The American Family Association's mission is to strengthen moral foundations of our culture

>> Abraham Hamilton III: The American Family Association's mission is to inform, equip and activate individuals to strengthen the moral foundations of our culture. Our goal is to be a leading organization in biblical worldview training for cultural transformation. We stand on the biblical truth that all human beings, including the unborn, are created in the image of God and are endowed by him with the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Thank you for standing with the American Family Association.

>> Fred Jackson: Welcome to Today's Issues. Join us for the next hour as.

>> Ed Vitagliano: We offer a Christian response to the.

>> Fred Jackson: Issues of the day. Here's your host, Ed Vitagliano.

>> Ed Vitagliano: And welcome everybody, to Today's Issues. Ed Vitagliano sitting in for Tim Wildmon. Today, I'm joined in studio by Fred Jackson. Good morning to you, sir.

>> Fred Jackson: Good morning, Ed.

>> Ed Vitagliano: And Tony Battagliano comes in.

>> Tony Vitagliano: Good morning.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Off the bench, our utility infielder.

>> Tony Vitagliano: Morning.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Good morning to you. And, folks, it is February 4th, and Fred, the weather has calmed down across the nation a little bit. Right. We had the follow up storm in the Carolinas, after the big winter storm last weekend.

>> Fred Jackson: Yeah. The Southeast, especially in this area of the country that had the ice storm. now we still have tens of thousands of people without power repercussions. Yeah. So that is still a major problem. But the weather is warmer. we're living right now. I think temperature's, gonna get up in the 60s this week.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Yeah.

>> Fred Jackson: So that is great relief. Now, anybody listening up in, Illinois or Wisconsin, they're probably saying, yeah, right, yeah, winter ain't over here.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Well, and that's the kind of thing where I just say, well, that's your ch. Yeah, I mean, you, you know, it's kind of same thing with, with Canada.

>> Tony Vitagliano: And, it's like so m. It's like summer here. You know, it's like, oh, it's true.

>> Ed Vitagliano: When people complain about July and August here down in the south and in Texas, it's it, it can be. You kind of know what you're getting in, getting into. So.

Tom Holman announced immediate drawdown of 700 ICE officers in Minneapolis

All right, well, lots going on. there was a big press conference this morning.

>> Fred Jackson: Yeah. Just a couple of hours ago. Now, President, Trump's borders are to who has been in, Minneapolis the last couple of weeks. the president assigned him there to try to bring the heat down. de escalate. De escalate is the term that was used. so last week he held a news conference that he had met with the governor of the state, Tim Walls. He had met with the mayor of Minneapolis, Jacob, Fry and in that news conference, Tom Holman said, you know, I had good meetings, productive meeting meetings, but then within like four hours, both the governor and the mayor said, no deals yet. You know, we still want ICE out of here. We think it's terrible what they're doing, et cetera, et cetera. So when I heard there was a news conference this morning with Tom Holman, I was kind of, okay, you know, another one of those. but here's the announcement from Tom Holman and, we got a bit of the audio here, but basically he's talking about immediate drawdown of about a quarter of the immigration officers that are in Minneapolis in exchange for, he says, some confirmed cooperation from local authorities who are holding illegal immigrants in their jails. And basically they're going to give ICE some notification when these people are to be released so that ICE agents can go to the jail and do a peaceful arrest and follow up by deportation. Anyway, here's a little bit what Tom Holman had to say at the news conference. We currently have an unprecedented number of counties communicating with us now and allowing ICE to take custody of illegal aliens before they hit the streets. This is efficient, requires only one or two officers to assume custody of a criminal alien target, rather than eight or 10 officers going into the community and arresting that public safety threat. This frees up more officers to arrest or remove criminal aliens. More officers taking custody of criminal aliens directly from the jails means less officers on the street doing criminal operations. This is smart law enforcement, not less law enforcement. And as a result of the need for less law enforcement officers to do this work in a safer environment, I have announced, effective immediately, we will draw down 700 people effective today.

>> Ed Vitagliano: You know, Tony, this, this is a no brainer. I don't, I don't know why it came to this other than the fact that you have high ranking political figures in Minnesota, including the Attorney General, Keith Ellison. We always mentioned Tim Walls, the governor of the state, and then Jacob Fry, the mayor of Minneap. There are other high profile political, figures in Minnesota, who just seem to hate President Trump so much and hate the idea of sending illegal immigrants back to where they came from, that they would go to these lengths because it's a no brainer. If you already have an illegal immigrant in custody and they have committed some crime and we're talking some of these are extremely serious and violent crimes, then you contact ice, and say, hey, we got them. Rather than making ICE go to where the, the released criminal is now living and, allowing Protesters to come and create the havoc that we've seen. But this seems to be a no brainer. In a lot of places, a lot of states, a lot of cities, this is the way things are done. Yeah, we got this guy in custody. He's got two warrants for violent crime. we're calling in ice. what is your interpretation of why it took all this time to get to this point?

