Sponsor Spotlight: Preborn's Mission to Save Babies and Support Moms Through Ultrasounds
Dr. Jessica Peck: We would like to take a moment to thank our sponsor, PreBorn. When a mother meets her baby on ultrasound and hears their heartbeat, it's a divine connection. And the majority of the time she will choose life. But they can't do it without our help. Preborn needs us, the pro life community, to come alongside them. One ultrasound is just $28. To donate, dial pound 250 and say the keyword baby or visit preborn.com/AFR what if one moment could change a life forever? Every day, mothers facing unplanned pregnancies walk into PreBorn Network clinics searching for hope. Through a free ultrasound, they meet their baby for the very first time. And when they see that tiny life and hear that heartbeat, everything can change.
Dan Steiner: Hey friend. Dan Steiner, president at PreBorn here with a heartfelt thank you. Because you know what? This year so far, your partnership with PreBorn has saved over 50,000 babies and moms from abortion. And it wouldn't have happened without you. We what you are doing together with PreBorn is truly changing generations. Every tax deductible dollar that you give is used to rescue babies lives and lead moms to Jesus Christ. So far this year alone, We've seen over 8,000 women give their hearts to Christ. All because you helped with an ultrasound scan for $28 or a machine for $15,000. So thank you. Your caring help saves lives both for earth and and for eternity. God bless you.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Right now, more mothers are waiting for that life changing moment. $28 helps to provide one life saving ultrasound. $140 helps rescue five babies. To donate to help pound 250 and say the keyword baby. That's pound 250 baby or visit preborn.com/AFR that's preborn.com/AFR every gift is tax- deductible. Hello and welcome to the doctor Nursemama show prescribing Hope for healthy Families here on American Family Radio. And here's your host, professor, pediatric nurse practitioner and mom of four, Dr. Jessica Peck.
Navigating Youth Sports: Understanding the Pressures and Pitfalls for Christian Families
Dr. Jessica Peck: Well, hey there friends and welcome. Welcome to my favorite time of day, getting to spend time with you, prescribing Hope for healthy families. And hey, I've got something really great for you today. If you have been listening recently, you might have heard my conversation with Brian Smith and Ed Uszynski They're authors of Away Game, a Christian Parents Guide to Navigating Youth Sports. And at the end of that conversation, I told them I felt like it was dot, dot, dot, to be continued. And we are in fact delivering on that Today and continuing our conversation. I know there are so many of you who have kids who are involved in sports. There are a lot of you who are grandparents out there who are dragging your lawn chairs out to watch the sports and be there and ring the cowbells and all the things, and sports can be such a good thing. But there are also some pitfalls in there. And we're going to talk about that some more. And when we talk today, I want to talk to families. You are really in it. Like, you're saying, okay, hey, yeah, I know that there are some. Some dangers, some things we need to watch out for. There are some risks that come along with the pressured environment, the hyper professionalization of sports, all of those things. But, hey, we're in it. Our kids enjoy it. We love it. Our kids are good at it. We've got a game plan. nope. Well, pun intended. That's who we're talking to. Those families who are traveling on the weekends.
Sports as a Spiritual Formation Tool: Balancing Competition, Play, and Christian Values
If you've invested financially or you're looking at camps and coaches and rank and auditions and scholarships and calendars, sometimes it feels like your second job. And this isn't just really applicable to sports. It can be anything competitive in your child's life. When we're looking at things like academics or music or anything that is competitive, because the tension is, what if we really, really love it? And yet we feel like, you know, a little bit of a, shame about that, almost like, okay, like, it's not like I feel like I have to explain it. Like, okay, we love it, but, you know, here's how it's good. You kind of feel that need to explain it. But there's some of you out there whose child is really gifted or who's just naturally competitive or they really do have a shot at playing in college or playing even in the pros, even though we know those statistics are really, really small, there are some who are doing there, and some. Some of you are just saying, hey, this is providing us really good community. It's teaching my kid discipline. We've got friendships. They have developed some confidence. And so the question is, how do we participate wholeheartedly without allowing what can be a good gift to become a God? And so we are looking. That's why I wanted to talk to Brian and Ed some more, because they make the argument that sports can be a good gift from God and a powerful context for spiritual formation. And their work really challenges families to move beyond just asking what. Whether our kids are winning and ask what kind of people they are becoming. Through the experience. Where's that thread of discipleship? And when we look at the landscape of childhood, we see a lot of things that kids used to do for fun, and now we have professional systems that are built around them. And those systems are primarily designed to make money. We see kids who used to play base basketball in the neighborhood or baseball in the neighborhood. Now there's travel teams. And we see all of those things, like just becoming really commercial, commercialized, professionalized, specialized. And something precious can get lost along the way. One of the things I want to emphasize in today's show is really remembering how important it is for kids to have fun and to play, because play is way different than performance, and that is something important for us to remember. And how do we. So how do we redeem this competition we're already in? How do we make the most of it? If you'll remember, I, introduced to you Brian and Ed last time. But as a quick, quick recap, Brian founded the Christian Athlete. He is one of the authors of this book, Away Game, A, Christian Parents Guide to Navigating Youth Sports. He has a master's degree in theology and sports studies from Baylor University. And Ed has a PhD from Bowling Greene State University. More than three decades of experience discipling college and professional athletes. And both of them have kids who are in sports. They played sports growing up, and in college, so they understand this so much. Brian and Ed, I'm so glad to. To have you back here. Thank you so much for agreeing to join us again to continue the conversation.
Brian Smith: Absolutely. I feel like we could talk about this all day. So excited, excited. You brought us back for round two, for sure. Yep.
Ed Uszynski: Well, and the intro just makes me want to ask you more questions. Actually, that's such a good intro again, where I'm just like, all right, you get it. And you're, you know, you're hearing the stories all the time. You're living them at home with your own kids and family, so. So it's always fun to talk to someone like you.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Well, Ed, I see that you got my payment from my team to, you know, hype me up here, but I do see this. I see this as a pediatric nurse practitioner. I see this as a mom. And really, it's changed in the way that I've seen it over the last 30 years when I see the level of pressure that comes through, even on something as simple as a sports physical or somebody who comes in who has a sports injury, and there's so much pressure to get back, and it's almost like I have families who are standing there saying, wait, you don't understand. Like we're really invested. I'm going to need you to get out the magic wand here. Like that whole rest ice thing. No, we would like an instant cure and then I can't provide that. But let's start really at the beginning. Brian, you have written and I know both of you have, but Brian, you've written about how youth sports have become increasingly professionalized. We talked about that last time. What is, what do we lose when something that was once really just for fun, honestly is now so highly structured, Expensive, expensive, year round, performance driven. What do we, how, what do we lose? And how can we still try to hold on to or reclaim that?
Brian Smith: Yeah, great, great question to lead off and I would say too, even as a backdrop, before I get to this, when, when we say, and when we just collectively use the term professionalization around the category of youth sports, we're not saying we should not try to win. We're not saying we should not try to give our, our very best. I heard somebody once say that sports only care. Like I really think there's some truth to that. There's, there's beauty when you bring your best to the space of athletics and there's beauty when you are doing what you can appropriately within the rules to try to win a game. And when, when two teams or two individuals are doing that. It can make, it can make for a beautiful product. If we can use that language to see people striving to be their best. What we mean by professionalization is really what you laid out in the beginning. It's the, it's the fall ball that turns into the winter training, that turns into spring ball, that turns into hiring strength coaches in the summer and really building an entire system around trying to maximize every little bit of a kid before their body has reached full maturity. trying to maximize their skill set before maybe they've even developed a body capable of handling a skill set like that in an entire system like that. And yeah, what do we miss? I think the biggest thing we miss as parents and as kids is just the, the enjoyment of sport. That when sport is when it means something beyond the win, it means something beyond the game itself. We put a tremendous, tremendous amount of pressure on not just ourselves, but our kids. That what's happening here makes a really big difference for the next three years of your life. And we lose the ability to just be in the moment, maybe to put our phones down and say it's really Cool that I get to watch my kid play a game right now. And yes, they're going to struggle and they're going to, we're going to see some, some wins but there, there's a lot of joy that comes from just sitting in the stands and watching your kid play. And unfortunately we just live in a culture right now where we're missing more and more of the ability to do that. And that doesn't mean we have to be really a slave to the culture, but we have to do some work if we really want to sit and enjoy it. Because everything else in the youth sport industrial complex is telling us that's actually not good parenting if you're just sitting, watching and smiling.
Ed Uszynski: And that's because. Brian let me, let me take it here because I was literally just thinking that one of the after effects of the professionalization of it, the industry nature, it becoming a complex. The way we talk about is that we start to, as parents start to take on the identity of agent, we start to operate like our eight year old sports agents. And it, as silly as that sounds, if you really think about it, we do what agents do, we start to think about their future, we think about how to maximize this next season. We think about how to make sure, like Brian said, they're getting what they need in order to be able to move up the ladder. We've got 10 years into the future in mind when we're making our decisions. Today we're negotiating with coaches and which club we're going to be a part of and why. and as we, what Brian just said, I need to keep working myself back to a place where I'm thinking more intentionally about what it means to be a parent in this moment and not a sports agent. How do I be present like Brian just talked about? You know what, in fact, if I'm going to take on a different identity than parent, what we're arguing amongst the Christian audience is I need to take on the identity of a discipler, a chaplain, somebody who's actually looking at those areas of my kid's life that probably the coaches and the other parents and the agents that are actually out there are not paying attention to because nobody else is going to do that. And that's sort of a God given expectation that I would do it. I'll be held accountable for that in some way. Not for making sure I get them on the best team, but making sure that I show them how to walk with Jesus on this one.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Well, Ed and Brian, you both brought up Some that's really compelling thinking about parents acting as agents because you can go to any game and you can see that happening. And it's hard because most of the time it comes from a place that's well intentioned. We want to help our kids succeed. We want them to achieve their dreams. But not too long ago I was at my son's sports game and I noticed the camera set up that parents had on the sideline and I'm talking that was professional. And I thought how much that had changed because you're taking the film for two reasons. One is to hyper analyze every, every single movement, you know, to watch the film, for technique. The other is to package it for social media for college scouts and things like that. What do we lose ed, you know, in the, and the joy of the game. And being a parent when we're trying to manage that professional aspect of it, that's really uncomfortable to say, but it is a reality.
