Rob West: Women are gaining more financial influence than ever before, but for Christian women, the bigger question isn't simply how much wealth they'll control, it's what they'll do with it. I am Rob West. From greater earning power to entrepreneurship and the coming wealth transfer, women are entering a significant season of financial stewardship. Pam Pugh joins us today to talk about using what God has placed in their hands with wisdom and purpose. And then it's on to your calls at 800-525-7000. This is Faith & Finance on American Family Radio. Biblical wisdom for your financial decisions.
Well, our guest today is Pam Pugh, one of the founders of Women Doing Well and president of Virtue Assets Foundation, where she helps individuals and families put their assets to virtuous use. Pam, it is so great to have you with us today.
Pam Pugh: Thanks, Rob. Great to be here.
Rob West: Pam, you've written an important article for our Faithful Steward magazine on women stewarding wealth, looking at how women are increasingly shaping the economic landscape. So, I'd love for you to talk a bit about what's changing right now and why is this such a significant moment?
Pam Pugh: Well, Rob, we are seeing seismic shifts in the financial landscape as women control and influence more personal wealth than in previous generations. Truly, both the amount and the rate of increase are extraordinary. These shifts have been developing for years, and we're only really beginning to see now their full financial impact. So, as women align their growing economic influence with purpose, there's great potential to release resources for good through families, communities, and out into the world. We can look at four major shifts that help explain what's happening.
Rob West: Let's do that. I want to start with the first shift: education and earning power. How has women's economic position changed in those two areas?
Pam Pugh: Well, listen to this. Women now make up 62% of college graduates and earn more than half of all the doctorate degrees granted. Four out of ten physicians and attorneys are women. Among women ages 25 to 54, 78% work outside the home. And now, one in four first-time homebuyers is a single woman. Women make up 80% of consumer purchasing decisions, and women's economic influence is growing both through their earning and their spending.
Rob West: Wow, those numbers are staggering. Now, Pam, I know another major shift is longevity. Women generally live longer than men. So, what unique financial implications does that create?
Pam Pugh: Well, that's right. The average age of widowhood is 59. And women live an average of 5.8 years longer than men. And because women live longer, it's estimated that 90% of us will manage our wealth on our own at some point in our lives. Women are estimated to inherit 124 trillion through the year 2048, and that includes 54 trillion transferred to spouses, mostly widowed baby boomers. So, women already own about 34% of investable assets in the US, and an estimated 53% of those assets aren't currently managed with the help of an investment advisor.
Rob West: Wow, what an opportunity there! Those numbers are staggering, particularly the average age of a widow at 59. That just seems hard to believe, and yet I've seen that before. Powerful. We're also seeing, Pam, significant growth in women-owned businesses. What's driving more women toward entrepreneurship, in your view?
Pam Pugh: Well, that's right. Women often see entrepreneurship as a pathway to create the life they want to live. They're looking for flexibility. In fact, 1 in 11 working-age women is an entrepreneur. Rob, both of my daughters are entrepreneurs, and they're in their early 30s!
Rob West: Wow, incredible!
Pam Pugh: Yes! So, 39% of all closely held enterprises in the US are women-owned, which employ 12.9 million people and generate 3.3 trillion in revenue. Isn't that astounding?
Rob West: It sure is.
Pam Pugh: And for many women, it's really not about making more money. It's freedom, it's flexibility, it's control over their lives. Those are important motivators.
Rob West: They sure are. Wow, these are incredible. Well, after this break, when we come back, we're going to talk more about the shifts that you're describing and the implications of what's taking place. Plus, what it looks like to marry your passion and your purpose with this opportunity for women to lean into what God has entrusted to her specifically. We're talking today with my friend Pam Pugh. Pam is one of the founders of Women Doing Well; she's president of Virtue Assets Foundation, where they help individuals and families put their assets to virtuous use. Back with much more right around the corner. Stay with us.
SEGMENT 2
Rob West: So glad to have you with us today on Faith & Finance on American Family Radio. We're talking about the power of a woman's economic voice. You know, as women gain greater financial influence, the opportunity is about more than wealth, it's about stewardship. And the question is: how faithfully will you use what God has placed in our hands for His glory and the good of others? I'm joined today by my friend Pam Pugh. Pam is the president of Virtue Assets Foundation, and she just shared before the break some powerful statistics around really the influence of women today and what's coming through the great wealth transfer. And Pam, you talked about some of the significant shifts taking place right now in education and earning power, in longevity, specifically around the growth in women-owned businesses. The fourth shift that you described in your article in this special edition of Faithful Steward, our magazine, is really interesting. You suggest that as women's economic influence grows, the very definition of wealth is beginning to change. Share a bit more about that.
Pam Pugh: That's right, Rob. Women tend to view wealth more holistically. So, true wealth isn't simply financial; it's not just the numbers. It's physical health, it's spiritual health, along with social and intellectual wealth. So, financial reserves represent freedom. In that way, money is a tool, and it has meaning only as it serves a purpose. So, studies show that women tend to be studious, patient, holistic, and methodical investors. And for most women, ethical investing is important in doing good with what they own.
Rob West: Yeah, I mean we're certainly seeing that in the data, Pam, on our end, that in particular, as we move into the space of faith-based investing starting to mature, in particular women and the younger generations are more interested in leaning in.
Pam Pugh: That's right. That's right.
Rob West: Yeah, very fascinating. We've also established that women have a growing economic voice. So, for a Christian woman, how should that shape the way she thinks about her responsibility as a steward?
Pam Pugh: Yeah, Rob, this is so important. Faithful stewardship takes preparation. In a survey we conducted with widows several years ago, women who prepared in advance fared much better in the long run. Well, we can use an analogy of trip planning if we want to talk about how a woman can prepare for faithful stewardship. So, think about it this way: if you were going overseas for a month, you would plan. First, you would consider where you're going and what you'll need when you arrive. Second, you'll look at what you already have for that journey. And finally, you would want to talk to others who would help prepare you for that journey.
Rob West: Yeah, that's exactly right. It absolutely takes preparation. And you described the first step in that preparation as "dream." What does it mean to begin there? Talk about that.
Pam Pugh: So, sometimes this can be a challenging part of the process, just to get started. But what I'll typically say is envision your life five years from now. Prayerfully ask yourself, "If I were confident that God was with me, what would I explore?" Now, here's a secret I'm going to share with you: write this down. Get your journal out and write it down. Neuroscientific research is telling us that we increase our potential for success multiple times over when we write it down. It's actually called neuro-encoding. Our brain processes information more deeply when we write out our thoughts and goals on paper. Secondly, I say make it tangible. So, when you're writing this out, you might start with a phrase like this: "It's the year 2031, and I'm X years old." It's a bit sobering! What does your life look like? What does it sound like? Awaken those five senses. What does it feel like? What values are reflected in your life? So, be intentional about where you're headed and why.
Rob West: I love that framework because answering that simple question might be the single thing that gets her unstuck, maybe to start this journey, is that right?
Pam Pugh: That's exactly right.
Rob West: Now, the second step is "inventory," and you connect that idea to God's call for Moses. I'd love for you to unpack that a bit.
Pam Pugh: Yes! Yes, it really hit me one day when I was studying Exodus, Moses' call. And when God called Moses to this tremendous journey to free the Israelites, Moses was reluctant, and he offered excuse after excuse, reasons why he couldn't meet this great calling. And finally, remember God asked him in Exodus 4:2, "Moses, what's in your hand?" Moses had a shepherd's staff in his hand—such an ordinary object—and he probably didn't even see it as something God could use in his calling. I think we can ask ourselves the same question: What has God already placed in my hand? You know, nothing's wasted in God's economy, that's such a wonderful truth. We have relationships, resources, financial means, knowledge, experience... Rob, even our hardships can provide resources for our journey. So, ask God to show you what's in your hand, and remember the secret: write it down.