>> Tony Vitagliano: Well, I think, I think it took all this time because it accomplished, the Democrats have accomplished what they wanted, to do in the court of public opinion, so to speak. You had the spectacle, you had the controversy, you had the tension, you had the violence and unfortunately you had the deaths. So, Tim Waltz, Ellison, the mayor, Jacob Fry, they were in no hurry to calm things down and to work with the federal agents while the pressure was being ramped up on ICE and while they had all eyes on Minneapolis and what was going on there. they just were in no hurry to work with the federal agents or to settle it down. And to, to me, if I'm looking at this press conference with Holman, I was discussing with this with Fred.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Before.

>> Tony Vitagliano: To me this looks a little bit like capitulation, from the Trump administration. I get that they're saying, you know, Holman is pumping up, that we'll have this unprecedented, cooperation with local authorities. Well, first of all, where were these authorities during the crisis? What guarantee do we really have that these authorities will continue to work with the federal agents when they weren't willing to work with the federal agents before? Right. When they were just sitting there on the sidelines watching, watching these protesters, antifa people. Yeah. Assault federal agents. So I'm not 100%. I, to me, I think if I was Waltz and these and the Democrats, and their ilk, I would look at this as a victory. you're not going to get the same, you're not going to get the same progress on detaining these illegal immigrants, with 700 less federal agents, and you're relying on the local authorities. I don't know. That's, that's my interpretation. I think this, I think the Democrats will look at this as a win because you had some bloodshed. Like I said, just sad, tragic, but avoidable bloodshed. But that's what they were wanting. I mean the pressure kept ramping up and ramping up. In my opinion, that's what they wanted.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Well, Fred, Tony makes a good point. It's, it's, I see no change in attitude on the part of Democratic leaders in Minnesota towards the issue of immigration and illegal immigration and whether these people should be allowed to stay. I also don't know what has shifted in the minds of these Democratic leaders with regards to concerns for the safety of actual citizens who fall prey a lot of times to the, aggressive and violent criminal element within the immigrant, Illegal immigrant community. And they certainly don't care about the protesters because they allowed things to ramp up to the place where people like Renee Goode and Alex Peretti. I get the. Peretti is that. I, think I got the name right there. that they didn't care about what happened to those people either.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: No.

>> Ed Vitagliano: So it's hard to. It is hard to figure why the sudden change, in their attitude if that is, if that has actually happened.

>> Tony Vitagliano: It's Alex Preddy Peretti.

>> Ed Vitagliano: I think I get that mixed up with the, Christian author.

>> Fred Jackson: Well, I think it was all about politics. you know, I think what Tony had to say was exactly right. And what you're saying is that the radical Democrats who are running Minnesota right now, who are running the city of Minneapolis, really didn't care if people were injured. They hate Donald Trump so much. That is the bottom line in all of this. As we've said before on this program, this problem started with Joe Biden, a Democrat president, allowing 15 to 20 million people into this country. That is the source of this problem. And I wanted to play you a montage of other Democrat presidents who did exactly what Donald Trump has been striving to do since he was elected in 2024. And that's get a handle on all the violent, criminal illegal aliens in this country.

>> Ed Vitagliano: So we're going to be listening to former presidents Barack Obama and presidential candid.

>> Fred Jackson: Bill Clinton, Hillary Clinton. You're going to hear Chuck Schumer. All of those voices who are now condemning President Trump, were just as concerned as he is about what, violent illegal aliens were doing. Just have a listen to this little trip down memory lane.

Americans are right to demand better border security and better enforcement of immigration laws

Cut number four. Americans are right to demand better border security and better enforcement of the immigration laws. We simply cannot allow people to pour into the United States undetected, undocumented, unchecked. We've had 5 million undocumented workers come over the borders. It has become an extraordinary problem.

>> Ed Vitagliano: All Americans, not only in the states most heavily affected, but in every place in this country, are rightly disturbed by the large numbers of illegal aliens entering our country. And we must do more to stop it. Senator Biden, yes or no?

>> Speaker E: Would you Allow the cities to ignore the federal law.

>> Ed Vitagliano: No, any city should listen to the Department of Homeland Security. The city made a mistake not to deport someone that the federal government strongly felt should be deported. Just because your child gets across the border, that doesn't mean the child gets to stay.

>> Tony Vitagliano: We do not think the comprehensive health.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Care benefits should be extended to those who are undocumented workers and illegal aliens.

>> Tony Vitagliano: We do not want to do anything.

>> Ed Vitagliano: To encourage more illegal immigration. People say, well, why can't you stop.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: Illegal immigrants from coming here? And the number one answer we give is, when they come here, they can.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Get jobs, get benefits. Against the law because of fraud. Illegal immigration is wrong, plain and simple. Open borders.

>> Speaker E: You're doing away with the concept of a nation state.

>> Fred Jackson: Our nation, like all nations, has the.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Right and obligation to control its borders.

>> Fred Jackson: And no matter how decent they are, no matter their reasons, the 11 million who broke these laws should be held accountable for decades.

>> Ed Vitagliano: These weren't controversial or radical ideas. The only thing that changed is them.

>> Fred Jackson: Well, if your head is spinning after hearing all of those Democrats, almost, you could say Donald Trump has been quoting them for the last two years. And yet, because they were Democrats, the mainstream media never challenged what they had to sell.

