Transcript

American Family Radio takes your Bible questions live on American Family Radio

>> Bert Harper: The Bible. It's the word of God.

>> Alex McFarland: Sharper than any two edged sword. This sacred book is living and active and contains all that's needed for life and godliness.

>> Bert Harper: Stay with American Family Radio for the

>> Alex McFarland: next hour as we study God's word and take your Bible questions.

Bert Harper: One of the most famous stories in the Old Testament

>> Bert Harper: Welcome to Exploring the Word.

>> Alex McFarland: Certainly one of the most famous stories in the Old Testament is in Numbers chapter 13, the story of a place called Kadesh Barnea. And that might sound like an unusual name for a place, but it's a very significant place. And I would submit that in the life of not only ancient Israel, but many churches, many individuals, there is a Kadesh Barnea, a decision time where you trust God fully and go forward in his blessings or maybe get afraid and make a poor decision. We'll elaborate on this, but this is Exploring the word. Alex McFarland, Bert Harper, so honored that you're listening. If you've got a copy of the Bible, God's word, turn to the Old Testament book of Numbers and we'll talk about what has been called one of the saddest parts of the Old Testament. Really. And Bert, in your life have you heard a lot of sermons on Kadesh Barnea, and the moment of decision?

>> Bert Harper: Yes, I have and I've preached some of them. And yes, this is an important place in the Bible. A lot of things we can learn and it changed the course of their history and so much can be learned from this. So I pray that we will be able to understand it all and then convey it all and then receive it and help us with our decisions. That may be difficult and may be hard, but, but we can trust the Lord, Alex. Well, when you start chapter 13, there's a, you know, later on, In Deuteronomy chapter 1, Moses would remind them of this and talk about. They came to me and asked me before we go into the land that God has, and I'm going to add a word supposedly given us. I think that's what they were thinking if they didn't say it, send some spies in and let us know what we're facing. Well, that was a bad decision on the people's part because it does say that in Deuteronomy 1. And so. But yet God says go ahead. And Moses said, go ahead. So they do get the 12 spies to go into the land, Alex.

>> Alex McFarland: They really do. You know what's interesting? As I was studying, Kadesh Barnea really is mentioned in three ways or three times. Okay. This is an oasis. And Abraham stopped there on his journeys to and from Egypt. This is in Genesis 21. Joshua would later list Kadesh Barnea as part of the promised land. And as far as I'm aware, and you correct me if I'm wrong, the last mention is gonna be in Joshua 10, verse 41. And after that Kadesh Barnea kind of seems to disappear from, from the biblical record. But this is about an 11 days journey from Mount Sinai. And really the numbers 13, really kind of 26. And following is the most significant of the three mentions. I've always just been fascinated with this place, haven't you, Bert?

>> Bert Harper: I have. And again we find out that these men that go in and they bring back word from Kadesh, they left Kadesh Barnea, they. They came back to Kadesh Barnea 40, days later. And they brought back evidence of what was there. But these 12 men. Now Alex, I've preached quite a few times from this passage of scripture. And as yet when I've asked the question, could they name the 10 spies that brought back an evil report? No, listen, you got me.

>> Alex McFarland: M. Most people couldn't.

>> Bert Harper: I can't. I. I have refu. Reviewed them today and that's hard to remember, but the two that brought back the good report, the godly report, what heroes it is sometimes, many times, being in the minority is a place you want to be. And here it was that Caleb and Joshua would stand strong and, and they would reap the benefit. Yes they did. But they didn't know that when they were standing strong, they were just standing for what God had said. I think we'll do well to stand. Preaching, teaching, voting, sharing with others what God says. We're in a good place when we do that, aren't we Alex?

>> Alex McFarland: Amen. Amen. Well, yes, we are in a good place. And Joshua and Caleb, you know, there have been children's songs about it. They were bold and they were brave. okay, verse 25 of Numbers 13 says they the spies returned from searching of the land after 40 days. And not to get too deep into this, but we've mentioned pretty respected book by E.W. bullinger on number in scriptures. And you know the significance of numbers. You don't want to, as they say, go to seed on it. Sometimes there's more than is really there. But in general, Bert, 40 has been kind, of significant in relation to judgment or evaluation or testing or kind of probation. I mean.