Rob West: Yes! Well, I love that question, "What's in your hand?" because I can imagine once a woman has considered where God may be leading her, and then taken inventory of what He's already entrusted to her, she's ready to move forward. Then what comes next?
Pam Pugh: Okay, so then we want to talk about it. When you're excited about an upcoming trip, you talk about it. You want to talk about your goals with your friends and peers, and each of those times, it increases our psychological ownership and commitment to that journey. So, just as we talk about an upcoming trip and plan for it, if we want to live and give well, we need to plan for it. Now, here's where I'd say it's wise to find a like-minded advisor and share your vision for the future. A Kingdom-minded advisor can help you develop a strategy for reaching those goals and for strengthening your economic voice. So, the whole idea is prepare intentionally for the journey ahead.
Rob West: That's well said. Now, Pam, as you consider all of these shifts you've described—them the wealth transfer, the greater earning power, the entrepreneurship, and women's growing financial influence—what do you most hope Christian women will understand about this moment we're in right now?
Pam Pugh: So, I want women to realize we have tremendous opportunity to make real change. There has never been a time that God has resourced women as today. So, the question isn't simply how much influence or wealth women will have; it's what they'll do with it. And we can prayerfully consider what God has already placed in our hands and use it for His glory and for the good of those around us. What an opportunity!
Rob West: Pam, we're about out of time, but I want to double back on the role of the advisor for a moment. What have you seen in terms of the power of the advisor in this relationship?
Pam Pugh: Right. So, I think sometimes as women we can stall out because there's things we don't know, and we look out into the future and we're not sure, "Will I have enough? Will I be able to finish well?" And so I talked to a lady actually yesterday, and she called asking, "How does she find a good Kingdom-minded advisor? What are the right questions to ask?" And as we further explored it, she said, "You have helped me alleviate some of my greatest concerns in going forward." By finding a Kingdom-minded advisor, the advisor can project out into the future given what is already in your hand and what your plans are: Will you have enough? What investment objectives do you need to have so that you will have enough and be able to accomplish those goals? It really puts fuel into your purpose.
Rob West: Oh, that's incredible! And by the way, folks, we talk about it all the time, if you want to find a Certified Kingdom Advisor in your area, just head to findacka.com. Pam, this has been fabulous. We're going to have to have you back real soon. Thanks for your time.
Pam Pugh: Thanks, Rob.
Rob West: That's Pam Pugh, co-founder of Women Doing Well and president of Virtue Assets Foundation. You can read more from Pam on this topic in a special resource we're releasing this month. It's our special edition of Faithful Steward magazine. Learn more at faithfi.com. We'll be right back.
SEGMENT 3
Rob West: Well, thanks for joining us today on Faith & Finance on American Family Radio. I'm Rob West. Looking forward to taking your calls and questions today back in the studio live, in fact, in a brand new studio today. We've made a big move while I was out last week on vacation. We're coming to you from our brand new studio, which does have video capabilities. Now, we're not streaming the broadcast at this point, but we do have the ability to capture some video, just looking for ways to continue to enhance how we equip you to be a faithful steward of God's resources. Nevertheless, great to be back in the studio live today, looking forward to taking your questions. Perhaps over the last week there's been something you're wrestling with in your financial life, you'd like to talk about it. We'd love to hear from you. The number: 800-525-7000. Patty's standing by to take your calls today right now, 800-525-7000. Whether you're living, giving, owing, or growing God's money, whatever it is today, whether it's, you know, investing in the markets, navigating the volatility we're experiencing right now. Maybe it's just staying on budget with these prices where they are, or perhaps it's how do I give more intentionally? Maybe you're trying to dump some debt. Whatever's going on in your life today, we would love to hear about it. Again, those numbers, or that number to call: 800-525-7000. Again, that's 800-525-7000. We will dive into those questions here in just a moment. We do have some lines open.
In the news today, retirement used to mean leaving work behind for good, but a growing number of Americans are keeping work a part of the picture, and that could make a significant difference financially. According to Northwestern Mutual's 2026 Planning & Progress Study, 41% of Americans say they're either working or planning to work during their retirement years, and money isn't the only reason. Among those planning to work in retirement, 56% say they want to continue feeling useful or stimulated. Another 48% want additional income to support their preferred lifestyle. 47% say they'll need the extra income to afford retirement. Investopedia actually looked at retirement costs recently across the country using the familiar 4% withdrawal rule. We've talked about that before. Remember that came from a gentleman with the last name Bengen. He updated that recently to 4.7%, so closer to 5% now. Nevertheless, the Investopedia study found that if one spouse earns just $10,000 a year for the first 10 years of retirement, the couple may need about $100,000 less in retirement savings. Now, at $20,000 a year, that drops the saving target by about $200,000. Wow, that's a real difference! The principle is straightforward: every dollar you earn from part-time work is a dollar you won't need to withdraw from retirement savings. Well, that can help preserve your nest egg, particularly during the important early years of retirement.
Continued work may also give you greater flexibility about when to claim Social Security. For those who can afford to wait, delaying benefits can produce a larger monthly benefit later. We've talked about this: 8% a year up to age 70, where it stops growing. But work has value beyond a paycheck, of course. Scripture reminds us that God created us for productive purposes. Retirement may change how we work, but it doesn't necessarily mean retiring from meaningful service. Remember that picture we see in God's Word of the person with years at the city gate, dispensing wisdom, that crown of gray hair? Think about the experience, the opportunity for mentorship, not the least of which is your ability to still contribute in a work capacity. So, if you're approaching retirement, don't assume the only question is, "When can I stop working?" Perhaps a better question may be, "What kind of work makes sense in this next season?" because even a modest amount of enjoyable, purposeful work could strengthen both your finances, your health, and your sense of calling. Hope that's an encouragement to you today.
All right, we're going to dive into your questions. Again, that number with just two lines open at the moment: 800-525-7000. Let's begin in Arkansas today. Douglas, how can I help?
Douglas: Yeah, yes. We bought my wife a car just recently, about a month ago, and it's about $43,000. And I have a CD coming up due in October, and it's got $83,000 in it. So, I'm trying to decide whether I need to pay the car off or pay—I can borrow money off my CD for 1% above what my CD's making. So, I just kind of want a little direction about the best way of trying to take care of this car issue.
Rob West: Yeah, and what is the interest rate on that car?
Douglas: About 7.5%.
Rob West: Yeah. So, at a 7.5% car loan, Douglas, you know, I'd really guarantee that—or look at that guaranteed interest cost with what the CD is actually earning after taxes. Because, you know, if you look at essentially a guaranteed 7.5% return by eliminating every dollar of interest expense, let's say the CD's earning 4% to 5%, that interest is going to be taxable, generally, so the after-tax return is even lower. And if you're not having to pay an early withdrawal penalty because it's maturing, you know, I think that's great. Now, the key would be we don't want to drain what might be an emergency reserve—although if it's truly your emergency reserve, I wouldn't have it in a CD anyway. So, I think typically speaking, all things being equal, if you're going to have enough liquidity left over and you can pay off that car, then the math is going to favor paying off that 7.5% car loan rather than keeping that money in a lower-yielding CD, especially after tax. Does that make sense, though?