>> Ed Vitagliano: I even heard Bernie Sanders in there saying, if you don't have a border, you don't have a nation state.

>> Tony Vitagliano: Like, the MAGA bench is deeper than we thought. Start pulling some of these ringers out to join us.

>> Ed Vitagliano: We do need to. Who produced that? That's obviously some kind of ad. Do you have that info?

>> Fred Jackson: I don't have that. Right.

>> Ed Vitagliano: All right.

>> Tony Vitagliano: They tried to get the Sam Elliott sound alike, at the end.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Yeah, I'm surprised it didn't say, you know, in a world, you know, that. That kind of. It had that kind of, tone at the end. No, that. Listen, that's a great ad because they were saying. They were saying what most normal people believe, but because. I hate to keep saying this, but because of Trump Derangement Syndrome, these people on the democr have lost their minds. I mean, we. We actually had. Was it. Wasn't it attorney, Minnesota Attorney General Keith Ellison, who said after the church invasion that, even churches are not immune to, to free speech. Something like that.

>> Fred Jackson: Yep.

>> Ed Vitagliano: So they have gone into complete wackiness and lawlessness simply because it's Donald Trump behind this. to the extent that, you know, I think Tim has mentioned. I'm in agreement with Tim's sentiments that none of us like the idea of ICE agents wearing masks. It's not a good look, but these people are protecting their families. Yes, because the left is so unhinged. We know they would show up at the homes and probably the schools of these ICE agents and terrorize their families.

>> Tony Vitagliano: Yeah, that's exactly right.

Tony Phillips: I'm nervous about compromise that Republicans made regarding government shutdown

>> Fred Jackson: So, well, we'll see where it goes from here because, yesterday we had the budget bill that was passed, signed into law by the President last night. But in order to get that done, President Trump pressured Senate Republicans and House Republicans to agree to a Democrat demand that the portion of that funding bill that involved money for Homeland Security was cut out and treat it separately. And so over the next 10 days, there's going to be a debate about that, about cutting funding, about, you know, mandatory, you know, take off those masks, all of those sorts of things. So the Democrats and Republicans were somewhat criticized to the point that Tony was making for compromising. and we had Republicans who actually voted with the Democrats on this, I think Susan Murray from, Maine, she said she wanted ICE out of Maine.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Republican Susan Collins.

>> Fred Jackson: Susan Collins, pardon me. she wanted ice, out of Maine, or she wasn't going to support it. So you have this battle that's going on right now. But I wanted to play that montage just to show the height of hypocrisy of what's going on right now.

>> Ed Vitagliano: And of course, Republicans can be hypocrites too, but the Democrats, ah, are clearly at the head of the pack when it comes to hypocrisy on this, issue. By the way, I am, I am nervous about this compromise that Republicans made regarding, the government shutdown with the extension of spending. But the carve out of the conversation over funding for ICE and DHS more broadly. For this reason, I do not put it past the Democrats. I understand no one wants a government shutdown. Democrats use it. If you're a conservative, you understand Democrats use government shutdowns as a weapon to try to get what they want. And Republicans, because of the mainstream media, they, they are usually the ones to cave. Tony, I am nervous about this because what if the Democrats say, you know what, we're not gonna, we're not gonna fund ICE and you can't stop us. I suppose it would be possible for the Republicans to add that funding back in, when they decide to have a reconciliation bill. but I'm not sure the Democratic Party is operating in good faith here. Maybe they will, maybe they will come to some sort of agreement on funding for Homeland Security and ICE in particular. But they haven't shown me a lot of good faith when it comes to these kinds of issues here over the last several years.

>> Tony Vitagliano: Yeah, I'm not sure how this is all going to shake out. you know, I correct. Someone can correct me if I'm wrong. There are other departments that fall under the Department of Homeland Security, such as tsa, fema, fema. so this is not. I'm not sure the Democrats will be able to get what they want, which is some type of, targeted defunding of ICE while funding all, all the other parts of the Department of Homeland Security. You know, my hope would be that Republicans wouldn't be that, soft to give in to something as ridiculous as that. It's in. In which case the Republicans can, can kind of lever that back on to the Democrats and say, well, look, Democrats don't want to fund, you know, the Department of Homeland Security is tsa. You know, you really want to throw chaos back into the, you know, the air and air travel now. So, you know, I'm not sure how it's all going to shake out. The Democrats, like I said, have accomplished what they wanted. They're getting their PR stunt right now. They get to look like they're taking a stand and they want actual reform. but we'll see how it actually plays out.

>> Fred Jackson: One of the most disturbing things was the invasion of that church during this.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: Yeah.

>> Fred Jackson: And you didn't have a Democrat out there saying, you've gone too far. Protesters. This is ridiculous. Now, ah, some of those people have been charged, but I wanted to bring you up to date on that story at City's church there in St. Paul.

>> Ed Vitagliano: this is the original church that was invaded.

>> Fred Jackson: Invaded. Caleb, Phillips, who is a member there, says the, protesters, the anti ICE protesters are still outside intimidating members of that congregation this past Sunday. They're still there doing this. I want you to hear from him. Cut number 16.