Bert says giving reports is very important in worship

All right. During the flood of Noah, the rain lasted 40 days and 40 nights, really kind of washing the earth. Moses was on Mount Sinai 40 days and nights before getting the Ten Commandments. The Lord Jesus was in the wilderness 40 days and nights. And, he appeared to the disciples for 40 days after the resurrection. By the way, Jonah gave Nineveh 40 days to repent. And here's the thing. After, not believing the report of Joshua and Caleb, and Joshua and Caleb brought what we call the minority report. God is with us. The majority report was, oh, we're just little grasshoppers. But after this, they wandered for 40 years. So, Bert, I don't think it's ambiguous or a stretch here to say that 40 is very significant about testing. And frankly, the judgment. If one were to fail the test.

>> Bert Harper: Again, you see that again and again. And this 40 is significant. They had spied it out. They brought back the evidence of what they said, and they brought back a report. And notice who they said. And they departed and came back to Moses and Eryn. They departed, and they came back to give that report. That reminds me of Jesus sending the 70 out. They would leave, but then they would come back and give their report. reports are so important. What, Paul would do on his missionary journeys, he would leave, but then he'd come back to Antioch, give a report. This is what God has done. And giving reports is very important, even in worship a lot of times, what you want to do. What has God done? You went out last Sunday, in a small group, tell me what God's done for you this week. What God has done. Bring that report. And it says, and all the congregation of the children of Israel in the wilderness of Paran at Kadesh, they brought back word to them and to all the congregation and showed them the fruit of the land. Now, again, they brought it back. That's what was told them in verse 20. He says, Be of good courage, bring back some of the fruit of the first rock grapes. And they did that, and it was bigger and better than they thought it would be. When they brought back that cluster of grapes hanging on a pole, that's one of the prettiest, I would say, impressions you get a lot of times when, they, Like a biblical scene, those men bringing back those grapes. So, Alex, it says, and showed them the fruit of the land. they said, this is what it is. It is a land flowing with milk and honey. It is a land that is ready. And so they all agreed to begin with notice, and I will throw it back to you. Then they told him and said, we went to the land where you sent us. It truly flows with milk and honey, and this is its fruit.

>> Alex McFarland: All.

>> Bert Harper: All 12 give this report. But things really take a turn for the worse in verse 28, doesn't it?

>> Alex McFarland: Well, it really does. And by the way, Speaking of verse 28 in Numbers 13, this is kind of recounted in Deuteronomy 1. 28 as well. And you're going to see a phrase here in verse 28. You're going to see it again in verse 33. The sons of Anakin, or Anak, the, children of Anak. Now, the Anakim are described as being related to the Nephilim. And we've gotten a lot of questions on this. at the very least, big, tall, physical stature. And you know what? later on, you know, Joshua would defeat the children of Anakim. Okay? They lived in Gath, which is in Gaza and a place called Ashdod. So, old Goliath, he is a, distant descendant of Anakim, a giant, isn't he?

>> Bert Harper: He is here. He was close to 8 and 9ft tall. And, Goliath from Gath. That's exactly right. The word in verse 28 that got my attention was nevertheless.

Alex Martin: Verse 26 says take possession of promised land

Okay, the land that you told us about, the land that you have given us, it truly is what you said. It was nevertheless. Alex, it worries me that sometimes God's given me promise. And I'd say, but, Lord, but what if, what if, what if? And these what ifs can really wreak havoc, can't they?

>> Alex McFarland: Well, they really can. Let me go back just a little bit to verse 26. They went and came to Moses and to Eryn and to all the congregation of the children of Israel, unto the wilderness of Paran, to Kadesh, okay, this oasis. And they brought back word unto them and unto all the congregation showed them the fruit of the land, the grapes of Eskel, which means, clusters. Clusters of grapes. And they told them and said, we came to the land whither thou sent us, and surely it does flow with milk and honey. This is the fruit of it nevertheless. Oh, the people are strong. They have walled cities. And the children of Anak, these giants. And the Amalekites that dwell in the south. And the Hittites, Jebusites, Amorites, Canaanites. the Amorites in the mountains. Canaanites by the sea, by the coast of Jordan. Verse 30. And Caleb stilled the people before Moses. in other words, by verse 30, the people are getting upset. Don't you know? There's this Murmur in the crowd. Oh, no. Oh, no. Oh, no.

>> Bert Harper: Yeah.

>> Alex McFarland: And Moses, is listening. And Caleb says, let us go up at once and possess it, for we are well able to overcome it. But the men, here's the 10 spies. It's almost like this. And I'm going to paraphrase and you say how you feel led, but it's almost like the 10 other spies are saying, Moses, Moses, Joshua and Caleb are going to get us killed. Now, you know, we be not able to go against this people. They are stronger than we. I would never advocate doing something reckless, but at the same time, I want to say this as a Christian in the ministry, in the church. The fruitful Christian life is a life of trust and obedience. And God gets us out of our comfort zone and stretches, us. And it takes faith, but, it's, you know, by faith we overcome. And I, think this is one of the first examples of what a church business meeting is going to look like. When God calls people to walk by faith.