Douglas: Oh, yeah! Oh, yeah, a lot of sense. I just hate draining my CD like that, because it's the difference between having $40,000 and $80,000. But I want to do the smart thing, also.
Rob West: Well, let me ask: what are you all spending monthly?
Douglas: Well, probably about $6,000. I don't really have a set amount right now.
Rob West: All right. Well, it sounds like you'd still have at least six months' worth of expenses if you don't have any savings beyond this. Let's do this: you and I can talk a bit more off the air, but hopefully that gives you a good sense of where to go from here, Douglas. Stay on the line. We'll be right back on Faith & Finance.
SEGMENT 4
Rob West: Great to have you with us today on Faith & Finance here on American Family Radio. You know, when you think about money through the lens of biblical wisdom, it's ultimately either a treasure or a tool. If it's a treasure in our lives, we're trying to ascribe worth, and significance, and security to something that will never deliver on those promises. Well, we're set up for failure. We see that throughout God's Word. Remember the parable of the sower? What choked out the word from bearing a 30, 60, 100-fold return? It was, among other things, the deceitfulness from riches. Remember what Paul said to Timothy: "Don't put your hope in the uncertainty of riches." We don't want money to be a treasure in our lives. Instead, the proper biblical perspective is that of a tool. Money is a tool to accomplish God's purposes for us to enjoy. We see what Boaz did with his field. He didn't go right up to the edge so he could serve the poor. Joseph saved 20%, a fifth, of everything that came in during those years of plenty to be prepared for the famine. When money is a tool, it protects the vulnerable, it advances the gospel, it provides meaningful experiences for our loved ones, it allows us to put food on the table and provide for our families. But we've got to be careful. Is it a treasure or a tool? When it's a treasure, a created thing becomes the object of our affection rather than the Creator Himself. God is our ultimate treasure, money is a tool, God owns everything, our goal: faithfulness. What does faithfulness today look like? That's what we want to help you drive toward on this program each day when you call 800-525-7000. Let's dive right back into your questions today. We're going to go out to Houston, Texas. David, go ahead.
David: Hello.
Rob West: Hi, how can I help?
David: Yes, I was trying to—I'm meeting with a financial advisor tomorrow, and I'm kind of skeptical about going with annuities. It sounds very good. It got laid off last year, and trying to move about $140,000 into it, or partially. So, I'm kind of just wanted to get some advice to see if that's a good idea or not.
Rob West: Yeah. Well, I appreciate the question, and, you know, annuities are a broad category, and it's going to depend heavily on the specific proposal you receive and what your overall objectives are. Annuities are typically not my tool of choice to grow and protect wealth, but ultimately, they do have a place. I'm not someone who says they don't ever have a place; they're just not my default. What are the potential pros? Well, it can provide guaranteed income, it can provide tax-deferred growth, and depending on the contract, it can provide protection from market losses, and that's often why people buy them. Remember, you know, typically annuities are sold to you rather than somebody going out and looking for an annuity. But with those protections, if you will, from market losses and some of those other features, there's always a cost. And so the question is: what is that cost, and is it worth what you're receiving in return? They tend to be complicated and expensive. They have surrender charges, typically for years where you're locking up the money. In addition to that, when you give up the upside, or a portion of it, in exchange for that downside protection, that really limits your overall growth potential. Remember, the result of the average annual returns of the stock market being 9-plus percent a year, if you go back, you know, more than 50 years, comes in large part due to those dramatic upswings of the market that happen over time. Well, if you're giving that up because your upside participation, they call it, is capped, well, you're losing a significant, you know, value that comes from stock market investing. Now, what are you gaining in return? Well, you're gaining that downside floor. But remember, as long as you have the right time horizon and the right mix of investments, the floor doesn't concern me. You know, even if that portion that was in the market, let's say stocks, was down 20 or 30%, which is typically what we would see if we got into a bear market, that portion you wouldn't touch, and you would build the portfolio such that you don't have to. You'd have plenty of income-generating fixed-income type of assets in your portfolio, especially as you're in retirement, such that you could let that stock portion that was down recover, and it always has. I mean, it came back after 1929, came back after '87, came back after the the dot-com bubble burst, came back after the Great Recession of '08, the pandemic. I mean, I could go through the list. The market has always recovered and gone to new highs. The key is you just can't sell while the market is down or try to time it. But at the end of the day, what is the feature you're most interested in here, David, when you're considering an annuity?
David: Well, probably in the next 5 to 7 years, start pulling funds out. For right now, it would be for investing. I do have a special-needs adult child that I would like to have most of it for that purpose of when me and my wife are no longer here, so she'll be able to manage, you know, with my younger daughter. So, but, you know, the rate the rate on the annuity is, I think it's 1.1%?
Rob West: Should should be quite a bit higher than that, so I would take a look at that. But I think the key here in what you just said is you're trying to protect and grow what you have thoughtfully—that's great—and you want to set this up in a way that is thoughtful about how it might be there for your son with special needs in the future. And that's an important consideration as well, but those things aren't mutually exclusive. My preference would be you find a Certified Kingdom Advisor who could build a portfolio for you that gives consideration to your risk tolerance, your income needs, all of these things, allows you to grow that money over time, allows you to not take unnecessary risk, and then with an estate planning attorney, probably put a special needs trust in place, if you don't already have one, maybe an ABLE account alongside that. That's going to ensure that the assets, after you and your wife pass away, are preserved for your son, but done so in a way that does not limit his ability to access any government assistance that may be coming his way as well. And then he could draw the money out as he needs to, you know, for living expenses, both daily and ongoing needs that he might have.
David: Okay. Okay, I got it.
Rob West: So, here's what I would suggest you do: maybe in addition to the meeting you're going to have tomorrow, perhaps you get a second opinion with a Certified Kingdom Advisor who might manage this money outside of an insurance product, which, for the reasons I mentioned, I would probably prefer that approach. That would ensure that, you know, you don't have the lockups, and you get more access to the money without the the complicated features and expenses that come with the annuity. And to find an advisor in Houston that you could interview, maybe two or three that you might interview to find the one that's the best fit, just go to findacka.com. That's findacka.com.
David: Okay, fine. And that'll be within the website of the of the Kingdom Advisor?
Rob West: That's right. It's actually FaithFi's website, findacka.com. You'll be able to put in your zip code, and it'll give you a list of advisors in your area.
David: Okay, excellent.
Rob West: Thank you, David. We appreciate your call. If I can help further along the way, don't hesitate to reach out. All right, a quick break. Bob Doll stops by in our final segment. We'll get his read on the market as we start a new trading week, and we'll try to get to a few more questions right after this. Stick around.
SEGMENT 5
Rob West: Great to have you with us today on Faith & Finance here on American Family Radio. I'm Rob West. We'll get back to those phones here in just a moment, but first, our good friend Bob Doll is here. Bob's our go-to guy on the market; he's Chief Executive Officer and Chief Investment Officer at Crossmark Global Investments, a leader in faith-based investing. And Bob, I know we were off last week. Great to have you back. A lot going on in these markets! You've got a special market commentary out today on the bond market that's getting a lot of attention right now. Give us a rundown on that.
Bob Doll: Yeah, bonds have been in a bear market really since COVID. The yield on the 10-year Treasury got well under 1%, and now they've crossed 5% to the upside, which means bond prices have suffered. A lot of the reason, Rob, is lingering/sticky inflation, and a lot of that is caused by oil prices. And when you have those two things going up—that is, the price of oil and interest rates—that's why there's more red on the screen in the stock market than normal. It's going to take a while to get out of this, most likely, and so we're just going to have to be patient investors.
