Ed Vitagliano to go to Boston this fall for spiritual heritage tour
>> Today's Issues continues on AFR with your host, Ed Vitagliano.
>> Ed Vitagliano: And welcome back to Today's Issues. Ed Vitagliano sitting in for Tim Wildmon today. Tim will be back in the Captain's chair for Trivia Friday tomorrow. So, folks, make sure you tune in. We'll have a little bit of fun. Tim and I think, J.J. jasper will be on as well. So we'll have some fun, and, do some learning on, what we call Learning University. join in studio by Fred Jackson. And now Steve Paisley Jordal joins us. Hey, what's up? How you doing? I'm doing. I'm doing good. How you doing?
>> Steve Jordahl: How you doing?
>> Ed Vitagliano: By the way, I am going to get two chances to, go to Boston here this fall.
>> Steve Jordahl: I'm kind of jealous.
>> Ed Vitagliano: I'll listen. I am looking forward to it. I'm going with one of our spiritual heritage tours, I think the third week in September. Looking forward to that. Going with Wesley and Walker. And, we do. You do have. On these tours, you do have some free time. So Wesley, Walker and I and, Kevan Parker and Chuck Bunn, who, do our security here and usually go with our groups when we go on a tour. We're to go see the Red Sox. Listen, I have never been to Fenway. No, I. I used to tease my dad. I did grow up in the. I. I was born and spent some of my early years in the Boston area, Peabody and Wakefield. I had family in Reading and Lowell, Massachusetts, in the Boston area. But, I don't know. I was 8 years old or whatever. We moved across the state line, Nasher, NewSong Hampshire. And that's where I really grew up. My dad was always promising me to take me to Fenway. We were that close. It's like people who grow up in NewSong York City and never go to the Statue of Liberty. I was, dad, when we go into Fenway, we're gonna do it. We're gonna do it. And then he moved the family to NewSong Mexico, and we never got back there. I used to tease him, the poor guy, to the day he died. I would say, you know, I love you, dad, but you never took me to Fenway. Well, now I'm going, Lord willing. And then in October, going, back for my 50th high school reunion.
>> Fred Jackson: Oh, nice.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Yeah. So that's just for a weekend. and so, anyway, look, I am really looking forward, to going.
>> Fred Jackson: Who are they playing?
>> Ed Vitagliano: NewSong England.
>> Fred Jackson: Who are the Sox playing?
>> Ed Vitagliano: They're playing I think the Cleveland Guardians. Oh, yeah. So that's in September. They're in a playoff hunt right now. So, it's, they're having a. Having a good year. I know, I know. It's the Cleveland Indians. Who, Who Are you kidding?
>> Steve Jordahl: The, the Fenway's on my bucket list.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Oh, yeah, listen, and we got pretty decent seats for really reasonable. I, I didn't think there'd be any seats available because of the playoff hunt. but we got some right there on the first baseline. Very, very reasonable. So nice. I, don't think I could talk everybody into going to watch a hockey game. The season wouldn't be underway anyway in September. But anyway, that's boring to probably 99.9 of the people listening. But hey, you may want to know a little thing or two about me.
>> Fred Jackson: So it's a wonderful time of the year to go out of that area.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Yeah.
>> Fred Jackson: Yeah.
>> Ed Vitagliano: You talk about cool weather. I'll probably have to bring a sweater or two. I love that time of year.
>> Fred Jackson: Yeah, fall.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Because of growing up, fall in NewSong England was always my favorite time.
>> Fred Jackson: Absolutely.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Every time.
>> Fred Jackson: Beautiful.
Lindsay Clancy is on trial for murdering her three children
>> Ed Vitagliano: All right, Steve. Hey, let's get going.
>> Steve Jordahl: There is a very tragic case going on. It's a trial that's going on right now. It's in its final stages. And, it is the case of a young mother named Lindsay Clancy who was, suffering from, post birth psychosis and postpartum psychosis and bipolar disorder. And she is charged, she has admitted to. She is on trial for killing her three children, strangling them. And, we're getting to the end of the, of the trial, but it's kind of in the news and people are talking about mental illness in this country and how serious it is. there are a lot of women who think that they have suffered the same, symptoms as Ms. Clancy. And, there are people who say that they haven't because, postpartum psychosis is not postpartum depression. It's what I've been told.
>> Ed Vitagliano: But these are two different.
>> Steve Jordahl: A lot of people identifying with a woman. There's a GoFundMe for a million dollars that's raised almost a million dollars for the family of Lindsay Clancy. who's.
>> Fred Jackson: There are about 300 supporters outside the courtroom this morning.
>> Steve Jordahl: And so it has become kind of a cultural touchstone. And I just wanted to bring it up and get your guys thoughts about what's going on.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Well, you know, Fred, this, this is. I have not been pay to. This, this case simply Because I knew what it was about. And simply because the horrifying way in which these three children were murdered. Strangled, I think. and so those kinds of stories I tend to stay away from because it just, you know, cases, you know, of sexual assault, those kind of things just make my blood boil. it's just such so sad. I've not been paying attention to it as much. I am looking at an article we have on our own website, afn.net covering this because it is all over the news.