>> Bert Harper: Ooh, whoo. Ooh. Notice this. What he says, let us go up and listen to the next two words at once.

>> Alex McFarland: Amen.

>> Bert Harper: In other words, if we delay, it's going to be difficult and hard. There are some windows that are opened only at a certain time, and then they close certain doors that are opened only for a certain time. We're going to find that, that they try, to go through another door and they eat the. They'll reap destruction. But here it is. He said, let us go up at once. And then what does it say? Take possession. That word possession means it's already ours. We need to claim it. God has already given it to us. Let me say this. That land is still theirs. From the Abrahamic covenant, from his promise to them to possess the land, we're well able to do what? Overcome. We're more than conquerors. We're overcomers now. They were then. We'll be back with more right after this break. The AFR app is a powerful tool, but it does have limitations.

>> Alex McFarland: You can't use it to change the

>> Bert Harper: oil in your vehicle or get rid of carpet stains.

>> Alex McFarland: It won't walk the dog, won't pick

>> Bert Harper: up the dry cleaning or take the kids to practice. But while you're doing those things, you can listen to your favorite AFR content through the app on your phone or smart device or Roku. Just go to your app store or visit afr.net listen to AFR wherever you go.

>> Alex McFarland: With the AFR applied and the sun on my Face.

Bert and Alex discuss Genesis chapter 13 in Exploring the Word

>> Bert Harper: Welcome back to Exploring the Word. Bert and Alex here. And we're in numbers, chapter 13, about to go into 14, which continues, this episode, this event in the life of the nation of Israel, verse 30. You hear these words. Caleb says, we are able. Matter of fact, he says, we're well able to. But then the next words, but the men who had gone up with him says we're not able. Which crowd would you be in if you were facing giants? And I'm sure some of you are facing financial giants, you're facing some relationship giants. On Tuesdays when we get prayer requests, so many of them are relational, some of them are physical, medical. You're facing these giants. Do you say God is able or, you say, no, he's not able. Because Caleb, what he was saying we're able, is not based on who they were, but whose they were. Not who, but whose they were. They were God's people and God had given them the land. And as he said, we just need to go up. And do what? Possess it. Alex, there are so many truths here that I see in my life that I've. Lord, I want to be a Caleb and I want to be a Joshua man. They're two great heroes, aren't they?

>> Alex McFarland: Well, amen. And we need to believe God for good things. I mean, over and over the Bible tells us how he has good for us. And just, I mean, think about salvation itself. I mean, the Lord has literally moved heaven and earth and incarnated himself to come down here and purchase our redemption. Of course he cares about our day to day sustenance in our life. I mean, if he cares about our eternity, I think God certainly must care about our day to day journey as well. And, the people, verse 32, the spies and the men brought an evil report, or literally a bad report of the land which they had searched unto the children of Israel. The land through which we have gone to search. It is a land that eats up the inhabitants thereof. And all the people that we saw in it are men of a great stature. I mean, what an exaggeration. This land will eat us up and devour us. And we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, which come of the giants. And. And you know, it's almost like there's still this some, superstitious fear around what they had read back in Genesis 6. Maybe we were in our own sight as grasshoppers. And so we were in their sight. Hey, listen, here's the thing. They admitted we view ourselves as grasshoppers. And I don't want to get off track here, but numbers 1333. We need to view ourselves as Christ sees us. First. John 3:3 says that we are pure. We should purify ourselves even as we now are pure. If you're a born again believer, a son or daughter of the king, you're not a loser, you're not a victim, you are not evil. You are the property of the providential God of the universe. And so it's very telling, Bert, that the people that had the evil report, the fearful report, the disobedient report, they said, we see ourselves as grasshoppers, and so do these giants. I want to tell you, you're an overcomer. You're, bought with the blood of the lamb. You're not just a bug, you're a victor in Christ. And I think we need to view ourselves in our true identity.

>> Bert Harper: Amen. Our identity. And that's what the world wants to steal. They want to steal it in creation. That's the reason you have all this gender euphoria, changing and all of that. We want to steal who we are in Christ, our redemption, our possession, what we have in him. Satan has come to kill, steal and destroy. And those of you that are believers, the main thing he wants to steal is your identity as a follower of Christ and become that bug or that grasshopper, the one that can't and is not able, rather than the one who is able through Christ.