Ed Uszynski: Yeah, I feel like Brian already said it. I'll say it again. You just miss out on being present to just watch, just watch the game. I felt that sometimes, even when I'm trying to record something and have suddenly become really aware of it for our other friends that try to record everything, it's like when I'm recording, I don't actually really get to see it. There's like a separation between me as the videographer who's trying to capture it and keep them in the middle or whatever, depending on what the sport is and really just being able to be able to just sit back and watch it unfold and watch the other athletes around my kid and, and just take it in. Instead of trying to package it and trying to prepare it for a promotional, script or a promotional clip, I just missed out on the moment. So what ends up happening is you don't even realize it in the moment, but you get to the end of a year if you're paying any attention and realize you didn't really watch them
Brian Smith: play,
Ed Uszynski: you didn't watch them play. I was too busy constantly trying to package it. I was always thinking about the next thing. I was always frustrated about what that meant, whatever that was right there for tomorrow. And I end up missing out on today. And I did that, I did that a lot with our first. And that's why I'm so aware of it, because I know what that feels like. And like you said, Dr. Peck completely, good intentions and my, my kids best interest in mine. Some of mine are mixed in too. But I absolutely want the best for my kid and I end up missing the whole experience.
Brian Smith: And can I say this too?
Ed Uszynski: Yeah, go ahead, Brian.
Brian Smith: just to show that there's complexity in this and we're not just trying to, to give simple solutions or even simple principles that over, like, apply to everything. There's for sure instances out there where you have kids in high school who, who need to have things filmed and recorded and need to have highlight tapes put together and sent to college coaches if they want to play in college. So we're not saying don't do that. We're just saying we need to be careful of applying a model like that to kids who are 8, 9, 10, 11, 12. Like, it's not a light switch on and off, it's maybe a dimmer switch that it's okay to turn that up as they get older and it matters a little bit more. We're just saying let's, let's be careful about applying that type of, again, professionalization recruiting model to kids who are not going to get recruited as 8 year olds.
Ed Uszynski: Yeah. And it's just, I'm, hold you
Dr. Jessica Peck: right there because we're already at our first break, see, like you said, and we could talk about this all day. And I think sometimes it's about just remembering, like, okay, I need to take off this agent hat for a minute and I need to put on my mom hat, my dad hat, my parent hat, and I need to be a parent in this moment, even though sometimes you're managing both of those roles. And when we come back and I'll let you finish your thought and Brian, you have a degree in theology and sports studies, and I want to talk about some of the theological implications here. Like, if we have a God who, who delights and play and beauty and creativity, what do we learn from that and seeing it in sports? We'll be right back. Don't go away.
Without you, this podcast would not exist
Hello, I'm Jessica peck, host of Dr. Nurse Mama. did you know that this content is listener supported? Without people like you, this podcast would not exist. And that's why we need you. A generous monthly gift of any amount will help sustain American Family Radio and specifically this podcast. And please consider becoming a monthly financial partner today by visiting afr.net/give that's afr.net/give
Rise Up (Lazarus) by CAIN: In the dark and all alone growing comfortable Are you too scared to move and walk out of this tomb? There is buried underneath the lies that you believed safe and sound stuck in the ground too lost to be found. You're just asleep and it's time to leave Come on and rise up Take a breath, you're alive now can't you hear the voice of Jesus calling us out from the grave like Lazarus? Your brand new power m that couldn't hold you can't you hear the voice of Jesus calling us out from the grave like Lazarus Rise up, rise up
Dr. Jessica Peck: out from the bank like la M welcome back, friends. That is rise up By Lazarus, by Cain. And what I'm calling you today to do is to rise up you sports families and let's talk about sports. I'm talking today, having my second conversation with Brian Smith and Ed Uszynski They are authors of the book Away Game A Christian Parents Guide to Navigating Youth Sports. We had a first conversation. If you missed it, go back and catch it. We talked about the professionalization of youth sports and some of the, the great things that can happen with that, the opportunities that are there, but also the pitfalls when we're raising kids with a Christian worldview and some of the things that can really detract us from the people that we want our kids to be. And we're right in the middle of talking about the importance of play and the theology of sports because a lot of times what we ask our, our kids when they finish a game is, hey, you know, how did you do? How did you feel about that? Not what did you enjoy most about that? What did we say? The coach notice you? Did this coach say anything to you? We want to know all of those things. And sometimes we wear that agent hat is what we were talking about. And we forget to take that off and also be a parent. And the goal is not. I'm, we are not saying, oh, make your kids less competitive. Sports are bad, none of that at all. We're really just talking about how to leverage sports to reveal the heart, to disciple, to make sure we're strengthening our families. And Ed, I told you I would come right back to you and let you finish your thought because we were right in the middle of a conversation. Radio was so rude sometimes. So I'll let you finish your thought. And then, Brian, I got a question for you about sports theology.
Ed Uszynski: Thank you. Well, we were talking about recording our kids when they're competing. And, Brian said that, you know, there, there is a point in time where actually that, that may be really needed, especially when they're older, their sophomore, junior, senior year of high school, where they actually do have a chance to play at another level. And so you do want to have something recorded. I would say, though, even if you want to record them younger, see if you can get a friend to record them while they're running or swimming in the lane or again, whatever. The sports are all different. But so that I can be present to watch and I can get someone else, would you please just record this at bat for me? most of the time, the parent's not watching their kid at bat. They're not going to watch your kid at bat the same way they're watching their kid at bat. So I think they would be okay with recording it for you. So you can just watch it. They got to train them to make sure they get it right. You don't want a bad recording.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Be honest.
Ed Uszynski: But again, that's all we're saying is so that you can be present and not be, the videographer. Another thing, just real quick that I think we do need to think about, and Brian and I have posted different things when our kids have done things online, but I'm even really hesitant to do that because I think it creates another layer of pressure for our kids when they know that we are constantly looking for ways to put them up on our social media feed. And again, why do we do that? Because we're proud of them. We want to show off when our kids doing something. Well, I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with that, but there are some negative consequences that maybe we don't think about for our kids when we do that all the time. As I, as I see some people do is constantly coming into my feed. Every time their kid is playing, I'm getting a clip of them. And I just think, what is this doing to him or her when they know that it's worth thinking about.
Dr. Jessica Peck: It absolutely is. And again, we talked even before we started the show, guys, that some of this is just the messy middle. Some of this is just, hey, this is hard. We're figuring this out together. But I think there's value in having honest conversations about it and some accountability, with people who share the same worldview to when. When are we crossing the line? When are our priorities, you know, getting misaligned? And how can we not become, you know, bl. Sometimes we just miss what we're doing. And. And Brian, I want to go back to some of the theological underpinnings. It's fascinating to me that you have a degree in theology and sports studies, but let's go back to some of the theological underpinnings here. Help us go back to basics. Some of those basic spiritual principles.
Brian Smith: Yeah. So let's
Let's talk briefly about a theology of play
let's talk briefly about a theology of, of play. Maybe we can start there. And so to do that, we, we've talked a lot about professionalization and kind of built a soft framework definition around that. To play is really to creatively enjoy something for its own intrinsic good. There's a pastor out of lnla, his name is Jeremy Treat, and that's how he defines play is just to enjoy something, for its own intrinsic good, which when there's intrinsic goodness in something, that means it doesn't need to serve any other purpose beyond just what it does. And so I think I first realized that, when my kids were young, just watching them play in the yard and realizing, like, there's goodness in what they're doing, not because they're learning how to throw a ball with their right hand or, not because they're learning teamwork, not because they're doing anything beyond just playing. And so I think a theology of play starts there. That God, it's this idea that God created us to play. And when we are moving our bodies and creating games and even competing with and against each other, this belief that God, God smiles upon that in the same way a, father or mother smiles upon their kids playing in the backyard. So I think it starts there. my theology of play, was influenced too by German theologian. His name is, if I can get this right, Jurgen Moltman. And Moltman was a former Nazi soldier. He was captured, he was a prisoner of war, he was given a Bible in one of those camps and became a Christian. And from there just like learned to study the Bible, became a theologian. And he was asked one time, with all of the wars going on in the world, is it okay for Christians to, especially on the other side of the world, is it okay for Christians to play and essentially be involved in games when there's just crazy war, going on the other side of the world? And this is how he responded. I'm going to read this quote. He said, yes, in playing we anticipate the eternal kingdom of God where there will be no war. Sin will not corrupt the goodness of which we are to the light. And our longing for freedom and childlike joy will be satisfied. Play foreshadows the joy of the kingdom where Christ will reign over all, and decay and disease and death will be no more. Play is not merely a glimpse of the future, it's an in breaking of the future. And that last line has always stuck with me, that play is an in breaking of the future. That when we, when we play. A good theology and understanding of play is we really do get a glimpse of what life could be like on the new earth when there's no sin and death, and bad referees and all the stuff that go along with the brokenness of sport today.
