nidal Hasan, this had been a Christian in the military who shot and killed a group of people at a military facility in the name of Christ. Can you imagine what the mainstream media would do with that? They would have been doing it for the last 17 years.
Fred Jackson: Exactly. They would try to paint the picture that this is another example of how violent Christians are, and so forth. But no, they pretty well covered up that he did it in the name of his religion.
Host: Our story on AFN.net has the headline from the Associated Press, "Trump says Pentagon won't livestream execution of Fort Hood shooter." The word shooter kind of tones it down. He's a mass murderer. That's what he did.
Fred Jackson: He was a mass murderer. He went into a medical facility where soldiers were getting ready to be deployed to Afghanistan, and he decided to shoot them up. That's what he did. It was a terrible thing.
Host: Regarding the decision by the president this morning, it was our secretary of war, Pete Hegseth, who first announced that the execution would take place on December 3rd. Hegseth was asked about this, and he said it would be livestreamed. Almost immediately, the vice president, J.D. Vance, backed away from this. The president also said, when he was asked about it, "We're looking at this."
Host: Another interesting aspect of this is that almost immediately, Roman Catholic officials denounced the idea of livestreaming. They actually opposed capital punishment, and I believe one story early on after the announcement from Pete Hegseth said that one of the Catholic officials was encouraging any soldier who might be asked to be part of the firing squad to ask for a religious exemption from that. So there was that element in all of this.
Host: But I agree with Ray. I think President Trump weighed the politics of this and the scene of something like this being livestreamed and decided it was not good.
Host: I can certainly understand this being an issue where religious exemptions should be allowed, because people's consciences do vary. I have no problem with the death penalty for egregious crimes, as long as there are safeguards in place to make sure that the innocent aren't put to death. But at the same time, I wouldn't have watched the livestream.
Host: I remember when I was a youth pastor many years ago, I found out that some of the young men in my youth group liked to watch a video series called Faces of Death. It was a series where, like news reports, people would inadvertently catch someone being killed on camera. I was frankly shocked and spoke to the local video store. I don't remember whether it was Blockbuster or some other store, but I talked to them about whether they should be renting this to underage teenagers.
Host: Teenage boys do all kinds of wacky, idiotic things, but there was something particularly dark about watching other people die for entertainment. Real-life death. This is a matter of conscience, and I respect people who would want to watch it and those who would not want to watch it for their own personal beliefs. But I'm glad this is not going to be done.
Host: All right, the next story, keeping it with politics. A government banking regulator known as the Office of the Comptroller of the Currency, or OCC, has released a report showing that major U.S. banks, including JPMorgan Chase and Bank of America, denied services or closed accounts for people and businesses linked to sensitive political or social topics.
Host: Targets included a pro-democratic education group, a merchant selling Trump merchandise including MAGA hats, a firearm company, an immigration reform organization, and a pro-life organization. When you look at the report and the news reports that have come out to flesh this out, it would appear that some of these decisions to debank these entities were based on the Southern Poverty Law Center labeling these organizations as hate groups.
Host: Somebody who commented on that yesterday was U.S. Representative Mike Haridopolos, a congressman from Florida. He was on Washington Watch to talk about this report and the fact that the banks wrongly used the SPLC as a source.
Mike Haridopolos: They're just a biased group that has an agenda to undercut the basic values of America, and they finally were exposed. I just recently think that you're doing good work, and others, that their agenda would undercut what really makes this country so unique and special. I'm so glad to see the administration go out, find the facts, and see that this group was clearly undermining what basic banking requirements should be.
Host: Fred, this story, in fact, in our story meeting we agreed to move this up. There are always all kinds of things happening in the world, especially around Ukraine and so forth, but this is a particularly frightening story.
Fred Jackson: We have been covering it. It was more anecdotal over the last several years and during the Biden administration, when we heard about banks doing this to individuals or groups. We have tried to expose for well over a decade, maybe a couple of decades, the Southern Poverty Law Center for its blatant hypocrisy and hostility to all things Jesus and anyone working with the Scriptures in mind as their guide.
Fred Jackson: We worked through our news division and so forth, finding out that they were using the Southern Poverty Law Center's hate map and list of so-called hate organizations when training the military and in all kinds of other situations.
Fred Jackson: The first thing I want to say is kudos to the Trump administration, because if they had not sought to expose this, we may never have known other than through a few stories here and there. But this isn't just anecdotal now. There is a report showing that this was systematic. It takes the vast resources and power of the federal government to persecute those of a different political view.