>> Speaker E: This past Sunday, the first Sunday after everything happened, it was packed. Even though it was only one of two services, there were also protesters outside the building. we had a police presence there, so that was helpful. several people mentioned that they felt very safe. so that was really great to hear. But as we were coming out of the church, from a wonderful, wonderful service that we had on Sunday, there are these protesters there. And it's kind of. It was almost like getting, I think I mentioned this to my girlfriend actually on her way home, but it was almost like getting out of a hot tub into, like an ice bath. Just, the safety and the peace and the joy that we were feeling in the church in our worship of Jesus Christ. Going out and seeing people who are like, spewing hatred towards us, and it made me feel sad for them. I would imagine that next Sunday, there's going to be a very similar presence. I don't know when it's going to end. I'm sure it will end eventually, but I would love for us to be the church that continues to not break under the pressure and continues to bless the people who curse us, no matter how often they're doing so well.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Tony, that's a very mature attitude for this young man. Fred, this is just a member. It's not a member of the pastoral staff. So it's a very. In terms of the Christian faith, that's a very mature attitude, especially there at the end, blessing those who curse them. I'm sure the protesters are probably on the sidewalk or they're in public space, because the police are there trying to keep the peace. So there's probably no trespassing going on. But still, that is something I think that Christians are going to increasingly, experience, at least in major cities. For now, as the radical left continues its march towards a more chaotic environment, their hostility is going to be revealed against Christians, especially Christians who stand for their particular beliefs on important political and social issues. so I'm not sure where you said this is city's church is the name of it. I'm not sure how soon they'll get back to business as usual. But that at least is a proper Christian response, to, the, pressure that's on that particular congregation.

>> Tony Vitagliano: Yeah, I agree. It was very measured. it was a biblical response. You know, we always have to be careful as Christians not to let our feelings and emotions get in the way of how Christ said we should approach hostility from the world. after all, he said they hated me first.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Right.

>> Tony Vitagliano: So, you know, I think Christians do need to, recognize that, you know, the levers of, the levers of control, of our culture and our society are not being pulled in our favor or Christians favor. The media didn't cover for the majority, the most of the media. When I say the media, I mean the mainstream media, the left media, they didn't cover that incident, with the type of objective coverage that they should have. the Hollywood, you know, obviously is not going to be sympathetic towards Christians at all, colleges and universities. So we have to start, expecting this type of behavior more and more in my opinion and to expect that you're not going to have the support from any type of, powerful institutions. Honestly, you'll have the support of your local community, and obviously you have the support of your brothers and sisters in Christ around the country and around the world. But, we need to accept that this is just part of the territory.

>> Ed Vitagliano: And maybe that is a stepping stone to a more Christian America should revival come, that there is a price to pay in order to get from here to there. But certainly for the foreseeable future, that hostility is there and it's not going away, and it may even grow.

You can listen to AFR wherever you go with the AFR app

All right, we're going to take a short break, folks. hope you will join us for more of today's issues. The AFR app is a powerful tool, but it does have limitations. You can't use it to change the oil in your vehicle or get rid of carpet stains. It won't walk the dog, won't pick up the dry cleaning or take the kids to practice. But while you're doing those things, you can listen to your favorite AFR content through the app on your phone, smart device, or Roku. Just go to your app store or visit afr.net listen to AFR wherever you go with the AFR app.

>> Fred Jackson: We would like to take a moment to thank our sponsor, PreBorn. When a mother meets her baby on ultrasound and hears their heartbeat, it's a divine connection. And the majority of the time she will choose life. But they can't do it without our help. Preborn needs us, the pro life community, to come alongside them. One ultrasound is just $28. To donate, dial £250 and say the keyword BABY or visit preborn.com afr.

>> Ed Vitagliano: This is today's issues. Email your comments to commentsfr.net Past broadcasts of today's Issues are available for listening and viewing in the [email protected] now back.

Today's Issues features Abraham Hamilton, Fred Jackson and Tony Vitagliano

>> Fred Jackson: To more of today's Issues.

>> Ed Vitagliano: And welcome back, everybody, to Today's Issues. Ed Vitagliano sitting in for Tim Wildmon today. I'm joined in studio by Fred Jackson and Tony Vitagliano. And now joining us, Abraham Hamilton iii, general counsel, host of the Hamilton Corner Herd, weekdays at 5pm Central Time on American Family Radio. Abe, welcome back.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: Thank you very much. Good morning, gentlemen.

>> Ed Vitagliano: okay, so we were talking, Fred set this up for, for Abe. I'm sure he was listening to the program. He had nothing else to do on the schedule, but I'd like to get his take on, the Tom Homan, press conference and then we're going to talk to him. and, folks, for you listening, we're going to talk some plastic surgery here. Kind of a big moment in terms of the transgender debate.

Jacob Fry: President Trump is drawing down 700 ICE agents in Minneapolis

But let's start with the Tom Homan thing.