Dr. Jessica Peck: And you had to throw the referees under the bus. It is just. I feel so bad for. The nurse in me is always like, oh, the poor. Most of the time, you know, sometimes I'm not feeling so bad for them. But, Brian, you know, let's break this down to the practical. I love that, that thought, that analogy there, because sometimes we think of it either as wasted time or it's just, you know, we see it as this driven time. But just to see it, that theological underpinning, I think that's a really good perspective shift for us to help keep things aligned. Like, is this. Is our engaging in this play? Is it helping us to foresee the kingdom, the coming of the kingdom of God?
Brian Smith: That.
Dr. Jessica Peck: That's a beautiful picture. And one of the things that's really hard for us to do is to let our kids struggle in that, you know, because when they engage in competitive play, there is struggle that happens there. They may struggle with self confidence. They may struggle with overconfidence. You know, they may struggle with a physical skill, they may struggle with a coach. They may struggle socially. There's all kinds of struggles that can happen. And as you turn up the level of competition, that potential for struggle increases. One of the things you talked about in your book is the concept of the parent as the spotter. We've already talked about parent as agent, but what does that look like in real life? And thinking of those theological underpinnings, how do we stay close enough to, you know, protect our kids, to support them, but also allowing them to struggle and seeing some of that as reflection of earthly struggle before Christ comes and makes all things new.
Brian Smith: Yeah. So for me, my tendency when I go to watch my kids play a game, like the. The earthly tendency in me is I'm. I'm showing up either as an agent or as a fan. And so for me to do what you just mentioned, to be a. To be a spotter, to show up almost as a. Have a chaplaincy mindset instead of an agent or a fan mindset. I need to. I need to coach myself in the car before I. Before I actually get in the stands or the sidelines. And so I need this gentle reminder to my own heart and have this time with God, even If it's like 30 seconds. I need to say, God, would you help me to just enjoy watching my kid play today? God, would you help me to notice things that you want me to notice that maybe you're doing, in their life? And God, would you help me to be okay with letting them struggle? And I'm not going to be somebody who prays for a loss or prays for bad referees, but I know as a human that's part of the athletic experience. And so I think for me to get in that mindset, it really means tackling it on the front end. Because if I don't do that, I show up at the game and I'm bringing 30 years of sport being discipled by sport junk to the game. And I just know my own tendency is to respond in ways that, ugh, an hour after the game I'm going to regret. Maybe 20 years after the game I'll regret. So to answer all that, it takes front end work and it's really just a short time with the Lord to invite him into that process with me
Ed Uszynski: so that we can represent, we have wisdom to know whether what this moment needs is grace. Or does the moment need truth?
Brian Smith: It's good.
Ed Uszynski: Does it need a, firm confrontation for one reason or another? Or does it just need the loving father whose arms are thrown open wide at the end of the prodigal son who comes home? And that's always a challenge, isn't it? That's why I love what Brian just said. It's like I am doing spiritual formation inside myself before I go and try to do anything with my kids. And sometimes we mess that up. And so that's why again, and the opportunity to ask for forgiveness, to apologize is this safety net that's created for us as Christians that says you can get a lot of do overs, man. you gotta ask for them. You have to humble yourself and ask for them. But what I'm looking for is, Lord, give me eyes to see whether this moment as a spotter needs grace or needs truth. And it's gonna look different all the time. And maybe one kid needs more of one than the other. And you know, that's the other complication is you think you figure it out for one kid in one sport and then it's a completely different experience for another kid in a completely different sport.
Dr. Jessica Peck: You know, you guys have just given me such a clear, you, just give me such a clear idea though, this idea of being agent or fan. You just said that, Brian. That's really compelling to me because as an agent, we're going to lean towards hyper critical and just kind of hyper advocate, you know, make sure our kids are getting the best, best spot on the team. You know, getting the right playing time, like getting the right coach, the right video, all of that kind of stuff.
But the fan is like, hyper protective
But the fan is like, hyper protective. Like, my kid can do no wrong. Like the refs. Like, this is where, you know, I'm just going to be hyper protective. But being the spotter in the middle, Ed, you've. You've started to kind of pull that out and say that's a different perspective. How should that inform our attitude towards our kids? Struggle when they are, you know, just struggling in the sport for whatever reason, whether that's emotionally, physically, psychologically, whatever it is. How do we pull that out some more? I want to hear more.
Ed Uszynski: Well, it is that same kind of continuum like we just did with grace and truth. Some of us maybe will lean in the direction of minimizing their disappointment or just trying to, like, wipe it away. We're uncomfortable with it, so we just want to say, get over it and let's move on and there's a different day tomorrow and kind of become a hype man who, who doesn't allow them to feel it. Or some of us, maybe we're going to rescue them from it in some other way. We're just going to deny it entirely. It's just not even going to be a category for us to feel pain. And again, I think the journey is to learn to be honest when something hurts and, empathize with that healthily. Empathize with. That's disappointing. That stinks that you miss the, free kick. It just does. It hurts and. Or that you didn't get to play today the way that you thought you were going to. I know the coach said they were going to do it. And sometimes that's just the way it goes. The other thing we can end up doing is putting blame, looking for ways to blame everybody else to try to make our kid feel better. I know Brian likes talking about different stories from his own journey doing that. And it's like, no, let's just stay here in this horrible feeling for a minute together, because this is what life is. So let's grow accustomed again. Like Brian said, we're not going to go look for it. There will be enough that comes to us on its own. And so let's not lose, let's not waste. I think Jon Piper had a book called don't waste your cancer when you're in a hard time, sit in it, feel it, and then look for what, maybe, what does God want to do with us in this? Like, bring, bring that perspective. It's not. What happens today is not the end. Bad stuff happens all the time. Like, we need to teach our kids this. Bad stuff happens all the time. And the strongest people in the world grow from it. They become different, they become better. They don't become bitter, they become better. so then you can bring that kind of perspective and say, we're going to get another shot at this. Let's be ready for it next time, or what do we need to do different so that the next time this situation arises, you'll have a different experience. But how do we do both of those? Feel it, stay in it, and then bring perspective that says this is just to set us up for a different future and it's okay.
Dr. Jessica Peck: That's so good. I mean, I love that, Ed. And then there's also another to add another layer of complexity onto this.
There are times as parents we need to recognize that the struggle is unhealthy
There are times when, as parents, we need to recognize that the struggle is unhealthy, that there is a toxic environment. Whether that's a toxic coach or a toxic team or just something that, okay, this is actually not forming character in my child. It is, it is destroying their self esteem and their morale. How do we figure out the line between that when we come back? I'm going to start with that with you, Brian. You can just, you know, solve world peace and apply for your Nobel Peace Prize while you're at it. But those are some of the, the things that we think about. And instead of immediately trying to solve your kid's problem when they're in competition, think, think.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Okay?
Dr. Jessica Peck: Ask them questions. That's so important to do. What do you think you can control here? What does perseverance look like right now? What did you learn about yourself? What do you think God is teaching you in this season? And what support do you need from me right now? Do you need me to listen, to encourage, to advise, to be quiet, to step back? What do you need? We'll have so much more with Brian Smith and Ed Uszynski on away game when we come back.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Back.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Don't go away.
Peter Rosenberger: While in the emergency room with my wife, as she was struggling with the Cove 19 virus herself. And I looked at her, I said, are you scared? And she said, a little bit, but I've been through worse.
The certainty of mankind's history with uncertainty by Peter Rosenberger
The certainty of mankind's history with uncertainty. An article by Peter Rosenberger.
Peter Rosenberger: And then as her fever was approaching almost 103, she started singing in Christ Alone I placed my trust and find my glory in the power of the cross. And that's how she has anchored herself in the certainty of Christ, through her huge medical journey that has included 80 surgeries, both of her legs amputated, 100 doctors have treated 12 hospitals, and now the COVID 19 virus. And so when we live with those kinds of uncertainties, anchoring ourselves in Christ, in Christ alone, that's the only place we can run to where there is certainty. To read this article and more, visit afa.net/thestand need the lights, don't need the stages.
Just Jesus by David Leonard: All I really, really want is you. Silence, noise, straight to the sacred. All I really really want is you in your right place. You and I are face to face you on the throne, on my heart and all my words, all my. Take.
Dr. Jessica Peck: M welcome back friends. That is just Jesus by David Leonard and if you caught that first line of that song said, I don't need the lights, I don't need the stages. That can be an easy thing to say on Sunday morning, but when you're under the Friday night lights, especially if you live in Texas like I do, that can be a harder thing to say. I'm right in the middle of my second conversation with Brian Smith and Ed Uszynski They are longtime sports ministry leaders. They're the authors of a book called Away Game A Christian Parents Guide to Navigating Youth Sports. If you have kids in sports, I highly, highly recommend that you get a copy of this book because sports can be such a great thing and it can also be a thing that is a destructive force. I know. And that can be true with anything that. I really love sports. I think they have a good and rightful place in a family's life. And I also think it can be something that is really difficult, that can be a pitfall in your life. And we're right in the middle of talking about that. And Ed, let's, let's come back to you and let's continue talking about what I was asking right before the break is where's the line between like, okay, this is hard. This is formative. I'm gonna let my kids struggle. Their character will be better for it to, okay, this is unhealthy and I need to intervene because sometimes that can be hard. As a Christian parent too, you can think, okay, I know that this isn't the greatest situation, but if we pull out of this, like, oh, what is that going to mean for my kid's future? And do we just suck it up and stay anyway. What do parents do to look at that and navigate that with, wisdom?