>> Fred Jackson: Yeah.
>> Ed Vitagliano: And, so, Fred, I am. I am frankly stunned. Now, we talked about this in our story meeting. This is something I did not know. Lindsay Clancy's attorneys are not, according to what I think I understood this morning, are not disputing the facts that Lindsay murdered her three children.
>> Fred Jackson: That's correct.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Okay. So this is not a case of people supporting her because they think she's innocent. Although there are some people that, who say that it was actually the husband who did it and all those kind of things.
>> Steve Jordahl: Those are a little fringe.
>> Ed Vitagliano: But I'm kind of stunned at the supporters who support Lindsey Clancy, even though the attorneys say, yes, she did it.
>> Fred Jackson: Ah.
>> Ed Vitagliano: What's going on here?
>> Fred Jackson: Well, I think the supporters are pointing to the reality of postpartum psychosis and that obviously she. I mean, we have heard testimony during this trial that she heard a male voice telling her to kill her children after she carried out this horrible, deed. she tried to kill herself. She cut her wrist, and she threw herself off a building. This is why, if you've watched some of the video from the trial, she is in a wheelchair.
>> Ed Vitagliano: She's paralyzed.
>> Fred Jackson: She's paralyzed from the waist down. she is being kept in a special unit right now because she is still very mentally unstable. She has, I was told this morning, two nurses that sit behind her in the court, because they're not sure that there may be an incident in court. So it's a very sad case.
Steve Martin: 30% of our daughters and granddaughters have contemplated suicide
our own Jenna Ellis this morning had Dr. Tim Clinton, who is president of the American association of Christian Counselors. And, Jenna wanted to talk to him about this case. And here's a little bit about what they talked about. just about the whole seriousness of mental illness in this country. It's cut number 12.
>> Gerard Filitti: The CDC reported not long ago that 50, 7% of our daughters and granddaughters felt persistently sad. They also found in their research that 30% of our daughters and granddaughters had seriously contemplated suicide. that's not a mental health crisis. That's a mental health disaster. Medication can help you, but it can't give you hope. Only Christ can give you hope. We shouldn't be looking to the people down the street for mental health conversations. They need to take place in the church. The word of God is strong. We anchor ourselves in God's word.
>> Fred Jackson: So that what Dr. Clinton there, I think, is expressing the tension that's in this courtroom. Yes, she did it, but was she responsible?
>> Ed Vitagliano: Yeah.
>> Fred Jackson: so that's where this trial is going. Also, her lawyer, Kevan Reddington, was interviewed very briefly this morning before he went in the courtroom. Cut number 11.
>> Speaker E: It's the message. It really is. It's the message that just has reverberated, you know, throughout the whole country.
>> Gerard Filitti: What is that?
>> Ed Vitagliano: Fighting for women's rights?
>> Speaker E: No, I don't. I think. I think that it's the mental health system. I hate to use the word health care, because unfortunately, in this case, we can see it hasn't been health care. And I think that it shines a light on this, issue. I mean, when a woman is going through what so many people do, and they go to a doctor and the doctor says, you know, here, take this pill. Take that pill. Take this pill, and then they basically treat them for 15, 20 minutes and send them on their way, it's just not right.
>> Fred Jackson: So it's going to be interesting to see where the jury comes down on this. today, I think, is the final day for defense witnesses. And, then there'll be summations and a charge to the jury, and it's going to be very interesting to see where this ends up.
>> Ed Vitagliano: You know, Steve, those statistics that Tim Clinton cited that. That was startling about. I think he said 30% of our daughters and granddaughters have thought about suicide. 57% feel, sad. in a perpetual sense. There's. There is something going on in this country. We've seen all kinds of stats about where the number one most medicated country in the world. In the midst of having so much. There is something. I agree with Tim Clinton. I'm not disregarding the actual mental health aspects of this, but there is, on top of that, something spiritual going on.
>> Steve Jordahl: Yeah, I agree. Both things are true. There is such a thing as mental illness, chemical imbalance, brain disorders. and with regard to.
Up to 20% of women experience postpartum depression after childbirth
Let me just throw this out there. With regard to the Lindsay Clancy, issue, about one in seven women experience postpartum depression. Up to 20% of women experience some depression, postpartum depression, after having a child.
>> Ed Vitagliano: And what is the. I'M not, up on all this. I've heard this and read some things, but what is. Generally, you may not know I'm ambushing here. What is the. Usually the. The culprit in terms of what is causing it. What is causing. Is this just the chemical imbalance.
>> Steve Jordahl: Yeah. Having a baby, a mom's, chemical makeup. Her. not the genes, but the. The hormones. Hormones. That's the word I'm looking for. after giving birth, your hormones are doing all kinds. Your body's crazy.
>> Ed Vitagliano: I mean, this is a real rebound thing here.