Rob West: Bob, so many crosscurrents here. We had President Xi, obviously, visiting the White House, expected perhaps in some sort of announcement, didn't really get anything. We are hearing from President Trump that he's rejecting the Iranian proposal to reopen the strait. Sounds like he maybe is suspect around how well that might hold. Oil going up, the market selling off. I mean, how do we evaluate where we find ourselves right now?
Bob Doll: Well, to add to what you just said, The Wall Street Journal had an article that says the President's likely to resume bombing post-election because the two sides can't come to an agreement, and neither side trusts each other. So behind all this, of course, is an economy. And the economy so far, as you and I have talked many weeks, has been doing just fine, enabling earnings to advance at a spectacular rate. And that's why all these political and geopolitical issues until now haven't mattered. We've argued that when interest rates are going up, the pace of increase is more important than the level. And it's been very gradual until the last couple weeks; now it's picking up some steam. So either interest rates have to stop moving up, or we probably have a bit of a pullback in stocks. But the economy underneath the surface so far—so good.
Rob West: Bob, what about AI? Of course, it's been such a huge driver of the market and some of the economic productivity as of late. Obviously, a lot of questions swirling around just the safety of it. We've got now an announcement out from Nvidia today around perhaps a software solution to some of the protections. Do you feel like there's some potential issues here that could bear out in the market?
Bob Doll: So every new technology has this kind of concern: What's it going to do to our everyday way of life? Like all technologies, Rob, this one will create some incredibly positive things for economy and productivity. But there'll be some people who use it for evil. And we're just going to have to try to sort that out, monitor it, to some degree regulate it. Every new technology has this possibility. So I don't think we're going to wake up and there'll be a billion people dead, as some people are saying. But I do believe we're going to have to keep our eye on the inevitable negative consequences of something new in the hands of the wrong people.
Rob West: Bob, we've obviously got this midterm coming up here ever so quickly. Where do you feel like the market heads between now and the end of the year?
Bob Doll: So first of all, the polls are suggesting the Republicans are going to lose the House and maybe the Senate. Historically, when the President's party loses in either House or both Houses, the next 12 months, stocks do just fine, thank you! So I don't know if it matters a whole lot in that sense. Now look, if the Democrats take the House and the Senate, among the things they will do is investigate President Trump, impeach President Trump, and we have to deal with all of that, Rob. So we have to come back to a hope and a prayer that our economy stays okay.
Rob West: Bob, we always appreciate your time, my friend. Thanks for stopping by.
Bob Doll: Enjoy the week. Bye-bye.
Rob West: All right, that's Bob Doll. You can learn more at crossmarkglobal.com. While you're there, sign up for his weekly market commentary. All right, let's try to sneak in a few more phone calls here today before we round out the program. Bill's been waiting patiently in Corpus Christi, Texas. Bill, go ahead, sir.
Bill: Hi, Rob. Listen, I need some help. I'm trying to determine what to do with some unsecured debt that I have, in the $15,000 to $20,000 range, but I just don't know what direction to go into. So what I'm looking for is somebody that I can trust to give me the correct guidance as to what path I need to take. Do you have any advice for me?
Rob West: I sure do, and I appreciate you calling, Bill, about this. I know this is weighing heavy on you. In terms of what has got you to this point, do you feel like you have resolved the issue that led to the debt in the first place, or do you think there's a spending and income issue that could contribute to additional debt moving forward?
Bill: Well, there was an employment issue, because I'm still working. I'm 76, but I'm still having to work. And I went the last three or four months without any extra income coming in, so that's where everything fell apart for me. So I need to recover from that, is what I'm looking at.
Rob West: Yeah. Yeah. But you have got to a place where you can live within your means and fund the minimum payment at this point?
Bill: I'm hoping so, yes.
Rob West: Okay. Yeah, my preferred option is what's called credit counseling or debt management. So there's several approaches people will take when they get a growing amount of unsecured credit card debt. One is what's called debt settlement; I do not recommend it. It's where you stop paying, you work through a debt settlement company—some of them unscrupulous, some of them above board—but the strategy is always the same: they ask you to stop paying, it lets the account get past due, which wreaks havoc on your credit report; they have you continue to make the monthly payment not to the creditor, but to a savings account to build up a war chest; and then they start negotiating behind the scenes to try to get a reduced payoff. I don't like it; it's fraught with problems, not the least of which is it will just really destroy your credit. The other is a loan consolidation where you take out a new loan to roll the debt up and try to lower the interest rate; I don't like that approach either. The third option is my preferred option: it's what is called debt management. The cards would stay with the existing creditors, but if you work through a non-profit credit counseling agency like our friends at Christian Credit Counselors, which thousands of our listeners have worked with successfully, it'll slide over to a department that's only accessible through credit counseling. Immediately, the interest rate will drop. If you're behind, it gets re-aged. You now make one monthly payment similar to what you're paying now, except it's going to be a level payment—it doesn't decline as the balance comes down—and with that lower interest rate, typically somewhere between 0% and 10%, depends on the creditor, you'll pay it off on average 80% faster. So that would be the way that I would go, Bill. While those cards are in that program, they will be suspended—you won't be able to make new charges—but it is the most effective way that I've found to get out of debt once and for all. So you would just want to head to christiancreditcounselors.org—that's christiancreditcounselors.org—or if it's easier, go to faithfi.com/ccc. But does that make sense?
Bill: Yes, it does, and I thank you so much! I really appreciate you.
Rob West: Well, happy to do it, and I appreciate you, Bill. And if I can help further along the way, don't hesitate to reach out. Lord bless you, my friend. Let's quickly go to Arkansas. Harlene, how can I help?
Harlene: Thank you for taking the call. I am calling on the behalf of my son, who is a working adult. He lost his job a little over two years ago and was unemployed for about a year, so it really set him back. But now he has some student loans that were deferred when the Biden administration was in, so he's having to start paying those student loans back, and it's around $6,500. Recently, I thought I heard you maybe answer another caller's question two or three weeks back about this same situation. So I was wondering if you have any advice on something that he could make a payment plan, or who could he get in contact with?
Rob West: Yeah. Are these federal loans, Harlene?
Harlene: Yes, MOHELA.
Rob West: Okay, yeah. So what he would want to do is, you know, he can look at the income-based options, including the newer what's called Repayment Assistance Plan (RAP, for short). The government's repayment calculator will show his eligible plans; it will estimate the monthly payments, give you the total repayment amount and potential discharge amounts if that's available. So he's going to want to go ahead and check that out. It's available at studentaid.gov, and he can compare the repayment plans. Again, it's the repayment calculator; that's going to be the starting point. He's got plenty of options available to him because these are federal loans. We're going to want to leave them as federal loans—we don't want to refinance them privately—because that's going to give him the most flexibility. I realize this is a huge amount; it's probably weighing on him. I think he'll feel a lot better when he's got a plan that fits his budget and he's actually making some progress, and I think studentaid.gov is the place to start. So if we can help further along the way, don't hesitate to reach out, Harlene, and thanks for your call today. That's going to do it for us today, folks. Big thanks to Michael, Devin, Pat, everybody here at FaithFi that makes this possible, Jim as well today serving us with great research. Come back and join us tomorrow; we'll see you then. Bye-bye.