>> Fred Jackson: Yeah. So President Trump, back a few weeks ago, sent Tom Homan up, to Minneapolis, see if he could settle things down up there. Homan had a news conference a few days later, and he said, you know, I've had good conversations with the governor, with the mayor of Minneapolis, and I'm optimistic that, you know, things are going to turn around and nothing happened. So this morning, I heard that Tom Holman was going to have another news conference, and I was a little bit skeptical as to what was going to come of that. But he did announce that immediately. He is drawing down 700 of the roughly 3,000 ICE agents that are in Minneapolis, basically saying, you can go home. And, along with saying that, he said he now believes that he is going to get cooperation from local sheriffs who he's been meeting with. They are telling him that, ICE is going to get notification as to when these bad guys are going to be released from these local jails so that ICE agents can come and pick them up. Couple of them come, put the guy in handcuffs. Handcuffs, and then deport them. that was the announcement this morning.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: Yeah. I think it's important every time Tom Homan's name comes up, I think it's important to remind people, because people don't know this, that Tom Homan was appointed as the Executive Associate Director of ICE, specifically over immigrations enforcement and removals deportations in 2013 under Barack Obama.

>> Fred Jackson: Yes.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: He received the presidential Rank, Distinguished Medal of service in 2015 from Barack Obama because he did such a stellar job at deporting illegal aliens. That's actually how President Trump learned about him from his service under Barack Obama.

>> Ed Vitagliano: And we played, by the way, this last segment, clips from Democratic politicians, including several from Barack Obama who sounded like Donald Trump or vice versa.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: Exactly right. But people don't know that, you know, so it's just absurd that how we are really in the midst of a propaganda war. Now, having said that, specifically concerning this drawdown, it just reveals what should have happened all along. I literally did this as a prosecutor when I'm prosecuted prosecuting criminal cases. When I get a new case, my investigator will run a background check and criminal history on the suspect. And one of the things we would look for to see whether or not there's any indication that this person is an illegal alien. If So I would instruct my investigator to send a notice to ICE to say, hey, in the Harris County Jail, here's a guy who might be of interest to you. And at that point, I had nothing else to do. It would be the Fed's determination as to when, if, and when they would come in to detain a guy. But it would be cooperation between local law enforcement and the federal. Federal law enforcement to enforce federal immigration law.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Well, now that. But that seems like that's a boon to local law enforcement and to the justice system in a. Like in Minneapolis. Why wouldn't they, it seems like it would be great. One more case we do not have to deal with. Send them to the Feds. That seems like it would be a help.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: And it is. Exactly. If the objective is the primary objective in terms of deportation procedures, that we want to deport criminal illegal aliens, that are those illegal aliens, in addition to the crime of entering our country illegally or remaining in our country illegally, who commit an additional crime in the United States of America. If that is the objective for everyone, what's the most efficient and safest way for the legal alien and for the ICE officers and for the community for this to happen? Let them in the jails. Let them in the jails. If you don't let ICE into the jails, you are then intentionally amplifying the circumstances. And in my view, I do believe the intentionality is directly proportional to all of the criminality in Minnesota. You know, so all of the amplified rhetoric and the hostile circumstances have been amplified by local law enforcement. Not local law enforcement. Local authorities. Jacob Fry and Tim Walsh, because they have refused to allow ICE to go first into the jails, into the state prisons to remove people, they have intentionally ramped up the rhetoric. So this drawdown now really is a response to what should have been happening all along. It shouldn't have taken people having protests and confrontations in the street. It shouldn't have taken, you know, these. These unfortunate losses of life that happened in the streets if the local elected officials and the local authorities let ISIS go into the jails first.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Well, because it's. It's clearly simpler and safer to go when you already have someone in custody to turn them over to ice. We made this point in the first segment. Rather than send ICE agents to a place where this illegal immigrant criminal is living and allowing, look, family members to get into the way where there's trying to stop ICE from taking uncle, you know, Harry or, Hefe or whatever it is, it's simpler to show that.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: Was an Italian expression.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Yeah. Ah, well, I was listening.

>> Tony Vitagliano: I was like, is he gonna go there?

>> Fred Jackson: Is he gonna do it?

>> Ed Vitagliano: Well, I figured somebody would say something anyway when I said Uncle Harry. And so I just did it anyway, pull the trigger. all right, so, yeah, I'm sorry I derailed your. No, no, listen, it's, that seems to be the simpler and safer way to handle this. You already have them in custody. Why let him back out on the street where. Where money has to be spent? They have to track them down. They get themselves, and then with all the protesters who kind of glommed on to this process in order to exacerbate the tensions, just, turn Uncle Harry over to ice.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: Yeah. And it's important for the listeners to know it was routine. It's not like. Yeah, it wasn't, it wasn't like it was an extravagant exercise as a routine manner. And we say, hey, this one has an ICE hold. Right? This one has an ICE hold. This one has an ICE hold. It was a routine thing. The refusal to do so intentionally exacerbates the circumstance.

Minnesota's refusal to cooperate with ICE is a messaging failure, Abe says

And that's also what I want the listeners to be aware of. And they know that. It's not like they're not aware of this. They know that they. I'm talking about is Jacob Fry and Tim Waltz and others. They know that it makes the circumstances far more dangerous for everyone who is involved.