>> Steve Jordahl: God designed an amazing thing when he designed a woman to give birth.
>> Ed Vitagliano: another human being inside your body,
>> Steve Jordahl: but it's hard on the body.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Right.
>> Steve Jordahl: So, those chemical imbalances, those hormonal, swings cause depression. and mom looks at. And she just feels what I hear she feels tired of. I don't want to take care of this kid anymore. I mean, this just drive me up a wall. Yeah, that's. That's, postpartum depression. Postpartum psychosis is something that occurs in about one in a thousand births, about 0.1%. And this is an actual psychosis like they were reporting with Lindsay Clancy. Hearing voices.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Right.
>> Steve Jordahl: Telling you that, you need to kill your child or do something.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Yeah.
>> Steve Jordahl: and other things that psychotic, issues. So, to your point, Yes, I think that there are such a thing as mental illness. But we also. Scripture is very clear that demons and the enemy Satan loves to confuse and confound people's minds. And a lot of times when someone is demon possessed in the Bible and is cured, mental illness goes away with the demon. Yeah, I would be the last person to say that. And some do. All mental illness is a spiritual problem. Throw all psychologists away. Or that the Bible has nothing to say about it. I agree with you. I think it's a balance. There are some things that we do, more things than we want to admit. We need to use scriptural principles and go and have spiritual resources to fight.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Yeah. I guess what. What I would want to just say is you. We have a culture that is increasingly cut off from the life and the light of God. Okay. Because people have turned away, and that means spiritual darkness is going to come in. And I guess what I'm saying is it is never going hurt a person to find Christ. And that is not going to be the automatic cure. Mentally, emotionally, or physically, or your circumstances, the circumstances of life, all those things don't automatically change. But as Dr. Tim Clinton was saying, you do Find a new purpose in life, Fred, and a new hope. And to understand that God loves you is not going to hurt anyone in these difficult circumstances. It can only help them even as they continue to fight against whatever plagued them before they came to know the Lord.
>> Fred Jackson: And, praise the Lord for organizations like the American association of Christian Counselors, because they bring that spiritual element into this, that God is bigger than the biggest problem that you have. And God can, through the influence of the Holy Spirit, you get scripture from a Christian counselor. and that is not to diminish, as I think you alluded, to Steve, that sometimes it is a combination of, chemical issues being involved too. So it's not to dismiss the physical medical community from this, but when we go in for counseling, in this case, with a Christian counselor, they can bring this. Have you prayed about this? Have you sought God's help in this, that God can overcome? A Christian counselor can give a hope that a medical doctor cannot give. So that's why it's so important. We know postpartum, blues for most women, that's what it is. They get through this eventually. But in this case, this is a serious case. I would assume that Lindsay Clancy will spend the rest of her life in special care. I think that's probably the route this is going to go.
About 11% of American adults are on prescription medication for depression
>> Ed Vitagliano: You found some statistics. Go ahead. Before we go on to another subject,
>> Steve Jordahl: we are incredibly over medicated as a society. And any of us that are getting older know this. my. The number of medications I'm on seems to go up every month as they find something new to treat.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Right.
>> Steve Jordahl: But we're treating a lot of stuff with pills that we could treat with exercise and discipline. But According to the CDC, about 11. A little more than 11% of American adults are on some form of prescription medication for depression.
>> Ed Vitagliano: It's more than one. Just over.
>> Gerard Filitti: But yeah.
>> Ed Vitagliano: More than one out of every ten.
>> Steve Jordahl: Yeah. yeah. So it's one in 11 or so, one in six women. so, that's a real issue going on.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Yeah, something's going on.
>> Steve Jordahl: I think there's a lot that could be done if we were a healthier society. Physically healthier.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Yeah.
California special ed teacher put on suspension over provocative Instagram post
All right, next story.
>> Steve Jordahl: All right, I want to introduce you to a, a woman named Keisha Day. She is a special ed teacher in, the Fresno area of California. Madera Unified School District. She's in trouble, though. She has been put on suspension and, because of, of some posts that you put out on Instagram. And I want to play you one? yeah, let's, let's listen to cut 16 sergeant.
>> Speaker E: Today I'm starting a black militia.
>> Ed Vitagliano: So if you're black, if you want
>> Steve Jordahl: to shoot some guns, come find me. We're gonna rob some white people.
>> Fred Jackson: Yeah, that might get you in trouble.
>> Ed Vitagliano: She posted that? Listen, even if she's being funny, has she drawn the attention of law enforcement with that post?
>> Steve Jordahl: yeah, she she, she has there investigating. She has other posts that show her with guns, a long gun and a pistol at a shooting range. So she's trained in them. But she says that she was sorry she, it was a poorly thought ah, out post. And the reason I'm bringing it in though is because we have a ah, whole community of minorities in this country that have been told that they are victims and it has caused a lot of anger, misplaced anger I think. But we see this in the teen takeover, phenomenon that we're seeing where hundreds of teens, mostly African American teens will descend on a store, a mall, intersection and basically cause havoc. And we're seeing it in the crime rate statistics. The over some people say that we have more African Americans in jail than we should have. but I think that as a society we have told people that they are victims, that they deserve more and that the white person has been doing it to them. That's why you get things like this Tanisha Daily.