Rob West: Women are gaining more financial influence than ever before, but for Christian women, the bigger question isn't simply how much wealth they'll control, it's what they'll do with it. I am Rob West. From greater earning power to entrepreneurship and the coming wealth transfer, women are entering a significant season of financial stewardship. Pam Pugh joins us today to talk about using what God has placed in their hands with wisdom and purpose. And then it's on to your calls at 800-525-7000. This is Faith & Finance on American Family Radio. Biblical wisdom for your financial decisions.
Well, our guest today is Pam Pugh, one of the founders of Women Doing Well and president of Virtue Assets Foundation, where she helps individuals and families put their assets to virtuous use. Pam, it is so great to have you with us today.
Pam Pugh: Thanks, Rob. Great to be here.
Rob West: Pam, you've written an important article for our Faithful Steward magazine on women stewarding wealth, looking at how women are increasingly shaping the economic landscape. So, I'd love for you to talk a bit about what's changing right now and why is this such a significant moment?
Pam Pugh: Well, Rob, we are seeing seismic shifts in the financial landscape as women control and influence more personal wealth than in previous generations. Truly, both the amount and the rate of increase are extraordinary. These shifts have been developing for years, and we're only really beginning to see now their full financial impact. So, as women align their growing economic influence with purpose, there's great potential to release resources for good through families, communities, and out into the world. We can look at four major shifts that help explain what's happening.
Rob West: Let's do that. I want to start with the first shift: education and earning power. How has women's economic position changed in those two areas?
Pam Pugh: Well, listen to this. Women now make up 62% of college graduates and earn more than half of all the doctorate degrees granted. Four out of ten physicians and attorneys are women. Among women ages 25 to 54, 78% work outside the home. And now, one in four first-time homebuyers is a single woman. Women make up 80% of consumer purchasing decisions, and women's economic influence is growing both through their earning and their spending.
Rob West: Wow, those numbers are staggering. Now, Pam, I know another major shift is longevity. Women generally live longer than men. So, what unique financial implications does that create?
Pam Pugh: Well, that's right. The average age of widowhood is 59. And women live an average of 5.8 years longer than men. And because women live longer, it's estimated that 90% of us will manage our wealth on our own at some point in our lives. Women are estimated to inherit 124 trillion through the year 2048, and that includes 54 trillion transferred to spouses, mostly widowed baby boomers. So, women already own about 34% of investable assets in the US, and an estimated 53% of those assets aren't currently managed with the help of an investment advisor.
Rob West: Wow, what an opportunity there! Those numbers are staggering, particularly the average age of a widow at 59. That just seems hard to believe, and yet I've seen that before. Powerful. We're also seeing, Pam, significant growth in women-owned businesses. What's driving more women toward entrepreneurship, in your view?
Pam Pugh: Well, that's right. Women often see entrepreneurship as a pathway to create the life they want to live. They're looking for flexibility. In fact, 1 in 11 working-age women is an entrepreneur. Rob, both of my daughters are entrepreneurs, and they're in their early 30s!
Rob West: Wow, incredible!
Pam Pugh: Yes! So, 39% of all closely held enterprises in the US are women-owned, which employ 12.9 million people and generate 3.3 trillion in revenue. Isn't that astounding?
Rob West: It sure is.
Pam Pugh: And for many women, it's really not about making more money. It's freedom, it's flexibility, it's control over their lives. Those are important motivators.
Rob West: They sure are. Wow, these are incredible. Well, after this break, when we come back, we're going to talk more about the shifts that you're describing and the implications of what's taking place. Plus, what it looks like to marry your passion and your purpose with this opportunity for women to lean into what God has entrusted to her specifically. We're talking today with my friend Pam Pugh. Pam is one of the founders of Women Doing Well; she's president of Virtue Assets Foundation, where they help individuals and families put their assets to virtuous use. Back with much more right around the corner. Stay with us.
SEGMENT 2
Rob West: So glad to have you with us today on Faith & Finance on American Family Radio. We're talking about the power of a woman's economic voice. You know, as women gain greater financial influence, the opportunity is about more than wealth, it's about stewardship. And the question is: how faithfully will you use what God has placed in our hands for His glory and the good of others? I'm joined today by my friend Pam Pugh. Pam is the president of Virtue Assets Foundation, and she just shared before the break some powerful statistics around really the influence of women today and what's coming through the great wealth transfer. And Pam, you talked about some of the significant shifts taking place right now in education and earning power, in longevity, specifically around the growth in women-owned businesses. The fourth shift that you described in your article in this special edition of Faithful Steward, our magazine, is really interesting. You suggest that as women's economic influence grows, the very definition of wealth is beginning to change. Share a bit more about that.
Pam Pugh: That's right, Rob. Women tend to view wealth more holistically. So, true wealth isn't simply financial; it's not just the numbers. It's physical health, it's spiritual health, along with social and intellectual wealth. So, financial reserves represent freedom. In that way, money is a tool, and it has meaning only as it serves a purpose. So, studies show that women tend to be studious, patient, holistic, and methodical investors. And for most women, ethical investing is important in doing good with what they own.
Rob West: Yeah, I mean we're certainly seeing that in the data, Pam, on our end, that in particular, as we move into the space of faith-based investing starting to mature, in particular women and the younger generations are more interested in leaning in.
Pam Pugh: That's right. That's right.
Rob West: Yeah, very fascinating. We've also established that women have a growing economic voice. So, for a Christian woman, how should that shape the way she thinks about her responsibility as a steward?
Pam Pugh: Yeah, Rob, this is so important. Faithful stewardship takes preparation. In a survey we conducted with widows several years ago, women who prepared in advance fared much better in the long run. Well, we can use an analogy of trip planning if we want to talk about how a woman can prepare for faithful stewardship. So, think about it this way: if you were going overseas for a month, you would plan. First, you would consider where you're going and what you'll need when you arrive. Second, you'll look at what you already have for that journey. And finally, you would want to talk to others who would help prepare you for that journey.
Rob West: Yeah, that's exactly right. It absolutely takes preparation. And you described the first step in that preparation as "dream." What does it mean to begin there? Talk about that.
Pam Pugh: So, sometimes this can be a challenging part of the process, just to get started. But what I'll typically say is envision your life five years from now. Prayerfully ask yourself, "If I were confident that God was with me, what would I explore?" Now, here's a secret I'm going to share with you: write this down. Get your journal out and write it down. Neuroscientific research is telling us that we increase our potential for success multiple times over when we write it down. It's actually called neuro-encoding. Our brain processes information more deeply when we write out our thoughts and goals on paper. Secondly, I say make it tangible. So, when you're writing this out, you might start with a phrase like this: "It's the year 2031, and I'm X years old." It's a bit sobering! What does your life look like? What does it sound like? Awaken those five senses. What does it feel like? What values are reflected in your life? So, be intentional about where you're headed and why.
Rob West: I love that framework because answering that simple question might be the single thing that gets her unstuck, maybe to start this journey, is that right?
Pam Pugh: That's exactly right.
Rob West: Now, the second step is "inventory," and you connect that idea to God's call for Moses. I'd love for you to unpack that a bit.
Pam Pugh: Yes! Yes, it really hit me one day when I was studying Exodus, Moses' call. And when God called Moses to this tremendous journey to free the Israelites, Moses was reluctant, and he offered excuse after excuse, reasons why he couldn't meet this great calling. And finally, remember God asked him in Exodus 4:2, "Moses, what's in your hand?" Moses had a shepherd's staff in his hand—such an ordinary object—and he probably didn't even see it as something God could use in his calling. I think we can ask ourselves the same question: What has God already placed in my hand? You know, nothing's wasted in God's economy, that's such a wonderful truth. We have relationships, resources, financial means, knowledge, experience... Rob, even our hardships can provide resources for our journey. So, ask God to show you what's in your hand, and remember the secret: write it down.