>> Fred Jackson: Abe, am I being unfair? If I was to say that Tim Waltz and Jacob Fry and the Attorney General of the State, Keith Ellison.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: Ellison, yeah.

>> Fred Jackson: Wanted this violence, wanted the cameras of the nation on this violence and the media, they knew how the media was going to cooperate with them to show that what, President Trump was trying to do to arrest these millions of people who have been allowed into this country illegally, did they want this violence? Did they know maybe I should. Did they know their policy would create violence and make President Trump and the administration look bad?

>> Abraham Hamilton III: I don't know what's in their hearts, but I am comfortable and confident in saying that it was predictable that their refusal to cooperate with ice, specifically allowing access to the jails and other prisons, would result in the potential for something to be news, news to glom onto that would divert attention away from things like, oh, I don't know, this is the place that record numbers of immigration fraud. This is the place where you have quality leering centers, that, that it. And if you have a 20 something year old nick Shirley can take his iPhone and walk around and knock on the door and say, hey, any children in there. And like, surely, surely Jacob Fry and Tim Walsh could have done that. It's interesting about, I don't know, 9 billion other monetary reasons to have attention in Minnesota diverted away from other things that are happening just as subpoenas are being issued and being served on Tim Walsh and his associates in his office and all of these. Yeah, things. And this is like a rinse and repeat phenomenon. How many times before have we seen as negative attention is drawn down on some people who might be worthy of criminal charges all of a sudden. Oh, man, the biggest story now is just the mean old big bad, very, very, very bad ICE doing very, very bad things in Minnesota. Yeah, yeah, it's pretty convenient.

>> Tony Vitagliano: And the perception that was pushed, by the Democrats and by the media was that ISIS wasn't going and arresting and, detaining criminals who were guilty of some of them heinous crimes. it was, you would think that they were just going to get, you know, Uncle Harry, Uncle Harry, you know, at the children's birthday party, who's just been here 20 years, you know, and that's what they wanted you to think. And to me, some of it, some of the responsibility of how it happened does fall on the Trump administration's inability to communicate. Okay, no, this is what. We cannot get these criminals because the local authorities are not keeping them detained enough for us to do this in a safe manner.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: Yes, I think that is something that the Trump administration could have done better. Simply explain what the process is. Explain the contrast between states that are not sanctuary states, in cities that are not sanctuary cities, and how efficient and simple and safe the process is of identifying and detaining and removing illegal aliens who've committed additional crimes upon being on American soil. That, that, that is a messaging failure. But let's be honest about something. We're at the stage where the legacy media is pretty much the propaganda, PR arm of the Democrat Party.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Yeah.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: They are more than eager and willing to do their bidding. Like when you have stories when they're reporting ICE detained a five year old. They're big bad ice, and they literally deny and omit from their coverage the fact that no ICE was pursuing this little boy's father who has a criminal record in the United States of America. And upon viewing ICE coming to detain him, he takes off running, abandoning his own child. And when ICE is doing a charitable humanitarian service and caring for this child in freezing temperatures, because otherwise if they leave him there, it's a five year old on the streets by themselves. Wandering through the snow.

>> Ed Vitagliano: And ice left him there and ice left him. That's what they would have said.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: That's what they would have said in that regard, you know, and so you can't win for losing with that. But that doesn't excuse the Trump administration from being able to be consistently on message and show the contrast. This is how this process is supposed to go. But we have opposition in Minnesota that seems to be intentionally seeking to inflame circumstances there. And they're willing to subjugate the Minnesota people to additional criminality, all to advance their political agenda.

Fred Fox: A New York jury awarded a teenage girl $2 million

>> Ed Vitagliano: All right, Fred, next, next story. This is fascinating.

>> Fred Jackson: Abe, I'm, I'm sure last week you covered the story. This 2 million doll, that was given to. I was a young lady detransitioner.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: I covered it last night on the Hamilton corner in NewSong York.

>> Fred Jackson: Tell us a little bit about that case.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: Yeah, so it was a young lady who was 16 years old at the time. She's 22 now. Her name was Isabel. She went through various iterations of names, which now goes by Fox variant. And it had two people. A, ah, psychologist Kenneth Einhorn and a surgeon, Dr. Simon Chin, who both, aided, encouraged, and moved this little girl to where they performed chest surgery, removed her healthy breast tissue, as when she's 16. she's now come to embrace her God given identity. And she testified, her mom even testified that I didn't want this to happen, but these doctors made me feel like my child was going to kill herself if I didn't consent to it. The trial reveals, and this is galling on a level that I have a hard time wrapping my mind and heart around. They testified, the psychologist and the surgeon testified at trial that they were completely unaware that this little girl had been telling people, even in the LGBTQ community, that she wasn't sure she wanted to identify as a boy. She wasn't sure she wanted to do so. There also was testimony that the psychologist never had one conversation with the surgeon about the little girl. Not one, never had one conversation about her, but they were all too willing to, to cut off her healthy breast tissue. Well, after having heard all of the facts, the jury, interestingly, in NewSong York state awarded her $2 million, 1.6 million. The little girl who's now 22, $1.6 million for pain and suffering and another $400,000 for additional medical expense, future medical expenses going forward. And it's interesting that now all of a sudden plastic surgeons are saying maybe we should be a little bit slower before we Mutilate people's bodies irreparably.