Fred Jackson: This isn't far off, and I don't think this is hyperbole, from what the communists and the Nazis used to do.
Host: Absolutely. We've heard Democrats saying lately that the Trump administration is weaponizing itself against its political enemies. It almost chokes you to think that they would accuse the Trump administration of weaponizing the Justice Department when you look at what the Biden administration was doing.
Host: There were nine banks in total, folks, and you need to know this: JPMorgan Chase, Bank of America, Citibank, Wells Fargo, U.S. Bank, Capital One, PNC, TD Bank, and BMO Bank. Those were the ones mentioned in this government report.
Fred Jackson: Those are some of the biggest banks in the world.
Host: Yes, big banks here in America. I wanted to give an example. Among the examples in the report is JPMorgan Chase's payment operation, WePay, closing the account of a merchant. What did that merchant do?
Fred Jackson: They sold merchandise promoting President Trump and the Make America Great Again brand, claiming it promoted hate, violence, or racial intolerance.
Host: So they shut the account down?
Fred Jackson: They shut the account down. In other cases, they were watching who was buying MAGA hats.
Host: That may be one of the most absurd parts about this story.
Fred Jackson: Yes. You buy a MAGA hat, you go on the list. They're watching you.
Host: MAGA was a keyword, a search word, that these banks were using. Folks, like you said, this is what communists do. They not only disagree with you if you disagree with them. They say, "We're going to shut you down. We're going to punish you."
Host: When I was reading this story this morning, I was reminded of what Prime Minister Trudeau did to those truckers protesting in Canada. "We're going to freeze your bank account. You can't do this. We're going to put you out of business. We're not going to allow you to withdraw $20 from your bank account."
Host: This is how the left works. The left loves to describe itself as being towers of tolerance. No, you're not. You're not tolerant at all.
Host: This story is out there, and we're getting reaction from various sources. We want to underline over and over again that this is what the Democrats did during the Biden administration. I believe if they get in power again, you're going to see this on steroids.
Host: Ray, I don't want to oversell or overhype this, although it may sound like that's exactly what I want to do when I mention the book of Revelation. Whatever your theological view, it is clear that we have a picture of a tyrannical government that uses, or will use, the power of economic control to coerce people into worshiping the beast.
Host: If you believe that is a futuristic coming reality, we can at least see hints of that through communism or fascism, or in this case, the Democratic Party starting to lean that way. I would feel this strongly if Republicans were doing it. But saying, "If you believe something different, you can't buy or sell," is a terrifying thing to consider.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: Friends, if you want to see where this ends, read Revelation 13. In these days, there is hardly any chapter more important for Christians and conservatives to read and think about.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: Revelation 13 says that in those last terrible days before the coming of Jesus Christ to establish His kingdom, during the tribulation period, the Antichrist is going to say, "You take the mark on your hand or your forehead, or you will not buy and you will not sell."
Dr. Ray Pritchard: What Bank of America, Chase, and these other banks did, these are not just American banks. These are banks with branches and power that stretch around the world. What starts with what we're talking about in this news story ends up in Revelation 13. I don't think you're overhyping it at all.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: The sad and shocking part is not that the left-wing, incredibly liberal Democrats did this, or that the Biden administration did this. The shocking part is that these banks, led by people who ought to know better, went along with it.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: I'm hardly ever surprised when we hear there has been government misconduct. But it is truly sad to think that the banks could be coerced into putting people on a list whose only crime was buying a MAGA hat. It is terrifying to think about. It is totalitarian. It is communistic. It is fascistic, if you want to say it that way. We're not saying that people are communists, but we are saying that this is what communists do.
Host: I just want to give a couple more examples that came from this report from the federal agency yesterday, again dealing with JPMorgan's WePay. In the bank's internal tracking system, employees described the organization as a "right-wing, religious conservative nonprofit with strong anti-LGBTQ rhetoric."
Host: They didn't like them because they spoke out against homosexuality, same-sex marriage, and so forth.
Host: Citibank pressured a payment processor to terminate a religious nonprofit because of its views on same-sex marriage. They were looking at what you believe, folks. As Christians, what you believe, and they were going to punish you. They were going to shut down your bank account because of what you believe about homosexuality, and I'm sure there were those who were targeted because of their views about abortion as well.
Host: AFA may not have fallen victim to this particular movement, although it may have. We have fallen victim to this with at least one credit card processor that refused to do business with us. They had been processing payments so that when people gave to the ministry, they could use a particular credit card, but the processor that handled all credit cards refused to process them. Discover Card also would not do business with us.