Rob West: Yes! Well, I love that question, "What's in your hand?" because I can imagine once a woman has considered where God may be leading her, and then taken inventory of what He's already entrusted to her, she's ready to move forward. Then what comes next?
Pam Pugh: Okay, so then we want to talk about it. When you're excited about an upcoming trip, you talk about it. You want to talk about your goals with your friends and peers, and each of those times, it increases our psychological ownership and commitment to that journey. So, just as we talk about an upcoming trip and plan for it, if we want to live and give well, we need to plan for it. Now, here's where I'd say it's wise to find a like-minded advisor and share your vision for the future. A Kingdom-minded advisor can help you develop a strategy for reaching those goals and for strengthening your economic voice. So, the whole idea is prepare intentionally for the journey ahead.
Rob West: That's well said. Now, Pam, as you consider all of these shifts you've described—them the wealth transfer, the greater earning power, the entrepreneurship, and women's growing financial influence—what do you most hope Christian women will understand about this moment we're in right now?
Pam Pugh: So, I want women to realize we have tremendous opportunity to make real change. There has never been a time that God has resourced women as today. So, the question isn't simply how much influence or wealth women will have; it's what they'll do with it. And we can prayerfully consider what God has already placed in our hands and use it for His glory and for the good of those around us. What an opportunity!
Rob West: Pam, we're about out of time, but I want to double back on the role of the advisor for a moment. What have you seen in terms of the power of the advisor in this relationship?
Pam Pugh: Right. So, I think sometimes as women we can stall out because there's things we don't know, and we look out into the future and we're not sure, "Will I have enough? Will I be able to finish well?" And so I talked to a lady actually yesterday, and she called asking, "How does she find a good Kingdom-minded advisor? What are the right questions to ask?" And as we further explored it, she said, "You have helped me alleviate some of my greatest concerns in going forward." By finding a Kingdom-minded advisor, the advisor can project out into the future given what is already in your hand and what your plans are: Will you have enough? What investment objectives do you need to have so that you will have enough and be able to accomplish those goals? It really puts fuel into your purpose.
Rob West: Oh, that's incredible! And by the way, folks, we talk about it all the time, if you want to find a Certified Kingdom Advisor in your area, just head to findacka.com. Pam, this has been fabulous. We're going to have to have you back real soon. Thanks for your time.
Pam Pugh: Thanks, Rob.
Rob West: That's Pam Pugh, co-founder of Women Doing Well and president of Virtue Assets Foundation. You can read more from Pam on this topic in a special resource we're releasing this month. It's our special edition of Faithful Steward magazine. Learn more at faithfi.com. We'll be right back.
SEGMENT 3
Rob West: Well, thanks for joining us today on Faith & Finance on American Family Radio. I'm Rob West. Looking forward to taking your calls and questions today back in the studio live, in fact, in a brand new studio today. We've made a big move while I was out last week on vacation. We're coming to you from our brand new studio, which does have video capabilities. Now, we're not streaming the broadcast at this point, but we do have the ability to capture some video, just looking for ways to continue to enhance how we equip you to be a faithful steward of God's resources. Nevertheless, great to be back in the studio live today, looking forward to taking your questions. Perhaps over the last week there's been something you're wrestling with in your financial life, you'd like to talk about it. We'd love to hear from you. The number: 800-525-7000. Patty's standing by to take your calls today right now, 800-525-7000. Whether you're living, giving, owing, or growing God's money, whatever it is today, whether it's, you know, investing in the markets, navigating the volatility we're experiencing right now. Maybe it's just staying on budget with these prices where they are, or perhaps it's how do I give more intentionally? Maybe you're trying to dump some debt. Whatever's going on in your life today, we would love to hear about it. Again, those numbers, or that number to call: 800-525-7000. Again, that's 800-525-7000. We will dive into those questions here in just a moment. We do have some lines open.
In the news today, retirement used to mean leaving work behind for good, but a growing number of Americans are keeping work a part of the picture, and that could make a significant difference financially. According to Northwestern Mutual's 2026 Planning & Progress Study, 41% of Americans say they're either working or planning to work during their retirement years, and money isn't the only reason. Among those planning to work in retirement, 56% say they want to continue feeling useful or stimulated. Another 48% want additional income to support their preferred lifestyle. 47% say they'll need the extra income to afford retirement. Investopedia actually looked at retirement costs recently across the country using the familiar 4% withdrawal rule. We've talked about that before. Remember that came from a gentleman with the last name Bengen. He updated that recently to 4.7%, so closer to 5% now. Nevertheless, the Investopedia study found that if one spouse earns just $10,000 a year for the first 10 years of retirement, the couple may need about $100,000 less in retirement savings. Now, at $20,000 a year, that drops the saving target by about $200,000. Wow, that's a real difference! The principle is straightforward: every dollar you earn from part-time work is a dollar you won't need to withdraw from retirement savings. Well, that can help preserve your nest egg, particularly during the important early years of retirement.
Continued work may also give you greater flexibility about when to claim Social Security. For those who can afford to wait, delaying benefits can produce a larger monthly benefit later. We've talked about this: 8% a year up to age 70, where it stops growing. But work has value beyond a paycheck, of course. Scripture reminds us that God created us for productive purposes. Retirement may change how we work, but it doesn't necessarily mean retiring from meaningful service. Remember that picture we see in God's Word of the person with years at the city gate, dispensing wisdom, that crown of gray hair? Think about the experience, the opportunity for mentorship, not the least of which is your ability to still contribute in a work capacity. So, if you're approaching retirement, don't assume the only question is, "When can I stop working?" Perhaps a better question may be, "What kind of work makes sense in this next season?" because even a modest amount of enjoyable, purposeful work could strengthen both your finances, your health, and your sense of calling. Hope that's an encouragement to you today.
All right, we're going to dive into your questions. Again, that number with just two lines open at the moment: 800-525-7000. Let's begin in Arkansas today. Douglas, how can I help?
Douglas: Yeah, yes. We bought my wife a car just recently, about a month ago, and it's about $43,000. And I have a CD coming up due in October, and it's got $83,000 in it. So, I'm trying to decide whether I need to pay the car off or pay—I can borrow money off my CD for 1% above what my CD's making. So, I just kind of want a little direction about the best way of trying to take care of this car issue.
Rob West: Yeah, and what is the interest rate on that car?
Douglas: About 7.5%.
Rob West: Yeah. So, at a 7.5% car loan, Douglas, you know, I'd really guarantee that—or look at that guaranteed interest cost with what the CD is actually earning after taxes. Because, you know, if you look at essentially a guaranteed 7.5% return by eliminating every dollar of interest expense, let's say the CD's earning 4% to 5%, that interest is going to be taxable, generally, so the after-tax return is even lower. And if you're not having to pay an early withdrawal penalty because it's maturing, you know, I think that's great. Now, the key would be we don't want to drain what might be an emergency reserve—although if it's truly your emergency reserve, I wouldn't have it in a CD anyway. So, I think typically speaking, all things being equal, if you're going to have enough liquidity left over and you can pay off that car, then the math is going to favor paying off that 7.5% car loan rather than keeping that money in a lower-yielding CD, especially after tax. Does that make sense, though?
Douglas: Oh, yeah! Oh, yeah, a lot of sense. I just hate draining my CD like that, because it's the difference between having $40,000 and $80,000. But I want to do the smart thing, also.