Ed Uszynski: Yeah. Again, such a great question. I don't think there's a one size fits all answer. So I'm going to put that disclaimer out right out front and I will say again, it's so funny that we're talking about this right now because I just told Brian the other day that I feel like we waited too long to intervene with my college sport playing son in the situation he was in that ended up being very detrimental for him and set him up, to make a lot of bad choices. And it was just not a good environment from the beginning. But I think we continue to encourage him to grind it out. When all the signs were saying, it's not going to change, this is not going to get any healthier. Why does he need to keep grinding, grinding it out in this setting? And again, we could talk for a whole hour just about that. I've got my own issues with that because that's how I'm wired. You always just keep grinding it out. I don't think that's always the right answer. So when my kid no longer is enjoying being there and is saying it, not just, you know, it's one thing to say that for one practice on one day, it's one thing to have a bad week. Like, I, know we need to come back the next week and try again. But when it's week after week and it's game after game and it's practice after practice, that they are, they are saying both through their body and their words and their attitude, I am not enjoying this. That should get my attention. That doesn't mean there's something wrong with my kid. Okay. When they're, when they're, especially when they can name the things. When my kid is looking for ways to medicate themselves again, that becomes way more relevant when they're older. But they're looking for ways to escape from the plate from what's supposed to be a game. That's a problem. They, they're just, they're, they're taking no enjoyment in it. They're not talking, they're not wanting to come home and actually play it anymore. They want to get away from it. I'm seeing that happen a little bit even with my son who's in high school right now. That again, I want to be careful how we name these things. But just one sport that he's involved in, he just doesn't even want to play anymore by himself because he's got such a bad taste in his mouth because of the culture created mostly by the lack of leadership with coaches and, and just kind of letting things run wild all the time. And it's just not fun to be around that. So I want him to overcome that. I want him to be the leader. I want him to change the culture. I want him to push back. But again, that's, that's more about me because of how I'm wired. That's not necessarily who he is. He wants to go do other things now. And I think I need to make peace with, that. Yeah.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Oh, yeah. I mean, wow. I am so impressed by your transparency. Because what I was going to say is, yeah, that's an issue of identity. You know, sometimes it is.
Our kids, they have their identity so much wrapped up in sports
Our kids, they have their identity so much wrapped up in sports, and then our identity becomes enmeshed with theirs. It's hard for us to walk away because it's not just an activity that you're walking away from, it's your whole identity. Right?
Ed Uszynski: Yeah. And it's super hard. Brian, what are you thinking when you're thinking about how to answer that question? How do you know when to step away?
Brian Smith: Yeah, I'm gonna just throw some more layers of complexity on it because I'm, I'm a high school cross country coach, with my wife. And we've had, a handful of people. We're three weeks into the season, we've already had a handful of people quit. Not because of, toxicity coming from us as coaches, but with this new category that has gained awareness over the last half a decade of mental health and athletes, having categories for things like anxiety and pressure. And even the, even the idea of racing creates so much internal anxiety and pressure that they just don't want to be a part of the team with all the other school responsibilities going on and so on. On that end, as a coach, but also as a Christian and as somebody who really believes deep in my guts that sports in a healthy way can maybe not solve issues like that, but it can sure help create disciplines and habits that help you work through things like that. So that in your first job when you're feeling anxiety, you will begin to have some tools and some healthy habits to overcome that. and so I am seeing in this generation, again, I don't want to just make this blanket statement, but I am seeing some people just using anxiety and it's not fun anymore as a way of saying, I, I don't like trying hard and I'm gonna be done So I think that too, like, man, if my kid gets to that situation, what am I. What am I gonna say? Yeah, I want to make sure I lead with grace. I do want my kids to do things because they enjoy it. But there is benefit to doing hard things, not toxic things. Right. But there is benefit to doing things that are. That are going to challenge you and make you a little bit it uncomfortable, because that stuff's going to keep showing up for the rest of your life. And sports should be one of the safest places where we can work through this stuff, where we have teammates who are going through it. Hopefully we have coaches who can help us navigate it in a healthy way and parents who have understanding, too. So just on the other side, from what Ed was saying, I do think, man, sports can be a place where we can teach and grow resiliency in kids. Well, now coaches need to make sure they're not creating a toxic environment.
Ed Uszynski: You just said it. As long as you have parents and coaches that aren't creating it. And so if they are, I don't think that's a good. Okay, here's the other thing. There's a whole bunch of other ways to learn that. Yeah, there are. So I don't need to be on this toxic team to learn it. But I think your point is a good one, Brian. We as parents need to be careful that we're not allowing anxiety to be an excuse for not learning how to persist under difficult circumstances. We had a whole chapter on this that didn't actually make it into the book because there wasn't enough space in the book, but it's the one we really regret is not in there. And that's persistence. How do you teach persistence? But it doesn't have to happen on this team, and I need to give myself permission and my kids permission to say, okay, we're going to learn this, but you're going to have to go do something else. You're not just going to come home and play video game games. We're not going to quit every time it gets hard, is what Brian's saying, which we do see that. I see parents let that happen, too. As soon as you're not getting the playing time you want, as soon as. As soon as your feelings are hurt in some way, we're going to pull the rug out and let you go somewhere else. And that's not setting them up for success in life.
Dr. Jessica Peck: I love this, this balance, this pendulum here, because it's always a pendulum swinging. And to layer in my perspective as a Healthcare provider. I see this, this trend towards over medicalization of human emotions.
So, it's normal in your life to feel some anxiety, it's normal to feel some depression
So it's normal in your life to feel some anxiety, it's normal to feel some depression. It's normal to be anxious when you're in a season of highly competitiveness. It's normal to feel depressed if you're in a slump and you're having trouble that way. But there, and there is also a place for people who have those symptoms that rise to the level of a diagnosable disorder. And I don't want to undermine that in any way. But let me ask you about this, guys, because this brings, a memory for me. And that is Simone Beless. If you'll remember, in the Tokyo Olympics, she withdrew and her stated reason was because she had a case of the twisties, quote, unquote, which really, she was just saying she had mental health issues. Now I will say I was in St. Louis during the trials, the Olympic trials for that particular season. It was right in the middle of Cove It was insane. I walked through the convention center and you've got moms who have linked arms, who are all wearing masks and poster boards like, begging people to please stay away because they think, you know, these kids have been training for months for the Olympics, and if they test positive for Covid, even if they're asymptomatic, you know, they're going to be kicked out. So the pressure was just insane. But when you watch the public narrative, the response to that, which I know kids are watching you had two kind of camps emerge. One said, hey, she's a hero. I can't believe she said that. You know, that that's so brave. The other said, she's a traitor. Like she's literally a traitor to her country. I, I reject both narratives. I think she was a human who was having some human issues. But, but what is your response to all of that and seeing that and keeping it in its rightful place, Recognizing that mental health struggles are real, they need to be taken care of, but also not over medicalizing them and helping our kids to push through when it's healthy. I'll, I'll let, I'll let y'.
Dr. Jessica Peck: All.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Rock, paper, scissors. Who wants to go after that first?
Brian Smith: You can start.
Ed Uszynski: Ed, I was gonna say you go first. Well, with. When you're asking that, though, seriously, give us a more specific context. Do you mean with our 8 year old, with our 18 year old, with our Olympic athlete, with our, you know, because those are all different settings.
Dr. Jessica Peck: It is so, so what is your perspective? Just in, in Thinking of that, thinking kids are watching how the response is to that. So they may, you know, feel like, oh, if I say, you know, I have mental health issues, I'm going to be brave. Oh, no, I'm going to be a traitor and I'm a quitter and I'm, you know, terrible. How do we, like, cut? I guess my specific question is how do we cut above that narrative and go back to the heart of our own child and be the wise parent and steward sports in their particular life, recognizing they're in this huge ecosystem of competing voices?
Ed Uszynski: Okay, good. So this is what I want to teach my kids to do, even as I'm trying to model for my friends and be this myself. I want you to live an authentic, true life and realize, especially in this day and age, no matter what you do, there's some who are going to be supportive of it, and there's some that are going to hate you for it. It's true. When you stand up to speak in front of a crowd, which is, I'm in a lot of settings where I get to talk to other communicators.
There's always somebody in the crowd who can't stand you
There's always somebody in the crowd who can't stand you. For whatever reason, they're projecting things onto you. You remind them of somebody. They don't like your tone. And there's going to be people who love you. What does it mean for you to be true to who God made you to be? And you show up with your full person every time and not be affected by those extremes or what the crowd thinks. Again, way easier said than done. But that's. You have the rest of your life now to try to. To try to live that out. I want you to have a security in who you were created to be, a security in your relationship with me and in your relationship with God. This is why this is so important, what we're talking about, that sports become a training ground to teach these kinds of things. I don't want you to be affected by the circumstances that, like, that's not going to be what's going to determine what your next move is. You are not what the crowd thinks, not what the coach thinks, not even what your parents think. At some point, you need to be true to who God made you to be. And what does it mean to be true in this. In this moment? And authentic, which, again, that's a word that you gets played out. And we might even be kind of post authentic now, because now authenticity is, like, almost gotten exploited. I want you to live in a true way, though. And not, not the way everybody else is telling you to live. So if you need a mental health break, take a mental health break. If you're going to grind it out because that's what you think is the right thing to do, then do that. Just know there's going to be people at both ends of the continuum, them that have an opinion about it. You do you,
Dr. Jessica Peck: Brian. I'm not letting you get away with it.
Brian Smith: Be careful that you do you.
Ed Uszynski: I will fix that. Help me, Brian. Fix that up.