>> Ed Vitagliano: She's black. I haven't seen the video.
>> Steve Jordahl: She's black.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Okay, well listen, as somebody who, by the way folks, don't misunderstand us, we have, we have plenty of, there are plenty of fine young African American young people in this country, some of them who work here with us. But as somebody who has been. Who has not been careful with his speech when trying to be funny, I'm talking about myself. there is an implicit danger. You think it's funny and you say something and it turns out not to be funny. And the pressure to to get eyeballs on your posts I think leads a lot of people to say things that ordinarily they might have taken a little bit more time to think about it. that apparently is what happened here in this case. I hope that's the explanation. I hope she is not thinking that her life or the lives of any of her friends or family are going to be made better by robbing anyone. And it's evidence of a very sad mindset.
>> Steve Jordahl: Yeah, she says she's genuinely heartbroken about the careless posts that cause people to question her character. So she says she's sorry.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Well, yeah.
>> Fred Jackson: Good.
>> Steve Jordahl: Good for her.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Listen, people make mistakes. That was a stupid thing to post. I hope she learns from it. But a lot of people feel pressure to post something outrageous or provocative on social media. It's called, you know, rage baiting. And this, time it wound up with her getting the attention of law enforcement and she changes it. Or.
>> Fred Jackson: This is the kind of thing that happens when a person is not taught responsibility, that there are consequences to actions. Whether consequences to something you say, consequences to something that you do and when you remove consequences. And that's many times. And we could have a whole discussion of parental discipline and all of that sort of thing that kids need to be taught, that if you do something wrong, there is a consequence.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Right?
>> Fred Jackson: And if that is kind of, burned into your brain early, you carry that through life. You think about things, think about consequences before you do or say something. And, so that's. We have to. And it usually goes back to what was the home environment, what was the school environment, right? You know, you're in grade two and you say something you shouldn't in class, there should be a consequence, right? that just has to be. I think we have to return to that kind of thing.
>> Ed Vitagliano: And those consequences. What those consequences do is they train a child and then a young person to restrain themselves and to direct their feelings and their ideas in a more constructive direction. I've used this example before for my own life. I did not grow up in a Christian home. When I got to high school, I, with my friends, drank. I was a sinner, okay? I did sinful things, but I would not take drugs. And I would not take drugs because my dad, the former Marine, he, hated. He hated marijuana. That was hippie weed. I knew I feared my dad more than I feared the disapproval of my partying friends. And I would tell them, no way. They say, oh, come on. I'd say, no. If my dad finds out, he'll kill me. I would have gotten in trouble for underage drinking as well. But I wouldn't have died. I would have died doing the hippie thing. And the point I'm making is that even non Christian young people can learn to restrain themselves and direct their activities in a more productive and constructive way. If they have a mom and dad at home who teaches them about consequences and they learn to respect authority in the home and they. That gets transferred to respecting the authority at school and respecting authority in, the streets.
>> Fred Jackson: I think the Bible says, bring them up in the way they should go. And when they're old, they won't depart from it.
>> Ed Vitagliano: The Bible is true, folks. That's what we believe and we stand by it.
American Family Radio focuses on Christian perspectives on today's news
All right. We had some different discussions today. Had a great discussion with Alex McFarland. This was a good discussion about mental health issues. You can hear all kinds of stuff like that on American Family Radio. We approach the events and incidences in our world from a Christian perspective. And with that in mind, there's more great programming directly ahead on American Family Radio. Tomorrow, Lord willing, we'll see you on Trivia Friday.
Ed Vitagliano to go to Boston this fall for spiritual heritage tour
>> Today's Issues continues on AFR with your host, Ed Vitagliano.
>> Ed Vitagliano: And welcome back to Today's Issues. Ed Vitagliano sitting in for Tim Wildmon today. Tim will be back in the Captain's chair for Trivia Friday tomorrow. So, folks, make sure you tune in. We'll have a little bit of fun. Tim and I think, J.J. jasper will be on as well. So we'll have some fun, and, do some learning on, what we call Learning University. join in studio by Fred Jackson. And now Steve Paisley Jordal joins us. Hey, what's up? How you doing? I'm doing. I'm doing good. How you doing?
>> Steve Jordahl: How you doing?
>> Ed Vitagliano: By the way, I am going to get two chances to, go to Boston here this fall.
>> Steve Jordahl: I'm kind of jealous.