>> Fred Jackson: Yes. Well, to that point, the American Society of Plastic Surgeons issued a position statement. Abe. and this basically what they're saying there should not be. Well, we call these mutilation surgeries on any young person until they reach at least the age of 19. Because what they're finding out is that when they reach that age, some of the emotions that they may have had, confusion, even just confusion and confusion these younger years, that they've changed their mind. They're a little bit more mature now. Fox, this morning did an interview with Sheila Nazarian. she is a plastic surgeon. She's part of this, the American Society of Plastic Surgeons. She had something interesting to say about the possible motivations that's been going on in the medical community who've been carrying out these surgeries. Cut number 10.

>> Speaker E: In the beginning, I actually thought they thought they were doing the right thing. But when the European data came out and I approached one and I said, what about all this long term data coming out of Europe? He said, what long term data coming out of Europe? And at that point I realized this is ideology driven. It is money driven. Hospital systems and physicians that do these surgeries have made a lot of money. And again, this should not be how we treat our patients and especially not children. We are doctors first. How is this any different than research done on blood pressure medication or diabetes medication? This is a medical procedure and it should be evidence based driven, not ideology driven or what makes you feel like a morally superior person. Everything has to be done with evidence. It is a surgical, permanent, life altering procedure.

>> Fred Jackson: You know, when she said that, my thoughts went back to what's two or three years ago when we have audio coming out of Vanderbilt, I believe it.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Was, I think that's right.

>> Fred Jackson: where somebody, it was an internal meeting. Yeah. Somebody was caught on tape saying, yeah, if we do this surgery, it's about 40,000 bucks that we get. And, of course it was totally denounced when that was made public. but it's shocking, I guess, Abe, when medical decisions would be made based on money.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: Yeah. You know, and it's also kind of shocking that it's revelatory for us as a society when you think, I don't know, maybe a 16 year old may not be sure about m something they want to do. Like the idea. Another part of the testimony that this again boggles my mind. The surgeon testified at trial that, oh, we thought she was happy with the surgery after it was done, initially which brings to the forefront the problematic issue of the day. This is a medical procedure.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Right.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: It shouldn't be determined based on. Well, I hope you feel better about it.

>> Ed Vitagliano: yeah.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: About yourself and about yourself after the fact. And to have. We don't allow children to do all kinds of things for the very same reasons we don't allow children to get tattoos and things of that nature.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Well, I have a perfect example right here to my right. I was wondering, my son, when he was driving, living at home, his insurance was sky high. You know, when it stopped being sky high when he was 25 years old. That's the cutoff for auto insurance. Because in their opinion, auto insurance, young men change so much when they get to their mid twenties.

>> Ed Vitagliano: We can drop the amount we charge for their auto insurance. That's how much they talk about how long it takes for the male brain to, to, to mature and fully develop. My wife might have questions about whether at 67, that's happening to me. But this is, that's based more on science than what these people have been doing.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: And this is not from an entity that is bound with Hippocratic oaths.

>> Fred Jackson: Right.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: You know, they don't have a first do no harm posture.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Yeah.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: You know, they're seeking the bottom line. And it's, and it's so sad to me that this is a case that you have people and doctors who, who won't listen to reason, who won't even listen to science. Like the clip you just played, that you don't know anything about this data, but they're so ideologically driven that you have to go to sting them in the wall. I had a basketball coach to say, you know, Abe is pain that stimulates the brain.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Yeah.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: So these folks won't listen to reason, won't listen to science, won't listen to the wealth of human wisdom for millennia. Even a moto automobile insurance industry knows, probably dealing with a young man, you probably need to wait until he's a little older because it'll be a less risky choice. Then they won't listen to any of that. But now when you have a jury verdict that's monetary in nature, now all of a sudden you have, you know, surgeons, cosmetic surgeons, and others are saying, maybe we should slow down on our eagerness and willingness to do these. All right.

>> Tony Vitagliano: Yeah, we just, we just, we just blew past, boundary after boundary. It's amazing how fast this accelerated because first it started with, you know, accepting transgenderism in adults. Right. You started there and then you went on to, well, what if children are, have gender dysphoria?

What about hormone, hormone treatment? We'll start with that. Tony's question was the last question

If children are confused about their gender. What about hormone, hormone treatment? We'll start with that. Then you just blew past that and you go to these horrific, life altering surgeries. And now what you're seeing is, as you mentioned, the monetary cost, is going to be felt. So now they're trying to roll it back. Even now, still the Hill, I'm looking at. I was trying to find a few articles from the media on this, this decision, that the ASPS made. even now the Hill and NewSong York Times are still referring to the plastic surgeon organization delaying gender affirming surgery.

>> Fred Jackson: Uh-huh.