Rob West: Well, let me ask: what are you all spending monthly?
Douglas: Well, probably about $6,000. I don't really have a set amount right now.
Rob West: All right. Well, it sounds like you'd still have at least six months' worth of expenses if you don't have any savings beyond this. Let's do this: you and I can talk a bit more off the air, but hopefully that gives you a good sense of where to go from here, Douglas. Stay on the line. We'll be right back on Faith & Finance.
SEGMENT 4
Rob West: Great to have you with us today on Faith & Finance here on American Family Radio. You know, when you think about money through the lens of biblical wisdom, it's ultimately either a treasure or a tool. If it's a treasure in our lives, we're trying to ascribe worth, and significance, and security to something that will never deliver on those promises. Well, we're set up for failure. We see that throughout God's Word. Remember the parable of the sower? What choked out the word from bearing a 30, 60, 100-fold return? It was, among other things, the deceitfulness from riches. Remember what Paul said to Timothy: "Don't put your hope in the uncertainty of riches." We don't want money to be a treasure in our lives. Instead, the proper biblical perspective is that of a tool. Money is a tool to accomplish God's purposes for us to enjoy. We see what Boaz did with his field. He didn't go right up to the edge so he could serve the poor. Joseph saved 20%, a fifth, of everything that came in during those years of plenty to be prepared for the famine. When money is a tool, it protects the vulnerable, it advances the gospel, it provides meaningful experiences for our loved ones, it allows us to put food on the table and provide for our families. But we've got to be careful. Is it a treasure or a tool? When it's a treasure, a created thing becomes the object of our affection rather than the Creator Himself. God is our ultimate treasure, money is a tool, God owns everything, our goal: faithfulness. What does faithfulness today look like? That's what we want to help you drive toward on this program each day when you call 800-525-7000. Let's dive right back into your questions today. We're going to go out to Houston, Texas. David, go ahead.
David: Hello.
Rob West: Hi, how can I help?
David: Yes, I was trying to—I'm meeting with a financial advisor tomorrow, and I'm kind of skeptical about going with annuities. It sounds very good. It got laid off last year, and trying to move about $140,000 into it, or partially. So, I'm kind of just wanted to get some advice to see if that's a good idea or not.
Rob West: Yeah. Well, I appreciate the question, and, you know, annuities are a broad category, and it's going to depend heavily on the specific proposal you receive and what your overall objectives are. Annuities are typically not my tool of choice to grow and protect wealth, but ultimately, they do have a place. I'm not someone who says they don't ever have a place; they're just not my default. What are the potential pros? Well, it can provide guaranteed income, it can provide tax-deferred growth, and depending on the contract, it can provide protection from market losses, and that's often why people buy them. Remember, you know, typically annuities are sold to you rather than somebody going out and looking for an annuity. But with those protections, if you will, from market losses and some of those other features, there's always a cost. And so the question is: what is that cost, and is it worth what you're receiving in return? They tend to be complicated and expensive. They have surrender charges, typically for years where you're locking up the money. In addition to that, when you give up the upside, or a portion of it, in exchange for that downside protection, that really limits your overall growth potential. Remember, the result of the average annual returns of the stock market being 9-plus percent a year, if you go back, you know, more than 50 years, comes in large part due to those dramatic upswings of the market that happen over time. Well, if you're giving that up because your upside participation, they call it, is capped, well, you're losing a significant, you know, value that comes from stock market investing. Now, what are you gaining in return? Well, you're gaining that downside floor. But remember, as long as you have the right time horizon and the right mix of investments, the floor doesn't concern me. You know, even if that portion that was in the market, let's say stocks, was down 20 or 30%, which is typically what we would see if we got into a bear market, that portion you wouldn't touch, and you would build the portfolio such that you don't have to. You'd have plenty of income-generating fixed-income type of assets in your portfolio, especially as you're in retirement, such that you could let that stock portion that was down recover, and it always has. I mean, it came back after 1929, came back after '87, came back after the the dot-com bubble burst, came back after the Great Recession of '08, the pandemic. I mean, I could go through the list. The market has always recovered and gone to new highs. The key is you just can't sell while the market is down or try to time it. But at the end of the day, what is the feature you're most interested in here, David, when you're considering an annuity?
David: Well, probably in the next 5 to 7 years, start pulling funds out. For right now, it would be for investing. I do have a special-needs adult child that I would like to have most of it for that purpose of when me and my wife are no longer here, so she'll be able to manage, you know, with my younger daughter. So, but, you know, the rate the rate on the annuity is, I think it's 1.1%?
Rob West: Should should be quite a bit higher than that, so I would take a look at that. But I think the key here in what you just said is you're trying to protect and grow what you have thoughtfully—that's great—and you want to set this up in a way that is thoughtful about how it might be there for your son with special needs in the future. And that's an important consideration as well, but those things aren't mutually exclusive. My preference would be you find a Certified Kingdom Advisor who could build a portfolio for you that gives consideration to your risk tolerance, your income needs, all of these things, allows you to grow that money over time, allows you to not take unnecessary risk, and then with an estate planning attorney, probably put a special needs trust in place, if you don't already have one, maybe an ABLE account alongside that. That's going to ensure that the assets, after you and your wife pass away, are preserved for your son, but done so in a way that does not limit his ability to access any government assistance that may be coming his way as well. And then he could draw the money out as he needs to, you know, for living expenses, both daily and ongoing needs that he might have.
David: Okay. Okay, I got it.
Rob West: So, here's what I would suggest you do: maybe in addition to the meeting you're going to have tomorrow, perhaps you get a second opinion with a Certified Kingdom Advisor who might manage this money outside of an insurance product, which, for the reasons I mentioned, I would probably prefer that approach. That would ensure that, you know, you don't have the lockups, and you get more access to the money without the the complicated features and expenses that come with the annuity. And to find an advisor in Houston that you could interview, maybe two or three that you might interview to find the one that's the best fit, just go to findacka.com. That's findacka.com.
David: Okay, fine. And that'll be within the website of the of the Kingdom Advisor?
Rob West: That's right. It's actually FaithFi's website, findacka.com. You'll be able to put in your zip code, and it'll give you a list of advisors in your area.
David: Okay, excellent.
Rob West: Thank you, David. We appreciate your call. If I can help further along the way, don't hesitate to reach out. All right, a quick break. Bob Doll stops by in our final segment. We'll get his read on the market as we start a new trading week, and we'll try to get to a few more questions right after this. Stick around.
SEGMENT 5
Rob West: Great to have you with us today on Faith & Finance here on American Family Radio. I'm Rob West. We'll get back to those phones here in just a moment, but first, our good friend Bob Doll is here. Bob's our go-to guy on the market; he's Chief Executive Officer and Chief Investment Officer at Crossmark Global Investments, a leader in faith-based investing. And Bob, I know we were off last week. Great to have you back. A lot going on in these markets! You've got a special market commentary out today on the bond market that's getting a lot of attention right now. Give us a rundown on that.
Bob Doll: Yeah, bonds have been in a bear market really since COVID. The yield on the 10-year Treasury got well under 1%, and now they've crossed 5% to the upside, which means bond prices have suffered. A lot of the reason, Rob, is lingering/sticky inflation, and a lot of that is caused by oil prices. And when you have those two things going up—that is, the price of oil and interest rates—that's why there's more red on the screen in the stock market than normal. It's going to take a while to get out of this, most likely, and so we're just going to have to be patient investors.