>> Ed Vitagliano: I'll listen. I am looking forward to it. I'm going with one of our spiritual heritage tours, I think the third week in September. Looking forward to that. Going with Wesley and Walker. And, we do. You do have. On these tours, you do have some free time. So Wesley, Walker and I and, Kevan Parker and Chuck Bunn, who, do our security here and usually go with our groups when we go on a tour. We're to go see the Red Sox. Listen, I have never been to Fenway. No, I. I used to tease my dad. I did grow up in the. I. I was born and spent some of my early years in the Boston area, Peabody and Wakefield. I had family in Reading and Lowell, Massachusetts, in the Boston area. But, I don't know. I was 8 years old or whatever. We moved across the state line, Nasher, NewSong Hampshire. And that's where I really grew up. My dad was always promising me to take me to Fenway. We were that close. It's like people who grow up in NewSong York City and never go to the Statue of Liberty. I was, dad, when we go into Fenway, we're gonna do it. We're gonna do it. And then he moved the family to NewSong Mexico, and we never got back there. I used to tease him, the poor guy, to the day he died. I would say, you know, I love you, dad, but you never took me to Fenway. Well, now I'm going, Lord willing. And then in October, going, back for my 50th high school reunion.
>> Fred Jackson: Oh, nice.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Yeah. So that's just for a weekend. and so, anyway, look, I am really looking forward, to going.
>> Fred Jackson: Who are they playing?
>> Ed Vitagliano: NewSong England.
>> Fred Jackson: Who are the Sox playing?
>> Ed Vitagliano: They're playing I think the Cleveland Guardians. Oh, yeah. So that's in September. They're in a playoff hunt right now. So, it's, they're having a. Having a good year. I know, I know. It's the Cleveland Indians. Who, Who Are you kidding?
>> Steve Jordahl: The, the Fenway's on my bucket list.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Oh, yeah, listen, and we got pretty decent seats for really reasonable. I, I didn't think there'd be any seats available because of the playoff hunt. but we got some right there on the first baseline. Very, very reasonable. So nice. I, don't think I could talk everybody into going to watch a hockey game. The season wouldn't be underway anyway in September. But anyway, that's boring to probably 99.9 of the people listening. But hey, you may want to know a little thing or two about me.
>> Fred Jackson: So it's a wonderful time of the year to go out of that area.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Yeah.
>> Fred Jackson: Yeah.
>> Ed Vitagliano: You talk about cool weather. I'll probably have to bring a sweater or two. I love that time of year.
>> Fred Jackson: Yeah, fall.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Because of growing up, fall in NewSong England was always my favorite time.
>> Fred Jackson: Absolutely.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Every time.
>> Fred Jackson: Beautiful.
Lindsay Clancy is on trial for murdering her three children
>> Ed Vitagliano: All right, Steve. Hey, let's get going.
>> Steve Jordahl: There is a very tragic case going on. It's a trial that's going on right now. It's in its final stages. And, it is the case of a young mother named Lindsay Clancy who was, suffering from, post birth psychosis and postpartum psychosis and bipolar disorder. And she is charged, she has admitted to. She is on trial for killing her three children, strangling them. And, we're getting to the end of the, of the trial, but it's kind of in the news and people are talking about mental illness in this country and how serious it is. there are a lot of women who think that they have suffered the same, symptoms as Ms. Clancy. And, there are people who say that they haven't because, postpartum psychosis is not postpartum depression. It's what I've been told.
>> Ed Vitagliano: But these are two different.
>> Steve Jordahl: A lot of people identifying with a woman. There's a GoFundMe for a million dollars that's raised almost a million dollars for the family of Lindsay Clancy. who's.
>> Fred Jackson: There are about 300 supporters outside the courtroom this morning.
>> Steve Jordahl: And so it has become kind of a cultural touchstone. And I just wanted to bring it up and get your guys thoughts about what's going on.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Well, you know, Fred, this, this is. I have not been pay to. This, this case simply Because I knew what it was about. And simply because the horrifying way in which these three children were murdered. Strangled, I think. and so those kinds of stories I tend to stay away from because it just, you know, cases, you know, of sexual assault, those kind of things just make my blood boil. it's just such so sad. I've not been paying attention to it as much. I am looking at an article we have on our own website, afn.net covering this because it is all over the news.
>> Fred Jackson: Yeah.
>> Ed Vitagliano: And, so, Fred, I am. I am frankly stunned. Now, we talked about this in our story meeting. This is something I did not know. Lindsay Clancy's attorneys are not, according to what I think I understood this morning, are not disputing the facts that Lindsay murdered her three children.
>> Fred Jackson: That's correct.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Okay. So this is not a case of people supporting her because they think she's innocent. Although there are some people that, who say that it was actually the husband who did it and all those kind of things.
>> Steve Jordahl: Those are a little fringe.
>> Ed Vitagliano: But I'm kind of stunned at the supporters who support Lindsey Clancy, even though the attorneys say, yes, she did it.
>> Fred Jackson: Ah.
>> Ed Vitagliano: What's going on here?
>> Fred Jackson: Well, I think the supporters are pointing to the reality of postpartum psychosis and that obviously she. I mean, we have heard testimony during this trial that she heard a male voice telling her to kill her children after she carried out this horrible, deed. she tried to kill herself. She cut her wrist, and she threw herself off a building. This is why, if you've watched some of the video from the trial, she is in a wheelchair.