Host: This processor did the same thing. It would not process our payments, and it did it without warning. It was just before the end of the year, when it would hurt us the most. This happened probably four or five years ago.
Host: But think about this tactic. That's banking. What if internet providers said, "You're a hate group according to the SPLC, so we're not doing business with you. Find somebody else to take care of your internet"? What if phone providers, Android phones, Apple phones, or carriers said they were not going to sell to you? You could get to the place where even energy companies could say, "You're a hate group. You're an enemy of the people, so we're not going to do business with you."
Host: You get to that point, and it really echoes the things we read in the Bible. That is one of the reasons why AFA has become more involved with shareholder activism. We get a share in a company so we can confront a chief executive officer or the president of an organization face to face and raise the issue with shareholders, many of whom have no idea that the company in which they have money does this kind of thing.
Host: The other thing I want to point out is that all the information we have shared so far on this debanking report is on the Today's Issues Facebook page. In one post, we have a link to the report itself. In another, we have related news stories and a link to the Washington Watch show that had the Mike Haridopolos interview about this very topic.
Host: We are covering this.
Fred Jackson: Yes, we're in the process. After the show today, I've got some calls lined up with various organizations, so stick around.
Host: Because it's breaking news, right?
Fred Jackson: It is.
Host: All right, folks, that's an eye-opener for a Thursday. There are some more things coming up about banks and so on. There are a lot of players in the political and cultural chaos engulfing our country. Which way will America go? Some big players are choosing sides.
Host: We're going to take a short break. When we come back, more of Today's Issues right here on the American Family Radio Network.
Host: Welcome back. I'm sitting in for Tim Wildmon this week. I am joined in the studio by Fred Jackson and Chris Woodward, and from his home in Florida, Dr. Ray Pritchard.
Host: Fred, we were talking about banks before the break. I'm looking here at American Family News' website, AFN.net. There's another story here about banks behaving badly.
Fred Jackson: We mentioned Bank of America as being one of the nine that has been targeted in this government report about treating conservatives unfairly. Just about two days ago, Bank of America was hit with a $1.2 billion fine, not million, a $1.2 billion fine, for allegedly violating anti-money-laundering and sanctions laws.
Fred Jackson: This is what the government said: "When a bank of this size fails to meet its anti-money-laundering and sanctions obligations, the consequences extend far beyond its own walls, exposing the entire U.S. financial system to significant illicit financial risks."
Fred Jackson: In a statement, the Treasury Department said its Financial Crimes Enforcement Network assessed the $1.2 billion penalty for Bank of America's "failure to mitigate and report priority national security risks, including Chinese money-laundering networks and illicit finance along the southwest border."
Fred Jackson: The phrase "Chinese money-laundering networks" is in capital letters. They are actually looking at China, and we shouldn't be surprised by this. China is a bad character. They really are. We could talk about the fact that they're aiding Iran and Russia, and all the bad players in the world, including North Korea. They are friends with all these people.
Fred Jackson: But what Bank of America apparently has been fined for is that they weren't being diligent enough in going after these money-laundering operations from bad characters moving money through the system in order to clean it up. That's why it's called laundering.
Host: Ray, this story on AFN.net also states that Bank of America reached an $11.6 million settlement with the Treasury Department's Office of Foreign Assets Control over apparent violations of numerous sanctions programs. So this isn't just the money laundering. They were doing business with countries that had sanctions against them, including Iran and Russia, as well as narcotics and global terrorism.
Host: It is a bizarre situation where they are apparently doing business with narcotics and global terrorist groups, countries that are hostile to the United States and the free West, while they are looking at American citizens who buy a MAGA hat and shuttering their businesses.
Host: Look, I'm no expert on the law, but I do watch a lot of episodes of Law & Order, so I qualify to make at least this comment. You see it in these dramas, and it always ends up the same way: follow the money. Follow the money, and it will lead you to the bad guys. It will lead you to the truth.
Host: The bad guys have a lot of money. Drug dealers have a boatload of money, really billions of dollars gained through evil activities. You take these two stories together and wonder, what is wrong with the banks?
Host: You don't expect the banks to take part in politics one way or the other. You want the bank to take care of your money. Our money is in one of the banks that has already been mentioned on this program today. All I want from them is to take care of my money and make sure nothing happens to it. If they can make me some money and increase it a little bit, that's enough for a bank to do.