>> Tony Vitagliano: They're still going to use that language until, until they're forced, by society to roll this back in. In all of its language. they're still referring to it as gender affirming surgery. I'm sorry. And they're still not, you know, they haven't made a statement on hormone, treatment. You know, that's still something that they're going to hold on to. Hopefully we can see that also rolled back in this momentum, which is remarkable.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: And that, that is the very issue that the state of Tennessee passed a law to protect its minor citizens from the surgeries as well as the hormone medication, and that is being considered by the Supreme Court. Oral arguments just took place, right before the end of the year in 2025.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Yeah.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: It's absurd to think. Wait, we're really thinking about this? Like you really want to invest money and to file a lawsuit to say that children. This shouldn't be done to children. The prospect of, irreparable harm and irreparable damage. You're not willing to concede that.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Right? So I said. Tony's question was the last question.

Hamilton: Is it going to take a female athlete to be seriously injured

Let me just talk. Let me slip one more under the door. Okay. 20 years from now, let's say, let's say our country makes it, the republic is still in force. God is.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: May it be so, Lord.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Yes. What do you, what do you, what do you think people are going to say about this snapshot in time with the, this just through the transgender issue? This kind of craziness? How idolatry? yeah, idolatry. Some of that, too. Ideology so infected. Medical and mental health, the, those institutions so infected by ideology that they did this to kids? what do you, what do you think, do you think this will be looked at kind of like the, satanic panic, those kinds of things that happened?

>> Fred Jackson: Whatever.

>> Ed Vitagliano: that was 2025. Years ago.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: I, I would hope so. And I would hope that the medical industry would have to do things kind of like the legal industry has to do, like with continuing legal education all over the country and attorneys, in order to maintain our licenses, we have to get ethical training annually. You know, because of historical instances of attorneys being shysters, frankly, I hope and pray that this is something that the medical profession has to succumb to. I don't want to be cynical, you know, because when you have, like Tony says, even in the face of this, and there are 28 additional lawsuits pending for what's being described as detransitioners suing doctors and physicians for having these procedures performed on them when they're minors. but when you see pinches like that, gender affirming, care language, all this type of language, in spite of the data that we have, in spite of the evidence we have from Europe, who's a decade ahead of us on this crazy train where they, they've decided, you know what, we're going to stop doing this to children. I hope there's a recalibration. But when you. With the kind of devotion it reminds me of, when the people surrounded Lot's house.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Oh, yeah.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: And the Lord through the angels smote the men from the oldest to the youngest with blindness. And the Bible says even after they're blind, they're still groping and clawing trying.

>> Ed Vitagliano: To get the lock door right.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: Unfortunately, I think we may see some iteration of that, even two decades removed from the crazy moment that we're in current.

>> Fred Jackson: Do you think all that we've been talking about the case last week that we outlined this. maybe we could see a change also in biological males being allowed to compete in female sports. Is it going to take a female athlete on a high school volleyball team to be seriously injured and a lawsuit in order for this to stop?

>> Abraham Hamilton III: I think so. Because unfortunately, to your point about the auto insurers, the insurance companies are more on the front line in terms of bearing the brunt of the risk. And what you're going to see happening is insurers are going to say, unless you doctors commit not to doing these types of things, we won't provide malpractice, medical malpractice insurance for you. And as that begins to be more normalized, you're going to find doctors start to say, I can't do these because in order to do this, my malpractice insurance is going to be sky high. So I have to agree not to do this. On, unfortunately, in our country, it's the pain that stimulates the brain in this instance is the money.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Well, and also, unfortunately, athletes generally have to sign a waiver. And then you've got to. Then you have. The burden of proof is on the injured girl to prove that this transgender, quote, unquote, woman, is, because, quote unquote, she is really a man. That's the cause of the injury and not just the inherent risk of participating in athletics that puts the burden on these poor girls. We are going to talk about, I think, another case here, in terms of, girls in sports and transgender, girls. But the girls are the ones who are suffering not only from losing opportunities and scholarships and spots on the team, but also putting their health at risk. All right, Abraham Hamilton III has been our guest. You can hear him, every weekday on AFR on the Hamilton corner at 5pm Central Time.

>> Fred Jackson: Time.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Abe, any idea about what you're going to be, talking about?

>> Abraham Hamilton III: Well, a couple different things that I'm considering, but I haven't landed that plane just yet. But you definitely want to tune in because you don't want to miss out.

>> Ed Vitagliano: 5Pm Central Time. Thank you, Abe.

>> Abraham Hamilton III: Thank you.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Appreciate it.

We will be joined after our five minute break for news by Steve Jordahl

All right, folks, you're listening to today's issues on American on the American Family Radio Network. Ed Vitagliano, Tony Vitagliano. We will be joined after our five minute break for news by Steve Jordahl. Steve Paisley Jordal. We hope you will join us again. Five minute break for news. And we will be right back. You're listening to today's issues on afr.

>> Tony Vitagliano: The m Views and opinions expressed in this broadcast may not necessarily reflect those of the American Family association or American Family Radio.

Ed and Tony talk with Fred on top news headlines of the day. Also, Abraham Hamilton III joins the program to discuss Tom Homan's latest press conference.