William Carey: There's going to be conflict anytime you go forward

Now, again, Alex, let me ask you this. There's going to be conflict anytime you go forward. There's usually conflict, there's resistance. Is there such a thing? I want to ask you, victory without conflict?

>> Alex McFarland: I doubt it.

>> Bert Harper: Well, I've never seen it. I use this illustration. Matter of fact, I used it last night while I was preaching at Friendship Baptist Church here in northeast Mississippi, close to Baldwin, Mississippi. And I'll be preaching there tonight at 6:30. If anyone would love to come, I'd love to visit, will you and see you. But here it is. I used to play softball on the church league softball team.

>> Alex McFarland: Me too.

>> Bert Harper: And, so Jan would always go with me until we started having children. When we started having children, it was hard for her to go to the ball game and take care of the child. So I played for a few years after that. Not many, but every time we would win and maybe I got a hit that drove in a run or whatever, I'd come back and I'd tell her, you should have been there. It was great. Why? There was a conflict between two teams. Not that they were Fighting. We're just talking about two teams trying to win. But every once in a while in church league, softball league, a lot of times the other team didn't have enough players, and they would have to forfeit a game. I never came home and told Jan, oh, you should have been there.

>> Alex McFarland: It was the best forfeit ever.

>> Bert Harper: Yeah. And so in the conflict, there's the victory in the cross. The conflict, when Jesus said, lord, let this. Let this pass from me, there was that conflict, that. That of suffering, of being separated. But he won through that conflict and brought us peace in Christ. So here they are. They're trying to avoid the conflict. If you avoid the conflict that is. That is there like that, you'll never have the victory. Alex, I, That's powerful. They didn't want that. They wanted to do what? Go back to Egypt? they wanted to do this and that, but they did not want to go forward to the land that God had given them.

>> Alex McFarland: You know the old saying, no pain, no gain.

>> Bert Harper: Right. That's it.

>> Alex McFarland: Therefore, the prize comes a price, doesn't it?

>> Bert Harper: It does.

>> Alex McFarland: And that's true with anything. I mean, whether it's, you know, getting a degree or achieving a goal or learning a musical instrument or, you know, joining a gym and working out or achieving something. And, years ago, there was a book. It said, expect great things from God. Attempt great things for God. I remember seeing that book. And, yeah, I mean, down here in this fallen world, it is a struggle. And the Bible has much to say about that. We wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against spiritual wickedness. Last, thing. And I want to get into 14. Dear fellow believers, pray big things before God and believe God for great things. And you can do things. Bert, you and I have been so blessed and are so blessed to do what we do with exploring the Word. And there have been much, much speaking and other ministry and even some writing that has gone with that. And, my goodness, I could tell you so many great things. Yesterday I was in danville, virginia. Dr. Danny campbell there at the baptist tabernacle and had two great, great services, great altar call, prayed with a lot of people. Saw a dear lady from Seattle, Washington, pray and get saved yesterday. Just tearfully, joyfully accepted Christ. And every day has its blessings. But every day has its requirements, too. It really does, of obedience and trust. And I'm not saying it's easy bearing, fruit for Jesus. It's not always easy, but it is right? And, my friends, I'll throw it back to you. Bert, God has more that he wants to do in you and through you than you could possibly imagine.

>> Bert Harper: Amen. He can do all and above all, that we can even think or attempt for God. You talking about that? expect great things from God. Attempt great things. William Carey, the modern. Yeah, that was William Carey that coined that phrase, and others have picked it up. But he was the first man, what we call modern missions. William Carey, as here, was a cobbler, but learned all the languages and would go and change the world. And, that's it.

Bert says lack of gratitude in church can undermine faith in God

Well, Alex, you come to 14 and listen to this. I just want to read the first few verses. Then all the congregation lift up their voices and cried, and the people wept that night. And all the children of Israel murmured. You asked me what Israel did best. The generation that came out of Egypt into the, land of wilderness and not going into the promised land. What did they do better than anything else? Murmuring. I mean, it didn't take them any time. Three days out, they started murmuring. After they got murmuring. Here it is. And all the children of Israel murmured against Moses and Eryn. And the whole congregation said to them, if only we had died in the land of Egypt, or if only we had died in this wilderness. Guess what? The last phrase underline that in your Bibles. That's exactly what's going to happen here. They're going to get their wish. They're going to get their wish. They're going to die. Why has the Lord brought us to this land to fall by the sword? That our wives and children should become victims? Would it not be better for us to return to Egypt? So they said to one another, let us select leader and return to Egypt. Alex. Now, what were they. Let me see. What was their position in society back in Egypt?