Brian Smith: Well, I, I, I love what you're saying and it makes me just think of the, the importance of our kid understanding who they are, apart from their sport too. And that, that is one of, one of the things that we can help them do as, as parents is to be able to say, yeah, live, authentically. But, but how does God see you? And so to give our kids a growing understanding of what does it actually mean to be the child of God that you've heard your entire life that you are, you are skilled and you have potential and you're a winner and blah, blah, blah, all the things of sport. But did you know that God says you are, you're loved, that you are worthy, that and so the apple of his eye.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Guys, we're already at the end of our time together. Here we go, dot, dot, dot. Listen, I have already got these guys booked to continue our conversation because there's so much more to talk about and I know that this is an issue that many, many families are facing. They love sports and they want to steward it. Well, we'll have more to talk about with Brian Smith and Ed Uszynski on Away Game a Christian parents guide to navigating youth sports. So to be continued. And as you're waiting for that, I, praise, I always do that. The Lord will bless you and keep you and make his face to shine upon you. I'll see you next time.
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Sponsor Spotlight: Preborn's Mission to Save Babies and Support Moms Through Ultrasounds
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Dr. Jessica Peck: Right now, more mothers are waiting for that life changing moment. $28 helps to provide one life saving ultrasound. $140 helps rescue five babies. To donate to help pound 250 and say the keyword baby. That's pound 250 baby or visit preborn.com/AFR that's preborn.com/AFR every gift is tax- deductible. Hello and welcome to the doctor Nursemama show prescribing Hope for healthy Families here on American Family Radio. And here's your host, professor, pediatric nurse practitioner and mom of four, Dr. Jessica Peck.
Navigating Youth Sports: Understanding the Pressures and Pitfalls for Christian Families
Dr. Jessica Peck: Well, hey there friends and welcome. Welcome to my favorite time of day, getting to spend time with you, prescribing Hope for healthy families. And hey, I've got something really great for you today. If you have been listening recently, you might have heard my conversation with Brian Smith and Ed Uszynski They're authors of Away Game, a Christian Parents Guide to Navigating Youth Sports. And at the end of that conversation, I told them I felt like it was dot, dot, dot, to be continued. And we are in fact delivering on that Today and continuing our conversation. I know there are so many of you who have kids who are involved in sports. There are a lot of you who are grandparents out there who are dragging your lawn chairs out to watch the sports and be there and ring the cowbells and all the things, and sports can be such a good thing. But there are also some pitfalls in there. And we're going to talk about that some more. And when we talk today, I want to talk to families. You are really in it. Like, you're saying, okay, hey, yeah, I know that there are some. Some dangers, some things we need to watch out for. There are some risks that come along with the pressured environment, the hyper professionalization of sports, all of those things. But, hey, we're in it. Our kids enjoy it. We love it. Our kids are good at it. We've got a game plan. nope. Well, pun intended. That's who we're talking to. Those families who are traveling on the weekends.
Sports as a Spiritual Formation Tool: Balancing Competition, Play, and Christian Values
If you've invested financially or you're looking at camps and coaches and rank and auditions and scholarships and calendars, sometimes it feels like your second job. And this isn't just really applicable to sports. It can be anything competitive in your child's life. When we're looking at things like academics or music or anything that is competitive, because the tension is, what if we really, really love it? And yet we feel like, you know, a little bit of a, shame about that, almost like, okay, like, it's not like I feel like I have to explain it. Like, okay, we love it, but, you know, here's how it's good. You kind of feel that need to explain it. But there's some of you out there whose child is really gifted or who's just naturally competitive or they really do have a shot at playing in college or playing even in the pros, even though we know those statistics are really, really small, there are some who are doing there, and some. Some of you are just saying, hey, this is providing us really good community. It's teaching my kid discipline. We've got friendships. They have developed some confidence. And so the question is, how do we participate wholeheartedly without allowing what can be a good gift to become a God? And so we are looking. That's why I wanted to talk to Brian and Ed some more, because they make the argument that sports can be a good gift from God and a powerful context for spiritual formation. And their work really challenges families to move beyond just asking what. Whether our kids are winning and ask what kind of people they are becoming. Through the experience. Where's that thread of discipleship? And when we look at the landscape of childhood, we see a lot of things that kids used to do for fun, and now we have professional systems that are built around them. And those systems are primarily designed to make money. We see kids who used to play base basketball in the neighborhood or baseball in the neighborhood. Now there's travel teams. And we see all of those things, like just becoming really commercial, commercialized, professionalized, specialized. And something precious can get lost along the way. One of the things I want to emphasize in today's show is really remembering how important it is for kids to have fun and to play, because play is way different than performance, and that is something important for us to remember. And how do we. So how do we redeem this competition we're already in? How do we make the most of it? If you'll remember, I, introduced to you Brian and Ed last time. But as a quick, quick recap, Brian founded the Christian Athlete. He is one of the authors of this book, Away Game, A, Christian Parents Guide to Navigating Youth Sports. He has a master's degree in theology and sports studies from Baylor University. And Ed has a PhD from Bowling Greene State University. More than three decades of experience discipling college and professional athletes. And both of them have kids who are in sports. They played sports growing up, and in college, so they understand this so much. Brian and Ed, I'm so glad to. To have you back here. Thank you so much for agreeing to join us again to continue the conversation.
Brian Smith: Absolutely. I feel like we could talk about this all day. So excited, excited. You brought us back for round two, for sure. Yep.
Ed Uszynski: Well, and the intro just makes me want to ask you more questions. Actually, that's such a good intro again, where I'm just like, all right, you get it. And you're, you know, you're hearing the stories all the time. You're living them at home with your own kids and family, so. So it's always fun to talk to someone like you.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Well, Ed, I see that you got my payment from my team to, you know, hype me up here, but I do see this. I see this as a pediatric nurse practitioner. I see this as a mom. And really, it's changed in the way that I've seen it over the last 30 years when I see the level of pressure that comes through, even on something as simple as a sports physical or somebody who comes in who has a sports injury, and there's so much pressure to get back, and it's almost like I have families who are standing there saying, wait, you don't understand. Like we're really invested. I'm going to need you to get out the magic wand here. Like that whole rest ice thing. No, we would like an instant cure and then I can't provide that. But let's start really at the beginning. Brian, you have written and I know both of you have, but Brian, you've written about how youth sports have become increasingly professionalized. We talked about that last time. What is, what do we lose when something that was once really just for fun, honestly is now so highly structured, Expensive, expensive, year round, performance driven. What do we, how, what do we lose? And how can we still try to hold on to or reclaim that?
Brian Smith: Yeah, great, great question to lead off and I would say too, even as a backdrop, before I get to this, when, when we say, and when we just collectively use the term professionalization around the category of youth sports, we're not saying we should not try to win. We're not saying we should not try to give our, our very best. I heard somebody once say that sports only care. Like I really think there's some truth to that. There's, there's beauty when you bring your best to the space of athletics and there's beauty when you are doing what you can appropriately within the rules to try to win a game. And when, when two teams or two individuals are doing that. It can make, it can make for a beautiful product. If we can use that language to see people striving to be their best. What we mean by professionalization is really what you laid out in the beginning. It's the, it's the fall ball that turns into the winter training, that turns into spring ball, that turns into hiring strength coaches in the summer and really building an entire system around trying to maximize every little bit of a kid before their body has reached full maturity. trying to maximize their skill set before maybe they've even developed a body capable of handling a skill set like that in an entire system like that. And yeah, what do we miss? I think the biggest thing we miss as parents and as kids is just the, the enjoyment of sport. That when sport is when it means something beyond the win, it means something beyond the game itself. We put a tremendous, tremendous amount of pressure on not just ourselves, but our kids. That what's happening here makes a really big difference for the next three years of your life. And we lose the ability to just be in the moment, maybe to put our phones down and say it's really Cool that I get to watch my kid play a game right now. And yes, they're going to struggle and they're going to, we're going to see some, some wins but there, there's a lot of joy that comes from just sitting in the stands and watching your kid play. And unfortunately we just live in a culture right now where we're missing more and more of the ability to do that. And that doesn't mean we have to be really a slave to the culture, but we have to do some work if we really want to sit and enjoy it. Because everything else in the youth sport industrial complex is telling us that's actually not good parenting if you're just sitting, watching and smiling.
Ed Uszynski: And that's because. Brian let me, let me take it here because I was literally just thinking that one of the after effects of the professionalization of it, the industry nature, it becoming a complex. The way we talk about is that we start to, as parents start to take on the identity of agent, we start to operate like our eight year old sports agents. And it, as silly as that sounds, if you really think about it, we do what agents do, we start to think about their future, we think about how to maximize this next season. We think about how to make sure, like Brian said, they're getting what they need in order to be able to move up the ladder. We've got 10 years into the future in mind when we're making our decisions. Today we're negotiating with coaches and which club we're going to be a part of and why. and as we, what Brian just said, I need to keep working myself back to a place where I'm thinking more intentionally about what it means to be a parent in this moment and not a sports agent. How do I be present like Brian just talked about? You know what, in fact, if I'm going to take on a different identity than parent, what we're arguing amongst the Christian audience is I need to take on the identity of a discipler, a chaplain, somebody who's actually looking at those areas of my kid's life that probably the coaches and the other parents and the agents that are actually out there are not paying attention to because nobody else is going to do that. And that's sort of a God given expectation that I would do it. I'll be held accountable for that in some way. Not for making sure I get them on the best team, but making sure that I show them how to walk with Jesus on this one.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Well, Ed and Brian, you both brought up Some that's really compelling thinking about parents acting as agents because you can go to any game and you can see that happening. And it's hard because most of the time it comes from a place that's well intentioned. We want to help our kids succeed. We want them to achieve their dreams. But not too long ago I was at my son's sports game and I noticed the camera set up that parents had on the sideline and I'm talking that was professional. And I thought how much that had changed because you're taking the film for two reasons. One is to hyper analyze every, every single movement, you know, to watch the film, for technique. The other is to package it for social media for college scouts and things like that. What do we lose ed, you know, in the, and the joy of the game. And being a parent when we're trying to manage that professional aspect of it, that's really uncomfortable to say, but it is a reality.