>> Ed Vitagliano: She's paralyzed.
>> Fred Jackson: She's paralyzed from the waist down. she is being kept in a special unit right now because she is still very mentally unstable. She has, I was told this morning, two nurses that sit behind her in the court, because they're not sure that there may be an incident in court. So it's a very sad case.
Steve Martin: 30% of our daughters and granddaughters have contemplated suicide
our own Jenna Ellis this morning had Dr. Tim Clinton, who is president of the American association of Christian Counselors. And, Jenna wanted to talk to him about this case. And here's a little bit about what they talked about. just about the whole seriousness of mental illness in this country. It's cut number 12.
>> Gerard Filitti: The CDC reported not long ago that 50, 7% of our daughters and granddaughters felt persistently sad. They also found in their research that 30% of our daughters and granddaughters had seriously contemplated suicide. that's not a mental health crisis. That's a mental health disaster. Medication can help you, but it can't give you hope. Only Christ can give you hope. We shouldn't be looking to the people down the street for mental health conversations. They need to take place in the church. The word of God is strong. We anchor ourselves in God's word.
>> Fred Jackson: So that what Dr. Clinton there, I think, is expressing the tension that's in this courtroom. Yes, she did it, but was she responsible?
>> Ed Vitagliano: Yeah.
>> Fred Jackson: so that's where this trial is going. Also, her lawyer, Kevan Reddington, was interviewed very briefly this morning before he went in the courtroom. Cut number 11.
>> Speaker E: It's the message. It really is. It's the message that just has reverberated, you know, throughout the whole country.
>> Gerard Filitti: What is that?
>> Ed Vitagliano: Fighting for women's rights?
>> Speaker E: No, I don't. I think. I think that it's the mental health system. I hate to use the word health care, because unfortunately, in this case, we can see it hasn't been health care. And I think that it shines a light on this, issue. I mean, when a woman is going through what so many people do, and they go to a doctor and the doctor says, you know, here, take this pill. Take that pill. Take this pill, and then they basically treat them for 15, 20 minutes and send them on their way, it's just not right.
>> Fred Jackson: So it's going to be interesting to see where the jury comes down on this. today, I think, is the final day for defense witnesses. And, then there'll be summations and a charge to the jury, and it's going to be very interesting to see where this ends up.
>> Ed Vitagliano: You know, Steve, those statistics that Tim Clinton cited that. That was startling about. I think he said 30% of our daughters and granddaughters have thought about suicide. 57% feel, sad. in a perpetual sense. There's. There is something going on in this country. We've seen all kinds of stats about where the number one most medicated country in the world. In the midst of having so much. There is something. I agree with Tim Clinton. I'm not disregarding the actual mental health aspects of this, but there is, on top of that, something spiritual going on.
>> Steve Jordahl: Yeah, I agree. Both things are true. There is such a thing as mental illness, chemical imbalance, brain disorders. and with regard to.
Up to 20% of women experience postpartum depression after childbirth
Let me just throw this out there. With regard to the Lindsay Clancy, issue, about one in seven women experience postpartum depression. Up to 20% of women experience some depression, postpartum depression, after having a child.
>> Ed Vitagliano: And what is the. I'M not, up on all this. I've heard this and read some things, but what is. Generally, you may not know I'm ambushing here. What is the. Usually the. The culprit in terms of what is causing it. What is causing. Is this just the chemical imbalance.
>> Steve Jordahl: Yeah. Having a baby, a mom's, chemical makeup. Her. not the genes, but the. The hormones. Hormones. That's the word I'm looking for. after giving birth, your hormones are doing all kinds. Your body's crazy.
>> Ed Vitagliano: I mean, this is a real rebound thing here.
>> Steve Jordahl: God designed an amazing thing when he designed a woman to give birth.
>> Ed Vitagliano: another human being inside your body,
>> Steve Jordahl: but it's hard on the body.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Right.
>> Steve Jordahl: So, those chemical imbalances, those hormonal, swings cause depression. and mom looks at. And she just feels what I hear she feels tired of. I don't want to take care of this kid anymore. I mean, this just drive me up a wall. Yeah, that's. That's, postpartum depression. Postpartum psychosis is something that occurs in about one in a thousand births, about 0.1%. And this is an actual psychosis like they were reporting with Lindsay Clancy. Hearing voices.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Right.
>> Steve Jordahl: Telling you that, you need to kill your child or do something.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Yeah.