>> Alex McFarland: let me think. They were, slaves.

>> Bert Harper: Oh, and we want that so bad. We want to come back to that slavery.

>> Alex McFarland: Goodness. Well, I mean, I read verse two of Numbers, chapter 14, and they're basically saying, we would rather die than walk by faith. Walking by faith. It's not always easy. And, I can tell you I have travailed in prayer about things, needs and direction. And, you know, rent a coliseum and have several thousand seats that you have to fill, and you'll know how to walk by faith. But it's glorious to see God come through. And I just want to say this, and I know you could testify to no doubt most everybody listening could. God is so faithful. God is so faithful, isn't he, Bert?

>> Bert Harper: He is faithful all the way. Even when we are faithless, he is faithful. That's who he is. He cannot deny who he is. That's his nature, faithfulness. And he never wavers.

>> Alex McFarland: Alex, let me say something here, too. In verse 2. Forgive me, but says all the children of Israel murmured against Moses? And the word murmur there means like grumble and grumbling, comes out of ingratitude. One of the surest ways to keep your heart straight. I mean, really cultivate with the Holy Spirit a heart of appreciation. But notice this. With ingratitude and really grousing and murmuring, then they begin to slander the character of God. Verse 3. Why has the Lord brought us out to this land to fall by the sword? Our wives, our children would be a prey were it not better for us to return to Egypt. See, here's the thing. Ingratitude. If you don't stop it, turn it around, count your blessings, you will begin to doubt the character of God. Then you'll begin to accuse the nature and the work of God. That's a dark place. You don't want your heart to go there. And I've seen it. And, Bert, listen, I love the church. It's been my joy to work with a lot of churches. But I'm going to tell you, lack of thankfulness in gratitude, call it what you will, that has birthed more church trouble. Really. Murmuring, grumbling. I, don't know. I just think trying to count your blessings and stay appreciative, that'll. That'll keep you in a pure spirit,

>> Bert Harper: I think, Bert, I agree with you. I never met a believer who was walking with the Lord that did not have a heart of gratitude.

Alex Martin shares biblical story with your Bible questions after this break

And, a song that I heard earlier today. Gratitude. How can I express my gratitude? It is one of the great songs. And listen, how you know, what else could we sing but hallelujah? Hallelujah. What a king he really is. But they said, let us. We're not going to follow God. We're going to go by what we want to do, and we want to go back to Egypt. That's what we. We don't want to go forward. We want to go backward. we don't want to advance. We. We want to decline. And. And that's their heart. Then Moses and Eryn listen to their response. Here it is, Moses again, interceding, of all the great things that Moses did, interceding for these people, I'm amazed he would. Then Moses and Eryn fell on their faces before all the assembly of the congregation of the Children of Israel. They fell on their face before God, prostrated themselves. And Joshua, the son of nun, and Caleb, the son of Jetneel, who were among those who had spied out the land, tore their clothes, and they spoke to the congregation of the children of Israel, saying, the land we passed through to sp is an exceedingly good land. If the Lord delights in us, then he will bring us into the land and give it to us. A land which flows with milk and honey only. Do not rebel against the Lord. Not against Moses, but against the Lord. You're going against, God. Not against Moses. Nor fear the people of the land, for they're our bread. Their protection has departed from them, and the Lord is with us. Do not fear them. That was their message. Now the congregation rejects them. They really do. But notice. Do not fear. You know what fear does? As much as anything, Alex? It paralyzes. It paralyzes. They can't move. We can't go forward. We're here. We can't go forward. So they departed. The protection has departed from the enemy. Caleb and Joshua, they knew the enemy, but they also knew the Lord. Let us look unto the Lord, the author and finisher of our faith. We better look unto him, hadn't we?

>> Alex McFarland: Well, we should. We should. And really, you know, by the way, verse nine is a commentary on verse four. Because in verse four, all these people, they said, let's get a captain and let's return to Egypt. and Joshua says, don't rebel against the Lord. so much more we could say. This is exploring the word. Hey, here's the number we're going to take. Bible questions. It's 888, 589, 88, 40. Triple 858-9840. Your questions and God's answers after this break. Stay tuned, please.