Host: They shouldn't be getting in bed with arms dealers, terrorists, and drug dealers. But the problem is, follow the money, guys. It isn't going to lead to me. The real money is going to lead somewhere else. That's always the temptation.
Host: I'm glad the Trump administration, the Justice Department, Treasury, and whoever else are bringing this to light, because the only way things are going to change is through a little sunlight on these misdeeds behind closed doors.
Fred Jackson: Kudos to the Trump administration for this. I can give you two answers as to what's wrong with banks. From my years of helping AFN cover this, number one, left-leaning people and organizations go to shareholder meetings and issue shareholder resolutions. They are also very good at using social media to raise a stink about what a bank is doing or what it has done, and whom it has held accounts for.
Fred Jackson: The left is very good at all of those things, which is why a number of right-leaning people have said, "We have to get involved here, otherwise they're going to wreak havoc."
Fred Jackson: The other thing, and this is probably an even bigger reason, is that a lot of the asset-holder management companies that basically do the work for Bank of America or JPMorgan Chase, where they have investments and all that other stuff, have for several years been big drivers of DEI, ESG, and CRT.
Fred Jackson: Those people in boardrooms and through phone calls, emails, and other means are a big reason why Bank of America or somebody else does this silly stuff.
Host: One of the things we've talked about here is that at AFA, we've gotten our people into some of those shareholder meetings, and we've seen some amazing results. In this case, the left-leaning people got there first. But our experience shows that when we get the right people in the right place and they speak up at shareholder meetings behind closed doors, we can see things change.
Host: This is a great teaching moment for many, although not all. A lot of our listeners are already active. All the things we're talking about can be changed, or at least balanced and leveled, if Christians simply get involved. If you don't get involved, guess who will? The devil's crowd.
Host: I'm not saying everybody on the opposite end of the political or cultural spectrum from conservatives is of the devil. But I am talking about those who want to shut people down because of their political beliefs, religious beliefs, or groups like ours that stand for Christian values.
Host: To level the playing field, you have to get involved. I want to issue what I call a commercial. If you go to AFA.net, as soon as that website pops up, on the right side it says AFA Insider, and you can subscribe. We usually send just one action alert a week, and we do all the legwork for you.
Host: The one that's up there right now is to tell the WNBA to define eligibility based on biological sex. That is the Women's National Basketball Association. It is very simple. You can take action, send an email, and have your voice heard.
Host: A lot of times these AFA Insider alerts go to corporations, the federal government, or a congressman's or congresswoman's office. We do all the legwork for you. All you have to do is subscribe, and you'll get these opportunities to take action and take a stand.
Host: Don't cede the territory to the people who want to destroy our country and take away our freedoms. One day, if we're not active, we may wake up and find that our bank account has been canceled, wondering what happened and why nobody did something. You and I, everyone here, and everyone in your family, among your friends and church members, can be part of the group that does something.
Host: I have a text message here from Rob West. He wants to book us for Faith and Finance tomorrow. Is that right?
Fred Jackson: Yes.
Host: All right. Next story.
Chris Woodward: This is a very big and serious situation that we're continuing to follow. Do stick with AFN for radio and print coverage on what I'm about to talk about. A group of pastors in the state of Kansas has written a letter to Adam Hamilton.
Chris Woodward: Adam Hamilton is a Methodist pastor. He's also a Democratic candidate for Senate in the state of Kansas. These pastors, including Kyle Lamont, have written an open letter to Adam Hamilton because they went through his sermons and found that he is preaching all kinds of woke ideas. He's pushing things on the campaign trail that they have deemed heresy. They are calling for him to repent of his heresy and also to drop out of the Senate race.
Chris Woodward: Let's begin with audio of Kyle Lamont, a pastor who is part of this effort to try to get Adam Hamilton to repent of his sins and also drop out of the race.
Kyle Lamont: Adam Hamilton is first and foremost an ordained minister of the gospel. As an ordained minister of the gospel, there is an oath, a vow, that pastors hold to: the authority of God's Word. They should stand on the correct side of issues such as sexuality, abortion, and even the inerrancy and exclusivity of Jesus Christ as the way for salvation through faith alone.
Kyle Lamont: Pastor Hamilton rejects these convictions and these oaths. As far as we're aware, Hamilton has not responded to this call for him to repent and step away from the Senate race.