Ed Uszynski: Yeah, I feel like Brian already said it. I'll say it again. You just miss out on being present to just watch, just watch the game. I felt that sometimes, even when I'm trying to record something and have suddenly become really aware of it for our other friends that try to record everything, it's like when I'm recording, I don't actually really get to see it. There's like a separation between me as the videographer who's trying to capture it and keep them in the middle or whatever, depending on what the sport is and really just being able to be able to just sit back and watch it unfold and watch the other athletes around my kid and, and just take it in. Instead of trying to package it and trying to prepare it for a promotional, script or a promotional clip, I just missed out on the moment. So what ends up happening is you don't even realize it in the moment, but you get to the end of a year if you're paying any attention and realize you didn't really watch them
Brian Smith: play,
Ed Uszynski: you didn't watch them play. I was too busy constantly trying to package it. I was always thinking about the next thing. I was always frustrated about what that meant, whatever that was right there for tomorrow. And I end up missing out on today. And I did that, I did that a lot with our first. And that's why I'm so aware of it, because I know what that feels like. And like you said, Dr. Peck completely, good intentions and my, my kids best interest in mine. Some of mine are mixed in too. But I absolutely want the best for my kid and I end up missing the whole experience.
Brian Smith: And can I say this too?
Ed Uszynski: Yeah, go ahead, Brian.
Brian Smith: just to show that there's complexity in this and we're not just trying to, to give simple solutions or even simple principles that over, like, apply to everything. There's for sure instances out there where you have kids in high school who, who need to have things filmed and recorded and need to have highlight tapes put together and sent to college coaches if they want to play in college. So we're not saying don't do that. We're just saying we need to be careful of applying a model like that to kids who are 8, 9, 10, 11, 12. Like, it's not a light switch on and off, it's maybe a dimmer switch that it's okay to turn that up as they get older and it matters a little bit more. We're just saying let's, let's be careful about applying that type of, again, professionalization recruiting model to kids who are not going to get recruited as 8 year olds.
Ed Uszynski: Yeah. And it's just, I'm, hold you
Dr. Jessica Peck: right there because we're already at our first break, see, like you said, and we could talk about this all day. And I think sometimes it's about just remembering, like, okay, I need to take off this agent hat for a minute and I need to put on my mom hat, my dad hat, my parent hat, and I need to be a parent in this moment, even though sometimes you're managing both of those roles. And when we come back and I'll let you finish your thought and Brian, you have a degree in theology and sports studies, and I want to talk about some of the theological implications here. Like, if we have a God who, who delights and play and beauty and creativity, what do we learn from that and seeing it in sports? We'll be right back. Don't go away.
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Rise Up (Lazarus) by CAIN: In the dark and all alone growing comfortable Are you too scared to move and walk out of this tomb? There is buried underneath the lies that you believed safe and sound stuck in the ground too lost to be found. You're just asleep and it's time to leave Come on and rise up Take a breath, you're alive now can't you hear the voice of Jesus calling us out from the grave like Lazarus? Your brand new power m that couldn't hold you can't you hear the voice of Jesus calling us out from the grave like Lazarus Rise up, rise up
Dr. Jessica Peck: out from the bank like la M welcome back, friends. That is rise up By Lazarus, by Cain. And what I'm calling you today to do is to rise up you sports families and let's talk about sports. I'm talking today, having my second conversation with Brian Smith and Ed Uszynski They are authors of the book Away Game A Christian Parents Guide to Navigating Youth Sports. We had a first conversation. If you missed it, go back and catch it. We talked about the professionalization of youth sports and some of the, the great things that can happen with that, the opportunities that are there, but also the pitfalls when we're raising kids with a Christian worldview and some of the things that can really detract us from the people that we want our kids to be. And we're right in the middle of talking about the importance of play and the theology of sports because a lot of times what we ask our, our kids when they finish a game is, hey, you know, how did you do? How did you feel about that? Not what did you enjoy most about that? What did we say? The coach notice you? Did this coach say anything to you? We want to know all of those things. And sometimes we wear that agent hat is what we were talking about. And we forget to take that off and also be a parent. And the goal is not. I'm, we are not saying, oh, make your kids less competitive. Sports are bad, none of that at all. We're really just talking about how to leverage sports to reveal the heart, to disciple, to make sure we're strengthening our families. And Ed, I told you I would come right back to you and let you finish your thought because we were right in the middle of a conversation. Radio was so rude sometimes. So I'll let you finish your thought. And then, Brian, I got a question for you about sports theology.
Ed Uszynski: Thank you. Well, we were talking about recording our kids when they're competing. And, Brian said that, you know, there, there is a point in time where actually that, that may be really needed, especially when they're older, their sophomore, junior, senior year of high school, where they actually do have a chance to play at another level. And so you do want to have something recorded. I would say, though, even if you want to record them younger, see if you can get a friend to record them while they're running or swimming in the lane or again, whatever. The sports are all different. But so that I can be present to watch and I can get someone else, would you please just record this at bat for me? most of the time, the parent's not watching their kid at bat. They're not going to watch your kid at bat the same way they're watching their kid at bat. So I think they would be okay with recording it for you. So you can just watch it. They got to train them to make sure they get it right. You don't want a bad recording.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Be honest.
Ed Uszynski: But again, that's all we're saying is so that you can be present and not be, the videographer. Another thing, just real quick that I think we do need to think about, and Brian and I have posted different things when our kids have done things online, but I'm even really hesitant to do that because I think it creates another layer of pressure for our kids when they know that we are constantly looking for ways to put them up on our social media feed. And again, why do we do that? Because we're proud of them. We want to show off when our kids doing something. Well, I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with that, but there are some negative consequences that maybe we don't think about for our kids when we do that all the time. As I, as I see some people do is constantly coming into my feed. Every time their kid is playing, I'm getting a clip of them. And I just think, what is this doing to him or her when they know that it's worth thinking about.
Dr. Jessica Peck: It absolutely is. And again, we talked even before we started the show, guys, that some of this is just the messy middle. Some of this is just, hey, this is hard. We're figuring this out together. But I think there's value in having honest conversations about it and some accountability, with people who share the same worldview to when. When are we crossing the line? When are our priorities, you know, getting misaligned? And how can we not become, you know, bl. Sometimes we just miss what we're doing. And. And Brian, I want to go back to some of the theological underpinnings. It's fascinating to me that you have a degree in theology and sports studies, but let's go back to some of the theological underpinnings here. Help us go back to basics. Some of those basic spiritual principles.
Brian Smith: Yeah. So let's
Let's talk briefly about a theology of play
let's talk briefly about a theology of, of play. Maybe we can start there. And so to do that, we, we've talked a lot about professionalization and kind of built a soft framework definition around that. To play is really to creatively enjoy something for its own intrinsic good. There's a pastor out of lnla, his name is Jeremy Treat, and that's how he defines play is just to enjoy something, for its own intrinsic good, which when there's intrinsic goodness in something, that means it doesn't need to serve any other purpose beyond just what it does. And so I think I first realized that, when my kids were young, just watching them play in the yard and realizing, like, there's goodness in what they're doing, not because they're learning how to throw a ball with their right hand or, not because they're learning teamwork, not because they're doing anything beyond just playing. And so I think a theology of play starts there. That God, it's this idea that God created us to play. And when we are moving our bodies and creating games and even competing with and against each other, this belief that God, God smiles upon that in the same way a, father or mother smiles upon their kids playing in the backyard. So I think it starts there. my theology of play, was influenced too by German theologian. His name is, if I can get this right, Jurgen Moltman. And Moltman was a former Nazi soldier. He was captured, he was a prisoner of war, he was given a Bible in one of those camps and became a Christian. And from there just like learned to study the Bible, became a theologian. And he was asked one time, with all of the wars going on in the world, is it okay for Christians to, especially on the other side of the world, is it okay for Christians to play and essentially be involved in games when there's just crazy war, going on the other side of the world? And this is how he responded. I'm going to read this quote. He said, yes, in playing we anticipate the eternal kingdom of God where there will be no war. Sin will not corrupt the goodness of which we are to the light. And our longing for freedom and childlike joy will be satisfied. Play foreshadows the joy of the kingdom where Christ will reign over all, and decay and disease and death will be no more. Play is not merely a glimpse of the future, it's an in breaking of the future. And that last line has always stuck with me, that play is an in breaking of the future. That when we, when we play. A good theology and understanding of play is we really do get a glimpse of what life could be like on the new earth when there's no sin and death, and bad referees and all the stuff that go along with the brokenness of sport today.
Dr. Jessica Peck: And you had to throw the referees under the bus. It is just. I feel so bad for. The nurse in me is always like, oh, the poor. Most of the time, you know, sometimes I'm not feeling so bad for them. But, Brian, you know, let's break this down to the practical. I love that, that thought, that analogy there, because sometimes we think of it either as wasted time or it's just, you know, we see it as this driven time. But just to see it, that theological underpinning, I think that's a really good perspective shift for us to help keep things aligned. Like, is this. Is our engaging in this play? Is it helping us to foresee the kingdom, the coming of the kingdom of God?
Brian Smith: That.
Dr. Jessica Peck: That's a beautiful picture. And one of the things that's really hard for us to do is to let our kids struggle in that, you know, because when they engage in competitive play, there is struggle that happens there. They may struggle with self confidence. They may struggle with overconfidence. You know, they may struggle with a physical skill, they may struggle with a coach. They may struggle socially. There's all kinds of struggles that can happen. And as you turn up the level of competition, that potential for struggle increases. One of the things you talked about in your book is the concept of the parent as the spotter. We've already talked about parent as agent, but what does that look like in real life? And thinking of those theological underpinnings, how do we stay close enough to, you know, protect our kids, to support them, but also allowing them to struggle and seeing some of that as reflection of earthly struggle before Christ comes and makes all things new.