Preborn network clinics offer free ultrasounds to women facing unplanned pregnancies

>> Bert Harper: Right now, the voices in our culture are loud. But truth is often silent. And today, preborn needs you to help speak that truth. Women facing unplanned pregnancies are often pressured to act quickly, before they have time to pause, breathe, or hear the truth about life, dignity, and hope. But I refuse to be silent, and I am asking you to join me. At preborn network clinics, a woman is welcomed with compassion and given a free ultrasound. She sees the life growing inside her, often for the first time. And in that sacred moment, fear gives way to clarity. And she's offered something the abortion industry will never provide. The hope of Jesus Christ. This April, our goal is to have 11,000 gospel conversations in preborn network clinics, trusting God to bring the increase as we remain faithful to speak. You can help make that possible by sponsoring ultrasounds. Just $28 provides one ultrasound. $140 sponsors five ultrasounds for mothers in crisis. Every dollar helps save babies and share the good news of Jesus Christ. To donate, dial £250 and say the keyword baby. That's £250, baby. Or visit preborn.com host that's preborn.com host

>> Alex McFarland: so I throw my hands and praise you again and again. Hallelujah.

>> Bert Harper: Hallelujah.

American Family association puts on this wonderful summer conference every year

>> Alex McFarland: Welcome back to Exploring the Word on the American Family Radio Network. Alex and Bert, again, the number for Bible questions, and you will get through. We probably have a couple of lines open. If you have a Bible question, dial 888-589-8840. As we, boot up the, phone bank here, I want to mention the Activate Summit. Bert, this is 2026. American Family association puts on this wonderful summer conference. I had the great privilege of speaking last year. But this upcoming year, my goodness, there's going to be, Dr. Jessica Peck and there's going to be Jeff Schrieve that you hear on afr. And there's going to be, among other speakers, Reverend Bert Harper. And, Bert, tell us about the Activate Summit, if you would, brother.

>> Bert Harper: Well, it is a great summit, not just a great teaching. It's brothers and sisters fellowshipping together. They have opportunity to meet, those of us who are privileged to work here at afr. tours will be available. They're going to get to be a part of that if they desire to. So you can go to afa.netsummit, that's afa.netsummit. and you can get all the details, pricing details, and all the things that is available. And the dates, again, as you said, July 16th, 17th and 18th of, this year. And we would love for you to do that. And matter of fact, you need to get your tickets. Now, this is, if I remember right, April 20th, and tickets must be bought by May 22nd. So that means you got just a day or two, more than a month to order your tickets and be sure and be here for Roots to fruit, grounded in truth, growing in grace. That is the title, Roots to Fruit. And, that's what we want to say. I better not say that two or three times in a row. I'd mess it up for sure. But grounded in truth and growing in grace, that's the Activate Summit.

>> Alex McFarland: Well, it's going to be fantastic. And, folks, you will not be disappointed.

Alex, real quick, before we go to the first caller, that song I mentioned

>> Bert Harper: Alex, real quick, before we go to the first caller, that song I. I just mentioned it, and here Brent, he brings it up. The first time I heard that song was mine and Jan's grandson Andrew singing it. And he was just singing it. And he had been to the concert and heard that. And I said, man, tell me about that song. And, I love it. Yes, I do. He is a great God, and we need to have thankfulness toward him for all he has done. I just wanted to throw that in, huh? Yes.

>> Alex McFarland: And, one last thing before we go to the college. Please be in prayer for the, I'm sure you've seen it in the news. In our nation's capital, America reads the Bible this week. The word of God in its entirety is being read in our nation's capital. And I just pray that the spirit of God will sweep across our nation with a revival, and that really, once again, God and his word would be honored throughout America, as it was in our founding here at the 250th birthday of America. May God please draw us back to himself.

>> Bert Harper: Amen. Let's go to the phone lines, and we go to Virginia. You're talking about the Founding Fathers, where a whole lot of them lived and dwelt. Betty from Virginia, thank you for calling. Go right ahead. Hello.

>> Alex McFarland: Thank you for taking my call.

I have a question concerning Mark 16, uh, nine through 20

I have a question concerning Mark 16, nine through 20.

>> Bert Harper: I have the NIV Ryrie Study

>> Alex McFarland: Bible, the ESV and the King James. Both the, NIV and the ESV give a disclaimer on those verses.

>> Bert Harper: The King James does not. Can you explain that to me? Well, let me just share with you this has. We've had this question before because they noticed that, Alex, I don't see it as an addendum. I don't. It sounds consistent to me. And, from what I've heard others say, I'm not a Greek scholar, but I've looked at the words. I think it's consistent with. With the rest of chapter, 16, especially when you see the rest of it, the Ascension of Jesus in verses 19 and 20.