Chris Woodward: Steve Jordan has done a nice job providing us with a little bit of sound from Adam Hamilton. This is an excerpt of something he preached a few years ago, where he took time out of a church service to talk about greenhouse gas emissions and climate change, including meat consumption.
Adam Hamilton: Then there are the carbon dioxide sinks that are to take away the carbon dioxide, things like forests in parts of the world where there is deforestation. We are sometimes raising crops, tilling up the ground, and taking away part of the ground's capacity for absorbing some of the oxygen.
Adam Hamilton: Some of the things that we grow because we like to eat them, like cattle, end up producing more carbon dioxide than other crops we could grow or other forms of food that we could have. In all of these ways, we are creating or adding to the amount of greenhouse gases in our world.
Host: You have preached, and Ray has preached as well, that we should be good stewards of the environment. That's scriptural. But should a church service sound like a climate summit?
Fred Jackson: You asked me that question. Yes, yes, no. That is a legitimate question.
Host: Fred, the Gospel of Mark clearly lays out a plan to reduce greenhouse gases.
Fred Jackson: No, no, it doesn't.
Host: I know that's in Hezekiah. First Hezekiah.
Host: Pastors will sometimes go outside the lines a little bit and talk about different issues. You might want to talk about crime or something. But in my opinion, when you go outside the box to talk about cultural or political issues, you should at least tie them to something in the Bible.
Host: Greenhouse gases, first of all, are a load of baloney in terms of what they have predicted is happening or going to happen to the world. But I don't know where you would tie this into Scripture. You can extrapolate a little bit and talk about what we might do to Nidal Hasan, but you have to have some sort of principle in Scripture to build on. That's my opinion. What's yours?
Dr. Ray Pritchard: You're absolutely right. When we think of churches, pastors, and sermons, the sermon ought to be based on a portion of Scripture for that day that God has laid on the heart of the pastor.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: I find it very difficult to believe that this pastor, whose church is the largest Methodist church in the country, would make this the focus. This isn't a small corner church. I also want to point out that he is running as a Democrat against the incumbent, Senator Roger Marshall.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: He is running for a party that fully advocates for the killing of unborn babies. Can you defend that from Scripture, sir? He is running for a party that is all in on boys going into girls' bathrooms and boys playing on girls' teams. Can you find me in Scripture where a boy transitions to a girl? Can you find that for me? And there are so many other things, including same-sex marriage. You have to write down the list and go down it. So I'm troubled by this.
Host: I am glad that this group of pastors has written a letter. I don't think they expected him to step away from this.
Fred Jackson: They didn't.
Host: But they are putting their concerns on record to this gentleman. I think this Senate race is fairly close. It could go either way. It's one of those toss-ups they're talking about. This is really going to be a test for the people of Kansas, and we have a lot of Kansas listeners. Are you okay with this and what he believes?
Host: You've got a big decision there in Kansas. This is quite the opposite of the current senator in terms of where this pastor stands on the issues. The people of Kansas are not going to be able to say, "I didn't know he believed that." He's out there with what he believes and what his priorities are. I think the differences are very distinct.
Host: Ray, as we mentioned, we're coming back to you. You are a former pastor, but you're still a minister and a preacher and teacher of God's Word. A tip of the hat to these pastors for the reasons we just stated. They're not sitting quietly on this. They're not saying, "Just let this United Methodist Church go." By the way, it has gone completely off the rails, and John Wesley would be rolling over in his grave about what the UMC has become.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: This is the pastor of the largest Methodist church in the country, and at least these pastors are standing up and saying that what this man believes and teaches is not scriptural or biblical. We're not going to sit by and do nothing.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: I agree with Fred. I don't think this group of pastors thinks this pastor is going to repent of his views, step down, and leave the race. But at the same time, they're not going to let him try to take the high ground and say, "As a pastor, I think the Democratic Party is the way to go." These pastors are speaking out and helping the voters of Kansas come to grips with what this man actually believes.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: Two or three things about all of this. Number one, as someone who until recently lived in Kansas, I have to say I'm not surprised that it is a close race. Roger Marshall has been a fine senator for Kansas, but he's not flamboyant or extravagant. He's simply a faithful man serving in the Senate, and he's done a really good job.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: On the other hand, Adam Hamilton is liberal, but he knows how to speak language that evangelicals could understand. He's way to the left, but he is well spoken. He's what I would expect a pastoral candidate to be. He's a good communicator and knows how to get in touch with people's feelings and problems in life, as pastors should be able to do. So I'm not surprised that the race is close.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: I think Kansas is still conservative enough, outside of Kansas City itself, that Roger Marshall is going to get reelected. But it will be closer than most people thought.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: I also want to make a comment about this pastoral letter. It is worth reading and very well done. If a pastor is going to put out a letter like this, he has to couch it in a way that it comes from his calling as a minister of the gospel. That's what this pastor did, the Wichita pastor who wrote the public letter to Adam Hamilton.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: When you read the letter online, you see the list of signatories underneath it. There are at least 179 Kansas pastors who have signed on, and then there are hundreds of laypeople who have signed on. I looked and saw that one of the Bible study leaders from the church we attended back in Kansas had signed the letter.