Brian Smith: Yeah. So for me, my tendency when I go to watch my kids play a game, like the. The earthly tendency in me is I'm. I'm showing up either as an agent or as a fan. And so for me to do what you just mentioned, to be a. To be a spotter, to show up almost as a. Have a chaplaincy mindset instead of an agent or a fan mindset. I need to. I need to coach myself in the car before I. Before I actually get in the stands or the sidelines. And so I need this gentle reminder to my own heart and have this time with God, even If it's like 30 seconds. I need to say, God, would you help me to just enjoy watching my kid play today? God, would you help me to notice things that you want me to notice that maybe you're doing, in their life? And God, would you help me to be okay with letting them struggle? And I'm not going to be somebody who prays for a loss or prays for bad referees, but I know as a human that's part of the athletic experience. And so I think for me to get in that mindset, it really means tackling it on the front end. Because if I don't do that, I show up at the game and I'm bringing 30 years of sport being discipled by sport junk to the game. And I just know my own tendency is to respond in ways that, ugh, an hour after the game I'm going to regret. Maybe 20 years after the game I'll regret. So to answer all that, it takes front end work and it's really just a short time with the Lord to invite him into that process with me
Ed Uszynski: so that we can represent, we have wisdom to know whether what this moment needs is grace. Or does the moment need truth?
Brian Smith: It's good.
Ed Uszynski: Does it need a, firm confrontation for one reason or another? Or does it just need the loving father whose arms are thrown open wide at the end of the prodigal son who comes home? And that's always a challenge, isn't it? That's why I love what Brian just said. It's like I am doing spiritual formation inside myself before I go and try to do anything with my kids. And sometimes we mess that up. And so that's why again, and the opportunity to ask for forgiveness, to apologize is this safety net that's created for us as Christians that says you can get a lot of do overs, man. you gotta ask for them. You have to humble yourself and ask for them. But what I'm looking for is, Lord, give me eyes to see whether this moment as a spotter needs grace or needs truth. And it's gonna look different all the time. And maybe one kid needs more of one than the other. And you know, that's the other complication is you think you figure it out for one kid in one sport and then it's a completely different experience for another kid in a completely different sport.
Dr. Jessica Peck: You know, you guys have just given me such a clear, you, just give me such a clear idea though, this idea of being agent or fan. You just said that, Brian. That's really compelling to me because as an agent, we're going to lean towards hyper critical and just kind of hyper advocate, you know, make sure our kids are getting the best, best spot on the team. You know, getting the right playing time, like getting the right coach, the right video, all of that kind of stuff.
But the fan is like, hyper protective
But the fan is like, hyper protective. Like, my kid can do no wrong. Like the refs. Like, this is where, you know, I'm just going to be hyper protective. But being the spotter in the middle, Ed, you've. You've started to kind of pull that out and say that's a different perspective. How should that inform our attitude towards our kids? Struggle when they are, you know, just struggling in the sport for whatever reason, whether that's emotionally, physically, psychologically, whatever it is. How do we pull that out some more? I want to hear more.
Ed Uszynski: Well, it is that same kind of continuum like we just did with grace and truth. Some of us maybe will lean in the direction of minimizing their disappointment or just trying to, like, wipe it away. We're uncomfortable with it, so we just want to say, get over it and let's move on and there's a different day tomorrow and kind of become a hype man who, who doesn't allow them to feel it. Or some of us, maybe we're going to rescue them from it in some other way. We're just going to deny it entirely. It's just not even going to be a category for us to feel pain. And again, I think the journey is to learn to be honest when something hurts and, empathize with that healthily. Empathize with. That's disappointing. That stinks that you miss the, free kick. It just does. It hurts and. Or that you didn't get to play today the way that you thought you were going to. I know the coach said they were going to do it. And sometimes that's just the way it goes. The other thing we can end up doing is putting blame, looking for ways to blame everybody else to try to make our kid feel better. I know Brian likes talking about different stories from his own journey doing that. And it's like, no, let's just stay here in this horrible feeling for a minute together, because this is what life is. So let's grow accustomed again. Like Brian said, we're not going to go look for it. There will be enough that comes to us on its own. And so let's not lose, let's not waste. I think Jon Piper had a book called don't waste your cancer when you're in a hard time, sit in it, feel it, and then look for what, maybe, what does God want to do with us in this? Like, bring, bring that perspective. It's not. What happens today is not the end. Bad stuff happens all the time. Like, we need to teach our kids this. Bad stuff happens all the time. And the strongest people in the world grow from it. They become different, they become better. They don't become bitter, they become better. so then you can bring that kind of perspective and say, we're going to get another shot at this. Let's be ready for it next time, or what do we need to do different so that the next time this situation arises, you'll have a different experience. But how do we do both of those? Feel it, stay in it, and then bring perspective that says this is just to set us up for a different future and it's okay.
Dr. Jessica Peck: That's so good. I mean, I love that, Ed. And then there's also another to add another layer of complexity onto this.
There are times as parents we need to recognize that the struggle is unhealthy
There are times when, as parents, we need to recognize that the struggle is unhealthy, that there is a toxic environment. Whether that's a toxic coach or a toxic team or just something that, okay, this is actually not forming character in my child. It is, it is destroying their self esteem and their morale. How do we figure out the line between that when we come back? I'm going to start with that with you, Brian. You can just, you know, solve world peace and apply for your Nobel Peace Prize while you're at it. But those are some of the, the things that we think about. And instead of immediately trying to solve your kid's problem when they're in competition, think, think.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Okay?
Dr. Jessica Peck: Ask them questions. That's so important to do. What do you think you can control here? What does perseverance look like right now? What did you learn about yourself? What do you think God is teaching you in this season? And what support do you need from me right now? Do you need me to listen, to encourage, to advise, to be quiet, to step back? What do you need? We'll have so much more with Brian Smith and Ed Uszynski on away game when we come back.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Back.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Don't go away.
Peter Rosenberger: While in the emergency room with my wife, as she was struggling with the Cove 19 virus herself. And I looked at her, I said, are you scared? And she said, a little bit, but I've been through worse.
The certainty of mankind's history with uncertainty by Peter Rosenberger
The certainty of mankind's history with uncertainty. An article by Peter Rosenberger.
Peter Rosenberger: And then as her fever was approaching almost 103, she started singing in Christ Alone I placed my trust and find my glory in the power of the cross. And that's how she has anchored herself in the certainty of Christ, through her huge medical journey that has included 80 surgeries, both of her legs amputated, 100 doctors have treated 12 hospitals, and now the COVID 19 virus. And so when we live with those kinds of uncertainties, anchoring ourselves in Christ, in Christ alone, that's the only place we can run to where there is certainty. To read this article and more, visit afa.net/thestand need the lights, don't need the stages.
Just Jesus by David Leonard: All I really, really want is you. Silence, noise, straight to the sacred. All I really really want is you in your right place. You and I are face to face you on the throne, on my heart and all my words, all my. Take.
Dr. Jessica Peck: M welcome back friends. That is just Jesus by David Leonard and if you caught that first line of that song said, I don't need the lights, I don't need the stages. That can be an easy thing to say on Sunday morning, but when you're under the Friday night lights, especially if you live in Texas like I do, that can be a harder thing to say. I'm right in the middle of my second conversation with Brian Smith and Ed Uszynski They are longtime sports ministry leaders. They're the authors of a book called Away Game A Christian Parents Guide to Navigating Youth Sports. If you have kids in sports, I highly, highly recommend that you get a copy of this book because sports can be such a great thing and it can also be a thing that is a destructive force. I know. And that can be true with anything that. I really love sports. I think they have a good and rightful place in a family's life. And I also think it can be something that is really difficult, that can be a pitfall in your life. And we're right in the middle of talking about that. And Ed, let's, let's come back to you and let's continue talking about what I was asking right before the break is where's the line between like, okay, this is hard. This is formative. I'm gonna let my kids struggle. Their character will be better for it to, okay, this is unhealthy and I need to intervene because sometimes that can be hard. As a Christian parent too, you can think, okay, I know that this isn't the greatest situation, but if we pull out of this, like, oh, what is that going to mean for my kid's future? And do we just suck it up and stay anyway. What do parents do to look at that and navigate that with, wisdom?
Ed Uszynski: Yeah. Again, such a great question. I don't think there's a one size fits all answer. So I'm going to put that disclaimer out right out front and I will say again, it's so funny that we're talking about this right now because I just told Brian the other day that I feel like we waited too long to intervene with my college sport playing son in the situation he was in that ended up being very detrimental for him and set him up, to make a lot of bad choices. And it was just not a good environment from the beginning. But I think we continue to encourage him to grind it out. When all the signs were saying, it's not going to change, this is not going to get any healthier. Why does he need to keep grinding, grinding it out in this setting? And again, we could talk for a whole hour just about that. I've got my own issues with that because that's how I'm wired. You always just keep grinding it out. I don't think that's always the right answer. So when my kid no longer is enjoying being there and is saying it, not just, you know, it's one thing to say that for one practice on one day, it's one thing to have a bad week. Like, I, know we need to come back the next week and try again. But when it's week after week and it's game after game and it's practice after practice, that they are, they are saying both through their body and their words and their attitude, I am not enjoying this. That should get my attention. That doesn't mean there's something wrong with my kid. Okay. When they're, when they're, especially when they can name the things. When my kid is looking for ways to medicate themselves again, that becomes way more relevant when they're older. But they're looking for ways to escape from the plate from what's supposed to be a game. That's a problem. They, they're just, they're, they're taking no enjoyment in it. They're not talking, they're not wanting to come home and actually play it anymore. They want to get away from it. I'm seeing that happen a little bit even with my son who's in high school right now. That again, I want to be careful how we name these things. But just one sport that he's involved in, he just doesn't even want to play anymore by himself because he's got such a bad taste in his mouth because of the culture created mostly by the lack of leadership with coaches and, and just kind of letting things run wild all the time. And it's just not fun to be around that. So I want him to overcome that. I want him to be the leader. I want him to change the culture. I want him to push back. But again, that's, that's more about me because of how I'm wired. That's not necessarily who he is. He wants to go do other things now. And I think I need to make peace with, that. Yeah.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Oh, yeah. I mean, wow. I am so impressed by your transparency. Because what I was going to say is, yeah, that's an issue of identity. You know, sometimes it is.