>> Alex McFarland: Yeah, you know, it's funny. two hours ago, Bert, I was on the phone with one of the great NewSong Testament scholars in the world, and he's, PhD, and he's writing a defense of what we call the traditional authorship of the four gospels. Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John. And, you know, bert, I remember 30, 35 years ago when I was in a secular university and in a world religions class, just very glibly, the professor said, well, we know the biblical books weren't written by the people attributed to. And I remember even as a college student, I thought, well, why not? And so, as we learn more and I get, I'm hopefully going to be one of the people that gets to read an early draft. there is a rapid, rapid scholarly return to what we call traditional authorship. Matthew, Mark, Luke and John. Now why am I saying that? Let me say this. Some years ago there was a Detroit News journalist named Lewis Cassels. And he, I'm told, became a Christian. But he said, and this was 50 years ago, he said, we live in a time of a ruthless hermeneutic of suspicion. In other words, people, not average people, but many academicians approach the Bible with suspicion. Now, the short ending of Mark 16 and the long ending, there are some manuscripts that ended at what we would call verse 8 and did not contain verses 9 through 20 of M. Mark. But here's the thing. and look, there are all sorts of manuscripts with, all sorts of portions, complete and incomplete. But if you end at verse eight, I mean, it's kind of on a note of fear and trembling. There's not a clear, clear account of the resurrection. And I believe in what they call the long ending or the traditional nine through 20. let me just say the fact that the NIV is ambiguous about this. Don't let that scare you. Mark 16 has all 20 verses. And Bert, I just, I bristle at the skeptical, posture of much of academics.

>> Bert Harper: I agree. And part, most of this, the Commission is in here. Verse 15. Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature. And then it goes on. It's part of the Great Commission and I believe it is signs that he is especially given to those in the early church. Paul would take up that serpent. There's so many things that would take place. And again, that doesn't. This is not a call to worship. It's not calling us to take up serpents as a form of worship. It's a matter of missions and no fear. Alex. Go into those places where danger will accompany you, just like we studied today in the Book of Numbers. There's giants in the land. They could say there's snakes in the land. there's deadly things in the land. We better not go into that land. No, he says, the Great Commission. God's command is to go in those without fear. I see the consistencies myself, Alex, as it is.

>> Alex McFarland: Amen. I do too.

>> Bert Harper: Okay. Hey, by the way, we've got plenty of lines for people to call in. And that number, triple 858-98-8840. If you've got a Bible question, we'd love to hear it. And let's go to Arkansas. Rebecca, thank you for calling. Go right ahead.

Alex: Question about why the Book of Enoch wasn't in canon

>> Alex McFarland: Yes, the question about why the Book of Enoch wasn't in the canon or what y' all think about that. I'm sure y' all have answered it before, but y' all talking about the giants and stuff made me think of that, so.

>> Bert Harper: Okay, Alex, this is one of the most. Rebecca, it's not an unusual question. It's one of the most common questions we get, isn't it? Ale?

>> Alex McFarland: Well, here lately, it's almost like the common questions have been changing a little bit. and so, let's talk about this. For one thing, there is a famous historical book called the Book of Enoch, or that's how it's kind of known. I do not think it was ever part of the biblical canon. and so let's talk about this a little bit. All right? and Enoch was a biblical person, but this Book of Enoch, that comes after the completion of the NewSong Testament. and there's actually several. I mean, there's a second Enoch and what's called a third Enoch, but these are what are called pseudepigraphal. Now, pseudepigrapha, that's spelled P S E U D E P I G R A P H A L. The pseudepigraphal writings, are writings that are interesting, historical, curiosity. But we're never really part, never not part of the Old Testament Genesis through Malachi, never part of the NewSong Testament. And now with, 2,000 years of archeology and history, many, many, many things have come to light. But these apocryphal writings, or pseudepigraphal. The word pseudepigrapha means second canon. Although there is no second canon. There's the one canon of scripture that they are very historically inaccurate. They're very biblically inaccurate. just for instance, if 1,000 years from now, people came across the writings of Billy Graham or David, Jeremiah, or heretics like Jeannie Dixon, they might say, oh, my goodness, you know, the Christian America, look, there were all these writings. They were historical curiosities, but they were never part of the canonical scripture.

>> Bert Harper: Amen, Rebecca. We hope that's helped.

Alex: When we die, do we go directly to heaven

Next, we want to go to Brent in Mississippi, now that Brent in Mississippi is our board op. He gave me a look on that one. But, we got some questions that's come in to us. Brent, would you mind sharing Them. That was pretty good, by the way. Okay, caught you there, didn't I? It's actually three questions. I'll give them to you one at a time. It is from Wendy. She sent an email in first. She says, my question is, when we die, do we go directly to heaven? Okay, good question. The answer is Easy question. Yes. Jesus said that, didn't he? Alex, today you will be with me in paradise. Let me see, who did he say that to?