>> Steve Jordahl: and other things that psychotic, issues. So, to your point, Yes, I think that there are such a thing as mental illness. But we also. Scripture is very clear that demons and the enemy Satan loves to confuse and confound people's minds. And a lot of times when someone is demon possessed in the Bible and is cured, mental illness goes away with the demon. Yeah, I would be the last person to say that. And some do. All mental illness is a spiritual problem. Throw all psychologists away. Or that the Bible has nothing to say about it. I agree with you. I think it's a balance. There are some things that we do, more things than we want to admit. We need to use scriptural principles and go and have spiritual resources to fight.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Yeah. I guess what. What I would want to just say is you. We have a culture that is increasingly cut off from the life and the light of God. Okay. Because people have turned away, and that means spiritual darkness is going to come in. And I guess what I'm saying is it is never going hurt a person to find Christ. And that is not going to be the automatic cure. Mentally, emotionally, or physically, or your circumstances, the circumstances of life, all those things don't automatically change. But as Dr. Tim Clinton was saying, you do Find a new purpose in life, Fred, and a new hope. And to understand that God loves you is not going to hurt anyone in these difficult circumstances. It can only help them even as they continue to fight against whatever plagued them before they came to know the Lord.
>> Fred Jackson: And, praise the Lord for organizations like the American association of Christian Counselors, because they bring that spiritual element into this, that God is bigger than the biggest problem that you have. And God can, through the influence of the Holy Spirit, you get scripture from a Christian counselor. and that is not to diminish, as I think you alluded, to Steve, that sometimes it is a combination of, chemical issues being involved too. So it's not to dismiss the physical medical community from this, but when we go in for counseling, in this case, with a Christian counselor, they can bring this. Have you prayed about this? Have you sought God's help in this, that God can overcome? A Christian counselor can give a hope that a medical doctor cannot give. So that's why it's so important. We know postpartum, blues for most women, that's what it is. They get through this eventually. But in this case, this is a serious case. I would assume that Lindsay Clancy will spend the rest of her life in special care. I think that's probably the route this is going to go.
About 11% of American adults are on prescription medication for depression
>> Ed Vitagliano: You found some statistics. Go ahead. Before we go on to another subject,
>> Steve Jordahl: we are incredibly over medicated as a society. And any of us that are getting older know this. my. The number of medications I'm on seems to go up every month as they find something new to treat.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Right.
>> Steve Jordahl: But we're treating a lot of stuff with pills that we could treat with exercise and discipline. But According to the CDC, about 11. A little more than 11% of American adults are on some form of prescription medication for depression.
>> Ed Vitagliano: It's more than one. Just over.
>> Gerard Filitti: But yeah.
>> Ed Vitagliano: More than one out of every ten.
>> Steve Jordahl: Yeah. yeah. So it's one in 11 or so, one in six women. so, that's a real issue going on.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Yeah, something's going on.
>> Steve Jordahl: I think there's a lot that could be done if we were a healthier society. Physically healthier.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Yeah.
California special ed teacher put on suspension over provocative Instagram post
All right, next story.
>> Steve Jordahl: All right, I want to introduce you to a, a woman named Keisha Day. She is a special ed teacher in, the Fresno area of California. Madera Unified School District. She's in trouble, though. She has been put on suspension and, because of, of some posts that you put out on Instagram. And I want to play you one? yeah, let's, let's listen to cut 16 sergeant.
>> Speaker E: Today I'm starting a black militia.
>> Ed Vitagliano: So if you're black, if you want
>> Steve Jordahl: to shoot some guns, come find me. We're gonna rob some white people.
>> Fred Jackson: Yeah, that might get you in trouble.
>> Ed Vitagliano: She posted that? Listen, even if she's being funny, has she drawn the attention of law enforcement with that post?
>> Steve Jordahl: yeah, she she, she has there investigating. She has other posts that show her with guns, a long gun and a pistol at a shooting range. So she's trained in them. But she says that she was sorry she, it was a poorly thought ah, out post. And the reason I'm bringing it in though is because we have a ah, whole community of minorities in this country that have been told that they are victims and it has caused a lot of anger, misplaced anger I think. But we see this in the teen takeover, phenomenon that we're seeing where hundreds of teens, mostly African American teens will descend on a store, a mall, intersection and basically cause havoc. And we're seeing it in the crime rate statistics. The over some people say that we have more African Americans in jail than we should have. but I think that as a society we have told people that they are victims, that they deserve more and that the white person has been doing it to them. That's why you get things like this Tanisha Daily.
>> Ed Vitagliano: She's black. I haven't seen the video.
>> Steve Jordahl: She's black.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Okay, well listen, as somebody who, by the way folks, don't misunderstand us, we have, we have plenty of, there are plenty of fine young African American young people in this country, some of them who work here with us. But as somebody who has been. Who has not been careful with his speech when trying to be funny, I'm talking about myself. there is an implicit danger. You think it's funny and you say something and it turns out not to be funny. And the pressure to to get eyeballs on your posts I think leads a lot of people to say things that ordinarily they might have taken a little bit more time to think about it. that apparently is what happened here in this case. I hope that's the explanation. I hope she is not thinking that her life or the lives of any of her friends or family are going to be made better by robbing anyone. And it's evidence of a very sad mindset.
>> Steve Jordahl: Yeah, she says she's genuinely heartbroken about the careless posts that cause people to question her character. So she says she's sorry.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Well, yeah.