Rob West: Bob, so many crosscurrents here. We had President Xi, obviously, visiting the White House, expected perhaps in some sort of announcement, didn't really get anything. We are hearing from President Trump that he's rejecting the Iranian proposal to reopen the strait. Sounds like he maybe is suspect around how well that might hold. Oil going up, the market selling off. I mean, how do we evaluate where we find ourselves right now?
Bob Doll: Well, to add to what you just said, The Wall Street Journal had an article that says the President's likely to resume bombing post-election because the two sides can't come to an agreement, and neither side trusts each other. So behind all this, of course, is an economy. And the economy so far, as you and I have talked many weeks, has been doing just fine, enabling earnings to advance at a spectacular rate. And that's why all these political and geopolitical issues until now haven't mattered. We've argued that when interest rates are going up, the pace of increase is more important than the level. And it's been very gradual until the last couple weeks; now it's picking up some steam. So either interest rates have to stop moving up, or we probably have a bit of a pullback in stocks. But the economy underneath the surface so far—so good.
Rob West: Bob, what about AI? Of course, it's been such a huge driver of the market and some of the economic productivity as of late. Obviously, a lot of questions swirling around just the safety of it. We've got now an announcement out from Nvidia today around perhaps a software solution to some of the protections. Do you feel like there's some potential issues here that could bear out in the market?
Bob Doll: So every new technology has this kind of concern: What's it going to do to our everyday way of life? Like all technologies, Rob, this one will create some incredibly positive things for economy and productivity. But there'll be some people who use it for evil. And we're just going to have to try to sort that out, monitor it, to some degree regulate it. Every new technology has this possibility. So I don't think we're going to wake up and there'll be a billion people dead, as some people are saying. But I do believe we're going to have to keep our eye on the inevitable negative consequences of something new in the hands of the wrong people.
Rob West: Bob, we've obviously got this midterm coming up here ever so quickly. Where do you feel like the market heads between now and the end of the year?
Bob Doll: So first of all, the polls are suggesting the Republicans are going to lose the House and maybe the Senate. Historically, when the President's party loses in either House or both Houses, the next 12 months, stocks do just fine, thank you! So I don't know if it matters a whole lot in that sense. Now look, if the Democrats take the House and the Senate, among the things they will do is investigate President Trump, impeach President Trump, and we have to deal with all of that, Rob. So we have to come back to a hope and a prayer that our economy stays okay.
Rob West: Bob, we always appreciate your time, my friend. Thanks for stopping by.
Bob Doll: Enjoy the week. Bye-bye.
Rob West: All right, that's Bob Doll. You can learn more at crossmarkglobal.com. While you're there, sign up for his weekly market commentary. All right, let's try to sneak in a few more phone calls here today before we round out the program. Bill's been waiting patiently in Corpus Christi, Texas. Bill, go ahead, sir.
Bill: Hi, Rob. Listen, I need some help. I'm trying to determine what to do with some unsecured debt that I have, in the $15,000 to $20,000 range, but I just don't know what direction to go into. So what I'm looking for is somebody that I can trust to give me the correct guidance as to what path I need to take. Do you have any advice for me?
Rob West: I sure do, and I appreciate you calling, Bill, about this. I know this is weighing heavy on you. In terms of what has got you to this point, do you feel like you have resolved the issue that led to the debt in the first place, or do you think there's a spending and income issue that could contribute to additional debt moving forward?
Bill: Well, there was an employment issue, because I'm still working. I'm 76, but I'm still having to work. And I went the last three or four months without any extra income coming in, so that's where everything fell apart for me. So I need to recover from that, is what I'm looking at.
Rob West: Yeah. Yeah. But you have got to a place where you can live within your means and fund the minimum payment at this point?
Bill: I'm hoping so, yes.
Rob West: Okay. Yeah, my preferred option is what's called credit counseling or debt management. So there's several approaches people will take when they get a growing amount of unsecured credit card debt. One is what's called debt settlement; I do not recommend it. It's where you stop paying, you work through a debt settlement company—some of them unscrupulous, some of them above board—but the strategy is always the same: they ask you to stop paying, it lets the account get past due, which wreaks havoc on your credit report; they have you continue to make the monthly payment not to the creditor, but to a savings account to build up a war chest; and then they start negotiating behind the scenes to try to get a reduced payoff. I don't like it; it's fraught with problems, not the least of which is it will just really destroy your credit. The other is a loan consolidation where you take out a new loan to roll the debt up and try to lower the interest rate; I don't like that approach either. The third option is my preferred option: it's what is called debt management. The cards would stay with the existing creditors, but if you work through a non-profit credit counseling agency like our friends at Christian Credit Counselors, which thousands of our listeners have worked with successfully, it'll slide over to a department that's only accessible through credit counseling. Immediately, the interest rate will drop. If you're behind, it gets re-aged. You now make one monthly payment similar to what you're paying now, except it's going to be a level payment—it doesn't decline as the balance comes down—and with that lower interest rate, typically somewhere between 0% and 10%, depends on the creditor, you'll pay it off on average 80% faster. So that would be the way that I would go, Bill. While those cards are in that program, they will be suspended—you won't be able to make new charges—but it is the most effective way that I've found to get out of debt once and for all. So you would just want to head to christiancreditcounselors.org—that's christiancreditcounselors.org—or if it's easier, go to faithfi.com/ccc. But does that make sense?
Bill: Yes, it does, and I thank you so much! I really appreciate you.
Rob West: Well, happy to do it, and I appreciate you, Bill. And if I can help further along the way, don't hesitate to reach out. Lord bless you, my friend. Let's quickly go to Arkansas. Harlene, how can I help?
Harlene: Thank you for taking the call. I am calling on the behalf of my son, who is a working adult. He lost his job a little over two years ago and was unemployed for about a year, so it really set him back. But now he has some student loans that were deferred when the Biden administration was in, so he's having to start paying those student loans back, and it's around $6,500. Recently, I thought I heard you maybe answer another caller's question two or three weeks back about this same situation. So I was wondering if you have any advice on something that he could make a payment plan, or who could he get in contact with?
Rob West: Yeah. Are these federal loans, Harlene?
Harlene: Yes, MOHELA.
Rob West: Okay, yeah. So what he would want to do is, you know, he can look at the income-based options, including the newer what's called Repayment Assistance Plan (RAP, for short). The government's repayment calculator will show his eligible plans; it will estimate the monthly payments, give you the total repayment amount and potential discharge amounts if that's available. So he's going to want to go ahead and check that out. It's available at studentaid.gov, and he can compare the repayment plans. Again, it's the repayment calculator; that's going to be the starting point. He's got plenty of options available to him because these are federal loans. We're going to want to leave them as federal loans—we don't want to refinance them privately—because that's going to give him the most flexibility. I realize this is a huge amount; it's probably weighing on him. I think he'll feel a lot better when he's got a plan that fits his budget and he's actually making some progress, and I think studentaid.gov is the place to start. So if we can help further along the way, don't hesitate to reach out, Harlene, and thanks for your call today. That's going to do it for us today, folks. Big thanks to Michael, Devin, Pat, everybody here at FaithFi that makes this possible, Jim as well today serving us with great research. Come back and join us tomorrow; we'll see you then. Bye-bye.
From greater earning power to entrepreneurship and the coming wealth transfer, women are entering a significant season of financial stewardship. For Christian women, the bigger question is how to faithfully steward these resources. On this Faith & Finance on AFR, Rob West and Pam Pugh talk about using what God has provided with wisdom and purpose. Then, it’s on to calls.
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