>> Alex McFarland: The thief on the cross. And literally, he said, this day.

>> Bert Harper: This day.

>> Alex McFarland: So, yes, I believe that absent from the body is to be present with the Lord.

>> Bert Harper: And so there's going to be some transitions in heaven because one of these days, the dead in Christ will get a new body, and then we're going to be changed. The Bible talks about us as believers. We will be changed in the twinkling of an eye, but we're still in the presence of the Lord even today.

>> Alex McFarland: Amen. amen. So, yes, when a born again believer dies, they are instantly, instantaneously in the presence of the lord. And that's 2 Corinthians 5, 8.

>> Bert Harper: Okay, Brett. Well, in the second part, she was saying that Max Lucado had said that had stated, we're going to the front porch. Paradise, not heaven. And she had never heard that before. So she was wanting clarification on that. Well, go ahead, Alex, you go first.

>> Alex McFarland: Well, I've not seen that. I think I know what he means. and to say the front porch, that's kind of speculative because, you know, there's not, you know, 2 Corinthians, I believe it's 6, 9, says, Eye is not seen, ear is not heard, neither is entered into the heart of man. So we don't have the vocabulary to adequately convey how beautiful, how wonderful heaven is. I think what Max Lucado might have meant was the. The fact that while we do go straight to heaven, the presence of the Lord, the glorified eternal body, first John three, three, we shall be like him as he is. we don't get the glorified, permanent eternal body till later, but it will be very tangible, very corporeal, very physical, and very real and very much absolute presence of Christ.

>> Bert Harper: Paul was caught up into the third heaven. Matter of fact, that word caught up, it's used several times. Like Philip was caught up after he had witnessed to the Ethiopian eunuch. you know, and it's also in Acts 23, when Paul was being, challenged and even going to kill him, and the commander sent the Roman soldiers to rescue and Catch him up. And that's the word we get rapture from. And so here it is. Paul was caught up into the third heaven, from this place to a new location now. I don't know. He said he saw some awesome, awesome things. Okay. And, so we know even at the front porch, it's going to be good. I would use different terminology, but it's going to be a glorious place.

Alex: Wendy says after final battle, Satan is put away forever

What's the third part of Wendy's question? In the final part, she says, after the final battle and. And Satan is put away forever. Will that be the end of humankind? Meaning all the humans that are here at that time? Is that all that will ever be? Okay, Alex? Ah. It talks about eternity with him. is eternity. Does it have an end?

>> Alex McFarland: Well, it's everlasting. And, no, that won't be the end of humankind. I mean, humans will always be humans. One of the reasons that we often talk about the sanctity of human life is because, look, you will always be a human. You'll either be a redeemed, glorified human or a condemned, lost human. But you'll never turn into an angel. That's a different class of being. You'll never be annihilated. We are everlasting. And we don't turn into God either. We are humans. By the way, about that, the front porch of heaven, here's an illustration I've used. And maybe this is equally poor, so forgive me, but, Bert, when I played baseball, we had our traveling jerseys, but we also had uniforms, for a home game. And when you die and you go to be with Jesus, you're in the presence of the Lord, but you don't get your, home team, home field uniform, the glorified body, till later. It's still. You're on the team. You're the redeemed. It's very real. But, the away jersey was different than the home game jersey.

>> Bert Harper: Alex, when you said that, I can't think about. I, can't help but think about being in high school, on our basketball team. Yeah, we had away jerseys and home jerseys. Our home jerseys were white. Praise the Lord. We're going to robed in white robes of his righteousness. I just thought of that.

>> Alex McFarland: Amen.

>> Bert Harper: Isn't that going to be a glorious day, Alex?

>> Alex McFarland: All because of Jesus. Praise his name.

>> Bert Harper: Amen.

Tomorrow is Tuesday day of prayer; trust and obey God

Well, it's been great to be with you today. And tomorrow is Tuesday day of prayer. We look forward to that. And we'll be continuing in the book of Numbers. We're going to finish chapter 14 and go further. But I want to tell you, read the rest of chapter 14 and there's some things that happen there that really are interesting and makes you understand. We should have obeyed God when he said to do what I tell you. I pray that we would do that. Obey God. Here's the theme. Trust and obey. There is no other way. Thank you for listening to Exploring the Word.

>> Alex McFarland: The views and opinions expressed in this

>> Bert Harper: broadcast may not necessarily reflect those of

>> Alex McFarland: the American Family association or American Family Radio.