>> Fred Jackson: Good.
>> Steve Jordahl: Good for her.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Listen, people make mistakes. That was a stupid thing to post. I hope she learns from it. But a lot of people feel pressure to post something outrageous or provocative on social media. It's called, you know, rage baiting. And this, time it wound up with her getting the attention of law enforcement and she changes it. Or.
>> Fred Jackson: This is the kind of thing that happens when a person is not taught responsibility, that there are consequences to actions. Whether consequences to something you say, consequences to something that you do and when you remove consequences. And that's many times. And we could have a whole discussion of parental discipline and all of that sort of thing that kids need to be taught, that if you do something wrong, there is a consequence.
>> Ed Vitagliano: Right?
>> Fred Jackson: And if that is kind of, burned into your brain early, you carry that through life. You think about things, think about consequences before you do or say something. And, so that's. We have to. And it usually goes back to what was the home environment, what was the school environment, right? You know, you're in grade two and you say something you shouldn't in class, there should be a consequence, right? that just has to be. I think we have to return to that kind of thing.
>> Ed Vitagliano: And those consequences. What those consequences do is they train a child and then a young person to restrain themselves and to direct their feelings and their ideas in a more constructive direction. I've used this example before for my own life. I did not grow up in a Christian home. When I got to high school, I, with my friends, drank. I was a sinner, okay? I did sinful things, but I would not take drugs. And I would not take drugs because my dad, the former Marine, he, hated. He hated marijuana. That was hippie weed. I knew I feared my dad more than I feared the disapproval of my partying friends. And I would tell them, no way. They say, oh, come on. I'd say, no. If my dad finds out, he'll kill me. I would have gotten in trouble for underage drinking as well. But I wouldn't have died. I would have died doing the hippie thing. And the point I'm making is that even non Christian young people can learn to restrain themselves and direct their activities in a more productive and constructive way. If they have a mom and dad at home who teaches them about consequences and they learn to respect authority in the home and they. That gets transferred to respecting the authority at school and respecting authority in, the streets.
>> Fred Jackson: I think the Bible says, bring them up in the way they should go. And when they're old, they won't depart from it.
>> Ed Vitagliano: The Bible is true, folks. That's what we believe and we stand by it.
American Family Radio focuses on Christian perspectives on today's news
All right. We had some different discussions today. Had a great discussion with Alex McFarland. This was a good discussion about mental health issues. You can hear all kinds of stuff like that on American Family Radio. We approach the events and incidences in our world from a Christian perspective. And with that in mind, there's more great programming directly ahead on American Family Radio. Tomorrow, Lord willing, we'll see you on Trivia Friday.
Ed Vitagliano, Fred Jackson, Steve Jordahl, and George Barna discuss the Lindsay Clancy trial and the questions it has raised about postpartum psychosis, severe mental illness, criminal responsibility, and the limits of medication alone. The panel features comments from Dr. Tim Clinton of the American Association of Christian Counselors, who argues that churches should be part of serious mental health conversations because Christ offers hope that medicine cannot provide by itself. The hosts also respond to a California special education teacher suspended after a social media post about starting a “black militia,” using the story to discuss rage-baiting, responsibility, consequences, parental discipline, and biblical instruction for children.
Chapters:
(03:53) Lindsay Clancy trial and postpartum psychosis
(08:05) Dr. Tim Clinton on mental health, churches, and hope in Christ
(09:15) Clancy attorney Kevin Reddington on the mental health system
(10:13) Mental illness, spiritual darkness, and Christian counseling
(16:14) Prescription medication, depression statistics, and physical health
(17:13) California teacher suspended over social media militia post
(20:43) Social media consequences, responsibility, and parental discipline
(22:11) Ed Vitagliano reflects on authority, restraint, and consequences 23:51 Closing comments and AFR programming transition
Ed Vitagliano, Fred Jackson, Steve Jordahl, and George Barna discuss the Lindsay Clancy trial and the questions it has raised about postpartum psychosis, severe mental illness, criminal responsibility, and the limits of medication alone. The panel features comments from Dr. Tim Clinton of the American Association of Christian Counselors, who argues that churches should be part of serious mental health conversations because Christ offers hope that medicine cannot provide by itself. The hosts also respond to a California special education teacher suspended after a social media post about starting a “black militia,” using the story to discuss rage-baiting, responsibility, consequences, parental discipline, and biblical instruction for children.
Chapters:
(03:53) Lindsay Clancy trial and postpartum psychosis
(08:05) Dr. Tim Clinton on mental health, churches, and hope in Christ
(09:15) Clancy attorney Kevin Reddington on the mental health system
(10:13) Mental illness, spiritual darkness, and Christian counseling
(16:14) Prescription medication, depression statistics, and physical health
(17:13) California teacher suspended over social media militia post
(20:43) Social media consequences, responsibility, and parental discipline
(22:11) Ed Vitagliano reflects on authority, restraint, and consequences 23:51 Closing comments and AFR programming transition
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