Our kids, they have their identity so much wrapped up in sports
Our kids, they have their identity so much wrapped up in sports, and then our identity becomes enmeshed with theirs. It's hard for us to walk away because it's not just an activity that you're walking away from, it's your whole identity. Right?
Ed Uszynski: Yeah. And it's super hard. Brian, what are you thinking when you're thinking about how to answer that question? How do you know when to step away?
Brian Smith: Yeah, I'm gonna just throw some more layers of complexity on it because I'm, I'm a high school cross country coach, with my wife. And we've had, a handful of people. We're three weeks into the season, we've already had a handful of people quit. Not because of, toxicity coming from us as coaches, but with this new category that has gained awareness over the last half a decade of mental health and athletes, having categories for things like anxiety and pressure. And even the, even the idea of racing creates so much internal anxiety and pressure that they just don't want to be a part of the team with all the other school responsibilities going on and so on. On that end, as a coach, but also as a Christian and as somebody who really believes deep in my guts that sports in a healthy way can maybe not solve issues like that, but it can sure help create disciplines and habits that help you work through things like that. So that in your first job when you're feeling anxiety, you will begin to have some tools and some healthy habits to overcome that. and so I am seeing in this generation, again, I don't want to just make this blanket statement, but I am seeing some people just using anxiety and it's not fun anymore as a way of saying, I, I don't like trying hard and I'm gonna be done So I think that too, like, man, if my kid gets to that situation, what am I. What am I gonna say? Yeah, I want to make sure I lead with grace. I do want my kids to do things because they enjoy it. But there is benefit to doing hard things, not toxic things. Right. But there is benefit to doing things that are. That are going to challenge you and make you a little bit it uncomfortable, because that stuff's going to keep showing up for the rest of your life. And sports should be one of the safest places where we can work through this stuff, where we have teammates who are going through it. Hopefully we have coaches who can help us navigate it in a healthy way and parents who have understanding, too. So just on the other side, from what Ed was saying, I do think, man, sports can be a place where we can teach and grow resiliency in kids. Well, now coaches need to make sure they're not creating a toxic environment.
Ed Uszynski: You just said it. As long as you have parents and coaches that aren't creating it. And so if they are, I don't think that's a good. Okay, here's the other thing. There's a whole bunch of other ways to learn that. Yeah, there are. So I don't need to be on this toxic team to learn it. But I think your point is a good one, Brian. We as parents need to be careful that we're not allowing anxiety to be an excuse for not learning how to persist under difficult circumstances. We had a whole chapter on this that didn't actually make it into the book because there wasn't enough space in the book, but it's the one we really regret is not in there. And that's persistence. How do you teach persistence? But it doesn't have to happen on this team, and I need to give myself permission and my kids permission to say, okay, we're going to learn this, but you're going to have to go do something else. You're not just going to come home and play video game games. We're not going to quit every time it gets hard, is what Brian's saying, which we do see that. I see parents let that happen, too. As soon as you're not getting the playing time you want, as soon as. As soon as your feelings are hurt in some way, we're going to pull the rug out and let you go somewhere else. And that's not setting them up for success in life.
Dr. Jessica Peck: I love this, this balance, this pendulum here, because it's always a pendulum swinging. And to layer in my perspective as a Healthcare provider. I see this, this trend towards over medicalization of human emotions.
So, it's normal in your life to feel some anxiety, it's normal to feel some depression
So it's normal in your life to feel some anxiety, it's normal to feel some depression. It's normal to be anxious when you're in a season of highly competitiveness. It's normal to feel depressed if you're in a slump and you're having trouble that way. But there, and there is also a place for people who have those symptoms that rise to the level of a diagnosable disorder. And I don't want to undermine that in any way. But let me ask you about this, guys, because this brings, a memory for me. And that is Simone Beless. If you'll remember, in the Tokyo Olympics, she withdrew and her stated reason was because she had a case of the twisties, quote, unquote, which really, she was just saying she had mental health issues. Now I will say I was in St. Louis during the trials, the Olympic trials for that particular season. It was right in the middle of Cove It was insane. I walked through the convention center and you've got moms who have linked arms, who are all wearing masks and poster boards like, begging people to please stay away because they think, you know, these kids have been training for months for the Olympics, and if they test positive for Covid, even if they're asymptomatic, you know, they're going to be kicked out. So the pressure was just insane. But when you watch the public narrative, the response to that, which I know kids are watching you had two kind of camps emerge. One said, hey, she's a hero. I can't believe she said that. You know, that that's so brave. The other said, she's a traitor. Like she's literally a traitor to her country. I, I reject both narratives. I think she was a human who was having some human issues. But, but what is your response to all of that and seeing that and keeping it in its rightful place, Recognizing that mental health struggles are real, they need to be taken care of, but also not over medicalizing them and helping our kids to push through when it's healthy. I'll, I'll let, I'll let y'.
Dr. Jessica Peck: All.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Rock, paper, scissors. Who wants to go after that first?
Brian Smith: You can start.
Ed Uszynski: Ed, I was gonna say you go first. Well, with. When you're asking that, though, seriously, give us a more specific context. Do you mean with our 8 year old, with our 18 year old, with our Olympic athlete, with our, you know, because those are all different settings.
Dr. Jessica Peck: It is so, so what is your perspective? Just in, in Thinking of that, thinking kids are watching how the response is to that. So they may, you know, feel like, oh, if I say, you know, I have mental health issues, I'm going to be brave. Oh, no, I'm going to be a traitor and I'm a quitter and I'm, you know, terrible. How do we, like, cut? I guess my specific question is how do we cut above that narrative and go back to the heart of our own child and be the wise parent and steward sports in their particular life, recognizing they're in this huge ecosystem of competing voices?
Ed Uszynski: Okay, good. So this is what I want to teach my kids to do, even as I'm trying to model for my friends and be this myself. I want you to live an authentic, true life and realize, especially in this day and age, no matter what you do, there's some who are going to be supportive of it, and there's some that are going to hate you for it. It's true. When you stand up to speak in front of a crowd, which is, I'm in a lot of settings where I get to talk to other communicators.
There's always somebody in the crowd who can't stand you
There's always somebody in the crowd who can't stand you. For whatever reason, they're projecting things onto you. You remind them of somebody. They don't like your tone. And there's going to be people who love you. What does it mean for you to be true to who God made you to be? And you show up with your full person every time and not be affected by those extremes or what the crowd thinks. Again, way easier said than done. But that's. You have the rest of your life now to try to. To try to live that out. I want you to have a security in who you were created to be, a security in your relationship with me and in your relationship with God. This is why this is so important, what we're talking about, that sports become a training ground to teach these kinds of things. I don't want you to be affected by the circumstances that, like, that's not going to be what's going to determine what your next move is. You are not what the crowd thinks, not what the coach thinks, not even what your parents think. At some point, you need to be true to who God made you to be. And what does it mean to be true in this. In this moment? And authentic, which, again, that's a word that you gets played out. And we might even be kind of post authentic now, because now authenticity is, like, almost gotten exploited. I want you to live in a true way, though. And not, not the way everybody else is telling you to live. So if you need a mental health break, take a mental health break. If you're going to grind it out because that's what you think is the right thing to do, then do that. Just know there's going to be people at both ends of the continuum, them that have an opinion about it. You do you,
Dr. Jessica Peck: Brian. I'm not letting you get away with it.
Brian Smith: Be careful that you do you.
Ed Uszynski: I will fix that. Help me, Brian. Fix that up.
Brian Smith: Well, I, I, I love what you're saying and it makes me just think of the, the importance of our kid understanding who they are, apart from their sport too. And that, that is one of, one of the things that we can help them do as, as parents is to be able to say, yeah, live, authentically. But, but how does God see you? And so to give our kids a growing understanding of what does it actually mean to be the child of God that you've heard your entire life that you are, you are skilled and you have potential and you're a winner and blah, blah, blah, all the things of sport. But did you know that God says you are, you're loved, that you are worthy, that and so the apple of his eye.
Dr. Jessica Peck: Guys, we're already at the end of our time together. Here we go, dot, dot, dot. Listen, I have already got these guys booked to continue our conversation because there's so much more to talk about and I know that this is an issue that many, many families are facing. They love sports and they want to steward it. Well, we'll have more to talk about with Brian Smith and Ed Uszynski on Away Game a Christian parents guide to navigating youth sports. So to be continued. And as you're waiting for that, I, praise, I always do that. The Lord will bless you and keep you and make his face to shine upon you. I'll see you next time.
Concluding Remarks and Sponsor Thank You: Preborn and American Family Radio
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Jeff Chamblee: opinions expressed in this broadcast may not necessarily reflect those of the American Family association or American Family Radio.
Jessica talks with Ed Uszynski and Brian Smith about honoring the Lord with your child's sports experience.
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