Dr. Ray Pritchard: I say all that to say this: if you want to know how pastors can approach a situation like this, this is the way to do it. It is perfectly biblical for pastors to join together and call their people to stand up for biblical, righteous, noble, God-honoring values. So kudos to the pastor and to the others who have signed on.
Chris Woodward: A couple of days ago on this very program, we were talking about the ongoing efforts by Dr. Willie Rice, the president of the Southern Baptist Convention, for pastors to be more involved and more vocal about these kinds of issues and politics, and to encourage their congregants to register and vote.
Chris Woodward: Check out AFN.net for that story, because we're still getting reaction to it. The other thing I would highly recommend is that, in addition to listening to this program and other great things on AFR, like Exploring the Word, we believers all need to get into the Word of God and study Scripture. That way we can know if the person behind the pulpit is preaching a bunch of gobbledygook.
Chris Woodward: You're not going to realize that James Talarico is twisting things out of context if you don't know what the verse says. Second Timothy 3:16 tells us that all Scripture is given to us for reasons including instruction and correction.
Chris Woodward: The King James Version of that verse might say "the man of God," but that is not just talking about your male pastor. That verse applies to everybody. We all need to be in the Word so that we can know whether what a person is preaching is wrong.
Host: Let me ask you quickly in terms of logistics. Ray has recommended that people read the letter. Is that going to be up on AFN, or how will people get access to it if they want to read it?
Chris Woodward: We are in the process of putting that story together for the website. But I can tell you right now, if you'll go to the Today's Issues Facebook page, there is a link to an article from our friends at The Washington Stand, which is the Family Research Council's news outlet.
Chris Woodward: The headline is "Kansas Pastors Urge Adam Hamilton to Repent of Unbiblical Teachings and Withdraw from Senate Race." Click on that, and inside the article, in the very first paragraph, the second sentence, there is a link to the letter. It says that in an open letter, Kansas pastor Kyle Lamont called for the pastor to repent. We will have a link to it when we get our story up.
Host: Fred, let me ask you this, and then we can move from this story, although we've got a break coming up. It seems to me that, maybe slowly, the body of Christ seems to be waking up to its danger.
Host: This started under COVID, when Christian parents began finding out what their kids were being taught in schools. It also happened during the Biden administration, as Christians started waking up to transgender ideology and the borders being flung wide open. I think those two issues especially helped get President Trump elected.
Host: Now we see things like this happening with Talarico and Hamilton. Do you think pastors are waking up to the danger even more?
Fred Jackson: I believe it. Chris just referenced the president of the Southern Baptist Convention coming out and saying that pastors have to get involved. We've got to stop this separation where people say, "That's a political issue. This is a spiritual issue."
Fred Jackson: More and more pastors and Christians are understanding that the politicians over there are threatening what I believe, threatening biblical values, and threatening the freedom I have to express those biblical values. I think they are waking up and starting to be more bold.
Host: From woke to waking up, folks. We'll be right back.
Ed Vitagliano, filling in for Tim Wildmon, joins Fred Jackson, Chris Woodward, and Dr. Ray Prichard to discuss an Office of the Comptroller of the Currency report alleging that major banks denied services or closed accounts connected to conservative, pro-life, religious, and political organizations. The panel examines the role of the Southern Poverty Law Center and the implications for religious liberty and free expression.
The program also considers President Trump's decision to cancel plans to livestream the execution of Fort Hood shooter Nidal Hasan, including biblical views on capital punishment and concerns about publicly broadcasting an execution.
The discussion continues with Bank of America's $1.2 billion penalty related to alleged anti-money-laundering and sanctions violations. The hosts also review Kansas pastors' call for Democratic Senate candidate and Methodist pastor Adam Hamilton to repent of teachings they describe as unbiblical and withdraw from the race against Senator Roger Marshall.
Live
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